Not entirely. In Canada, they can hold a non-citizen under a security certificate without charge as well as not revealing the evidence against her/him. There are numerous violations against the Charter of Rights and Freedoms with this process, but there more loopholes that the Conservatives have cooked up to avoid answering for said violations.
Tho, it did say it was a "Londoner" and not protester. But I found it well said.
cosine
DocMcCoy"Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,913 Posts
bassie said:
These riots are burning down the wrong shit.
They always burn down the wrong shit. The sad truth of the matter is that the kids who are rioting and looting don't give much of a fuck for anything, let alone "their" communities. This is maybe the second generation of kids in succession to grow up seemingly without any concept of social responsibility, but if you say people ought to ask why that is, you're fingered as an "apologist". I see all this shit, and it just surprises me that it hasn't happened earlier or more often. Tottenham has had fuck-all for donkey's years, and what little they did have has been closed down. Hackney's not much better. These are parts of London that have just been written off, along with all the people who live there - successive governments who don't give a fuck about them have cemented in the minds of an entire generation of kids that there's nothing worth giving a fuck about in their community, so who's going to be bothered if they smash it up? I mean, nobody makes this much fuss when these kids are actually killing each other, so what kind of message does that send?
Absolutely.
I didn't mean to sound so flip, but I've seen this play out in Toronto at least a couple of times in my life and it's a sigh more than a shrug. While the disenfranchisement isn't to the same extent here as it is there (save for what is happening on the First Nations reservations), there is definitely something to be said about expecting people to show respect or appreciate what is at stake when they feel that they have nothing to lose.
There is an element of this that is just an excuse to go out and rob. They've obviously seen the reports of 'flash mobbing' in the US as they're using similar tactics, organising over sms, or what ever, to target areas / shops to go smash up and rob.
The shit in the 80s was a completely different thing. That was a simmering of tensions that reached boiling point. People went out and fought against their oppressors, the police, and whole communities understood.
This shit today, and over the weekend, just stinks of opportunism. They're not fighting against shit. They're just destroying local businesses and robbing stuff for themselves.
It will be interesting to see how the local community reacts this time.
Originally it was because the police shot & killed some local. But fck knows why it's still going on.
Hmmm. Anyone with more on this? From what I've been reading. There was a protest going on outside Tottenham police station and it was this that actually blew it up. Warning. Women swearing non stop in the vid.
They always burn down the wrong shit. The sad truth of the matter is that the kids who are rioting and looting don't give much of a fuck for anything, let alone "their" communities. This is maybe the second generation of kids in succession to grow up seemingly without any concept of social responsibility, but if you say people ought to ask why that is, you're fingered as an "apologist". I see all this shit, and it just surprises me that it hasn't happened earlier or more often. Tottenham has had fuck-all for donkey's years, and what little they did have has been closed down. Hackney's not much better. These are parts of London that have just been written off, along with all the people who live there - successive governments who don't give a fuck about them have cemented in the minds of an entire generation of kids that there's nothing worth giving a fuck about in their community, so who's going to be bothered if they smash it up? I mean, nobody makes this much fuss when these kids are actually killing each other, so what kind of message does that send?
A similar (not identical) perspective here that also quotes that MSNBC piece from the first page:
situational crime prevention is a major cause of this shit. police dudes focus on taking the opportunity away from criminals (with gated communities and cc tv) and crime becomes more about seizing the random opportunity than making the actual fucking choice.
They always burn down the wrong shit. The sad truth of the matter is that the kids who are rioting and looting don't give much of a fuck for anything, let alone "their" communities. This is maybe the second generation of kids in succession to grow up seemingly without any concept of social responsibility, but if you say people ought to ask why that is, you're fingered as an "apologist". I see all this shit, and it just surprises me that it hasn't happened earlier or more often. Tottenham has had fuck-all for donkey's years, and what little they did have has been closed down. Hackney's not much better. These are parts of London that have just been written off, along with all the people who live there - successive governments who don't give a fuck about them have cemented in the minds of an entire generation of kids that there's nothing worth giving a fuck about in their community, so who's going to be bothered if they smash it up? I mean, nobody makes this much fuss when these kids are actually killing each other, so what kind of message does that send?
at this point there are so many people involved, there is no sterotypical kid...
like the Sony distribution center looted and burned in Enfield... that wasn't anyone's neighborhood... that was a target... people had to get in a car and drive out there... i wouldn't be suprised if they burned it b/c it would destroy evidence...
so, at this point, you have active real criminals taking advantage of the chaos...
as for what triggered this, i agree w/ what Doc says about the broad history, but let's think about the recent history... just like we are having cutbacks on social services and budget problems, so is the UK... so people who have had nothing for years now have less... the poor are being asked to tighten their belts while the rich doing fine...
also, the gang problem there is def getting severe... i know alot of americans like to watch UK Blood videos and giggle, but that shit is no joke... alot of these neighborhoods that are going off have youth crime problems to begin w/,,,, just google London Closed Camera street fights and watch mobs of kids beat the shit out of each other on high streets all day...
then factor in the general shitty corrupt state of UK government (i.e. it's ok for MP's to steal or get their mansions refurnished on taypaxer dollar, but these kids are REAL CRIMINALS), the all time high state of conspicious consumption and materialsim, and the fact that's it's a hot fucking few days in August and BOOOOOOM....
and once a few kids see what's going on, they say fuck it and join in... b/c most of them have no reason not to, and that's whats fucked up...
and of course they are mostly fucking up their own neighborhood and small businesses, but c'mon what fucking 16 year old kid thinks about shit like that... i don't know about you, but my social conscious definitely wasn't the first part of me that developed in adolesence...
Democrats call Tea Partiers terrorists while leftists burn london to the ground. Sounds about right.
wait, these kids in london are leftists now? your comment seems to be nothing more than random ideas strung together in the hope of forming a ideological soundbite.
Originally it was because the police shot & killed some local. But fck knows why it's still going on.
Hmmm. Anyone with more on this? From what I've been reading. There was a protest going on outside Tottenham police station and it was this that actually blew it up. Warning. Women swearing non stop in the vid.
Bastion of truth The Evening Standard were reporting yesterday that she antagonised them by throwing a champagne bottle at them.
Which leads me to the real question, what the hell was she doing with a champagne bottle? Is this what the youth get their kicks out of on a friday night these days? What happened to good old Diamond White? I can only assume the eyewitness was thrown by the surrounding chaos and wrongly identified a far more likely bottle of cheap plonk, probably Asti Martini.
Despite my most intense prayers the violence still doesn't seem to be drifting far enough across London to warrant me working from home so may have to head off at lunchtime and boot in the windows of the Pret A Manger to kick start it.
neil_something said:
sabadabada said:
Democrats call Tea Partiers terrorists while leftists burn london to the ground. Sounds about right.
wait, these kids in london are leftists now? your comment seems to be nothing more than random ideas strung together in the hope of forming a ideological soundbite.
Yeah I sincerely doubt most of those rioting are in any shape or form lefties.
Leftie (surely? Check the attire) in looting fail:
C*nt.
"This will offset the dramatic nature of the drift wood marvellously in my latest piece. Ying and yang, the state of Britain in a hobby horse. Just wait till Saatchi sees this."
Sony warehouse in Enfield's gone up, and thats where PIAS were storing all their distributable stock for themselves and many other labels. Going to fuck some labels. Bad stuff
Sadly all top range models were taken by the first come first loot crew but could I interest you in a selection of printer ink refill cartridges or iphone bling covers? I also have a fine selection of H&M's women's summer clothing dresses that I think you would look dandy in FONT SIZE="-5"> and a slightly burnt hobby horseFONT SIZE="-5">.
???When you cut facilities, slash jobs, abuse power, discriminate, drive people into deeper poverty and shoot people dead while refusing to provide answers or justice, the people will rise up and express their anger and frustration if you refuse to hear their cries. A riot is the voice of the unheard.??? Martin Luther King
The Sony/PIAS distribution centre in Enfield was sadly destroyed in the riots last night in London (8th August).
Big hitters such as Sony had their stock destroyed, but perhaps more saddening is to hear of all the independent labels that have been affected, as this will hit them the most.
We suggest you check out the list of labels affected below and buy one of their records digitally. Also make sure to follow @fionchadd on twitter as she's organising a PIAS fundraiser event (or email her at piasfundraiser [at] gmail [dot] com).
1234, 2020 Vision, Accidental, Ad Altiora, Adventures Close to home , Alberts , All City , Alt Delete, Ambush Reality, Angular, Ark, ATC, Atic, Atlantic Jaxx, Azuli, B Unique, Backyard, Bad Sneakers, Bandstock, Banquet, Beggars, Big Chill, Big Dada, Big Life / Nul / Sindy Stroker, Boombox, Border Community, Boysnoize, Brille, Bronzerat, Brownswood, Buzzin Fly, Can You Feel It, Catskills, ChannelFly, Chemikal Underground, City Rockers, Counter, D Cypher, Dance To The Radio, Deceptive, Def Jux, Dirtee Stank, Divine Comedy, Domino, Drag City, Drive Thru, Drowned in Sound, Duophonic, Eat Sleep / Sorepoint, Electric Toaster, Emfire, F. Comm, Fabric, Faith And Hope, Fantastic Plastic, Fargo, FatCat, Feraltone, Finders Keepers / Twisted Nerve, Fingerlickin', Flock, Free Range, From The Basement, Full Time Hobby, Goldsoul, Gronland, Groove Attack, Halftime, Hassle ,Heron. Hum&Haw;, Independiente, Info UK, Join Us, Kartel, Kensaltown, Kitsune, Kompakt, Laughing Stock, Leftroom, Lex, Lo Max, Loose, Love Box, Lowlife, Lucky Number, Marquis Cha Cha, Memphis Industry, Merok, Metroline, Mute, Na??ve, Nation, Navigator. New World, Ninja Tune, Nuclear Blast ,One Little Indian, Output / People in the Sky / Process, Pale Blue, Palm, Peacefrog, PIAS Recordings, PIP 555 Productions, Play To Work, Powerhouse (T2), Propaganda / Ho Hum, Raw Canvas, Red Grape, Red Telephone Box, Rekids, Renaissance, Respect Productions (PES digital), Reveal Records, SMG, Rock Action, Roots, Rough Trade, Rough Trade Comps, Rubyworks, Ruffa Lane, Search And Destroy, Secret Sundaze, Secretly Canadian / Jagjaguwar / Dead Oceans, Sell Yourself, Setanta, Shatterproof, Sideone Dummy, Slam Dunk, Smalltown, Soma, Something In Construction, Sonar Kollectiv, Soul Jazz, Southern Fried, Stranded Soldier, Subliminal, Sunday Best, TARGO, Taste, Ten Worlds, Thrill Jockey, Total Fitness, Touch And Go, Track And Field, TriTone, Trouble, Try Harder, Turk, Turnstile, Twenty 20, Underworld, Union Square, Urban Torque, Vagrant, Vice, Victory, Wagram , Wall Of Sound, Warp, Wi45 , Wonky Atlas, Word And Sound, Xtra Mile, You Are Here.
Comments
Not entirely. In Canada, they can hold a non-citizen under a security certificate without charge as well as not revealing the evidence against her/him. There are numerous violations against the Charter of Rights and Freedoms with this process, but there more loopholes that the Conservatives have cooked up to avoid answering for said violations.
Yea. These riots are burning down the wrong shit.
cosine
They always burn down the wrong shit. The sad truth of the matter is that the kids who are rioting and looting don't give much of a fuck for anything, let alone "their" communities. This is maybe the second generation of kids in succession to grow up seemingly without any concept of social responsibility, but if you say people ought to ask why that is, you're fingered as an "apologist". I see all this shit, and it just surprises me that it hasn't happened earlier or more often. Tottenham has had fuck-all for donkey's years, and what little they did have has been closed down. Hackney's not much better. These are parts of London that have just been written off, along with all the people who live there - successive governments who don't give a fuck about them have cemented in the minds of an entire generation of kids that there's nothing worth giving a fuck about in their community, so who's going to be bothered if they smash it up? I mean, nobody makes this much fuss when these kids are actually killing each other, so what kind of message does that send?
I wonder if it's going to kick off up north?
I didn't mean to sound so flip, but I've seen this play out in Toronto at least a couple of times in my life and it's a sigh more than a shrug. While the disenfranchisement isn't to the same extent here as it is there (save for what is happening on the First Nations reservations), there is definitely something to be said about expecting people to show respect or appreciate what is at stake when they feel that they have nothing to lose.
The shit in the 80s was a completely different thing. That was a simmering of tensions that reached boiling point. People went out and fought against their oppressors, the police, and whole communities understood.
This shit today, and over the weekend, just stinks of opportunism. They're not fighting against shit. They're just destroying local businesses and robbing stuff for themselves.
It will be interesting to see how the local community reacts this time.
Thanks for this.
sky and even the bbc are a joke right now. i saw a loop of some hackney window smashing. storm in a fucking teacup.
Hmmm. Anyone with more on this? From what I've been reading. There was a protest going on outside Tottenham police station and it was this that actually blew it up. Warning. Women swearing non stop in the vid.
A similar (not identical) perspective here that also quotes that MSNBC piece from the first page:
http://pennyred.blogspot.com/2011/08/panic-on-streets-of-london.html
As opposed to Republicans killing thousands in the name of so called weapons of mass destruction?
I see what you did there...
situational crime prevention is a major cause of this shit. police dudes focus on taking the opportunity away from criminals (with gated communities and cc tv) and crime becomes more about seizing the random opportunity than making the actual fucking choice.
at this point there are so many people involved, there is no sterotypical kid...
like the Sony distribution center looted and burned in Enfield... that wasn't anyone's neighborhood... that was a target... people had to get in a car and drive out there... i wouldn't be suprised if they burned it b/c it would destroy evidence...
so, at this point, you have active real criminals taking advantage of the chaos...
as for what triggered this, i agree w/ what Doc says about the broad history, but let's think about the recent history... just like we are having cutbacks on social services and budget problems, so is the UK... so people who have had nothing for years now have less... the poor are being asked to tighten their belts while the rich doing fine...
also, the gang problem there is def getting severe... i know alot of americans like to watch UK Blood videos and giggle, but that shit is no joke... alot of these neighborhoods that are going off have youth crime problems to begin w/,,,, just google London Closed Camera street fights and watch mobs of kids beat the shit out of each other on high streets all day...
then factor in the general shitty corrupt state of UK government (i.e. it's ok for MP's to steal or get their mansions refurnished on taypaxer dollar, but these kids are REAL CRIMINALS), the all time high state of conspicious consumption and materialsim, and the fact that's it's a hot fucking few days in August and BOOOOOOM....
and once a few kids see what's going on, they say fuck it and join in... b/c most of them have no reason not to, and that's whats fucked up...
and of course they are mostly fucking up their own neighborhood and small businesses, but c'mon what fucking 16 year old kid thinks about shit like that... i don't know about you, but my social conscious definitely wasn't the first part of me that developed in adolesence...
robbing an injured person is one of the lowest things ever!
wait, these kids in london are leftists now? your comment seems to be nothing more than random ideas strung together in the hope of forming a ideological soundbite.
Bastion of truth The Evening Standard were reporting yesterday that she antagonised them by throwing a champagne bottle at them.
Which leads me to the real question, what the hell was she doing with a champagne bottle? Is this what the youth get their kicks out of on a friday night these days? What happened to good old Diamond White? I can only assume the eyewitness was thrown by the surrounding chaos and wrongly identified a far more likely bottle of cheap plonk, probably Asti Martini.
Despite my most intense prayers the violence still doesn't seem to be drifting far enough across London to warrant me working from home so may have to head off at lunchtime and boot in the windows of the Pret A Manger to kick start it.
Yeah I sincerely doubt most of those rioting are in any shape or form lefties.
C*nt.
"This will offset the dramatic nature of the drift wood marvellously in my latest piece. Ying and yang, the state of Britain in a hobby horse. Just wait till Saatchi sees this."
Junior, did you pick up that laptop for me?
I'd bet they will.
Sadly all top range models were taken by the first come first loot crew but could I interest you in a selection of printer ink refill cartridges or iphone bling covers? I also have a fine selection of H&M's women's summer clothing dresses that I think you would look dandy in FONT SIZE="-5"> and a slightly burnt hobby horseFONT SIZE="-5">.
???When you cut facilities, slash jobs, abuse power, discriminate, drive people into deeper poverty and shoot people dead while refusing to provide answers or justice, the people will rise up and express their anger and frustration if you refuse to hear their cries. A riot is the voice of the unheard.??? Martin Luther King
Big hitters such as Sony had their stock destroyed, but perhaps more saddening is to hear of all the independent labels that have been affected, as this will hit them the most.
We suggest you check out the list of labels affected below and buy one of their records digitally. Also make sure to follow @fionchadd on twitter as she's organising a PIAS fundraiser event (or email her at piasfundraiser [at] gmail [dot] com).
1234, 2020 Vision, Accidental, Ad Altiora, Adventures Close to home , Alberts , All City , Alt Delete, Ambush Reality, Angular, Ark, ATC, Atic, Atlantic Jaxx, Azuli, B Unique, Backyard, Bad Sneakers, Bandstock, Banquet, Beggars, Big Chill, Big Dada, Big Life / Nul / Sindy Stroker, Boombox, Border Community, Boysnoize, Brille, Bronzerat, Brownswood, Buzzin Fly, Can You Feel It, Catskills, ChannelFly, Chemikal Underground, City Rockers, Counter, D Cypher, Dance To The Radio, Deceptive, Def Jux, Dirtee Stank, Divine Comedy, Domino, Drag City, Drive Thru, Drowned in Sound, Duophonic, Eat Sleep / Sorepoint, Electric Toaster, Emfire, F. Comm, Fabric, Faith And Hope, Fantastic Plastic, Fargo, FatCat, Feraltone, Finders Keepers / Twisted Nerve, Fingerlickin', Flock, Free Range, From The Basement, Full Time Hobby, Goldsoul, Gronland, Groove Attack, Halftime, Hassle ,Heron. Hum&Haw;, Independiente, Info UK, Join Us, Kartel, Kensaltown, Kitsune, Kompakt, Laughing Stock, Leftroom, Lex, Lo Max, Loose, Love Box, Lowlife, Lucky Number, Marquis Cha Cha, Memphis Industry, Merok, Metroline, Mute, Na??ve, Nation, Navigator. New World, Ninja Tune, Nuclear Blast ,One Little Indian, Output / People in the Sky / Process, Pale Blue, Palm, Peacefrog, PIAS Recordings, PIP 555 Productions, Play To Work, Powerhouse (T2), Propaganda / Ho Hum, Raw Canvas, Red Grape, Red Telephone Box, Rekids, Renaissance, Respect Productions (PES digital), Reveal Records, SMG, Rock Action, Roots, Rough Trade, Rough Trade Comps, Rubyworks, Ruffa Lane, Search And Destroy, Secret Sundaze, Secretly Canadian / Jagjaguwar / Dead Oceans, Sell Yourself, Setanta, Shatterproof, Sideone Dummy, Slam Dunk, Smalltown, Soma, Something In Construction, Sonar Kollectiv, Soul Jazz, Southern Fried, Stranded Soldier, Subliminal, Sunday Best, TARGO, Taste, Ten Worlds, Thrill Jockey, Total Fitness, Touch And Go, Track And Field, TriTone, Trouble, Try Harder, Turk, Turnstile, Twenty 20, Underworld, Union Square, Urban Torque, Vagrant, Vice, Victory, Wagram , Wall Of Sound, Warp, Wi45 , Wonky Atlas, Word And Sound, Xtra Mile, You Are Here.