So I guess Gang of Four, The Minutemen, Band of Gypsys, Rare Earth, Big Boys, Gong...since they are "funky" they are funk and they were played on R&B radio and you can find their records in the R&B bins?
since they are "funky" they are funk and they were played on R&B radio and you can find their records in the R&B bins?
Huh?
OK let's go back to square one:
You dudes are saying Funkadelic is first and foremost a ROCK band. Correct?
you said since funkadelic was "funky" therefore they were a funk band.
So I listed other bands that are funky, but still rock bands...meaning they were not played on r&b radio and their records are NOT found in the r&b bins...but for some reason you said if a band is "funky" they are, by default, a funk band. So I suppose you consider those bands "funk" bands because "funky" is the only requirement for a band being a funk band.
And a band's opinion about it's own music? MEANINGLESS.
I realize you're being facetious, but I think this part is mostly true, actually. You know, "Never trust the artist, trust the tale," and all that.
I mean, Chuck Berry tells anybody who will listen that the most important thing about his music is that it sold. At any given moment, there are dozens of bands wearing dumb hats and grinding out remedial Wild Cherry covers in shithole college bars and billing themselves as "the funkiest band in the land." I read something where your man Chris Martin described the music of Coldplay as "orgasm-inducing." All of these people are, to a greater or lesser degree, wrong about their own music.
Now, I'm not saying that Ballz "Worst Username Since YoungCream" Deep is right, but these selectively deployed "But the band themselves said..." type arguments are kinda ridiculous.
I always though Funkadelic was the Rock side and Parliment the Funk side.
I've read that, too, but I don't hear much of a difference. Parliament's Osmium might as well be early 70s Funkadelic with cleaner production.
Maybe the Parliaments were more soulish, but as soon as they depluralized their name, all bets were off - there was hardly any diff at all, IMO.
Wasn't the name change to Funkadelic due to Holland/Dozier/Holland owning the name Parliament, or at least Parliament being under contract with Invictus therefore they had to record under a different name for Westbound? When they had the right to the name they then made the distinction between the 2...Funkadelic continued the rock end of things and Parliament the funk/dance end of things for records...hence going by Parkiament/Funkadelic then ultimately P-Funk for live performances. Or I might be completely wrong.
That's pretty much it, and Pickwick is tripping if he can't hear the difference, because they don't sound alike at all (Osmium is an anomaly that predates the split).
For one, there's barely any horns on any Funkadelic records, and the horn charts are a huge part of the Parliament sound. There's virtually no guitar solos on Parliament records, and the guitars are of course a big part of Funkadelic.
Do you really think Mothership Connection sounds like Maggot Brain?
No, I'd compare Mothership Connection to the later, Warners-era Funkadelic (One Nation Under A Groove, Hardcore Jollies, etc.).
Other than that, I see your point. I shouldn't have said they sounded alike. But I will say similar. Just with different elements emphasized (like what you just said about Parliament=horns/Funkadelic=guitars).
And a band's opinion about it's own music? MEANINGLESS.
I realize you're being facetious, but I think this part is mostly true, actually. You know, "Never trust the artist, trust the tale," and all that.
I mean, Chuck Berry tells anybody who will listen that the most important thing about his music is that it sold. At any given moment, there are dozens of bands wearing dumb hats and grinding out remedial Wild Cherry covers in shithole college bars and billing themselves as "the funkiest band in the land." I read something where your man Chris Martin described the music of Coldplay as "orgasm-inducing." All of these people are, to a greater or lesser degree, wrong about their own music.
Now, I'm not saying that Ballz "Worst Username Since YoungCream" Deep is right, but these selectively deployed "But the band themselves said..." type arguments are kinda ridiculous.
That depends on the band. In this case I think they knew what they were talking about, that's why I selectively deployed that here.
The fact is that they referred to themselves as a rock band over and over again in dozens of interviews I have read, from the beginning up until now.
Not saying you're lying, but I'd love to read a few of these dozens of interviews for context.
There was a book that came out in 1998, George Clinton & P-Funk, an oral history edited by Dave Marsh. There are quite a few isolated quotes which indicate they thought of themselves just as much a rock band as a funk band. It's too long to print here (i.e, I don't feel like transcribing that long-ass paragraph - LOL!), but on page 32, Billy Bass is quoted as saying that he listened to albums by Cream, Hendrix, the Beatles and Blue Cheer "diligently, every day," to the point where it influenced his playing and his outlook on music. "After I heard that stuff, I knew that I couldn't just play rhythm & blues constantly. I had to be able to branch out and play it all."
After an epiphany like that, I highly doubt that my man had aspirations to play in a typical, regulation R&B revue.
And a band's opinion about it's own music? MEANINGLESS.
I realize you're being facetious, but I think this part is mostly true, actually. You know, "Never trust the artist, trust the tale," and all that.
I mean, Chuck Berry tells anybody who will listen that the most important thing about his music is that it sold. At any given moment, there are dozens of bands wearing dumb hats and grinding out remedial Wild Cherry covers in shithole college bars and billing themselves as "the funkiest band in the land." I read something where your man Chris Martin described the music of Coldplay as "orgasm-inducing." All of these people are, to a greater or lesser degree, wrong about their own music.
Now, I'm not saying that Ballz "Worst Username Since YoungCream" Deep is right, but these selectively deployed "But the band themselves said..." type arguments are kinda ridiculous.
That depends on the band. In this case I think they knew what they were talking about
I disagree. I think they were influenced by and felt a kinship with rock bands (I've read more than a couple interviews where George Clinton makes it a point to say that Funkadelic was "like a black Stooges--yeah!"), and I know that rock dudes love love love to be able to plant their flag in the occasional black band, but at some point in conversations like this one you've gotta step back from the fine-grain, take in the bulk, and weigh shit. And when you do, I think only fools and horses would say that the total sound of Funkadelic (or the Isleys or whoever) bears out the idea that they were a fucking rock band.
Because we can sit here and point to Aspirational Clinton Quote X or Eddie Hazel Riff Y and say "See?! See?! Right there! Right there! That's rock!" and maybe cobble together a twenty- or thirty- or whatever-percent share to file under "ROCK," but when looked at in the context of things like, you know, Lyrics, and Rhythms, and Subject Matter, and Phrasing, and Presentation, and The Other Seventy Percent Of The Music They Ever Released, I think the wrongheadedness of trying to contain them within The Rock Conversation becomes clear.
I mean, I know that a lot of this kind of stuff is just parlor games ("Can: GOAT funk band? Discuss!"), but come the fuck on.
Put differently/less antagonistically: Even if you or I or George or Eddie or whoever thinks that Funkadelic was a great rock band, can anyone really say that Funkadelic was a better rock band than they were a funk band?
And how is Chris Martin "my man"?
Beats me. I'm mostly just trying to distract from the fact that I at some point sat down and read a Chris Martin interview.
Even if you or I or George or Eddie or whoever thinks that Funkadelic was a great rock band, can anyone really say that Funkadelic was a better rock band than they were a funk band?
I think they kicked ass both ways.
Just like Cal Tjader seems to get his props in both jazz and Latin music circles.
I still think Molly Hatchet are in with a shout on the funk band doe.
It's Southern Boogie though.
Like, 'boogie', like funky disco boogie, nahmsayin?***
Anyways, I'm in total agreement with James here and many dudes are reaching like Stretch Armstrong up in this bith to shoehorn their PMG faves into the mix.
Comments
are a rock band.
WELL I'LL BE DAD-GUMMED.
Dude listen to their records.
The whole " they dont call themselves a Rock band or they are filed with other Black genres" dont mean shit.
Right, because the important thing about music is how it is labeled, not what it sounds like.
And a band's opinion about it's own music? MEANINGLESS.
OK let me go throw on Not Just Knee Deep and One Nation Under A Groove and I'll get back to ya.
;-P
Who Says A Funk Band Cant Play Rock?!
Exactly. It sounds funky to me, hence a "funk" band.
Did they ever deny being a "funk" band?
Oops, sorry... more nonsense.
You said it!
I'm standing my ground folls!
I got bullied in the PIR thread... ain't gonna happen again!
:icegrill:
So I guess Gang of Four, The Minutemen, Band of Gypsys, Rare Earth, Big Boys, Gong...since they are "funky" they are funk and they were played on R&B radio and you can find their records in the R&B bins?
Huh?
OK let's go back to square one:
You dudes are saying Funkadelic is first and foremost a ROCK band. Correct?
No, but they said all along that they were a rock band, a simple and undeniable fact that you are, for whatever reason, incapable of acknowledging.
Can't argue with the facts!
you said since funkadelic was "funky" therefore they were a funk band.
So I listed other bands that are funky, but still rock bands...meaning they were not played on r&b radio and their records are NOT found in the r&b bins...but for some reason you said if a band is "funky" they are, by default, a funk band. So I suppose you consider those bands "funk" bands because "funky" is the only requirement for a band being a funk band.
NO, they are not funk bands. They are rock bands with occasional funky material.
Just like Funkadelic is a funk band with occasional rockin' material.
Is this really so outlandish of an opinion to have?
I mean, Chuck Berry tells anybody who will listen that the most important thing about his music is that it sold. At any given moment, there are dozens of bands wearing dumb hats and grinding out remedial Wild Cherry covers in shithole college bars and billing themselves as "the funkiest band in the land." I read something where your man Chris Martin described the music of Coldplay as "orgasm-inducing." All of these people are, to a greater or lesser degree, wrong about their own music.
Now, I'm not saying that Ballz "Worst Username Since YoungCream" Deep is right, but these selectively deployed "But the band themselves said..." type arguments are kinda ridiculous.
Right. And you can say the same thing about Grand FUNK Railroad. Your point?
Not saying you're lying, but I'd love to read a few of these dozens of interviews for context.
Sure you are, you just don't want to side with the new guy.
No, I'd compare Mothership Connection to the later, Warners-era Funkadelic (One Nation Under A Groove, Hardcore Jollies, etc.).
Other than that, I see your point. I shouldn't have said they sounded alike. But I will say similar. Just with different elements emphasized (like what you just said about Parliament=horns/Funkadelic=guitars).
That depends on the band. In this case I think they knew what they were talking about, that's why I selectively deployed that here.
And how is Chris Martin "my man"?
But yeah, what James said.
There was a book that came out in 1998, George Clinton & P-Funk, an oral history edited by Dave Marsh. There are quite a few isolated quotes which indicate they thought of themselves just as much a rock band as a funk band. It's too long to print here (i.e, I don't feel like transcribing that long-ass paragraph - LOL!), but on page 32, Billy Bass is quoted as saying that he listened to albums by Cream, Hendrix, the Beatles and Blue Cheer "diligently, every day," to the point where it influenced his playing and his outlook on music. "After I heard that stuff, I knew that I couldn't just play rhythm & blues constantly. I had to be able to branch out and play it all."
After an epiphany like that, I highly doubt that my man had aspirations to play in a typical, regulation R&B revue.
Funkadelic guitarist Garry Shider, talking about the One Nation Under A Groove album:
Man has a point. It does seem watered down compared to the Westbound elpees.
He also said that he didn't like the way the albums after Maggot Brain were mixed - "I didn't hear any helicopters after that".
Because we can sit here and point to Aspirational Clinton Quote X or Eddie Hazel Riff Y and say "See?! See?! Right there! Right there! That's rock!" and maybe cobble together a twenty- or thirty- or whatever-percent share to file under "ROCK," but when looked at in the context of things like, you know, Lyrics, and Rhythms, and Subject Matter, and Phrasing, and Presentation, and The Other Seventy Percent Of The Music They Ever Released, I think the wrongheadedness of trying to contain them within The Rock Conversation becomes clear.
I mean, I know that a lot of this kind of stuff is just parlor games ("Can: GOAT funk band? Discuss!"), but come the fuck on.
Put differently/less antagonistically: Even if you or I or George or Eddie or whoever thinks that Funkadelic was a great rock band, can anyone really say that Funkadelic was a better rock band than they were a funk band?
Beats me. I'm mostly just trying to distract from the fact that I at some point sat down and read a Chris Martin interview.
I think they kicked ass both ways.
Just like Cal Tjader seems to get his props in both jazz and Latin music circles.
It's Southern Boogie though.
Like, 'boogie', like funky disco boogie, nahmsayin?***
Anyways, I'm in total agreement with James here and many dudes are reaching like Stretch Armstrong up in this bith to shoehorn their PMG faves into the mix.
***
Pickwick, save it mate, I'm joshing you.