the definition of subculture is ambiguous, so anything can be a subculture.
I'm guessing your wife would not agree with this. Sure, the definition is somewhat ambiguous (lots of definitions are), that doesn't mean it's meaningless.
The_Hook_Up said:
But a culture, on it's own? No.
It's clearly not a culture on it's own. I'm not sure anyone who knows what they are talking about is asserting otherwise. I don't think using the phrase 'rave culture' is the same as saying that raves are a culture onto themselves.
She agreed the definition is ambiguous, and that the term subcultures just mean that a group of people have a means of conveying information. So advertising, music to buy, drugs to take satisfy that.
A responsible journalist would have titled the article "explaining the rave subculture to Americans"...if the subject matter invites a semantic argument, then proper designation is needed, I think. I am sure there are arguments that raves and the people who frequent them are indeed a culture. I want to hear them. Since cultures are above judgement, it seems that the "you think raves are stupid, therefore your disike of raves is based on ignorance" carries an implication that they should be treated as a culture.
Well, according to dictionary.com one definition of culture is: the behaviors and beliefs characteristic of a particular social, ethnic, or age group: the youth culture; the drug culture.
Raves in the UK have always had an existence outside mainstream culture and often outside of the law. They attract a particular segment of society, the illegal ones particularly, and because of this illegality it's quite exclusive and some what secretive in nature. Yet it has it's own set of cultural rules and norms.
Then if you look at the wider impact of "rave culture" in the UK; It's broken down social barriers, brought us moral panic and new laws, whilst also being credited with helping reduce football hooliganism. It's been a catalyst for countless bands and musical subgenres, many that have gone on the shape music throughout the world. New Order, Soul II Soul, Massive Attack, Portishead, Warp Records, Aphex Twin, The Stone Roses, Happy Mondays & anyone connected with Factory Records, Acid Jazzers, Jungle, DnB, UkGarage, Grime, Dubstep and many others all have their roots in rave culture. It's made superstars out of djs and made record decks outsell guitars as the bedroom musicians instrument of choice.
She agreed the definition is ambiguous, and that the term subcultures just mean that a group of people have a means of conveying information. So advertising, music to buy, drugs to take satisfy that.
She agreed the definition is ambiguous, and that the term subcultures just mean that a group of people have a means of conveying information. So advertising, music to buy, drugs to take satisfy that.
^^didn't attend^^
My band played a rave in '96...It was one of those drive out to the middle of nowhere, get directions from a dude on an intersection of dirt road and drive on a dirt wood through the woods to a clearing. It was interesting. I thought it was strange that a Rick band, albeit a psychedelic one was invited to play. The most impressive thing to me was the size if the truck that delivered the oranges and bananas at dawn. It was huge and had the biggest payload of fruit in one place I have ever seen. So yes I have attended a rave.
at least in my experience, there was a severe lack of advertising at any event i ever went to. except for maybe some sponsors listed on the purposely cryptic flyers that would circulate beforehand.
same goes for music being sold on site.
a lot of incredible electronic music came out of the "rave" scene
some of which stands the test of time.
to dismiss all of it would be elitist,narrow minded and arrogant.
oh wait ???..i forgot this is soul-strut and the benchmark for everything is primo's beats from 92-95
Some good posts on this page. The Acid House/Rave scene of the late 80's had a massive impact on other genres, instigated (unfortunately) a change in criminal law within the UK and had hooligans hugging each other at secret locations off motorways at 4am Sunday morning when they'd normally have been kicking shit out of each other 12 hours earlier.
I'd hoped for a few stories from Chicago/Detroit residents of the time.
Mayo shouldn't even be a condiment. It's disgusting.
Enjoy that bone-dry turkey sammich, homie. What do you put in chicken salad? Olive oil?
I think mayo is gross, too. LIGHTLY mixed in with tuna salad, etc. where its presence is sufficiently masked and it doesn't announce its rotting egg mess too loudly is fine...but hardly. Even then, retaining some of tuna's own liquid and/or mixing with lemon juice works lovely.
I will risk the ridicule to say that hummus is really good when the sandwich needs that adhesive but you don't want to touch things up with creamy puke.
Disagree, of course, but I enjoy the sentiment. Condiment status, retracted! Where does that leave us?
For those of you with room in the 'fridge for mayonnaise, here's a little riddle I've been pondering:
mayonnaise:Miracle Whip as Miracle Whip:________. Basically, what's Miracle Whip's Miracle Whip? I couldn't even really tell you what Miracle Whip is but I do own it.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
I don't know why folks are so anti-mayo. You like eggs? You like olive oil? Whisk the two together and you have mayo. I should note that I also make my own achiote paste from scratch, so that totally maintains my multliculti street cred. Achiote paste is like my One Black Friend that makes it OK for me to eat mayo with impunity.
Comments
She agreed the definition is ambiguous, and that the term subcultures just mean that a group of people have a means of conveying information. So advertising, music to buy, drugs to take satisfy that.
A responsible journalist would have titled the article "explaining the rave subculture to Americans"...if the subject matter invites a semantic argument, then proper designation is needed, I think. I am sure there are arguments that raves and the people who frequent them are indeed a culture. I want to hear them. Since cultures are above judgement, it seems that the "you think raves are stupid, therefore your disike of raves is based on ignorance" carries an implication that they should be treated as a culture.
Raves in the UK have always had an existence outside mainstream culture and often outside of the law. They attract a particular segment of society, the illegal ones particularly, and because of this illegality it's quite exclusive and some what secretive in nature. Yet it has it's own set of cultural rules and norms.
Then if you look at the wider impact of "rave culture" in the UK; It's broken down social barriers, brought us moral panic and new laws, whilst also being credited with helping reduce football hooliganism. It's been a catalyst for countless bands and musical subgenres, many that have gone on the shape music throughout the world. New Order, Soul II Soul, Massive Attack, Portishead, Warp Records, Aphex Twin, The Stone Roses, Happy Mondays & anyone connected with Factory Records, Acid Jazzers, Jungle, DnB, UkGarage, Grime, Dubstep and many others all have their roots in rave culture. It's made superstars out of djs and made record decks outsell guitars as the bedroom musicians instrument of choice.
^^didn't attend^^
My band played a rave in '96...It was one of those drive out to the middle of nowhere, get directions from a dude on an intersection of dirt road and drive on a dirt wood through the woods to a clearing. It was interesting. I thought it was strange that a Rick band, albeit a psychedelic one was invited to play. The most impressive thing to me was the size if the truck that delivered the oranges and bananas at dawn. It was huge and had the biggest payload of fruit in one place I have ever seen. So yes I have attended a rave.
at least in my experience, there was a severe lack of advertising at any event i ever went to. except for maybe some sponsors listed on the purposely cryptic flyers that would circulate beforehand.
same goes for music being sold on site.
some of which stands the test of time.
to dismiss all of it would be elitist,narrow minded and arrogant.
oh wait ???..i forgot this is soul-strut and the benchmark for everything is primo's beats from 92-95
etc etc
2:00 - 3:44
American explaining rave to the English. Props to the dude on crutches at 3:19!
Heavy track.
I'd hoped for a few stories from Chicago/Detroit residents of the time.
ive actually seen more than a few americans rock this disgusting move.
we canadians like to keep it healthy, just gravy and cheese curd for us.
also canadian.
sorry about that.
Blegh!
Had a chuckle when I read that on Daily Mash earlier.
Mustard on sweet potato fries is the troof
Naah man. No bueno.
LOL!
Nah, I love mustard. But on fries, guys? Uh, no thanks!
I suppose it's better than mayo on fries. Mayo shouldn't even be a condiment. It's disgusting.
Enjoy that bone-dry turkey sammich, homie. What do you put in chicken salad? Olive oil?
Ketchup is the most disgusting condiment.
I think mayo is gross, too. LIGHTLY mixed in with tuna salad, etc. where its presence is sufficiently masked and it doesn't announce its rotting egg mess too loudly is fine...but hardly. Even then, retaining some of tuna's own liquid and/or mixing with lemon juice works lovely.
I will risk the ridicule to say that hummus is really good when the sandwich needs that adhesive but you don't want to touch things up with creamy puke.
Disagree, of course, but I enjoy the sentiment. Condiment status, retracted! Where does that leave us?
For those of you with room in the 'fridge for mayonnaise, here's a little riddle I've been pondering:
mayonnaise:Miracle Whip as Miracle Whip:________. Basically, what's Miracle Whip's Miracle Whip? I couldn't even really tell you what Miracle Whip is but I do own it.
Let's not forget horseradish, wonderful, delightful horseradish!
Actually, mayo mixed with relish is literally this:
Which I will totally rock on a New England fried seafood plate.
horseradish with mayo on your fries is an awesome combo. I learned that from the Roy Rogers fixin's bar.