DId anyone notice Lester's walking styles in Episode 1 of season 5?
It's at 11:50 in, when he's walking up to pretend to buy a newspaper while staking out Chris and Michael. He's got this funny bow-legged speed walker style. And he walks up to a newspaper box that says "AFRO."
I didn't notice anyone talking about it, but how do people feel about the theme song this year? I'm not exactly feeling it. Sounds like a demo version or something. I think season two's was probably the best.
And I think Mao said it better than I could - I definitely feel a bit pressured by the pacing but to just write off the season? "What happened to this show?" "Just melodrama"? You'd think it turned into CSI overnight.
Oliver I think your opinion is totally impacted by the pace at which you rewatched the previous seasons - I had to lay off for a month or so before season 5 started or else I would have had completely unrealistic expectations for it.
It's just another case of people wanting it to be one way. But it's the other way.
There are so many good scenes & moments in 52 (McNulty at the garage unable to get a working vehicle & having to show up at the crime scene via bus; Marlo vs. Avon; Lester staking out the vacant lot on his own time reading miniatures magazines; Lester & McNulty Frickin' w/ their FBI contact in the parking garage - their only outlet for a few laughs their situation is so fucked) delivered in the classic deliberate Wire pace. It more than balances out any issues w/ the newsroom story thread. For me anyways.
53 was paced a little too fast IMO. There is an awful lot they tried to pack in. But I'm invested enough in the story & characters that I'm willing to forgive some over-reaching.
To say that this season outright sucks is way too hasty. No way a season can suck three eps into it when 52 is one of those eps.
I'm not saying the season sucks. It's only 3 in so far, as you note. But what I've seen so far has really astounded me some of the surprising shortcomings, especially how heavy-handed and damn near didactic some of the speech-fying has been. It's not that there has been some slick oratory on the show in the past, it's more that the show is doing a lot of "telling" and not so much "showing." Did we really need, two eps in a row, characters noting, "well, if the victim had been [white, rich, in a different zip code, blah blah blah] things would have played different." That used to be the kind of point the show would find ways of demonstrating without needing a character to come out and voice it.
Personally, on the balance, I like the newsroom stuff but maybe that's just my journalistic bias. I do wish a few of the characters weren't so thin from that world though. I ride for Augustus however.
As for moments I've liked though: Lester, listening to Erma Franklin, on stakeout. In my hubris, I'm wondering if Blake was giving SSV1 some love, ha. I'm bummed he never managed to get "Harlem Hendoo" approved past the directors though.
Personally, on the balance, I like the newsroom stuff but maybe that's just my journalistic bias. I do wish a few of the characters weren't so thin from that world though.
I work in a newsroom and I am pretty much coming to the same conclusion. Sure the executive editor seems extremely naive when he says, "I think it's a good read" or whatever, and the white reporter seems a little too stereotypical as well. Then again, Frank Sobatka (sp?) seemed the same -- your typical "I'd do anything for the union" guy. Come to think of it, I am sure Clay Davis has a softer side but I've yet to see it. I guess some of the folks on the show are plot devices while others are fullly drawn characters.
Also - I have no experience in a newsroom per se but as a former employee of a big corporation that went through massive layoffs I can totally identify - from the no-game asskisser to the slimy boss to the spineless middleman. It didn't seem far fetched at all and I think it balances the port, the street, the classroom, city hall, and the law. You can't portray the decline of the great American city without touching on this in some way.
Personally, on the balance, I like the newsroom stuff but maybe that's just my journalistic bias. I do wish a few of the characters weren't so thin from that world though.
I work in a newsroom and I am pretty much coming to the same conclusion. Sure the executive editor seems extremely naive when he says, "I think it's a good read" or whatever, and the white reporter seems a little too stereotypical as well. Then again, Frank Sobatka (sp?) seemed the same -- your typical "I'd do anything for the union" guy. Come to think of it, I am sure Clay Davis has a softer side but I've yet to see it. I guess some of the folks on the show are plot devices while others are fullly drawn characters.
I don't expect all the characters to be "fully fleshed out." As you point out, Clay is one dimensional but his character serves the show well. The clueless exec editor though? Plot device and a weak one at that. And it looks like Baby Glass is supposed to be the newsroom equivalent of Herc just minus the comic relief quality.
I thought Sobotka was fine; my issue was always with Ziggy though Noz keeps hollering: "but I know B-More dudes just like that!"
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Michael's put on a few too but nothing comes close to Duquan aging what looks like 5 years in the interim.
Is there any hint that we may see Bunny this season? I'm not expecting Namond or Randy to pop in though, alas.
As far as the boys aging, I guess that's the downside of casting age appropriate actors. When I was about their age I grew six inches taller in about six months. As far as Bunny et al. I think one thing about the "wrap up" season is this will be the season of cameos--a lot of other characters will pop in for one or two episode appearances. I've noticed a lot of people, Bunny, Cutty, Namond, Randy, etc not showing up in the opening credits so I don't expect to see them much this season, but they'll probably be seen once or twice. I wouldn't be surprised if we don't see Avon again this season. Plus, Julito has to work on his rapping career--when does the Namond album drop?
I'm not expecting Namond or Randy to pop in though, alas.
Maybe not. I'm gonna guess that we'll see Randy again - based solely on the fact that his character shares the same surname, "Wagstaff", as Cheese (Meth's character). (Too much of a coincidence?)
BTW, anyone else besides me having a hard time separating TV & realilty re: Cheese/Meth? I can't help watching Cheese sell out Omar & Butchy & thinking, "Yeah, that's why your career went down the toilet, Method Man - cause you're doing stupid, shortsighted sh*t like that, you dumb-ass."
lol - despite Meth's insistence on being casted not because he is a rapperdude but because he actually read for the part, I find him pretty flat in contrast to the rest of the cast.
I thought Season 3 was pretty slow in getting going as well.
Yeah, I've been disappointed with the news room subplot so far...although it's still early in the season. We all expect David Simon to be hypercritical of the various social institutions that have been the centerpiece of each season, but I think his view of the B-More Sun is just too black and white. His animosity toward his former employer is well-documented and I think its totally skewed the portrayal of the news room. And the journalistic archetypes he's using are just too stereotypical. The guys running the paper are old, disconnected white guys who have no clue. Of course, the good reporters are the wise black, street smart editor (Augustus) and the wide-eyed naive Latina. Can't forget the villain -- the sneaky, opportunistic young white guy, whose just a Stephen Glass knock-off.
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Here's David Simon talking about what he's up to this season:
I think it's a bit unfair to say Simon is just taking the season to get into the ass of his former employer. I would be really disappointed if that's all it adds up to. We gotta bear in mind that he is introducing totally fresh characters for a 10-ep run, and I think it's important at the start to paint them in broad, obvious strokes. It helps the less fanatical among us to put it all together, I think.
It's not like this hasn't happened before - early in season 4 you have Colvin walking down the halls of Tilghman Middle and looking in on a teacher who's yapping at his class about failing the tests and ending up in jail or dead because of it, then next door down a sweet lady awarding stars to an active and involved class, totally stereotypical "bad teacher"/"good teacher" shit, but that's how you set it up. Did people really think the multi-episode-long confusion about Cheese's dog was great, nuanced television?? "Yo... I had to do it man, my dog! My dog!" And the police just jump up, "he shot his dog!" And pull him in? Talk about a slow start to a season.
The magnifying glass is up and the expectations are high - Simon's only as high on his product as we all are, considering most of us have watched and rewatched the entire series 2, even 3 times at this point. Let's remain reticent shall we?
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And the journalistic archetypes he's using are just too stereotypical. The guys running the paper are old, disconnected white guys who have no clue.
I don't know about journalistic archetypes. In my first job out of undergrad at a biotech company, my boss's boss was nearly a clone of Executive Editor James C. Whiting III, right down to the buzzword mantras and even the suspenders. Perhaps my own experience, filtered through my own biases, leads me to derive particular satisfaction from his depiction in the show. Sadly, old, disconnected white guys who have no clue are very common in office situations, and unfortunately they're almost always the boss--I think a lot of working cats on the board can cosine this statement.
And the journalistic archetypes he's using are just too stereotypical. The guys running the paper are old, disconnected white guys who have no clue.
I don't know about journalistic archetypes. In my first job out of undergrad at a biotech company, my boss's boss was nearly a clone of Executive Editor James C. Whiting III, right down to the buzzword mantras and even the suspenders. Perhaps my own experience, filtered through my own biases, leads me to derive particular satisfaction from his depiction in the show. Sadly, old, disconnected white guys who have no clue are very common in office situations, and unfortunately they're almost always the boss--I think a lot of working cats on the board can cosine this statement.
Sure but as JP pointed out earlier: it's not whether it's "real" or not. It's whether these characters are interesting or contribute much and thus far, it seems like a straw man.
I believe the Cheese dog fighting subplot was concocted by Pelacanos, who fancies himself some sort of expert on dog fighting. Pretty unnecesary but also sorta funny. And the rest of the season was so dope that you hardly even remember that little story. Here's hoping S5 also develops beyond the lame little stories we've seen so far. I'm not holding my breath.
whether Simon wants to "stick it to his old employer" on some personal score-settling is one thing. Not sure about that. What does seem to be going on though, like I said earlier, is Simon's seizing his final chance to show us a little of what HE experienced during his years at the paper. and it seems rushed and contrived.
Did people really think the multi-episode-long confusion about Cheese's dog was great, nuanced television?? "Yo... I had to do it man, my dog! My dog!" And the police just jump up, "he shot his dog!" And pull him in? Talk about a slow start to a season.
I don't know what you're talking about, the scene when Cheese put down his dog was a tearjerker.
Method Man's acting in that season was epic, rivalling Nas's and DMX's performance in Belly.
Oh yeah, one other thing. The fact that Lester's onboard with McNulty's harebrained crazy scheme to concoct a bunch of serial murders pisses me off too.
Oh yeah, one other thing. The fact that Lester's onboard with McNulty's harebrained crazy scheme to concoct a bunch of serial murders pisses me off too.
i dont know man, we had to rewind that scene because we were laughing our asses off that lester was coaching mcnulty on where he went wrong. mcnulty is off his fuckin rocker this season!! that was a really good scene for me because the scene where they kill butchie really brought me down, no shit i shed a few tears. so it was good to get some laughter in.
and paycheck, last night i told my friends "its funny how we talk about the characters like theyre real people"
homeboys comment to bug about his dolphin had me crackin up too.
i was okay with the first two episodes but this third episode just seemed really forced for some reason. not really digging the way mcnutty is drumming up interest in his "serial killer." his whole drunken "LOL A RIBBON" performance along with bunk all tripping came off real fake
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It's at 11:50 in, when he's walking up to pretend to buy a newspaper while staking out Chris and Michael. He's got this funny bow-legged speed walker style. And he walks up to a newspaper box that says "AFRO."
I didn't notice anyone talking about it, but how do people feel about the theme song this year? I'm not exactly feeling it. Sounds like a demo version or something. I think season two's was probably the best.
That's the local Af/Am paper for Baltimore city and surrounding counties.
Oliver I think your opinion is totally impacted by the pace at which you rewatched the previous seasons - I had to lay off for a month or so before season 5 started or else I would have had completely unrealistic expectations for it.
It's just another case of people wanting it to be one way. But it's the other way.
I'm not saying the season sucks. It's only 3 in so far, as you note. But what I've seen so far has really astounded me some of the surprising shortcomings, especially how heavy-handed and damn near didactic some of the speech-fying has been. It's not that there has been some slick oratory on the show in the past, it's more that the show is doing a lot of "telling" and not so much "showing." Did we really need, two eps in a row, characters noting, "well, if the victim had been [white, rich, in a different zip code, blah blah blah] things would have played different." That used to be the kind of point the show would find ways of demonstrating without needing a character to come out and voice it.
Personally, on the balance, I like the newsroom stuff but maybe that's just my journalistic bias. I do wish a few of the characters weren't so thin from that world though. I ride for Augustus however.
As for moments I've liked though: Lester, listening to Erma Franklin, on stakeout. In my hubris, I'm wondering if Blake was giving SSV1 some love, ha. I'm bummed he never managed to get "Harlem Hendoo" approved past the directors though.
Did the FBI agent get really fat? His face looked like it gained about 10 lbs.
I noticed this and thought it was intentional - sitting around waiting for Osama to show up in Maryland can't be good for your physical fitness.
Michael's put on a few too but nothing comes close to Duquan aging what looks like 5 years in the interim.
Is there any hint that we may see Bunny this season? I'm not expecting Namond or Randy to pop in though, alas.
somebody mentioned earlier in this thread or in the other one about a bearded bunny at some point down the line.
I work in a newsroom and I am pretty much coming to the same conclusion. Sure the executive editor seems extremely naive when he says, "I think it's a good read" or whatever, and the white reporter seems a little too stereotypical as well. Then again, Frank Sobatka (sp?) seemed the same -- your typical "I'd do anything for the union" guy. Come to think of it, I am sure Clay Davis has a softer side but I've yet to see it. I guess some of the folks on the show are plot devices while others are fullly drawn characters.
I don't expect all the characters to be "fully fleshed out." As you point out, Clay is one dimensional but his character serves the show well. The clueless exec editor though? Plot device and a weak one at that. And it looks like Baby Glass is supposed to be the newsroom equivalent of Herc just minus the comic relief quality.
I thought Sobotka was fine; my issue was always with Ziggy though Noz keeps hollering: "but I know B-More dudes just like that!"
As far as the boys aging, I guess that's the downside of casting age appropriate actors. When I was about their age I grew six inches taller in about six months. As far as Bunny et al. I think one thing about the "wrap up" season is this will be the season of cameos--a lot of other characters will pop in for one or two episode appearances. I've noticed a lot of people, Bunny, Cutty, Namond, Randy, etc not showing up in the opening credits so I don't expect to see them much this season, but they'll probably be seen once or twice. I wouldn't be surprised if we don't see Avon again this season. Plus, Julito has to work on his rapping career--when does the Namond album drop?
Maybe not. I'm gonna guess that we'll see Randy again - based solely on the fact that his character shares the same surname, "Wagstaff", as Cheese (Meth's character). (Too much of a coincidence?)
BTW, anyone else besides me having a hard time separating TV & realilty re: Cheese/Meth? I can't help watching Cheese sell out Omar & Butchy & thinking, "Yeah, that's why your career went down the toilet, Method Man - cause you're doing stupid, shortsighted sh*t like that, you dumb-ass."
Randy coming, just wait...
I thought Season 3 was pretty slow in getting going as well.
My Nemisis, from the Stoop Storytelling Series
He seems to think that they wouldn't sacrifice storytelling to settle beef, I guess we'll have to see how it plays out in the season.
It's not like this hasn't happened before - early in season 4 you have Colvin walking down the halls of Tilghman Middle and looking in on a teacher who's yapping at his class about failing the tests and ending up in jail or dead because of it, then next door down a sweet lady awarding stars to an active and involved class, totally stereotypical "bad teacher"/"good teacher" shit, but that's how you set it up. Did people really think the multi-episode-long confusion about Cheese's dog was great, nuanced television?? "Yo... I had to do it man, my dog! My dog!" And the police just jump up, "he shot his dog!" And pull him in? Talk about a slow start to a season.
The magnifying glass is up and the expectations are high - Simon's only as high on his product as we all are, considering most of us have watched and rewatched the entire series 2, even 3 times at this point. Let's remain reticent shall we?
I don't know about journalistic archetypes. In my first job out of undergrad at a biotech company, my boss's boss was nearly a clone of Executive Editor James C. Whiting III, right down to the buzzword mantras and even the suspenders. Perhaps my own experience, filtered through my own biases, leads me to derive particular satisfaction from his depiction in the show. Sadly, old, disconnected white guys who have no clue are very common in office situations, and unfortunately they're almost always the boss--I think a lot of working cats on the board can cosine this statement.
Sure but as JP pointed out earlier: it's not whether it's "real" or not. It's whether these characters are interesting or contribute much and thus far, it seems like a straw man.
whether Simon wants to "stick it to his old employer" on some personal score-settling is one thing. Not sure about that. What does seem to be going on though, like I said earlier, is Simon's seizing his final chance to show us a little of what HE experienced during his years at the paper. and it seems rushed and contrived.
I don't know what you're talking about, the scene when Cheese put down his dog was a tearjerker.
Method Man's acting in that season was epic, rivalling Nas's and DMX's performance in Belly.
that was a really good scene for me because the scene where they kill butchie really brought me down, no shit i shed a few tears. so it was good to get some laughter in.
and paycheck, last night i told my friends "its funny how we talk about the characters like theyre real people"
homeboys comment to bug about his dolphin had me crackin up too.
I think Spider is not long for this world.