The only logical explanation (other than being mad at Obama for distancing himself) for Wright's actions is that maybe he's giving Obama some cover to distance himself further and more categorically.
i dont think that is even "a" logical explanation. could it be that a charitable, war veteran, who speaks for thousands of people, might want the opportunity to clear his demonized name, speak in less than 10 second sound bites, and make an attempt at restoring some respect for the black church?
people act like Wright used these speeches as an opportunity to convince the world he is a crazy madman. perhaps thats what people's perception is, but i agrees with rootlesscosmo that most of his statements are far from controversial. in fact, there is an op-ed in the nyt today which criticizes him for using these speeches as a platform to state the super-obvious: that Blacks have been historically discriminated against.
In defense of Obama, there are isolated statements from Wright that needed to be dealt with now, before the gop starts using them in political ads. He tried to defend his statements about the govt injecting Blacks with HIV, and he mocked JFK and LBJ's accents. To me, not a big deal, and both made sense through his explanations, but in little sound bites they could be a disaster if Obama chose to ignore them. He's being a politician - nothing wrong with that, especially when the stakes are the presidency!
As Wright would say, this is Obama doing what he has to do as "a politician".
This would mean lying just as Saba suggested he is guilty of.....I give Obama more credit than that.
no it's not lying. it's playing politics to save his ass. like I say when Wright really said some objectionable isht Obama just brushed it off. now he realizes he has to denounce Wright for real, so he picks this latest opportunity to express "outrage" when in reality Wright's previous remarks were far more "outrageous" than his Press Club remarks. Obama's saying what he now realizes he should have said all along for the sake of his campaign.
I don't blame Wright. he had a right to defend his words.
When your words include that the Goverment created AIDS to infect/wipe out the black population you shouldn't expect a chance to defend them, nor should people take you seriously.
You support plenty of stuff I disagree with, so there we are.
My point was merely that I don't disagree with Wright's statements - whereas, you clearly do - but I think his actions in the last few days have been kinda shameless.
You support plenty of stuff I disagree with, so there we are.
My point was merely that I don't disagree with Wright's statements - whereas, you clearly do - but I think his actions in the last few days have been kinda shameless.
still his Press Club remarks were totally unobjectionable, and Obama nonetheless chose this opportunity to denounce him. that's politics. good old fashioned Clinton-style politics.
in fact, there is an op-ed in the nyt today which criticizes him for using these speeches as a platform to state the super-obvious: that Blacks have been historically discriminated against.
this is kind of misrepresenting the piece - the nytimes (Bob Herbert, no less) was chastising Wright for dredging up points that are hardly new or news, but will certainly do damage to Obama's campaign.
You support plenty of stuff I disagree with, so there we are.
My point was merely that I don't disagree with Wright's statements - whereas, you clearly do - but I think his actions in the last few days have been kinda shameless.
still his Press Club remarks were totally unobjectionable, and Obama nonetheless chose this opportunity to denounce him.
I don't know man, didn't he go even further to lionize Farrakhan? It seems odd that you'd respond to my post so harshly but brush off Wright's speech as "totally unobjectionable".
As Wright would say, this is Obama doing what he has to do as "a politician".
This would mean lying just as Saba suggested he is guilty of.....I give Obama more credit than that.
no it's not lying. it's playing politics to save his ass. like I say when Wright really said some objectionable isht Obama just brushed it off. now he realizes he has to denounce Wright for real, so he picks this latest opportunity to express "outrage" when in reality Wright's previous remarks were far more "outrageous" than his Press Club remarks. Obama's saying what he now realizes he should have said all along for the sake of his campaign.
I don't blame Wright. he had a right to defend his words.
When your words include that the Goverment created AIDS to infect/wipe out the black population you shouldn't expect a chance to defend them, nor should people take you seriously.
maybe not, but he was nonetheless offered a chance to defend them (the Press Club and NAACP invited him to speak, and other venues clearly had an interest in hosting him). so you can't blame the man for accepting the invites and trying to explain himself.
to blame Wright for the damage this has done to Obama I just can't get with.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
When your words include that the Goverment created AIDS to infect/wipe out the black population you shouldn't expect a chance to defend them, nor should people take you seriously.
So what is the percentage of people in this world that you do take seriously?
Like .0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001?
Yep, I think that just leaves you alone...sounds accurate.
You support plenty of stuff I disagree with, so there we are.
My point was merely that I don't disagree with Wright's statements - whereas, you clearly do - but I think his actions in the last few days have been kinda shameless.
still his Press Club remarks were totally unobjectionable, and Obama nonetheless chose this opportunity to denounce him.
I don't know man, didn't he go even further to lionize Farrakhan? It seems odd that you'd respond to my post so harshly but brush off Wright's speech as "totally unobjectionable".
perhaps an overstatement I'll admit. my point is none of this was any worse than the stuff that came out months ago and that Obama pointedly refused to condemn in specific terms. he chose now because he realized he had to for the sake of his campaign. politics.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
lol. I figured that would rile you up.
You support plenty of stuff I disagree with, so there we are.
My point was merely that I don't disagree with Wright's statements - whereas, you clearly do - but I think his actions in the last few days have been kinda shameless.
still his Press Club remarks were totally unobjectionable, and Obama nonetheless chose this opportunity to denounce him.
I don't know man, didn't he go even further to lionize Farrakhan? It seems odd that you'd respond to my post so harshly but brush off Wright's speech as "totally unobjectionable".
perhaps an overstatement I'll admit. my point is none of this was any worse than the stuff that came out months ago and that Obama pointedly refused to condemn in specific terms. he chose now because he realized he had to for the sake of his campaign. politics.
You mean to tell me that a politician is engaging in politics?
You support plenty of stuff I disagree with, so there we are.
My point was merely that I don't disagree with Wright's statements - whereas, you clearly do - but I think his actions in the last few days have been kinda shameless.
still his Press Club remarks were totally unobjectionable, and Obama nonetheless chose this opportunity to denounce him.
I don't know man, didn't he go even further to lionize Farrakhan? It seems odd that you'd respond to my post so harshly but brush off Wright's speech as "totally unobjectionable".
perhaps an overstatement I'll admit. my point is none of this was any worse than the stuff that came out months ago and that Obama pointedly refused to condemn in specific terms. he chose now because he realized he had to for the sake of his campaign. politics.
I'm sure his condemnation is more about Wright's refusal of "management" assistance than anything but the main reason he's condemning the stuff more harshly now is that Wright basically accused him of saying one thing and winking to him on the side. He's now in a position where the consequences would be worse if he just let it go.
Look, he should've got on top of this long before the original youtube clips surfaced but I have no problem with his reaction to Wright's speeches.
And yes he was invited, and yes he has a right to air out his beliefs, but I think the appropriate response (and the response most others would take) would have been to do so more quietly or after the smoke of the election had cleared.
so what happened to persuade him to go on a national tour promoting his alliance with farrakhan and implying that Obama's disingenous??
After watching the Press club video it's clear he didn't align himself with Farrakhan....and i really can't blame Rev. Wright for questioning Obama's sincerity.
Obama offered to help him "manage his message" and he refused. Wright wants to take his 15 minutes of fame and shine, regardless of Obama or anyone else.
Of course he refused....Rev. Wright is a very intelligent man and doesn't need any help managing HIS message.....It was a slap in the face for Obama to even suggest that.....Wheteher the Rev was looking for his 15 minutes or defending his congregation depends on how you look at it....It was probably a little of both......but i won't doubt for a second his recent "tour" was only hurting Obama's campaign
agreed. if Wright had Obama's interests in mind he would have been more diplomatic, i.e. tried even a little bit to help Obama out of this mess in order to increase his chances of being President.
but Wright apparently likes the attention a little bit (and prefers to defend himslef and his church over helping Obama's campaign). too bad for Obama, but let's not blame Wright. it's Wright's right to do what he did and try to defend himself. Wright doesn't owe Obama any damage control; if Obama thought this Wright guy would cooperate in the event of a "scandal" such as this one, well he was wrong. that's one more reason Obama should have considered another pastor.
When your words include that the Goverment created AIDS to infect/wipe out the black population you shouldn't expect a chance to defend them, nor should people take you seriously.
The party's over It's time to call it a day They've burst your pretty balloon And taken the moon away It's time to wind up the masquerade Just make your mind up the piper must be paid
The party's over The candles flicker and dim You danced and dreamed through the night It seemed to be right just being with him Now you must wake up, all dreams must end Take off your makeup, the party's over It's all over, my friend
The party's over
It's time to call it a day
Now you must wake up, all dreams must end Take off your makeup, the party's over It's all over, my friend
so what happened to persuade him to go on a national tour promoting his alliance with farrakhan and implying that Obama's disingenous??
After watching the Press club video it's clear he didn't align himself with Farrakhan....and i really can't blame Rev. Wright for questioning Obama's sincerity.
Obama offered to help him "manage his message" and he refused. Wright wants to take his 15 minutes of fame and shine, regardless of Obama or anyone else.
Of course he refused....Rev. Wright is a very intelligent man and doesn't need any help managing HIS message.....It was a slap in the face for Obama to even suggest that.....Wheteher the Rev was looking for his 15 minutes or defending his congregation depends on how you look at it....It was probably a little of both......but i won't doubt for a second his recent "tour" was only hurting Obama's campaign
i mostly agree w/ you but i dont think that its a 'slap in the face' for obama to offer to manage his message - it made sense considering the context of the situation
i think jp's point would be better stated as: we all know this is and should be a non-issue to begin with, but why would Wright add flames to a bullshit fire, if by doing so, he is damaging the chances for Obama to become the first Black president?
I will cosign on that and everything Obama has to do to make this go away. In a perfect world, Obama could go on tv and say - I support Wright, but don't agree with him on many things, anyone who thinks that is wrong can kiss my ass.
so what happened to persuade him to go on a national tour promoting his alliance with farrakhan and implying that Obama's disingenous??
After watching the Press club video it's clear he didn't align himself with Farrakhan....and i really can't blame Rev. Wright for questioning Obama's sincerity.
Obama offered to help him "manage his message" and he refused. Wright wants to take his 15 minutes of fame and shine, regardless of Obama or anyone else.
Of course he refused....Rev. Wright is a very intelligent man and doesn't need any help managing HIS message.....It was a slap in the face for Obama to even suggest that.....Wheteher the Rev was looking for his 15 minutes or defending his congregation depends on how you look at it....It was probably a little of both......but i won't doubt for a second his recent "tour" was only hurting Obama's campaign
true... I just don't see how anyone - no matter how intelligent, how much seniority, how respected - would say "no, I don't need to manage my message, you're gonna have to deal with it full blast" in a situation like this. It implies that Wright really was upset by Obama's distancing himself.
true... I just don't see how anyone - no matter how intelligent, how much seniority, how respected - would say "no, I don't need to manage my message, you're gonna have to deal with it full blast" in a situation like this. It implies that Wright really was upset by Obama's distancing himself.
No doubt Wright's ego played a huge roll in all this.....You almost have to be a egomaniac to be the pastor of any church ...let alone a church with 10,000 members
true... I just don't see how anyone - no matter how intelligent, how much seniority, how respected - would say "no, I don't need to manage my message, you're gonna have to deal with it full blast" in a situation like this. It implies that Wright really was upset by Obama's distancing himself.
No doubt Wright's ego played a huge roll in all this.....You almost have to be a egomaniac to be the pastor of any church ...let alone a church with 10,000 members
When your words include that the Goverment created AIDS to infect/wipe out the black population you shouldn't expect a chance to defend them, nor should people take you seriously.
So what is the percentage of people in this world that you do take seriously?
Like .0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001?
Yep, I think that just leaves you alone...sounds accurate.
I don't take people serious who shout from every mountain that the Government is poisoning citizens with Chemtrails, yet allow their children to go outside for said poisoning without personal protective gear.
I also don't take people seriously who claim AIDS was invented in a lab for the purpose of infecting specific groups of people.
I would say that would total about 0.00000000000000000000000000000000000000000001 of out population.
Comments
i dont think that is even "a" logical explanation. could it be that a charitable, war veteran, who speaks for thousands of people, might want the opportunity to clear his demonized name, speak in less than 10 second sound bites, and make an attempt at restoring some respect for the black church?
people act like Wright used these speeches as an opportunity to convince the world he is a crazy madman. perhaps thats what people's perception is, but i agrees with rootlesscosmo that most of his statements are far from controversial. in fact, there is an op-ed in the nyt today which criticizes him for using these speeches as a platform to state the super-obvious: that Blacks have been historically discriminated against.
In defense of Obama, there are isolated statements from Wright that needed to be dealt with now, before the gop starts using them in political ads. He tried to defend his statements about the govt injecting Blacks with HIV, and he mocked JFK and LBJ's accents. To me, not a big deal, and both made sense through his explanations, but in little sound bites they could be a disaster if Obama chose to ignore them. He's being a politician - nothing wrong with that, especially when the stakes are the presidency!
When your words include that the Goverment created AIDS to infect/wipe out the black population you shouldn't expect a chance to defend them, nor should people take you seriously.
You support plenty of stuff I disagree with, so there we are.
My point was merely that I don't disagree with Wright's statements - whereas, you clearly do - but I think his actions in the last few days have been kinda shameless.
still his Press Club remarks were totally unobjectionable, and Obama nonetheless chose this opportunity to denounce him. that's politics. good old fashioned Clinton-style politics.
this is kind of misrepresenting the piece - the nytimes (Bob Herbert, no less) was chastising Wright for dredging up points that are hardly new or news, but will certainly do damage to Obama's campaign.
yes, he did that by mocking their accents.
I don't know man, didn't he go even further to lionize Farrakhan? It seems odd that you'd respond to my post so harshly but brush off Wright's speech as "totally unobjectionable".
maybe not, but he was nonetheless offered a chance to defend them (the Press Club and NAACP invited him to speak, and other venues clearly had an interest in hosting him). so you can't blame the man for accepting the invites and trying to explain himself.
to blame Wright for the damage this has done to Obama I just can't get with.
So what is the percentage of people in this world that you do take seriously?
Like .0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001?
Yep, I think that just leaves you alone...sounds accurate.
ok, go look up the definition of the word "mock", then come back and join the discussion.
perhaps an overstatement I'll admit. my point is none of this was any worse than the stuff that came out months ago and that Obama pointedly refused to condemn in specific terms. he chose now because he realized he had to for the sake of his campaign. politics.
You mean to tell me that a politician is engaging in politics?
How dare he.
I'm sure his condemnation is more about Wright's refusal of "management" assistance than anything but the main reason he's condemning the stuff more harshly now is that Wright basically accused him of saying one thing and winking to him on the side. He's now in a position where the consequences would be worse if he just let it go.
Look, he should've got on top of this long before the original youtube clips surfaced but I have no problem with his reaction to Wright's speeches.
And yes he was invited, and yes he has a right to air out his beliefs, but I think the appropriate response (and the response most others would take) would have been to do so more quietly or after the smoke of the election had cleared.
Seems rather self-obsessed, really.
After watching the Press club video it's clear he didn't align himself with Farrakhan....and i really can't blame Rev. Wright for questioning Obama's sincerity.
Of course he refused....Rev. Wright is a very intelligent man and doesn't need any help managing HIS message.....It was a slap in the face for Obama to even suggest that.....Wheteher the Rev was looking for his 15 minutes or defending his congregation depends on how you look at it....It was probably a little of both......but i won't doubt for a second his recent "tour" was only hurting Obama's campaign
agreed. if Wright had Obama's interests in mind he would have been more diplomatic, i.e. tried even a little bit to help Obama out of this mess in order to increase his chances of being President.
but Wright apparently likes the attention a little bit (and prefers to defend himslef and his church over helping Obama's campaign). too bad for Obama, but let's not blame Wright. it's Wright's right to do what he did and try to defend himself. Wright doesn't owe Obama any damage control; if Obama thought this Wright guy would cooperate in the event of a "scandal" such as this one, well he was wrong. that's one more reason Obama should have considered another pastor.
this whole mess is on Obama.
It's time to call it a day
They've burst your pretty balloon
And taken the moon away
It's time to wind up the masquerade
Just make your mind up the piper must be paid
The party's over
The candles flicker and dim
You danced and dreamed through the night
It seemed to be right just being with him
Now you must wake up, all dreams must end
Take off your makeup, the party's over
It's all over, my friend
The party's over
It's time to call it a day
Now you must wake up, all dreams must end
Take off your makeup, the party's over
It's all over, my friend
It's all over, my friend
I will cosign on that and everything Obama has to do to make this go away. In a perfect world, Obama could go on tv and say - I support Wright, but don't agree with him on many things, anyone who thinks that is wrong can kiss my ass.
true... I just don't see how anyone - no matter how intelligent, how much seniority, how respected - would say "no, I don't need to manage my message, you're gonna have to deal with it full blast" in a situation like this. It implies that Wright really was upset by Obama's distancing himself.
No doubt Wright's ego played a huge roll in all this.....You almost have to be a egomaniac to be the pastor of any church ...let alone a church with 10,000 members
Nope. Wrong.
There is no reason to equate one potential egomaniac with all pastors.
I don't take people serious who shout from every mountain that the Government is poisoning citizens with Chemtrails, yet allow their children to go outside for said poisoning without personal protective gear.
I also don't take people seriously who claim AIDS was invented in a lab for the purpose of infecting specific groups of people.
I would say that would total about 0.00000000000000000000000000000000000000000001
of out population.
Priest....yes......Preacher.....nope.....I doubt you'll find a Priest retiring to a $10 million dollar home.
What do you think the difference is? Priest, preacher, pastor all mean the same thing in the church I grew up in.
What are your thoughts on the Tuskegee experiment ?