That's not a 5 pager, it's a one poster...Madonna.
Who sampled... Public Enemy
But seriously, I Takes A Nation of Millions did get a lot of Dead Heads off their acid rock crap... but then they promptly got into Beck and the Beasties. Hard.
Most of the guys I grew up with managed to seamlessly integrate the Beasties into their daily routine of listening to 8 Phish tapes.
but in the end, its impact has been exaggerrated over the years
Maybe not for the average head or SStrut headcase, but how many people in this demographic (still) own and listen to this record (even if it is once a year) as opposed to others mentioned in the thread?
And to properly compare it to Sgt Pepper, are we not considering if people will be buying and listening to it 40yrs from now?
But to state the impact of It Takes a Nation has been exaggerated over the years is IMO wrong.
Some might not wanna admit it. But NWA in the beginning was really just trying to be the west coast version of Public Enemy mixed with the gangster reality of the world around them.
I'm not trying to degrade Straight Outta Compton in any way. I think they are both in the top 10 albums of importance of my generation. And while SOC is much more relevant today. At the core of the album is still the message NWA was projecting from Public Enemy.
I'd have to say that's a stretch to portray the influende between PE and NWA as anything more than symbolic. The energy was there, but the music and the messages were entirely different.
How so? I can remember reading an interview right after SOC came out. Eazy was talking about how he liked Chuck's message on black power and his I don't give a fuck what they think attitude.
Look at the very first NWO album. It's not just the clocks that they are pulling Public Enemy influences from.
calling Straight Outta Compton our generation's Sgt Peppers is crazy.
obviously SOC is a hugely influential album to us and to our friends. and yes it had societal import far beyond even those that own/listen to it.
but while I would venture most people (music-interested people or not particularly music-interested people) of the Beatles generation would site Sgt. Peppers as influential/great, Straight Outta Compton does not resonate with most people of our generation.
the impact of the Beatles was/is massive across the board, regardless of race, politics, whatever. on the other hand NWA is not even on the radar of HUGE swaths of our generation's music listeners. sad but true.
you can't compare those two groups; you can't compare those two albums.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
you can't compare those two groups; you can't compare those two albums.
calling Straight Outta Compton our generation's Sgt Peppers is crazy.
obviously SOC is a hugely influential album to us and to our friends. and yes it had societal import far beyond even those that own/listen to it.
but while I would venture most people (music-interested people or not particularly music-interested people) of the Beatles generation would site Sgt. Peppers as influential/great, Straight Outta Compton does not resonate with most people of our generation.
the impact of the Beatles was/is massive across the board, regardless of race, politics, whatever. on the other hand NWA is not even on the radar of HUGE swaths of our generation's music listeners. sad but true.
This, also, is way off - NWA resonated all over the map, from punk kids and skate rats, to suburban mall jocks and frat boys, to stick up kids on the east coast and gangbangers on the west, nerds to hair metal groupies, all the way to the white house. Don't get it twisted, NWA is easily one of the most influential groups in American pop music of ANY genre, any time period. Not just "us and our friends" (which on this site is a grouping so amorphous as to be rendered practically meaningless)
This whole subject is weird though. I wouldn't say "NWA is the Gen-X version of the Beatles" but I wouldn't say that about ANY group unless I was making a sonic comparison.
NWA and PE came out at just around the same time so how could they influence each other?
at any rate, i don't think any rap album could be the SP of GX. if any one rap album comes close, it could be "license to ill." other than that, when i was in high school, weren't too many white folks down with rap music and i doubt they ever really caught on. these albums greatly influenced me, but i can garauntee they were/are way off some of my homey's radars from back then. while they may have directly/indirectly affected the society in which they live, they themselves were never popping in "a nation of millions" on the way to the mall or chillin in their parents basement or whenever. rap (sans your run dmc's and beastie boys) was mostly unliked and ignored by the general populace in the 80's. the people i went to high school with were into u2 or the smiths or cure or bruce springsteen or whatever, the point is, it wasn't rap music that they were into, whether they liked it or not. i'm sure some rap album could be the SP of the following generations, but i'm not buying that it would be for mine - as much as i loved rap in the 80s (and still do despite popular SS opinion). whatever the equivelant album is, its generally known by the public. i know people that couldn't tell you a single NWA/PE song then, or now. my folks could tell you beatles songs and they weren't even into them. that is the impact of that album and whatever the equivelant is for us xers, it really isn't going to be a rap album. or beck.
but more to the point, there is no sgt pepper of my generation. that album came out in a completely different time for this world.
To me it seems like the Rock canon and the Rap canon are two very different animals. You can't pick up that many magazines about rock without getting the greatness of Sgt Pepper, Blonde on Blonde, Velvet Undergrounds 1st album etc. shoved down your throat. Whereas the rap kids are into the newest, latest thing - they're not as nostalgic, it seems to me. So it's hard to compare Sgt Pepper with Straight outta Compton or Nation of millions - there are SO many old dudes in high places working so hard to keep the Pepper legend alive. And they hate rap.
I'm not even sure I buy that Sgt Peppers was the 'Sgt Peppers' of it's generation - an old rocker guy told me that all his friends thought Peppers was a bunch of wimpy orchestrated crap when it came out & were relieved when the Beatles returned to rock band stuff with the White Album, Let it Be, Abbey Road etc.
NWA resonated all over the map, from punk kids and skate rats, to suburban mall jocks and frat boys, to stick up kids on the east coast and gangbangers on the west, nerds to hair metal groupies, all the way to the white house. Don't get it twisted, NWA is easily one of the most influential groups in American pop music of ANY genre, any time period. Not just "us and our friends" (which on this site is a grouping so amorphous as to be rendered practically meaningless)
no argument there. (and I by no means meant to suggest that only music nerds or hip hop heads consider this album significant).
hey if you wanna beleive these two albums had equal impact -- be my guest.
but at the end of the day you would have trouble finding ANYONE of the Sgt. Peppers generation that did not own the album/hear the album/at least recognize that it was important and that they probably should have heard the album.
on the other you couldn't exactly randomly pick anyone of our generation off the street and expect them to own/have heard/consider important Straight Outta Compton.
I invite you to try that though (but you may want to leave LES to get a more representative sample of your generation).
and for the record I think you overestimate NWA's impact in the White House (their visit there notwithstanding).
I invite you to try that though (but you may want to leave LES to get a more representative sample of your generation).
Dude, my whole generation has MOVED to the LES!
Like I said this whole comparison is messed up... music is way more segmented now. But you could certainly take a diverse sample of our generation and I'm sure the great majority would know of NWA.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
Maybe for the younger folks of Generation X, but on the older end...I can't imagine ANYONE who hasn't owned/heard/recognized-the-importance of NWA.
And yes, they were indeed influenced by PE...possibly more than I was considering this morning.
But you could certainly take a diverse sample of our generation and I'm sure the great majority would know of NWA.
they would probably "know of" the Macarena also...I'm just saying the impact of these two albums on their respective generations is not really a fair comparison.
I think you're right in that the generations themselves and the way they listen to music is different now. way more segmented.
but hey I was not around when St. Peppers dropped. nonetheless I hear it got five mics.
NWA and PE came out at just around the same time so how could they influence each other?
Uhhhh cause they were listening to each others' records??
eventually. what i'm saying is nwa and the posse came out in 87 and yo bum rush the show came out in 87 and i'm sure both were recorded well before their respective release dates.
but in the end, its impact has been exaggerrated over the years
Maybe not for the average head or SStrut headcase, but how many people in this demographic (still) own and listen to this record (even if it is once a year) as opposed to others mentioned in the thread?
And to properly compare it to Sgt Pepper, are we not considering if people will be buying and listening to it 40yrs from now?
I just see it as...PE's undoubtedly amazing concept took off for a minute there but then died a quick and horrible death.
As opposed to, you can still readily find 10 groups just like NWA in any given city.
Black Power rap lasted more than a minute. The Coup? NWA? Brand Nubian? X-Clan...etc.
NWA and PE came out at just around the same time so how could they influence each other?
Going from memory. Bum Rush came out around around 8 months before and the Posse. And college radio was playing tracks from Nation around 5-6 months before SOC dropped.
But whatever. Both are not a Gen X Sgt Pepper IMO.
NWA and PE came out at just around the same time so how could they influence each other?
Going from memory. Bum Rush came out around around 8 months before and the Posse. And college radio was playing tracks from Nation around 5-6 months before SOC dropped.
Public Enemy's first album is way before that.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
but in the end, its impact has been exaggerrated over the years
Maybe not for the average head or SStrut headcase, but how many people in this demographic (still) own and listen to this record (even if it is once a year) as opposed to others mentioned in the thread?
And to properly compare it to Sgt Pepper, are we not considering if people will be buying and listening to it 40yrs from now?
I just see it as...PE's undoubtedly amazing concept took off for a minute there but then died a quick and horrible death.
As opposed to, you can still readily find 10 groups just like NWA in any given city.
Black Power rap lasted more than a minute. The Coup? NWA? Brand Nubian? X-Clan...etc.
Comments
Most of the guys I grew up with managed to seamlessly integrate the Beasties into their daily routine of listening to 8 Phish tapes.
How so? I can remember reading an interview right after SOC came out. Eazy was talking about how he liked Chuck's message on black power and his I don't give a fuck what they think attitude.
Look at the very first NWO album. It's not just the clocks that they are pulling Public Enemy influences from.
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/MrClivver/vinyl%20pics/SH106628m.jpg
So let's make a list of all the LPs mentioned so far and see what jumps out. And add R.E.M.
Sure, let's. And by let's, I mean you should do it.
obviously SOC is a hugely influential album to us and to our friends. and yes it had societal import far beyond even those that own/listen to it.
but while I would venture most people (music-interested people or not particularly music-interested people) of the Beatles generation would site Sgt. Peppers as influential/great, Straight Outta Compton does not resonate with most people of our generation.
the impact of the Beatles was/is massive across the board, regardless of race, politics, whatever. on the other hand NWA is not even on the radar of HUGE swaths of our generation's music listeners. sad but true.
you can't compare those two groups; you can't compare those two albums.
Yet I will continue to do so...
This, also, is way off - NWA resonated all over the map, from punk kids and skate rats, to suburban mall jocks and frat boys, to stick up kids on the east coast and gangbangers on the west, nerds to hair metal groupies, all the way to the white house. Don't get it twisted, NWA is easily one of the most influential groups in American pop music of ANY genre, any time period. Not just "us and our friends" (which on this site is a grouping so amorphous as to be rendered practically meaningless)
This whole subject is weird though. I wouldn't say "NWA is the Gen-X version of the Beatles" but I wouldn't say that about ANY group unless I was making a sonic comparison.
at any rate, i don't think any rap album could be the SP of GX. if any one rap album comes close, it could be "license to ill." other than that, when i was in high school, weren't too many white folks down with rap music and i doubt they ever really caught on. these albums greatly influenced me, but i can garauntee they were/are way off some of my homey's radars from back then. while they may have directly/indirectly affected the society in which they live, they themselves were never popping in "a nation of millions" on the way to the mall or chillin in their parents basement or whenever. rap (sans your run dmc's and beastie boys) was mostly unliked and ignored by the general populace in the 80's. the people i went to high school with were into u2 or the smiths or cure or bruce springsteen or whatever, the point is, it wasn't rap music that they were into, whether they liked it or not. i'm sure some rap album could be the SP of the following generations, but i'm not buying that it would be for mine - as much as i loved rap in the 80s (and still do despite popular SS opinion). whatever the equivelant album is, its generally known by the public. i know people that couldn't tell you a single NWA/PE song then, or now. my folks could tell you beatles songs and they weren't even into them. that is the impact of that album and whatever the equivelant is for us xers, it really isn't going to be a rap album. or beck.
but more to the point, there is no sgt pepper of my generation. that album came out in a completely different time for this world.
Uhhhh cause they were listening to each others' records??
He is the Malcolm X of our generation.
no argument there. (and I by no means meant to suggest that only music nerds or hip hop heads consider this album significant).
hey if you wanna beleive these two albums had equal impact -- be my guest.
but at the end of the day you would have trouble finding ANYONE of the Sgt. Peppers generation that did not own the album/hear the album/at least recognize that it was important and that they probably should have heard the album.
on the other you couldn't exactly randomly pick anyone of our generation off the street and expect them to own/have heard/consider important Straight Outta Compton.
I invite you to try that though (but you may want to leave LES to get a more representative sample of your generation).
and for the record I think you overestimate NWA's impact in the White House (their visit there notwithstanding).
I really don't know about that, my dude... although I could direct you to website full of people that might agree with you.
Dude, my whole generation has MOVED to the LES!
Like I said this whole comparison is messed up... music is way more segmented now. But you could certainly take a diverse sample of our generation and I'm sure the great majority would know of NWA.
And yes, they were indeed influenced by PE...possibly more than I was considering this morning.
but Sgt. pepper was innovative AND popular. i don't think that's ever been duplicated.
they would probably "know of" the Macarena also...I'm just saying the impact of these two albums on their respective generations is not really a fair comparison.
I think you're right in that the generations themselves and the way they listen to music is different now. way more segmented.
but hey I was not around when St. Peppers dropped. nonetheless I hear it got five mics.
yeah...tough call there
how bout...36 chambers????
people all over the world love them some wu tang
Fear of a Black Planet = What's Going On
Sgt. Peppers = Crap
Boogiemonsters' first album = universal Christian message + appeals to people that don't like rap
eventually. what i'm saying is nwa and the posse came out in 87 and yo bum rush the show came out in 87 and i'm sure both were recorded well before their respective release dates.
yes but what about people that do like rap? i never really cut for the boogiemonsters in fact dare i say they fuckin suck
ok i think i have the answer>>>>>>>>midnight marauders
Black Power rap lasted more than a minute. The Coup? NWA? Brand Nubian? X-Clan...etc.
mad cats were biting that shit.
Going from memory. Bum Rush came out around around 8 months before and the Posse. And college radio was playing tracks from Nation around 5-6 months before SOC dropped.
But whatever. Both are not a Gen X Sgt Pepper IMO.
Public Enemy's first album is way before that.
And where are they now?