but dont try to tell me that if in this next week, we saw the numbers of occupiers double with people in business suits, it wouldnt raise more attention.
It would. That is a problem to be fixed, not embraced.
harvey, no ones saying playing dress up is a silver bullet. its just one thing that effects gneral perception
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
tripledouble said:
harvey, no ones saying playing dress up is a silver bullet. its just one thing that effects gneral perception
I'm sorry, but this idea of needing to dress it up is infinitely stupid to me. Dress as you normally dress. It's not court and it's not church. If the public can't deal with hippies and freaks, fuck em. It's not like Wall Street is going to bend to any of the demands regardless. The whole thing is symbolic. And if America reacts to the symbolism with a prescribed dress code, then we need to just blow all of ourselves up already. Sheesh!
harvey and martin...no one needs to do anything, i say over and over that nothing is prescribed and there shouldnt be. diversity is better than homogeneity. but you all seem to be skimming whats getting written here. but if we want to talk about impacts, why not consider every possible thing that can be used to ones advantage?
and saying "if the public cant deal fuck em" then whats the point of even going out there? are you just going out so that you have a clear conscience, that you made a statement meant solely for wall street? i thought these things were to increase the public awareness about issues and hopefully garner more support for a cause. the wider the base of a movement the better, right?
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
In my mind, it's a threat. Either change your ways or anarchy will ensue. And last time I checked, anarchy doesn't submit to dress codes.
its not about changing ways...its about considering other strategies. if people dont want to switch up their clothes for a day, they shouldnt. but if some folks did, it might have benefits. if i get a chance to go up, i will probably dress nicer than i usually do around my neighborhood, where i am often bummy
this whole discussion is getting boring. in my mind i dont even disagree much with you guys except for the shrill hysterical cries that i am an enemy of the poor
If tomorrow there are 75 people in polos and khakis, 50 people in business suits, 15 grannies, 125 high school kids, 65 members of the pilots union in uniform, and 22 anarchists black hoodies, and 16 white kids in dreads with drums, the evening news will show the 16 WKIDwD and the 22 ABH.
Except, Tony is correct, we create out own media via internet, so it is possible to get the other 330 people in the public's eye.
harvey, no ones saying playing dress up is a silver bullet. its just one thing that effects gneral perception
I'm sorry, but this idea of needing to dress it up is infinitely stupid to me. Dress as you normally dress. It's not court and it's not church. If the public can't deal with hippies and freaks, fuck em. It's not like Wall Street is going to bend to any of the demands regardless. The whole thing is symbolic. And if America reacts to the symbolism with a prescribed dress code, then we need to just blow all of ourselves up already. Sheesh!
Exactly. It's frankly embarrassing to hear people say, yeah, I kind of agree with what you're saying, but if only you were wearing khaki's I would be totally behind you.
neil...im just trying to be realistic. maybe im off base, but based on our politics, america's electorate is pretty fucking embarassing. not to mention the general lack of education and illiteracy of the population i'm exposed to on a daily basis
A turning point in public perception of Vietnam war protests was when police started beating mid-West middle class college students on campuses like University of Wisconsin.
These kids did not look like the drug crazed hippie commies that many people thought made up the anit-war movement.
Because they were different than the stereotype, and they got beat, they got press.
The religious community needs to get involved too. (If they are not already.)
A coherent message is good. One that fits on a bumper sticker is even better.
But few protests have a coherent message.
Unless you have a ML King type leader to articulate your message it is not likely to happen.
Even the civil rights movement had multiple factions, methods, styles and messages.
ML King's SCLC was at odds with CORE, and SNCC who were organizing young people and doing sit-ins and freedom rides. IIRC King was never involved in a sit-in or the freedom rides. Of course there was also the Communist Party, The Socialist Workers Party and the Nation of Islam all trying to get out their civil rights message.
We can't wait for or appoint a charismatic, clear thinking leader to lead us, we must lead ourselves.
Wow! Thanks for posting this! This is exciting news! I really see this gaining momentum, especially now that other occupy events are starting up in solidarity around the country (although, I wonder if it's more effective for everyone to join in NY?). Either way???. I'm starting to feel like there is a possibility this could have some kind of tipping point effect - or at least get some people in Washington to take note.
vindicated ??????..he laughs from the grave at the inevitable implosion
img src="" alt="" />
Man, Herm's looking a bit worse for wear these days.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
I watched that Chicago 10 documentary last night, about the 1968 Democratic National Convention...and oh boy, does this country really suck. Both then and now.
On the one hand you think they are doing the right thing.
On the other you think bailing out Wall Street was a great idea.
"But I???ll tell you what they don???t want. They don???t want a population of citizens capable of critical thinking. They don???t want well-informed, well-educated people capable of critical thinking. They???re not interested in that. That doesn???t help them. That???s against their interests. They don???t want people who are smart enough to sit around the kitchen table and figure out how badly they???re getting fucked by a system that threw them overboard 30 fucking years ago."
A populace that bailed them out when they broke the bank.
" The real owners are the big wealthy business interests that control things and make all the important decisions. Forget the politicians, they???re an irrelevancy. The politicians are put there to give you the idea that you have freedom of choice. You don???t. You have no choice. You have owners. They own you. They own everything. They own all the important land. They own and control the corporations. They???ve long since bought and paid for the Senate, the Congress, the statehouses, the city halls. They???ve got the judges in their back pockets. And they own all the big media companies, so that they control just about all of the news and information you hear. They???ve got you by the balls. They spend billions of dollars every year lobbying ?? lobbying to get what they want. Well, we know what they want; they want more for themselves and less for everybody else.
But I???ll tell you what they don???t want. They don???t want a population of citizens capable of critical thinking. They don???t want well-informed, well-educated people capable of critical thinking. They???re not interested in that. That doesn???t help them. That???s against their interests. They don???t want people who are smart enough to sit around the kitchen table and figure out how badly they???re getting fucked by a system that threw them overboard 30 fucking years ago.
You know what they want? Obedient workers ?? people who are just smart enough to run the machines and do the paperwork but just dumb enough to passively accept all these increasingly shittier jobs with the lower pay, the longer hours, reduced benefits, the end of overtime and the vanishing pension that disappears the minute you go to collect it. And, now, they???re coming for your Social Security. They want your fucking retirement money. They want it back, so they can give it to their criminal friends on Wall Street. And you know something? They???ll get it. They???ll get it all, sooner or later, because they own this fucking place. It???s a big club, and you ain???t in it. You and I are not in the big club.
Comments
It would. That is a problem to be fixed, not embraced.
I'm sorry, but this idea of needing to dress it up is infinitely stupid to me. Dress as you normally dress. It's not court and it's not church. If the public can't deal with hippies and freaks, fuck em. It's not like Wall Street is going to bend to any of the demands regardless. The whole thing is symbolic. And if America reacts to the symbolism with a prescribed dress code, then we need to just blow all of ourselves up already. Sheesh!
and saying "if the public cant deal fuck em" then whats the point of even going out there? are you just going out so that you have a clear conscience, that you made a statement meant solely for wall street? i thought these things were to increase the public awareness about issues and hopefully garner more support for a cause. the wider the base of a movement the better, right?
this whole discussion is getting boring. in my mind i dont even disagree much with you guys except for the shrill hysterical cries that i am an enemy of the poor
- Mitch
Except, Tony is correct, we create out own media via internet, so it is possible to get the other 330 people in the public's eye.
Exactly. It's frankly embarrassing to hear people say, yeah, I kind of agree with what you're saying, but if only you were wearing khaki's I would be totally behind you.
These kids did not look like the drug crazed hippie commies that many people thought made up the anit-war movement.
Because they were different than the stereotype, and they got beat, they got press.
The religious community needs to get involved too. (If they are not already.)
A coherent message is good. One that fits on a bumper sticker is even better.
But few protests have a coherent message.
Unless you have a ML King type leader to articulate your message it is not likely to happen.
Even the civil rights movement had multiple factions, methods, styles and messages.
ML King's SCLC was at odds with CORE, and SNCC who were organizing young people and doing sit-ins and freedom rides. IIRC King was never involved in a sit-in or the freedom rides. Of course there was also the Communist Party, The Socialist Workers Party and the Nation of Islam all trying to get out their civil rights message.
We can't wait for or appoint a charismatic, clear thinking leader to lead us, we must lead ourselves.
discuss different strategies and use which you think works best.
img src="
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/09/30/labor-unions-begin-voting-to-support-occupy-wall-street/
This is not cop camouflage. Cop camouflage in NY equates to jeans, a Massapequa or some other town-specific baseball t-shirt and a Yankee hat.
will i get pepper sprayed if i wear a phillies hat?
anyone going to be in attendance on tuesday or wednesday?
Marines...
http://www.addictinginfo.org/2011/10/01/semper-fi-marines-coming-to-protect-protesters-on-wall-street/
Wow! Thanks for posting this! This is exciting news! I really see this gaining momentum, especially now that other occupy events are starting up in solidarity around the country (although, I wonder if it's more effective for everyone to join in NY?). Either way???. I'm starting to feel like there is a possibility this could have some kind of tipping point effect - or at least get some people in Washington to take note.
Interesting. I wonder how many will show up
There are always veterans at these kind of protests in Portland.
They never deter the police.
Man, Herm's looking a bit worse for wear these days.
Here is what happened:
http://idealab.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/10/more-veterans-on-the-way-to-occupy-wall-street.php
Or that, whatever works.
On the other you think bailing out Wall Street was a great idea.
"But I???ll tell you what they don???t want. They don???t want a population of citizens capable of critical thinking. They don???t want well-informed, well-educated people capable of critical thinking. They???re not interested in that. That doesn???t help them. That???s against their interests. They don???t want people who are smart enough to sit around the kitchen table and figure out how badly they???re getting fucked by a system that threw them overboard 30 fucking years ago."
A populace that bailed them out when they broke the bank.