I know the conflict is deeply rooted and super complicated, but Israel always seems to bring the hammer down much harder than it needs to.
To be clear, I am not picking a side because I don't trust the media and I can't know all the details of who fired first and why. I'm just disgusted with the needless death of children.
I think it has been proven, that Hamas and Israel's enemies do not have the weapons, forces or will to annihilate Israel.
On the other hand Israel Has proven that despite having the weapons and forces they do not have the will to annihilate all Palestinians.
Actually I think the correct formulation is:
Israel's enemies have the will -- but not the means -- to annihilate Israel.
Israel has the means -- but not the will -- to annihilate all Palestinians.
I think it has been proven, that Hamas and Israel's enemies do not have the weapons, forces or will to annihilate Israel.
On the other hand Israel Has proven that despite having the weapons and forces they do not have the will to annihilate all Palestinians.
Actually I think the correct formulation is:
Israel's enemies have the will -- but not the means -- to annihilate Israel.
Israel has the means -- but not the mandate-- to annihilate all Palestinians.
Fixed
DocMcCoy"Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,917 Posts
Flomotion said:
rootlesscosmo said:
LaserWolf said:
I think it has been proven, that Hamas and Israel's enemies do not have the weapons, forces or will to annihilate Israel.
On the other hand Israel Has proven that despite having the weapons and forces they do not have the will to annihilate all Palestinians.
Actually I think the correct formulation is:
Israel's enemies have the will -- but not the means -- to annihilate Israel.
Israel has the means -- but not the mandate-- to annihilate all Palestinians.
Fixed
If it has the world in its pocket, why does it even need a mandate?
Do we suddenly decide to demand the collective punishment of a whole population and its creative industries for the actions of its leaders. Strange, that.
Maybe read these things before poasting?
Nothing you can ever say or do will convince me that wanting an end to the murder of children is racist.
I know the conflict is deeply rooted and super complicated, but Israel always seems to bring the hammer down much harder than it needs to.
To be clear, I am not picking a side because I don't trust the media and I can't know all the details of who fired first and why. I'm just disgusted with the needless death of children.
I agree 100% with this sentiment. I also agree 100% with the cool-headed analysis of Rootless who throughout this thread has run circles around the knee-jerk anti-Israeli brigade queueing up to be knocked down. Israel comes down way too hard, but come down they must. 2 State solution = only solution. Palestinians must reject Hamas and by dint the annihilation of Israel. By the way , Hamas "started it" (that's the bit you quote me on to pick at)
DocMcCoy"Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,917 Posts
Do we suddenly decide to demand the collective punishment of a whole population and its creative industries for the actions of its leaders. Strange, that.
Maybe read these things before poasting?
Nothing you can ever say or do will convince me that wanting an end to the murder of children is racist.
Yes, I did read it, thanks. If you can't or won't see the broader point I'm trying to make here, then I won't waste any more of my time. Next time you're on a Free Palestine march, and someone marching next to you strikes up a chant of "Death to the Jews", be sure to tell them - in the strongest possible terms, of course - "no kids!"
The Jews need to turn off the Iron Dome for a few days so that some of their kids are killed by the hundreds of rockets being sent their way to make this a "fair war".
the iron dome is a very effective defense system, Israel should be very thankful to the U.S. for providing it.
but instead, we get speeches on the floor of congress in opposition to the sitting President in the middle of an election year, expansions of settlements in direct defiance of the international community including the United States, and now a punishing war against its own occupied territory in which more than 2/3 of the casualties have been civilians, many of them children. and they call it "cutting the grass".
it baffles me that even Israel's supporters in this thread can argue with a straight face that this will somehow benefit Israel in the long run. All this has done is strengthen Hamas, inspire a new round of worldwide terrorist recruitment, ensure that a two-state solution will be even more impossible than ever, and weaken Israel's standing not only internationally but even within this country, their only remaining friend.
Pretty sure I said this at the top of the thread, but it appears pretty clear that Israel does not give a shit about anyone (U.S. included) and is determined to go it alone, secure in its ability to defend itself militarily and spatially from any outside aggression. Have fun with that.
Do we suddenly decide to demand the collective punishment of a whole population and its creative industries for the actions of its leaders. Strange, that.
Maybe read these things before poasting?
Nothing you can ever say or do will convince me that wanting an end to the murder of children is racist.
Yes, I did read it, thanks. If you can't or won't see the broader point I'm trying to make here, then I won't waste any more of my time. Next time you're on a Free Palestine march, and someone marching next to you strikes up a chant of "Death to the Jews", be sure to tell them - in the strongest possible terms, of course - "no kids!"
I'm done here.
So
Free Palestine = death to Jews
Boycott Israel = Hamas are saints
Condemning the murder of children/civilians doesn't mean I'm not against racism in any shape or form. But of course, if I'm critical of Israel, I must be a goose-stepping racist, ready to throw bricks at synagogues.
Israel apologists need a better defence than the racism card, and a fucking sense of perspective when they trot out shite like the quote from the article above.
Do we suddenly decide to demand the collective punishment of a whole population and its creative industries for the actions of its leaders. Strange, that.
Maybe read these things before poasting?
Nothing you can ever say or do will convince me that wanting an end to the murder of children is racist.
Yes, I did read it, thanks. If you can't or won't see the broader point I'm trying to make here, then I won't waste any more of my time. Next time you're on a Free Palestine march, and someone marching next to you strikes up a chant of "Death to the Jews", be sure to tell them - in the strongest possible terms, of course - "no kids!"
I'm done here.
So
Free Palestine = death to Jews
Boycott Israel = Hamas are saints
Condemning the murder of children/civilians doesn't mean I'm not against racism in any shape or form. But of course, if I'm critical of Israel, I must be a goose-stepping racist, ready to throw bricks at synagogues.
Israel apologists need a better defence than the racism card, and a fucking sense of perspective when they trot out shite like the quote from the article above.
The Jews need to turn off the Iron Dome for a few days so that some of their kids are killed by the hundreds of rockets being sent their way to make this a "fair war".
Do we suddenly decide to demand the collective punishment of a whole population and its creative industries for the actions of its leaders. Strange, that.
Maybe read these things before poasting?
Nothing you can ever say or do will convince me that wanting an end to the murder of children is racist.
Yes, I did read it, thanks. If you can't or won't see the broader point I'm trying to make here, then I won't waste any more of my time. Next time you're on a Free Palestine march, and someone marching next to you strikes up a chant of "Death to the Jews", be sure to tell them - in the strongest possible terms, of course - "no kids!"
I'm done here.
So
Free Palestine = death to Jews
Boycott Israel = Hamas are saints
Condemning the murder of children/civilians doesn't mean I'm not against racism in any shape or form. But of course, if I'm critical of Israel, I must be a goose-stepping racist, ready to throw bricks at synagogues.
Israel apologists need a better defence than the racism card, and a fucking sense of perspective when they trot out shite like the quote from the article above.
Dont fret, a nice cup of tea will sort this out.
The last march in London included numerous Jews - so there's some critical thinking going on outside of Israel, while within, the support for the current hostilities is either at 93% or 97%. This is doubtless because Israeli coverage focuses on the fatalities of just one side.
Rockadelic said:
The Jews need to turn off the Iron Dome for a few days so that some of their kids are killed by the hundreds of rockets being sent their way to make this a "fair war".
b/w
Yeah, that was sarcasm
No, the Israelis, not the Jews, there is a difference. Try to understand that part and maybe this won't seem like such a black & white argument.
the iron dome is a very effective defense system, Israel should be very thankful to the U.S. for providing it.
but instead, we get speeches on the floor of congress in opposition to the sitting President in the middle of an election year, expansions of settlements in direct defiance of the international community including the United States, and now a punishing war against its own occupied territory in which more than 2/3 of the casualties have been civilians, many of them children. and they call it "cutting the grass".
it baffles me that even Israel's supporters in this thread can argue with a straight face that this will somehow benefit Israel in the long run. All this has done is strengthen Hamas, inspire a new round of worldwide terrorist recruitment, ensure that a two-state solution will be even more impossible than ever, and weaken Israel's standing not only internationally but even within this country, their only remaining friend.
No, the Israelis, not the Jews, there is a difference. Try to understand that part and maybe this won't seem like such a black & white argument.
Tell these dudes
Luckily Qatar is just talk at the moment. How much of it can be as a result of the treatment of the Palestinias? On a scale 0-100%? Is it 0? Was Qatar making these statements about Jews before Israel existed?
There doesn't need to be a "winner". Looking in from the outside, there can't be. Israel only wins when it has exterminated the last Palestinian. Palestinians only win when they do the same to Israel. Which is the more likely outcome, and who would be the sick fuck to call themselves "winners" on the back of genocide?
Peace is the only option. This is known as a draw.
The last march in London included numerous Jews - so there's some critical thinking going on outside of Israel, while within, the support for the current hostilities is either at 93% or 97%. This is doubtless because Israeli coverage focuses on the fatalities of just one side.
and this ridiculous remark is doubtless because you don't read Israeli coverage.
Luckily Qatar is just talk at the moment. How much of it can be as a result of the treatment of the Palestinias? On a scale 0-100%? Is it 0? Was Qatar making these statements about Jews before Israel existed?
radical Islamism does not exist because of Israel, something you (and the Arabists at the US State Department) don't seem to understand.
The last march in London included numerous Jews - so there's some critical thinking going on outside of Israel, while within, the support for the current hostilities is either at 93% or 97%. This is doubtless because Israeli coverage focuses on the fatalities of just one side.
and this ridiculous remark is doubtless because you don't read Israeli coverage.
Not exhaustively no, but I had read that Israeli coverage was partisan and preferred to believe this could be behind the near unanimous support for war. There must be other reasons.
Luckily Qatar is just talk at the moment. How much of it can be as a result of the treatment of the Palestinias? On a scale 0-100%? Is it 0? Was Qatar making these statements about Jews before Israel existed?
radical Islamism does not exist because of Israel, something you (and the Arabists at the US State Department) don't seem to understand.
So they were explicitly making speeches calling for the death of Jews prior to the creation of Israel?
Comments
That is fucked up.
I know the conflict is deeply rooted and super complicated, but Israel always seems to bring the hammer down much harder than it needs to.
To be clear, I am not picking a side because I don't trust the media and I can't know all the details of who fired first and why. I'm just disgusted with the needless death of children.
Actually I think the correct formulation is:
Israel's enemies have the will -- but not the means -- to annihilate Israel.
Israel has the means -- but not the will -- to annihilate all Palestinians.
"Anti-Zionism is not anti-semitism"
"Anti-Zionism is not anti-semitism"
"Anti-Zionism is not anti-semitism"
Fixed
If it has the world in its pocket, why does it even need a mandate?
And now I'm on the same side of the argument as Melanie fucking Phillips. Lord Jesus help me.
Today a sign, tomorrow a brick.
Oh the irony...
Maybe read these things before poasting?
Nothing you can ever say or do will convince me that wanting an end to the murder of children is racist.
I agree 100% with this sentiment. I also agree 100% with the cool-headed analysis of Rootless who throughout this thread has run circles around the knee-jerk anti-Israeli brigade queueing up to be knocked down. Israel comes down way too hard, but come down they must. 2 State solution = only solution. Palestinians must reject Hamas and by dint the annihilation of Israel. By the way , Hamas "started it" (that's the bit you quote me on to pick at)
Yes, I did read it, thanks. If you can't or won't see the broader point I'm trying to make here, then I won't waste any more of my time. Next time you're on a Free Palestine march, and someone marching next to you strikes up a chant of "Death to the Jews", be sure to tell them - in the strongest possible terms, of course - "no kids!"
I'm done here.
b/w
Yeah, that was sarcasm
but instead, we get speeches on the floor of congress in opposition to the sitting President in the middle of an election year, expansions of settlements in direct defiance of the international community including the United States, and now a punishing war against its own occupied territory in which more than 2/3 of the casualties have been civilians, many of them children. and they call it "cutting the grass".
it baffles me that even Israel's supporters in this thread can argue with a straight face that this will somehow benefit Israel in the long run. All this has done is strengthen Hamas, inspire a new round of worldwide terrorist recruitment, ensure that a two-state solution will be even more impossible than ever, and weaken Israel's standing not only internationally but even within this country, their only remaining friend.
Pretty sure I said this at the top of the thread, but it appears pretty clear that Israel does not give a shit about anyone (U.S. included) and is determined to go it alone, secure in its ability to defend itself militarily and spatially from any outside aggression. Have fun with that.
So
Free Palestine = death to Jews
Boycott Israel = Hamas are saints
Condemning the murder of children/civilians doesn't mean I'm not against racism in any shape or form. But of course, if I'm critical of Israel, I must be a goose-stepping racist, ready to throw bricks at synagogues.
Israel apologists need a better defence than the racism card, and a fucking sense of perspective when they trot out shite like the quote from the article above.
wtf kind of operation are they running over there?
Dont fret, a nice cup of tea will sort this out.
You're a fucking idiot.
No, that wasn't sarcasm.
The last march in London included numerous Jews - so there's some critical thinking going on outside of Israel, while within, the support for the current hostilities is either at 93% or 97%. This is doubtless because Israeli coverage focuses on the fatalities of just one side.
No, the Israelis, not the Jews, there is a difference. Try to understand that part and maybe this won't seem like such a black & white argument.
F*ck.
Tell these dudes
Luckily Qatar is just talk at the moment. How much of it can be as a result of the treatment of the Palestinias? On a scale 0-100%? Is it 0? Was Qatar making these statements about Jews before Israel existed?
There doesn't need to be a "winner". Looking in from the outside, there can't be. Israel only wins when it has exterminated the last Palestinian. Palestinians only win when they do the same to Israel. Which is the more likely outcome, and who would be the sick fuck to call themselves "winners" on the back of genocide?
Peace is the only option. This is known as a draw.
yeah guns don't kill people, either... :-S
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2014/08/01/what-about-palestinian-right-to-freedom/
It really is the end of times! Cats mating with dogs! Fox News making sense!
and this ridiculous remark is doubtless because you don't read Israeli coverage.
radical Islamism does not exist because of Israel, something you (and the Arabists at the US State Department) don't seem to understand.
Not exhaustively no, but I had read that Israeli coverage was partisan and preferred to believe this could be behind the near unanimous support for war. There must be other reasons.
So they were explicitly making speeches calling for the death of Jews prior to the creation of Israel?