Is it worth looking up football and hockey, ya think?
No its worth looking at upper management.
Jeezus. Keep moving those goalposts, pal. Next you'll be talking about beer vendors.
The NBA continued to have the most racially diverse group of players of the major U.S. professional sports. People of color represented 82 percent of all players, and 78 percent of all players were African-American. The NBA also has a strong international contingent with 17 percent of all players from nations other than the United States.
So diversity doesn't mean diversity, it just means having the highest percentage of "people of color."
So if the NBA was 100% "people of color" it would have reached maximum diversity.
I've watched two complete baseball games in three years- WS games 6 & 7 btwn StL & Tex.
I said to a friend this morning, "do you know anyone who still likes baseball?" He laughed.
Shit is so dead. And dull.
My boss brought his sons class to work a couple years back, and they all laughed at us about baseball. 13 yrs old. They all love euro soccer, and could name all those dudes.
I think this is an important post. Young people don't give a fuck about baseball by and large, and that doesn't bode well for its future. It's like Northern Soul. There are fans, but they're not getting any younger. And I hate to point this out, but the two people most championing baseball in this thread are (perhaps) the two oldest people on this entire message board other than D*n.
I've watched two complete baseball games in three years- WS games 6 & 7 btwn StL & Tex.
I said to a friend this morning, "do you know anyone who still likes baseball?" He laughed.
Shit is so dead. And dull.
My boss brought his sons class to work a couple years back, and they all laughed at us about baseball. 13 yrs old. They all love euro soccer, and could name all those dudes.
I think this is an important post. Young people don't give a fuck about baseball by and large, and that doesn't bode well for its future. It's like Northern Soul. There are fans, but they're not getting any younger. And I hate to point this out, but the two people most championing baseball in this thread are (perhaps) the two oldest people on this entire message board other than D*n.
Back on topic, (Thanks, Non) that's sort of the point I was trying to make.
As most of you know, I work in sports television- and I sat in a symposium a few years back where the most popular league in America said they'd formed a task force to examine why their core fan base was 40+. They were terrified by that- and they were (and are) in the lead.
They also said in that meeting that if they do not have someone as a consumer- buying video games, jerseys, apparel etc- by the time they are 15, they are lost for life. They need these people to spend money as young people to build them into the fans that will buy season tickets and cable packages as adults.
Also, for all the Ken Burns' traditionalists out there- don't get it twisted, I loved baseball for most of my life. But, I do NOT have time for these 4 hour marathons. And, neither do those same soccer loving kids. I get the strategy, and work the pitcher and all that Bill James WAR shit, but that is DEATHLY as entertainment.
The NFL watches their game times OBSESSIVELY. Networks are given two :10 SECOND extensions coming back from a commercial per game. If you don't make it back in time from commercial, they will start without you. They are that worried about SECONDS being added to the length of their game broadcasts. Is it a coincidence they are now the number property in all of television? I don't think so.
(There is more technical crap to this that I won't get into, but that is the Readers' Digest version).
The thread isn't, "Is baseball dead." The answer to that is no.
The question is, "is baseball dying"? The answer, at this moment, may be yes. And, I'm sure they are aware of it and want to fix it.
The thread isn't, "Is baseball dead." The answer to that is no.
The question is, "is baseball dying"? The answer, at this moment, may be yes. And, I'm sure they are aware of it and want to fix it.
This thread brings up a lot of great points: time of game, attendance, popularity, and evolution.
I also think the economy has hit all professional sports in one way or another. IMHO, professional sports in general are becoming too big for their own good. The 'common' fan cannot either afford to attend games regularly or work too much to find the time to attend games even if they could.
**Side note**
I often wonder who the MLB is marketing these 12:30pm Wednesday games to??
I didn't read the thread. but the way to fix baseball is to allow steroids, aluminum bats,and cut the season in half.. 80 games played from May - August.
In any given year, roughly 70 million people will attend major-league baseball games. A lucky handful will be treated to something unforgettable: a no-hitter, a walk-off grand slam, a player stealing home. Many more fans will see towering home runs, late-inning rallies and diving catches. But there is one thing every single fan who buys a ticket is 100% guaranteed to see: a bunch of grown men standing in a field, doing absolutely nothing.
Baseball is remembered for its moments of action, and it is no secret that such moments are fleeting. But how much actual action takes place in a baseball game? We decided to find out.
By WSJ calculations, a baseball fan will see 17 minutes and 58 seconds of action over the course of a three-hour game. This is roughly the equivalent of a TED Talk, a Broadway intermission or the missing section of the Watergate tapes. A similar WSJ study on NFL games in January 2010 found that the average action time for a football game was 11 minutes. So MLB does pack more punch in a battle of the two biggest stop-and-start sports. By seven minutes.
Been giving this some thought......When I had kids in my late 20's my interest in baseball, and sports in general, took a back seat to raising a family and building a career. While raising two daughters, coaching their teams and spending time with them(including playing sports) my interest in professional sports took a back seat. Part of raising my kids was attending the odd sporting event but certainly not on a fanatic level. I'd like to think this had more to do with good parenting than a loss of interest in a particular sport.....simple priorities.
Once my kids were grown I found I once again had the time and interest to get back into the sport that I loved in my youth. My oldest daughter has a great interest in baseball and attends more games than I do. I look forward to the day that I can take my grand kids to games just like my Granddad did with me.
Conclusion: Baseball is not dying. Attendance and $$ is all the evidence you need to see that. BUT....I do believe there is a period in most men's lives when Sports in general take a back seat to just about everything else. For me that period was between 28 & 50 years of age when my family took top priority over other pursuits which definitely included but was not limited to sports. Since most members here are within that age range I can understand why they may think baseball (amongst other things) are "dying".
there will always be fans but the youth interest is going down hard and other sports are cashing in
any youth center around north america kids would go nuts to watch an nba finals game, ufc, nfl, hockey were applicable
even if its a local guy tennis and boxing
but apart from their snapbacks no one would care about baseball
i had expo games galore as a young man and would sleep through i once got woken up by a homerun landing in my section
it's a fun family activity but as far as fan following, jersey sales etc..soccer and the rest will take whatever part of the youth market that is left
kids would rather go to a MLS game than a world series match
Attending a football game blows, but that's a different argument. The sport is made for television. And, that is a big concern of the league as well- why spend the money and sit in traffic going to a game, when you can stay home and watch on a huge screen.
Because I am old I will now bore you with my opinions on many subjects.
Because you are young you can stop reading now.
Even though I like baseball I am not so stupid that I don't realize it's popularity has declined a lot since my youth.
Amazing that some people are arguing otherwise.
Other sports popularity have skyrocketed.
Football is the better tv sport, as Gareth points out.
Going to an NBA game is like going to a rock concert.
Baseball would greatly benefit from income sharing and other schemes to achieve parity.
Baseball is fun to watch at all levels, HS, college, AAA...
I had a chance to visit Baltimore this summer.
The town has always been baseball nuts and now that the O's are back above .500 the town is tuned in big time.
Back in Portland we have no baseball team, baseball is rarely on free American tv, which is all I get. So I have to follow it with box scores and one paragraph recaps in my daily paper.
We have no football team, but I see football everywhere, it is on the front of the sports page and FATV all the time.
The NBA, as Batmon points out, is part of popular culture.
The lesson, as always - when Thymebomb tells you something, the opposite is true.
Fixed.
1) By 1982 baseball was well into it's decline.
2) The US population has grown by a third since 1982.
3) 1982 was one of the worse years for baseball following the player strike shortened 1981.
4) The top 2 teams in '82 were small mid-west market teams.
5) Instead of manufacturing inaccurate statistics to prove something that is clearly false why not admit you were wrong.
6) Meet me in the john with the goldfish.
Rock and Laser, I really liked both of your posts.
And, Rock, I think you hit some of the nail on the head with time in your life when sports take a back seat.
But, that same demo is the core of NFL Fantasy. Which, brings up another point- gambling and fantasy will keep football popular. I tried playing fantasy baseball once, and wanted to shoot myself after a week when I realized I had to play everyday. Baseball is tougher for both fantasy and gambling purposes.
One thing for me that hastened my break from baseball was living in NYC. Here, it's just one of many, many things to do. When I lived in Boston (yes, during the height of Red Sox Nation/Pink Hat Mania of the aughts) it was a huge deal. Oddly, whenever I travel for work, I check if the local team is in town- and I too caught an O's game a couple years back on a work trip, and caught my only foul ball.
b/w
"fucking grueling asswipe," had me laughing out loud.
The only time baseball interests me is when there is a bench clearing brawl, like when all hell broke loose at "Fans Get Free Balls" night at Dodger Stadium in the mid-90s. I was there, man! "AAAAAnd here come the pretzels!!!"
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
gareth said:
Attending a football game blows, but that's a different argument. The sport is made for television. And, that is a big concern of the league as well- why spend the money and sit in traffic going to a game, when you can stay home and watch on a huge screen.
Deadspin(.com) has some pretty funny posts related to 'Today's Disinterested Baseball Fans'.
kinda rich considering that's a picture of my stadium packed to capacity.
Does capacity not mean every seat is filled? Maybe it's in between innings or something. But I see quite a few empty seats.
I know. Nitpicking. The game is pretty full in any case.
If it's SF, maybe people are getting a $10 beer.
:beer: :oof:
not exclusive to SF by the way.
i invite you come on up here to see the maple leafs (sic) at the ACC. $150 obstructed view standing room tickets, here's the kicker, IF YOU CAN GET THEM
Deadspin(.com) has some pretty funny posts related to 'Today's Disinterested Baseball Fans'.
kinda rich considering that's a picture of my stadium packed to capacity.
Does capacity not mean every seat is filled? Maybe it's in between innings or something. But I see quite a few empty seats.
I know. Nitpicking. The game is pretty full in any case.
If it's SF, maybe people are getting a $10 beer.
:beer: :oof:
not exclusive to SF by the way.
i invite you come on up here to see the maple leafs (sic) at the ACC. $150 obstructed view standing room tickets, here's the kicker, IF YOU CAN GET THEM
Or you can spend that $10 and get a seat behind home plate at the Rogers Centre. :hi:
Comments
hmmmm
I think this is an important post. Young people don't give a fuck about baseball by and large, and that doesn't bode well for its future. It's like Northern Soul. There are fans, but they're not getting any younger. And I hate to point this out, but the two people most championing baseball in this thread are (perhaps) the two oldest people on this entire message board other than D*n.
Back on topic, (Thanks, Non) that's sort of the point I was trying to make.
As most of you know, I work in sports television- and I sat in a symposium a few years back where the most popular league in America said they'd formed a task force to examine why their core fan base was 40+. They were terrified by that- and they were (and are) in the lead.
They also said in that meeting that if they do not have someone as a consumer- buying video games, jerseys, apparel etc- by the time they are 15, they are lost for life. They need these people to spend money as young people to build them into the fans that will buy season tickets and cable packages as adults.
Also, for all the Ken Burns' traditionalists out there- don't get it twisted, I loved baseball for most of my life. But, I do NOT have time for these 4 hour marathons. And, neither do those same soccer loving kids. I get the strategy, and work the pitcher and all that Bill James WAR shit, but that is DEATHLY as entertainment.
The NFL watches their game times OBSESSIVELY. Networks are given two :10 SECOND extensions coming back from a commercial per game. If you don't make it back in time from commercial, they will start without you. They are that worried about SECONDS being added to the length of their game broadcasts. Is it a coincidence they are now the number property in all of television? I don't think so.
(There is more technical crap to this that I won't get into, but that is the Readers' Digest version).
The thread isn't, "Is baseball dead." The answer to that is no.
The question is, "is baseball dying"? The answer, at this moment, may be yes. And, I'm sure they are aware of it and want to fix it.
This thread brings up a lot of great points: time of game, attendance, popularity, and evolution.
I also think the economy has hit all professional sports in one way or another. IMHO, professional sports in general are becoming too big for their own good. The 'common' fan cannot either afford to attend games regularly or work too much to find the time to attend games even if they could.
**Side note**
I often wonder who the MLB is marketing these 12:30pm Wednesday games to??
am I rite
kinda risky at ur age
Once my kids were grown I found I once again had the time and interest to get back into the sport that I loved in my youth. My oldest daughter has a great interest in baseball and attends more games than I do. I look forward to the day that I can take my grand kids to games just like my Granddad did with me.
Conclusion: Baseball is not dying. Attendance and $$ is all the evidence you need to see that. BUT....I do believe there is a period in most men's lives when Sports in general take a back seat to just about everything else. For me that period was between 28 & 50 years of age when my family took top priority over other pursuits which definitely included but was not limited to sports. Since most members here are within that age range I can understand why they may think baseball (amongst other things) are "dying".
any youth center around north america kids would go nuts to watch an nba finals game, ufc, nfl, hockey were applicable
even if its a local guy tennis and boxing
but apart from their snapbacks no one would care about baseball
i had expo games galore as a young man and would sleep through i once got woken up by a homerun landing in my section
it's a fun family activity but as far as fan following, jersey sales etc..soccer and the rest will take whatever part of the youth market that is left
kids would rather go to a MLS game than a world series match
kind of like baseball.
This morning at my train station.
But, that is not the title of the thread.
Because I am old I will now bore you with my opinions on many subjects.
Because you are young you can stop reading now.
Even though I like baseball I am not so stupid that I don't realize it's popularity has declined a lot since my youth.
Amazing that some people are arguing otherwise.
Other sports popularity have skyrocketed.
Football is the better tv sport, as Gareth points out.
Going to an NBA game is like going to a rock concert.
Baseball would greatly benefit from income sharing and other schemes to achieve parity.
Baseball is fun to watch at all levels, HS, college, AAA...
I had a chance to visit Baltimore this summer.
The town has always been baseball nuts and now that the O's are back above .500 the town is tuned in big time.
Back in Portland we have no baseball team, baseball is rarely on free American tv, which is all I get. So I have to follow it with box scores and one paragraph recaps in my daily paper.
We have no football team, but I see football everywhere, it is on the front of the sports page and FATV all the time.
The NBA, as Batmon points out, is part of popular culture.
Baseball is not dead, it's on life support.
Fixed.
1) By 1982 baseball was well into it's decline.
2) The US population has grown by a third since 1982.
3) 1982 was one of the worse years for baseball following the player strike shortened 1981.
4) The top 2 teams in '82 were small mid-west market teams.
5) Instead of manufacturing inaccurate statistics to prove something that is clearly false why not admit you were wrong.
6) Meet me in the john with the goldfish.
And, Rock, I think you hit some of the nail on the head with time in your life when sports take a back seat.
But, that same demo is the core of NFL Fantasy. Which, brings up another point- gambling and fantasy will keep football popular. I tried playing fantasy baseball once, and wanted to shoot myself after a week when I realized I had to play everyday. Baseball is tougher for both fantasy and gambling purposes.
One thing for me that hastened my break from baseball was living in NYC. Here, it's just one of many, many things to do. When I lived in Boston (yes, during the height of Red Sox Nation/Pink Hat Mania of the aughts) it was a huge deal. Oddly, whenever I travel for work, I check if the local team is in town- and I too caught an O's game a couple years back on a work trip, and caught my only foul ball.
b/w
"fucking grueling asswipe," had me laughing out loud.
Every single Saints home game disagrees with you.
Facebook
Home office
:game_over: :hard_as_fuck:
Virtual baseball > Real baseball?
I thought we had an origami gremlin? :roar:
kinda rich considering that's a picture of my stadium packed to capacity.
Does capacity not mean every seat is filled? Maybe it's in between innings or something. But I see quite a few empty seats.
I know. Nitpicking. The game is pretty full in any case.
If it's SF, maybe people are getting a $10 beer.
:beer: :oof:
Could someone put a field behind him and fox w/ the text?
not exclusive to SF by the way.
i invite you come on up here to see the maple leafs (sic) at the ACC. $150 obstructed view standing room tickets, here's the kicker, IF YOU CAN GET THEM
Or you can spend that $10 and get a seat behind home plate at the Rogers Centre. :hi: