Deflategate and All Things Superbowl

LaserWolfLaserWolf Portland Oregon 11,518 Posts
edited January 2015 in Strut Central
«13456

  Comments


  • RockadelicRockadelic Out Digging 13,993 Posts
    The atmospheric pressure explanation was the biggest crock of bullshit ever.

    Pats should haved come out and just said that it was obvious someone had fucked with the air pressure and they hope the NFL gets to the bottom of it.

    If I was an Olympic Shot Putter and I shaved one lousy pound off the shot and won the Gold Medal would anyone care that I cheated?
    Would they let me keep my Gold Medal?

  • Yawn.

    Cheaterz gon' cheat.

  • volumenvolumen 2,529 Posts
    They are cheating again and making excuses again. No real surprise. Sports is full of cheating. The nfl is more worked about shoe color and crotch grabs. Not worried about cheating, concussion or wife beating.

  • PrimeCutsLtdPrimeCutsLtd jersey fresh 2,632 Posts
    This just in...Robert Kraft: NFL should apologize to Patriots if football tampering isn’t proven

  • JRootJRoot 861 Posts
    I don't really care about the PSI in the balls, but ..having a softer football makes it easier to grip -- for QBs, for receivers, for RBs. The data regarding the Patriots fumble rates at home are pretty staggering, and date back to 2007. It seems likely that they have been tampering with the PSI on the footballs for a long time. It also seems likely that the NFL is not going to take any action until long after the Super Bowl, during which the Patriots won't be able to tamper with the PSI of the football (we assume).

    Go Seahawks!

    JRoot

    PS USC tried to deflate the footballs against Oregon a few years ago. It does nothing for the defense, which yielded like 800 yards of total offense, and over 200 yards on the ground to Kenjon Barner. Kiffin sacked the equipment manager after....and he was later sacked.

  • Rockadelic said:
    The atmospheric pressure explanation was the biggest crock of bullshit ever.

    Pats should haved come out and just said that it was obvious someone had fucked with the air pressure and they hope the NFL gets to the bottom of it.

    If I was an Olympic Shot Putter and I shaved one lousy pound off the shot and won the Gold Medal would anyone care that I cheated?
    Would they let me keep my Gold Medal?

    I love that this site's leading climate change denialist is now denying that a ball inflated at 70 degrees will lose pressure if brought into an environment at 40 degrees.

    That's just perfect.

    I also like how the league is releasing information by dribs and drabs via the highly scientific method of the LEAK. That's also perfect.

    Let's see the exact PSI readings for all balls used or available for the game pre-game, at halftime, and after the game. No more nonsense, no more bullshit. If Mr. Rock is aware of some reason why the laws of physics don't apply to footballs let's see it. Of course he's a right-wing Texan, so he believes in magic, so maybe that's his reason.

    Eventually all sane, educated adults will realize Deflategate was a national mania driven by poor education and intense jealousy of the only football team based in the best-educated part of the country.

    I'm also unfamiliar with an NFL team that hasn't "cheated." But the mania only seems to apply to the century's most successful franchise. Grow up, America. Embrace science. Resist popular manias.

  • PrimeCutsLtd said:
    This just in...Robert Kraft: NFL should apologize to Patriots if football tampering isn’t proven

    Indeed they should. The NFL should also stop running investigations like a sieve.

    It's amazing how many hipsters are slurping the NFL's authority dick like it's the best thing they ever tasted on this one. How many screw-ups does Goodell get before people realize there's no middle in his Tootsie Roll?

  • RockadelicRockadelic Out Digging 13,993 Posts
    LazarusOblong said:
    Rockadelic said:
    The atmospheric pressure explanation was the biggest crock of bullshit ever.

    Pats should haved come out and just said that it was obvious someone had fucked with the air pressure and they hope the NFL gets to the bottom of it.

    If I was an Olympic Shot Putter and I shaved one lousy pound off the shot and won the Gold Medal would anyone care that I cheated?
    Would they let me keep my Gold Medal?

    I love that this site's leading climate change denialist is now denying that a ball inflated at 70 degrees will lose pressure if brought into an environment at 40 degrees.

    That's just perfect.

    I also like how the league is releasing information by dribs and drabs via the highly scientific method of the LEAK. That's also perfect.

    Let's see the exact PSI readings for all balls used or available for the game pre-game, at halftime, and after the game. No more nonsense, no more bullshit. If Mr. Rock is aware of some reason why the laws of physics don't apply to footballs let's see it. Of course he's a right-wing Texan, so he believes in magic, so maybe that's his reason.

    Eventually all sane, educated adults will realize Deflategate was a national mania driven by poor education and intense jealousy of the only football team based in the best-educated part of the country.

    I'm also unfamiliar with an NFL team that hasn't "cheated." But the mania only seems to apply to the century's most successful franchise. Grow up, America. Embrace science. Resist popular manias.

    Amazing how the law of physics only worked on one teams balls.

    But you're right, all teams cheat so who cares......ummm....I mean there was no cheating.....Science!



    New England is favored by 5 over East Anglia.

    Coach B > Al Gore


  • Rockadelic said:
    LazarusOblong said:
    Rockadelic said:
    The atmospheric pressure explanation was the biggest crock of bullshit ever.

    Pats should haved come out and just said that it was obvious someone had fucked with the air pressure and they hope the NFL gets to the bottom of it.

    If I was an Olympic Shot Putter and I shaved one lousy pound off the shot and won the Gold Medal would anyone care that I cheated?
    Would they let me keep my Gold Medal?

    I love that this site's leading climate change denialist is now denying that a ball inflated at 70 degrees will lose pressure if brought into an environment at 40 degrees.

    That's just perfect.

    I also like how the league is releasing information by dribs and drabs via the highly scientific method of the LEAK. That's also perfect.

    Let's see the exact PSI readings for all balls used or available for the game pre-game, at halftime, and after the game. No more nonsense, no more bullshit. If Mr. Rock is aware of some reason why the laws of physics don't apply to footballs let's see it. Of course he's a right-wing Texan, so he believes in magic, so maybe that's his reason.

    Eventually all sane, educated adults will realize Deflategate was a national mania driven by poor education and intense jealousy of the only football team based in the best-educated part of the country.

    I'm also unfamiliar with an NFL team that hasn't "cheated." But the mania only seems to apply to the century's most successful franchise. Grow up, America. Embrace science. Resist popular manias.

    Amazing how the law of physics only worked on one teams balls.

    But you're right, all teams cheat so who cares......ummm....I mean there was no cheating.....Science!



    New England is favored by 5 over East Anglia.

    Coach B > Al Gore

    I don't recall saying anything about one team's balls being different from another's. The rules of physics apply in this world, even if they don't in Richworld, Texas, and Goodellworld.

    From Peter King:

    "I got a great and well-reasoned email from Tom Bannister, a chemistry professor from The Scripps Research Institute in Jupiter, Fla., Monday. I will save the explanation of the difference between absolute pressure and relative pressure, and other complex topics. But I called Bannister after getting his smart email, and you’ll see why in a moment.
    Key points from his email:

    “By the ideal gas law, a football inflated to 12.5 at 72 degrees and cooled to 51 degrees [the temperature on the field during the first half] will have a final pressure of 11.43 psi, thus a loss of 1.16 psi … A second factor, the expansion of a football as it gets wet, also leads to a drop in psi. This factor contributes another 0.7 psi in pressure drop … Plain English ultimate conclusion: It would be reasonable to expect, based on both experimental results and ideal gas law calculations, for a pressure drop in excess of 1.5 psi to have occurred within the Patriots footballs in the first half, based on the known game-time conditions and the observation that the footballs were inflated to 12.5 relative psi at room temperature.

    “[But] what about the Colts footballs? We don’t know their initial pressure, but if we assume that they were the maximum legal pressure of 13.5 psi relative pressure, we can calculate the expected pressure drop. Thus the Colts footballs should have been a final pressure of 12.3 psi. The legal lower limit is 12.5 psi. The Colts footballs should have been illegal by 0.2 psi. Question: Would a referee call a reading of 12.3 rather than 12.5 to be clearly out of specifications and illegal? Maybe yes, maybe no. It certainly depends on both the accuracy and precision of the pressure gauge.

    “Final conclusion: It is not unreasonable at all to assume that the Patriots balls would fail the inspection and the Colts balls would (barely) pass, based upon logical assumptions of inflation levels, inflation temperatures in concert with the issues of temperature-related gas expansion, the expansion properties of a leather football as it becomes water-soaked, and the human-element.”

    So I called Bannister Monday, and we discussed it. I said the assumption is the Colts footballs were at the higher pressure level, and that’s perhaps why they didn’t flunk the halftime pressure test; but there’s no proof of that. But if the Colts did deliver footballs to the officials at 13.5 PSI, then clearly there’s a chance the pressure level would have hovered around 12.5 PSI, and it’s possible the differing results have to do with where each football that was tested was set before the game.

    In other words, there’s much we don’t know.

    “There’s a lot of missing pieces in this story,” Bannister said."

    Now why does Rock assume the Colts balls didn't vary at all under any conditions? Well, it's because Rock is readin bad information provided by uneducated people and he's not using critical thinking ability to sift through the bullshit. As always - and there are NO exceptions to this in his repertoire - he "goes with his gut." It's a Texan thing.

    If he'd settled in civilization he might go with his brain instead. But, nope. Ain't no ball pressure fluctuatin' on his watch, no matter what the immutable laws of physics say. Those goddamn commies from Massachusetts got no bizness mixin' science with football. Physics, huh, wutzat? Phys Ed is all a real 'Merican really needs.

  • rain103rain103 476 Posts
    volumen said:
    They are cheating again and making excuses again. No real surprise. Sports is full of cheating. The nfl is more worked about shoe color and crotch grabs. Not worried about cheating, concussion or wife beating.

    Exactly. I sure hope the Hawks can be in a position, at some point, late in Sunday's game where Lynch can do a crotch grab flying across the endzone. Lawd that'd be great!

    Anyone else catch former Seahawk corner, Brandon Browner, talking to ESPN about wanting his new Patriot teammates to injure / break injured Seahawks - Earl Thomas and Richard Sherman?


  • RockadelicRockadelic Out Digging 13,993 Posts
    [Those goddamn commies from Massachusetts got no bizness mixin' science with football. Physics, huh, wutzat? Phys Ed is all a real 'Merican really needs.

    I understand that this is your team....but at least have some balls and say "Yeah, we cheated. So what, everybody cheats. We did it before and we'll do it again. Fuck the NFL. What are they gonna do, kick us out of the Super Bowl? Give us the measly $25K fine and be done with it. And if given the opportunity we'll do it again. Fine us all you want"

    Only a fool would think that Coach B or Tom Brady personally deflated these footballs. But did some flunky do it because some other flunky told him to......yeah, I believe that 100%. And for all I know that flunky's name was Atmos Phericpressure. But if anything ever was "Man-Made" it was this.

    The NFL won't say a word until the Super Bowl is over, but in the meantime all these Bill Cosby-like defenses are pretty damn amusing.


  • JimsterJimster Let go me ting, duppy, let go me hand 6,551 Posts
    As a limey NFL fan, I was surprised to learn the officials don't control the balls through the game. I'd have thought they'd have a pool of 'em and swap them in/out every down or at least every quarter.

    Y'know, like at Wimbledon tennis, where the chair guy says (in posh accent)

    "New balls, please."

    ...and everyone in the world sniggers.

    Didn't they used to accuse Ray Guy (Oakland Raiders punter in the 70s) of using balls with Helium in them, to explain the unusually long hang-times he could achieve?

  • JimsterJimster Let go me ting, duppy, let go me hand 6,551 Posts
    Then there was Lester Hayes, with the "Stickum"...


  • RockadelicRockadelic Out Digging 13,993 Posts
    J i m s t e r said:
    Then there was Lester Hayes, with the "Stickum"...

    .
    When Hayes used it there was no rule against it. The NFL banned its use in 1981 with what some called The Lester Hayes Rule.

  • [Those goddamn commies from Massachusetts got no bizness mixin' science with football. Physics, huh, wutzat? Phys Ed is all a real 'Merican really needs.

    I understand that this is your team....but at least have some balls and say "Yeah, we cheated. So what, everybody cheats. We did it before and we'll do it again. Fuck the NFL. What are they gonna do, kick us out of the Super Bowl? Give us the measly $25K fine and be done with it. And if given the opportunity we'll do it again. Fine us all you want"

    Only a fool would think that Coach B or Tom Brady personally deflated these footballs. But did some flunky do it because some other flunky told him to......yeah, I believe that 100%. And for all I know that flunky's name was Atmos Phericpressure. But if anything ever was "Man-Made" it was this.

    The NFL won't say a word until the Super Bowl is over, but in the meantime all these Bill Cosby-like defenses are pretty damn amusing.

    I'm not a Texan, so I don't think with my balls. That's not their function. I use my brain. I've spent a lot of time training it to spot bullshit, and the NFL's accusations stink heavily of bullshit.

    Their latest LEAK involves a Patriots staffer who is on tape carrying the 24 balls (12 for each team) and (shock!) "disappears" into a bathroom for 90 seconds. Yup, 90 whole seconds. During which time I'm sure your Texan balls suspect he used evil Belichickian magic to separate the 12 evil Patriot balls (which are easy to spot, because they're not good and pure like Texan balls) and deflate them to perfect Brady-specs. All in 90 seconds.

    Sure he did.

    If I start an evolution thread will you and your science-denying balls come in and ask, "If evolution is real why do we still have monkeys"? Might as well, because science is bunk.

    The balls say so.

  • J i m s t e r said:
    As a limey NFL fan, I was surprised to learn the officials don't control the balls through the game. I'd have thought they'd have a pool of 'em and swap them in/out every down or at least every quarter.

    Y'know, like at Wimbledon tennis, where the chair guy says (in posh accent)

    "New balls, please."

    ...and everyone in the world sniggers.

    Didn't they used to accuse Ray Guy (Oakland Raiders punter in the 70s) of using balls with Helium in them, to explain the unusually long hang-times he could achieve?

    The league does control the balls during the Super Bowl. Can't have magic there.

  • JRoot said:
    I don't really care about the PSI in the balls, but ..having a softer football makes it easier to grip -- for QBs, for receivers, for RBs. The data regarding the Patriots fumble rates at home are pretty staggering, and date back to 2007. It seems likely that they have been tampering with the PSI on the footballs for a long time. It also seems likely that the NFL is not going to take any action until long after the Super Bowl, during which the Patriots won't be able to tamper with the PSI of the football (we assume).

    Of course it also turns out that that much-trumpeted 'fumble data' is also bullshit, but there is probably no way in hell you'll agree.




    http://soshcentral.com/football-science/football-statistics/2015/01/27/fumbling-data-truth-patriots-fumble-rate/

  • LaserWolfLaserWolf Portland Oregon 11,518 Posts
    It's kind of sad how in denial Patriots fans are.
    First they turned to MIT to try to show that balls deflate themselves.

    Then there is this desperate attempt to recalculate the fumble rate:
    http://soshcentral.com/football-science/football-statistics/2015/01/27/fumbling-data-truth-patriots-fumble-rate/

    Even after selectively recalculating the numbers the results are:
    "Comparing this to Sharp’s original table, the data shows that the Patriots still have an advantage in ball security, even when comparing the same players."

    Unless fans hold teams/players responsible, they will continue to cheat.

    6 months from now, some poor equipment manager, ball boy or intern, will be charged with deflating the balls and lose their job/reputation. That or become an instant Boston celebrity and run for Mayor.

  • LaserWolf said:
    It's kind of sad how in denial Patriots fans are.
    First they turned to MIT to try to show that balls deflate themselves.

    Then there is this desperate attempt to recalculate the fumble rate:
    http://soshcentral.com/football-science/football-statistics/2015/01/27/fumbling-data-truth-patriots-fumble-rate/

    Even after selectively recalculating the numbers the results are:
    "Comparing this to Sharp’s original table, the data shows that the Patriots still have an advantage in ball security, even when comparing the same players."

    Unless fans hold teams/players responsible, they will continue to cheat.

    6 months from now, some poor equipment manager, ball boy or intern, will be charged with deflating the balls and lose their job/reputation. That or become an instant Boston celebrity and run for Mayor.

    I know you're an idiot and you know nothing about football, Lazy, but even your basic mind should be able to grasp that you don't have to cheat in order to be better at something than someone else is.

    I'm sure that fact is driven home to you every day by most personal interactions you have.

    The Patriots put more emphasis on ball security than any other team in the league. Players who fumble get benched. Stevan Ridley is their best all-around running back but he has been benched repeatedly after fumbling.

    Here's another article debunking the sad "Sharp" fumble claims:

    http://regressing.deadspin.com/why-those-statistics-about-the-patriots-fumbles-are-mos-1681805710

    Too many big words for Wolfie, but them's the breaks.


  • RockadelicRockadelic Out Digging 13,993 Posts
    PatrickCrazy said:

    But, but, but.......Texas, Evolution, Idiots, Climate Change, Physics, Republicans, Science, Texas, Rick Perry, 'Merica, Monkeys, Texas.


  • Bon VivantBon Vivant The Eye of the Storm 2,018 Posts
    Does anyone really believe the Colts got served because of some underinflated footballs?

    The Colts don't.

  • I can't believe I read this whole thread.

    You guys bicker about football just like you do about politics. I don't even care who's right. Especially about this shit.


  • RockadelicRockadelic Out Digging 13,993 Posts
    Bon Vivant said:
    Does anyone really believe the Colts got served because of some underinflated footballs?

    The Colts don't.

    Nope....the Pats were the better team hands down....making the whole episode even more absurd.

  • as the person who I imagine has played more football than anyone else in this thread let me tell you a 1lb under inflated football is absolutely 0% easier to not fumble.

  • LaserWolfLaserWolf Portland Oregon 11,518 Posts
    Amphibious I believe you.
    This isn't about the advantage.
    It isnt about who would have won.
    It is about cheating.

    For me, the NFL has sucked almost all the fun out of football. It is a game of complex rules and finding the loopholes. NE is great at finding the loopholes, they have proved that over and over. And they are great at cheating the rules. Getting caught over and over.

    But that is just one part of the sucked out fun. Injuries, penalties, tv time outs, and video reviews, has added an extra 2-3hrs to the game.

    I loved football until Joe Theismann's leg was broken. For the rest of that season, seemingly every football game had a moment when they would show his leg getting broke, the announcer would say "you hate to see that, lets watch it one more time".

    The Seahawks dynamic play and the trend to no huddle offense has me mildly interested again.

    But there is a black cloud of injuries, and amorality, that looms over the game.

  • DB_CooperDB_Cooper Manhatin' 7,823 Posts
    Dudes want to make deflated ball jokes about the grumpy old man and the handsome millionaire with the supermodel wife. I am not impressed.


  • volumenvolumen 2,529 Posts
    Yes. The point is they tried to break the rules to gain and advantage and then lied about it. Wheather it helped them or not is irrelevant.

    I'm more worried about this

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/01/28/marshawn-lynch-cap_n_6564812.html


  • RockadelicRockadelic Out Digging 13,993 Posts
    volumen said:
    Yes. The point is they tried to break the rules to gain and advantage and then lied about it. Wheather it helped them or not is irrelevant.


    Ex-NFL Quarterback Jeff Blake came out yesterday and stated that the practice of deflating the balls was commonplace and that every team did/does it. I believe that and Blake has no reason to lie.

    Like I said earlier, who cares, admit it and take your fine. What irks me is Bellicheat being so arrogant that he thinks he can piss on the leg of NFL fans and convince them it's raining. He's full of shit and so are all the Patriot fans who blindly back up his line of bullshit.

    http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/12244290/ex-quarterback-jeff-blake-deflating-footballs-common

  • also, how does no one believe you can loose 1 lb of pressure going from warm indoor situation to cold wet outdoor situation? y'all never tried to play basketball in the winter and had no bounce?
Sign In or Register to comment.