Just wanted to give Faux a nod for helping me with the lede to my NPR review that runs today.
Thank you, although I'm not sure you used it in the way that I intended it.
What I meant was that he is the last artist famous outside of rap still making music that matters within it.
As used in the item, it sounds like it could have originated with one of those little SoulStrut dudes who believe themselves to have grown beyond rap and now listen to, like, Beck or some such foolishness, but still check for Kanye because he uses samples, yo.
Just wanted to give Faux a nod for helping me with the lede to my NPR review that runs today.
Thank you, although I'm not sure you used it in the way that I intended it.
What I meant was that he is the last artist famous outside of rap still making music that matters within it.
As used in the item, it sounds like it could have originated with one of those little SoulStrut dudes who believe themselves to have grown beyond rap and now listen to, like, Beck or some such foolishness, but still check for Kanye because he uses samples, yo.
No, I meant it in the way you meant to mean it. And I thought it came off that way but it's not like I could really devote much time to explaining it at length to the potential listener who might confuse the statement as referring to what you describe at bottom.
Old dudes like it or not, but a certain generation will be listening to this and be getting the same impact that many of us got when we first heard Illmatic or Nation Of Millions.
This album is great, maybe even better than great. But 98% on metacritic? People talmbout
"this reminds me of the first time I heard Nation Of Millions"
"Fantasy will stand as an album that dare to push the entire medium of recorded music forward"
This is not just West's best album, it's a keen contender for the most ambitious LP in hip-hop history.
Like Kanye hatters who preposterously claim to hate the music because "he's so arrogant", I'm not sure how much the fawning has to do with the music itself, as opposed to journalists hoping on the bandwagon and simply loving a good come-back story. Which again, isn't to say that I'm not feeling this album, just that some of this seems pretty over the top to me.
Maybe I need a couple more listens, but as great as this album is, bassie's emperor with no clothes metaphor is starting to seem like a good fit.
Old dudes like it or not, but a certain generation will be listening to this and be getting the same impact that many of us got when we first heard Illmatic or Nation Of Millions.
well such a thing was vocally spoken of at one point, as bizarre as it sounds.
i don't think you have to be an asshurt ST fanboy to not be feeling this album. i'm waiting to absorb this album before hating or fellating excessively on it, i don't think its god awful - it doesn't have that Kingdom Come "could have been great but they missed the target" feeling about it. more of a "this shit is like the Bohemian Rhapsody of rap" feeling. the douchebag song makes me want to kick someone though, its truly appalling.
I get confused by all the posters on here but you're the attention seeking Stones Throw fanboy right?
Just wanted to check so we could move on.
do I know you
Paul said:
He was expecting 5 Madlib beats on the album at least....
I didn't bother checking the credits
listened to it the Sunday before the last just to see what all the fuss was about. skipped everything from track 1 to 7 and didn't even get to the end. I care about my ears
shit is ass. Madlib beats or not
i don't think you have to be an asshurt ST fanboy to not be feeling this album..
Yeah no argument here N*ck and after all the thread title is an open invitation to hate. Due to the many tastes of different posters here's never going to be a new release album that gets a thumbs up across the board and, while I love the whole thing, realise other people are going to think and react differently.
However, as much as the above needs to be taken into account, he is still an attention seeking ST fanboy who was only ever going to post this reaction. Sadly I feel like I've now wasted too much time fulfilling those attention seeking needs.
pitchfork make a casual pithy comparison like that? nah they're way too busy mining teenage fanblogs for the latest in hauntological post-step nano-genres to pseudo-intellectualise about.
Old dudes like it or not, but a certain generation will be listening to this and be getting the same impact that many of us got when we first heard Illmatic or Nation Of Millions.
And for the record I'm still loving this album.
I don't hate the album at all and in general, I've admired everything Kanye has put out - including "808s" (I just never want to listen to that album, ever again) - but I don't get what makes this album "Nation of Millions" or "Illmatic" level in terms of either 1) a just perfectly executed effort or 2) a paradigm-shifter.
Old dudes like it or not, but a certain generation will be listening to this and be getting the same impact that many of us got when we first heard Illmatic or Nation Of Millions.
And for the record I'm still loving this album.
I don't hate the album at all and in general, I've admired everything Kanye has put out - including "808s" (I just never want to listen to that album, ever again) - but I don't get what makes this album "Nation of Millions" or "Illmatic" level in terms of either 1) a just perfectly executed effort or 2) a paradigm-shifter.
pitchfork make a casual pithy comparison like that? nah they're way too busy mining teenage fanblogs for the latest in hauntological post-step nano-genres to pseudo-intellectualise about.
4chan should nuke their servers to teach them a lesson
then the Network guys would be a handful of lines away from the complete script for their next e-luminary biopic
Old dudes like it or not, but a certain generation will be listening to this and be getting the same impact that many of us got when we first heard Illmatic or Nation Of Millions.
And for the record I'm still loving this album.
I don't hate the album at all and in general, I've admired everything Kanye has put out - including "808s" (I just never want to listen to that album, ever again) - but I don't get what makes this album "Nation of Millions" or "Illmatic" level in terms of either 1) a just perfectly executed effort or 2) a paradigm-shifter.
What am I missing exactly?
it's generational
KanYe's not speaking for the over 25-30something
Ulysses31nicholas said:
pitchfork make a casual pithy comparison like that? nah they're way too busy mining teenage fanblogs for the latest in hauntological post-step nano-genres to pseudo-intellectualise about.
People talk as if Bohemian Rhapsody is a bad thing... I've been saying that rap music has been fully ensconced in it's Arena Rock era for a minute now but I think the comparisons to that would be much better suited with dudes like Three 3 Mafia and Birdman rapping over Tiesto-produced records. And regardless, nobody should be paying attention to the Pitchfuck ratings system. This is the same "publication" that gave TNG's Syl Johnson retrospective a 6.3 out of 10, starting their piece about him with something to the effect of "Make no mistake about it - Syl Johnson is an also ran (see here...)
But Oliver, I don't think it's something that can be measured. I don't know, it just is. Shit is good, I've given it about 2 weeks of objective listening and still think it is good. And as for someone in his mid 30s I am seeing this and for the most part all my friends in the same age bracket are as well, so that's a yes AND no with the generational argument. My Nation Of Millions was Nation Of Millions. But there's something with the way that this is resonating with that generation. Perhaps we are the ones that are missing it but I don't really think so.
I don't know I just said. But all I know is this - I really enjoy this music and think it is extremely well done - my only complaints are about sound fidelity and the brickwalling of the sound (which is more a product of the time than anything.)
But this is 2010. As Cannonball Adderley once said, "Music ain't supposed to stand still."
Pretty much cosign what Cosmo has said, my only critiques are the fidelity and compression.
But having just listened to the full release end to end, I am just blown away. Full on decadent prog arena rap. Computer chipmunks in the backing band. And seriously depressing - I am playing this back to back with "Everything's Berri" and it's fitting my mood. Both sides.
I can get with Oliver's critique of "endless codas". That is part of the vision, but can get excessive. That said, if you don't get it, I'm not sure you will. This isn't your dad's rap music...
Old dudes like it or not, but a certain generation will be listening to this and be getting the same impact that many of us got when we first heard Illmatic or Nation Of Millions.
And for the record I'm still loving this album.
I don't hate the album at all and in general, I've admired everything Kanye has put out - including "808s" (I just never want to listen to that album, ever again) - but I don't get what makes this album "Nation of Millions" or "Illmatic" level in terms of either 1) a just perfectly executed effort or 2) a paradigm-shifter.
What am I missing exactly?
it's generational
KanYe's not speaking for the over 25-30something
Ulysses31nicholas said:
pitchfork make a casual pithy comparison like that? nah they're way too busy mining teenage fanblogs for the latest in hauntological post-step nano-genres to pseudo-intellectualise about.
People talk as if Bohemian Rhapsody is a bad thing... I've been saying that rap music has been fully ensconced in it's Arena Rock era for a minute now but I think the comparisons to that would be much better suited with dudes like Three 3 Mafia and Birdman rapping over Tiesto-produced records. And regardless, nobody should be paying attention to the Pitchfuck ratings system. This is the same "publication" that gave TNG's Syl Johnson retrospective a 6.3 out of 10, starting their piece about him with something to the effect of "Make no mistake about it - Syl Johnson is an also ran (see here...)
But Oliver, I don't think it's something that can be measured. I don't know, it just is. Shit is good, I've given it about 2 weeks of objective listening and still think it is good. And as for someone in his mid 30s I am seeing this and for the most part all my friends in the same age bracket are as well, so that's a yes AND no with the generational argument. My Nation Of Millions was Nation Of Millions. But there's something with the way that this is resonating with that generation. Perhaps we are the ones that are missing it but I don't really think so.
I don't know I just said. But all I know is this - I really enjoy this music and think it is extremely well done - my only complaints are about sound fidelity and the brickwalling of the sound (which is more a product of the time than anything.)
But this is 2010. As Cannonball Adderley once said, "Music ain't supposed to stand still."
U can call this a Nations for this generation after '2' weeks? Seriously?
Just because its heat, you gonna say its a Genre bookmark. I know u like dude but applying the context of how big Nations was in 1988 or wack ass Illmatic was in 92 as = the Kanye in 2010 = biggin/hypin this shit up to emphasize how much you like it.
Old dudes like it or not, but a certain generation will be listening to this and be getting the same impact that many of us got when we first heard Illmatic or Nation Of Millions.
And for the record I'm still loving this album.
I don't hate the album at all and in general, I've admired everything Kanye has put out - including "808s" (I just never want to listen to that album, ever again) - but I don't get what makes this album "Nation of Millions" or "Illmatic" level in terms of either 1) a just perfectly executed effort or 2) a paradigm-shifter.
What am I missing exactly?
it's generational
KanYe's not speaking for the over 25-30something
Ulysses31nicholas said:
pitchfork make a casual pithy comparison like that? nah they're way too busy mining teenage fanblogs for the latest in hauntological post-step nano-genres to pseudo-intellectualise about.
People talk as if Bohemian Rhapsody is a bad thing... I've been saying that rap music has been fully ensconced in it's Arena Rock era for a minute now but I think the comparisons to that would be much better suited with dudes like Three 3 Mafia and Birdman rapping over Tiesto-produced records. And regardless, nobody should be paying attention to the Pitchfuck ratings system. This is the same "publication" that gave TNG's Syl Johnson retrospective a 6.3 out of 10, starting their piece about him with something to the effect of "Make no mistake about it - Syl Johnson is an also ran (see here...)
But Oliver, I don't think it's something that can be measured. I don't know, it just is. Shit is good, I've given it about 2 weeks of objective listening and still think it is good. And as for someone in his mid 30s I am seeing this and for the most part all my friends in the same age bracket are as well, so that's a yes AND no with the generational argument. My Nation Of Millions was Nation Of Millions. But there's something with the way that this is resonating with that generation. Perhaps we are the ones that are missing it but I don't really think so.
I don't know I just said. But all I know is this - I really enjoy this music and think it is extremely well done - my only complaints are about sound fidelity and the brickwalling of the sound (which is more a product of the time than anything.)
But this is 2010. As Cannonball Adderley once said, "Music ain't supposed to stand still."
U can call this a Nations for this generation after '2' weeks? Seriously?
Just because its heat, you gonna say its a Genre bookmark. I know u like dude but applying the context of how big Nations was in 1988 or wack ass Illmatic was in 92 as = the Kanye in 2010 = biggin/hypin this shit up to emphasize how much you like it.
You're missing the forest for the trees. Like I said, Nation Of Millions is my Nation Of Millions... But for someone born in 1993? No question that this can - AND WILL - be this album for many people in that generation. That may be me making a prediction but I definitely see it...
Time continues to move regardless of whether or not we move with it.
this is becoming a really interesting dialogue across the net. in an era where there are no music critics left i have seen lots of fans defending this album from the stance of critic, in the sense that instead of saying "well i love this shit" they are saying things like "in this climate, the music is relevant because xyz".. all of which i find really interesting. (Cosmo this isn't @ you,its liek the comments section of youtube has decided to become music critics on the net over this album)
I reread my post and triple cosign everything i said a week later. If people like the music as music/songs, then that's great, case closed, personal taste. To assign it some greater value in the history of recorded music makes it fair game for serious critique. An that being said, Nation of Millions? Really? I MEAN REALLY?
sorry guys but as a kid growing up listening to rap I learned a whole hell of alot of shit about things i wouldn't have normally seen or known in my little fishing village. Me and double were talking about this the other day, I mean, I knew about MArcus Garvy and Black Star in like 7th grade. I knew about the Nation, I knew about black empowerment movements and historical figures. Rap music had a powerful voice that in part, whether directly or indirectly informed us all of alot of shit.
All I learned from this album was Kanye has an expensive car and clothing and that we don't understand him and that apparently if i let him sleep with my wife he will teach her sexual things. Which is fine, but Nation of Millions? please fam. Chuck D. thats that.
and that being said, I was on 52nd and Vermont the other day chillin and I DIDNT HERE A SINGLE FUCKING CAR BOOMIN THAT 'YE shit. Try that in 88 with PE. Not happening. EVERYONE WAS TUNED IN.
Comments
Phoned in from the county jail, no less.
Yvette's making brisket.
It took me a sec to get that. Man "The Wire" never dies.
This leaked today(?), supposedly a Q-Tip produced joint from Kanye and Jay-Z upcoming collabo CD?
Thank you, although I'm not sure you used it in the way that I intended it.
What I meant was that he is the last artist famous outside of rap still making music that matters within it.
As used in the item, it sounds like it could have originated with one of those little SoulStrut dudes who believe themselves to have grown beyond rap and now listen to, like, Beck or some such foolishness, but still check for Kanye because he uses samples, yo.
No, I meant it in the way you meant to mean it. And I thought it came off that way but it's not like I could really devote much time to explaining it at length to the potential listener who might confuse the statement as referring to what you describe at bottom.
And for the record I'm still loving this album.
Like Kanye hatters who preposterously claim to hate the music because "he's so arrogant", I'm not sure how much the fawning has to do with the music itself, as opposed to journalists hoping on the bandwagon and simply loving a good come-back story. Which again, isn't to say that I'm not feeling this album, just that some of this seems pretty over the top to me.
Maybe I need a couple more listens, but as great as this album is, bassie's emperor with no clothes metaphor is starting to seem like a good fit.
I agree, and I also think the album is great
shit's horrendous
Just wanted to check so we could move on.
i don't think you have to be an asshurt ST fanboy to not be feeling this album. i'm waiting to absorb this album before hating or fellating excessively on it, i don't think its god awful - it doesn't have that Kingdom Come "could have been great but they missed the target" feeling about it. more of a "this shit is like the Bohemian Rhapsody of rap" feeling. the douchebag song makes me want to kick someone though, its truly appalling.
I didn't bother checking the credits
listened to it the Sunday before the last just to see what all the fuss was about. skipped everything from track 1 to 7 and didn't even get to the end. I care about my ears
shit is ass. Madlib beats or not
Yeah no argument here N*ck and after all the thread title is an open invitation to hate. Due to the many tastes of different posters here's never going to be a new release album that gets a thumbs up across the board and, while I love the whole thing, realise other people are going to think and react differently.
However, as much as the above needs to be taken into account, he is still an attention seeking ST fanboy who was only ever going to post this reaction. Sadly I feel like I've now wasted too much time fulfilling those attention seeking needs.
I don't hate the album at all and in general, I've admired everything Kanye has put out - including "808s" (I just never want to listen to that album, ever again) - but I don't get what makes this album "Nation of Millions" or "Illmatic" level in terms of either 1) a just perfectly executed effort or 2) a paradigm-shifter.
What am I missing exactly?
KanYe's not speaking for the over 25-30something
4chan should nuke their servers to teach them a lesson
then the Network guys would be a handful of lines away from the complete script for their next e-luminary biopic
People talk as if Bohemian Rhapsody is a bad thing... I've been saying that rap music has been fully ensconced in it's Arena Rock era for a minute now but I think the comparisons to that would be much better suited with dudes like Three 3 Mafia and Birdman rapping over Tiesto-produced records. And regardless, nobody should be paying attention to the Pitchfuck ratings system. This is the same "publication" that gave TNG's Syl Johnson retrospective a 6.3 out of 10, starting their piece about him with something to the effect of "Make no mistake about it - Syl Johnson is an also ran (see here...)
But Oliver, I don't think it's something that can be measured. I don't know, it just is. Shit is good, I've given it about 2 weeks of objective listening and still think it is good. And as for someone in his mid 30s I am seeing this and for the most part all my friends in the same age bracket are as well, so that's a yes AND no with the generational argument. My Nation Of Millions was Nation Of Millions. But there's something with the way that this is resonating with that generation. Perhaps we are the ones that are missing it but I don't really think so.
I don't know I just said. But all I know is this - I really enjoy this music and think it is extremely well done - my only complaints are about sound fidelity and the brickwalling of the sound (which is more a product of the time than anything.)
But this is 2010. As Cannonball Adderley once said, "Music ain't supposed to stand still."
But having just listened to the full release end to end, I am just blown away. Full on decadent prog arena rap. Computer chipmunks in the backing band. And seriously depressing - I am playing this back to back with "Everything's Berri" and it's fitting my mood. Both sides.
I can get with Oliver's critique of "endless codas". That is part of the vision, but can get excessive. That said, if you don't get it, I'm not sure you will. This isn't your dad's rap music...
U can call this a Nations for this generation after '2' weeks? Seriously?
Just because its heat, you gonna say its a Genre bookmark. I know u like dude but applying the context of how big Nations was in 1988 or wack ass Illmatic was in 92 as = the Kanye in 2010 = biggin/hypin this shit up to emphasize how much you like it.
You're missing the forest for the trees. Like I said, Nation Of Millions is my Nation Of Millions... But for someone born in 1993? No question that this can - AND WILL - be this album for many people in that generation. That may be me making a prediction but I definitely see it...
Time continues to move regardless of whether or not we move with it.
I reread my post and triple cosign everything i said a week later. If people like the music as music/songs, then that's great, case closed, personal taste. To assign it some greater value in the history of recorded music makes it fair game for serious critique. An that being said, Nation of Millions? Really? I MEAN REALLY?
sorry guys but as a kid growing up listening to rap I learned a whole hell of alot of shit about things i wouldn't have normally seen or known in my little fishing village. Me and double were talking about this the other day, I mean, I knew about MArcus Garvy and Black Star in like 7th grade. I knew about the Nation, I knew about black empowerment movements and historical figures. Rap music had a powerful voice that in part, whether directly or indirectly informed us all of alot of shit.
All I learned from this album was Kanye has an expensive car and clothing and that we don't understand him and that apparently if i let him sleep with my wife he will teach her sexual things. Which is fine, but Nation of Millions? please fam. Chuck D. thats that.
and that being said, I was on 52nd and Vermont the other day chillin and I DIDNT HERE A SINGLE FUCKING CAR BOOMIN THAT 'YE shit. Try that in 88 with PE. Not happening. EVERYONE WAS TUNED IN.