ENGLAND

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  • DORDOR Two Ron Toe 9,905 Posts
    SportCasual said:
    Looks like they are embracing gang culture.

    Just protecting their turf...

  • PATXPATX 2,820 Posts
    bassie said:
    SportCasual said:
    J i m s t e r said:

    National grid sees spike as nation collectively puts kettle on.

    Tea, another evil by-product of multiculturalism.

    Touche. When I next emigrate I am switching to non clearcut Mate.

  • AlmondAlmond 1,427 Posts
    DOR said:
    SportCasual said:
    Looks like they are embracing gang culture.

    Just protecting their turf...

    Many of those swords appear to be ceremonial. My grandma has one.

  • PATXPATX 2,820 Posts
    Almond said:
    DOR said:
    SportCasual said:
    Looks like they are embracing gang culture.

    Just protecting their turf...

    Many of those swords appear to be ceremonial. My grandma has one.

    Irony? And well, um, let's just say some of them do get put to use from time to time, in the UK at least.

  • jjfad027jjfad027 1,594 Posts
    ketan said:
    just another reflection of classism, current and historical, that is largely ignored when the architects/stewards of capitalist systems make their assumptions.

    http://livingdeadgirl84.tripod.com/jellobiafra/jello_int3.htm


  • The_Hook_UpThe_Hook_Up 8,182 Posts
    DOR said:
    sabadabada said:


    It's not that the population is "mixed," its the failure to integrate people into the society they have chosen to live in, both culturally and economically.


    Umm. Most of the are kids were born in the 90's. They never chose where they live. Just like they didn't choose to be poor.

    Just because they are brown. Does not mean they are immigrants... I'm betting most of these kids families have been in the UK for 40+ years. Many probably over 100.

    "product of all that multi-culti bullshit"

    Your statement seems to imply that the UK would be way better off if they had just left all those brown people in the countries Britain tended to have their way with for hundreds of years.

    Multiculturalism has more or less been a success in my country. The people who believe it's "bullshit" tend to be 9 out of 10 times racist IMO.

    And I think maybe the point The_Hook_Up was trying to make. Is that for all your "multi-culti bullshit". The music you seem to idolize is from the direct result of many cultures coming together. Both "culturally and economically". You think the music was from cultures mixing with no riots or poor people getting taken advantage of and rising up?

    exactly the point I was trying to make...granted, my only foray into Brazilian history was Caetano's "Tropical Truth"...but DOR articulated my sentimnent much better than I.

  • bassiebassie 11,710 Posts
    The_Hook_Up said:
    DOR said:
    sabadabada said:


    It's not that the population is "mixed," its the failure to integrate people into the society they have chosen to live in, both culturally and economically.


    Umm. Most of the are kids were born in the 90's. They never chose where they live. Just like they didn't choose to be poor.

    Just because they are brown. Does not mean they are immigrants... I'm betting most of these kids families have been in the UK for 40+ years. Many probably over 100.

    "product of all that multi-culti bullshit"

    Your statement seems to imply that the UK would be way better off if they had just left all those brown people in the countries Britain tended to have their way with for hundreds of years.

    Multiculturalism has more or less been a success in my country. The people who believe it's "bullshit" tend to be 9 out of 10 times racist IMO.

    And I think maybe the point The_Hook_Up was trying to make. Is that for all your "multi-culti bullshit". The music you seem to idolize is from the direct result of many cultures coming together. Both "culturally and economically". You think the music was from cultures mixing with no riots or poor people getting taken advantage of and rising up?

    exactly the point I was trying to make...granted, my only foray into Brazilian history was Caetano's "Tropical Truth"...but DOR articulated my sentiment much better than I.

    DOR is my dude.

    Generally speaking, when a difference of opinions happens, I am not really interested in changing people's minds; it takes away from the quality of discourse when the main objective is about strong-arming the next person, no matter how factual, measured and eloquent.
    Whether Saba sees it different or not, that's for him and his life to figure out. I am just happy he doesn't stoop to the level he used to - hurrah for fatherhood.

    But the bigger deal and outcome for these threads on the Board is that there are really good moments of perspective and ideas that shine through.

  • motown67motown67 4,513 Posts
    To relate the American experience to England and Europe, most of the modern immigration to western Europe was the result of WWII. After the war millions were dead, displaced, and the place was destroyed. That led to a huge labor shortage, which was filled by Europe looking to its colonies to bring in foreign workers. That went from the mid-1940s to 1960s. Most countries didn't expect these people to stay after the work was done but they did. Not only that but it established traditions of immigration from specific regions and cities in the developing world to the developed. When Europe had recovered it had a growing number of immigrants that they didn't especially want so they were segregated with declining job prospects, similar to blacks being segregated in urban America while jobs were migrating to the suburbs after WWII.

  • sticky_dojahsticky_dojah New York City. 2,136 Posts
    motown67 said:
    To relate the American experience to England and Europe, most of the modern immigration to western Europe was the result of WWII. After the war millions were dead, displaced, and the place was destroyed. That led to a huge labor shortage, which was filled by Europe looking to its colonies to bring in foreign workers. That went from the mid-1940s to 1960s. Most countries didn't expect these people to stay after the work was done but they did. Not only that but it established traditions of immigration from specific regions and cities in the developing world to the developed. When Europe had recovered it had a growing number of immigrants that they didn't especially want so they were segregated with declining job prospects, similar to blacks being segregated in urban America while jobs were migrating to the suburbs after WWII.

    I do agree here, but still think that London is one the most positively mixed cities in the world. Seriously, I've never experienced a city where it was so much irrelevant how you look, where you from etc. People mingle much better than let's say in Berlin. At least in my experience. And it wasn't only "Black" or "Brown" people that looted. I don't think you can really pull the race card when it comes to these riots. Maybe it all boils down to education. Then again, I am not an expert on the matter and can only speak from my experience. Btw, I did play this tonight to a crowd that mostly was just born when this did drop. And it went down really well:



  • Really though, all your immigration / race theories fall apart when you look at the riots in Manchester and other parts of the UK.

  • DORDOR Two Ron Toe 9,905 Posts

  • JimsterJimster Cruffiton.etsy.com 6,960 Posts
    neil_something said:
    Really though, all your immegration / race theories fall apart when you look at the riots in Manchester and other parts of the UK.

    Exactly.

    They way I see it is that the idea of theft with seemingly no repercussions is too big a carrot to dangle in front of these feral teenagers. Pls to note I am not tarring all of inner-city youth with the same brush, but the people you see looting are the ones who probably shoplift anyway, or already have some investment in crime.

    Sadly, as it has always been, a career of crime pays better than working towards a raise and has no educational barriers to entry, which means they don't need to bother with all that reading and writing and all that other pussy non-gangsta stuff. Specially if you nick somefink for your mum too.

    Seems to me the rest of the crowd are ghouls, bored, or have some axe to grind with the police. There is no goal to these riots. No agenda.

  • AlmondAlmond 1,427 Posts
    DOR said:

    Yes. Thank you.

  • DuderonomyDuderonomy Haut de la Garenne 7,793 Posts

    My position is that the welfare state [strike]prevents assimilation and[/strike] guarantees a permanent underclass that remains dependent on the government and thus ensures the continuation of the welfare state to the benefit of those that obtain profit or power from the operation of that system.

    And I'll agree with you to a point, but I don't think it's that cut-and-dried.
    This isn't about race. If you want evidence that multiculturalism is alive and well, look at the looters:



    Racial harmony in action, mate.
    The political and financial elite have no qualms about who they oppress, what colour they are, or how long they have lived in England.

  • JuniorJunior 4,853 Posts
    But............but..................99.9% white?

    By the way, if no one else wants it I'm all over this new location.

    SportCasual said:


    one of Soulstrut's foremost purveyors of ghetto reality porn

  • DuderonomyDuderonomy Haut de la Garenne 7,793 Posts
    Junior said:
    But............but..................99.9% white?

    Haha! It's too good to let Harv forget.

  • I'm not making light of the situation, being a Hackney youth worker... Far to much to say, and sad to see the young people we've spent many years working with and ploughing resources into, running amock.

    I want everything, I want it now and it should be given to me for free.....

    One of the inevitable..

    http://photoshoplooter.tumblr.com/

  • Last nights events were nothing more than criminal opportunism, Manchester gang leaders directing youths round the city to loot and cause damage. This isn't a race riot and it's an insult to those who were in the race riots of 1981 and 1985 to suggest they are, but there is the background of discrimination and SUS as well as other social deprivation that leads us to this point. White vigilantes on the streets reportedly (REPORTEDLY - but not a lot, and not on the BBC that i've seen) shouting 'BNP!' and trying to turn this into a race war, very worrying - there are parties that will use this to their advantage for all the wrong reasons.

    Also people on the ground reporting that the youths in Manchester were not local, and of taxi firms ferrying them in. It's hard to know what is truth and what is just bullshit in all this, but people with hope in their lives don't riot and the government need to rethink investment in the areas they have deprived for so many years so that young people have something to get out of bed for in the morning. This is the poorly educated indigenous underclass of England doing something for the thrill and kudos amongst their own peers, it's been going on for years but just not on this scale, and it's not about colour or race right now.

    The children of the children of Thatcher. It was coming.

  • DocMcCoyDocMcCoy "Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,917 Posts
    This ain't good.

  • White vigilantes on the streets of London reports are UNTRUE it seems, nothing more than racist shit from Nick Griffin and his moronic followers, if people want to hit on anything maybe they could pop round his place and sort him out vigilante style the C***.

    The people in Enfield were defending their community, all races and creeds as in Southall.

  • JimsterJimster Cruffiton.etsy.com 6,960 Posts
    http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/odd/news/a334193/london-riots-see-baseball-bat-sales-rise-5000-percent.html

    The sale of baseball bats on Amazon has risen a whopping 5,000% amid the London riots.

    One particular bat, the Rucanor aluminium design, has climbed from 6,500th in the best-selling items list to 125th overnight.

    One customer review, by Harry Fish in Bristol, says: "This bat is perfectly weighted and will suit any UK shop-owner looking to protect their property.

    "Thanks to the ergonomic handle, one easy swing should be enough to shatter patellas, skulls or any other bone on your targeted looter.

    "Personally, I would recommend also investing in some fingerless gloves for extra grip."

    All-metal police batons have also grown considerably in popularity, while the top seven items in the 'Movers and Shakers' in Amazon's 'Sports & Leisure' category can all be used as weapons.

  • OkemOkem 4,617 Posts
    Junior said:
    By the way, if no one else wants it I'm all over this new location.

    SportCasual said:


    one of Soulstrut's foremost purveyors of ghetto reality porn
    I was considering it, but I'm not sure if I can carry the weight of such a crown.

  • DocMcCoyDocMcCoy "Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,917 Posts

  • mrmatthewmrmatthew 1,575 Posts
    http://stereogum.com/779791/indie-labels-suffer-significant-inventory-losses-due-to-london-riots/top-stories/lead-story/


    I am NOT down with this.

    ALthough, we will probably see some real EBAY bargains on yr fave brit electronic new realeases!!!!!!!!

  • HarveyCanalHarveyCanal "a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
    Duderonomy said:
    Junior said:
    But............but..................99.9% white?

    Haha! It's too good to let Harv forget.

    Why would I forget something that is truth?

  • sabadabadasabadabada 5,966 Posts
    soulcitizen said:
    It's hard to know what is truth and what is just bullshit in all this.

    Truth = anything that supports your position that this is the fault of Thatcher and conservative government systematically neglecting and opressing the poor.

    Bullshit = anything that may suggest otherwise.

  • ReynaldoReynaldo 6,054 Posts
    bassie said:
    Generally speaking, when a difference of opinions happens, I am not really interested in changing people's minds;
    That's soft.

  • PATXPATX 2,820 Posts
    Truth rarely exists at the margins, but it is useful to go there and see for yourself. Some people don't get a round trip ticket though and then end up thinking that mind control crop dusters really are the biggest issue facing humanity's future. Or taxes.

  • RockadelicRockadelic Out Digging 13,993 Posts
    What I've read here so far is that the rioters are not affiliated with any particular political stance or party and are just random criminals.

    And that the people wo are patrolling the streets trying to protect their families and property are "right wing".

    So what are the folks on the "left wing" doing during this mess?
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