wow. some of the most agreeable and evil material I've ever seen.
So happy to see 2pac cosiners here -- never ever understood that. Same goes for Dylan. Whiney dudes with guitars all deserve the Jon Belushi treatment, IMO.
But Michael Jackson??? Prince??? Are those just social experiments?
wow. some of the most agreeable and evil material I've ever seen.
So happy to see 2pac cosiners here -- never ever understood that. Same goes for Dylan. Whiney dudes with guitars all deserve the Jon Belushi treatment, IMO.
But Michael Jackson??? Prince??? Are those just social experiments?
This thread would be boring if we did not attempt to kill gods.
That said, the mention of Coltrane bothers me more than MJ or Prince. Prince's early work is a+ classic, but lets be honest after the mid 90's = very uneven. Much of Prince's continued relevance in pop culture has alot to do w his theatrics, the personality, his various dalliances with the media etc. Bottom line his discography is mad patchy. MJ had more quality control but this was probably because he didnt record as much. Prince is overrated, but MJ or Coltrane ? Thats crazy talk.
wow. some of the most agreeable and evil material I've ever seen.
So happy to see 2pac cosiners here -- never ever understood that. Same goes for Dylan. Whiney dudes with guitars all deserve the Jon Belushi treatment, IMO.
But Michael Jackson??? Prince??? Are those just social experiments?
This thread would be boring if we did not attempt to kill gods.
That said, the mention of Coltrane bothers me more than MJ or Prince. Prince's early work is a+ classic, but lets be honest after the mid 90's = very uneven. Much of Prince's continued relevance in pop culture has alot to do w his theatrics, the personality, his various dalliances with the media etc. Bottom line his discography is mad patchy. MJ had more quality control but this was probably because he didnt record as much. Prince is overrated, but MJ or Coltrane ? Thats crazy talk.
I feel this thread is sort of like that GURU thread. Dudes just bashing the guys music and never listened to an entire Gangstarr album. I agree MJ & Coltrane being labeled overrated!!! I don't know about that one there.
As a whole, the entire Stax label (not counting Volt and subsidiaries).
Seems like a facetious argument. There was absolutely no separation between the Volt and Stax labels artistically and personnel-wise for non-reissue cuts. Stax alone produced an unfathomable amount of great material, especially from 1968 on.
I think I'd be more inclined to say that post 1970 HI is more overrated at this point. They put out a lot of turds in their time.
As a whole, the entire Stax label (not counting Volt and subsidiaries).
Seems like a facetious argument. There was absolutely no separation between the Volt and Stax labels artistically and personnel-wise for non-reissue cuts. Stax alone produced an unfathomable amount of great material, especially from 1968 on.
I think I'd be more inclined to say that post 1970 HI is more overrated at this point. They put out a lot of turds in their time.
Dante's comment made no sense whatsoever, IMO. When he wrote what he wrote, I thought that was just a case of a wax hound wishing he ran the world. You know, that kind of revisionist "if Capsoul Records were played nationwide, we'd forget about Motown" kind of thinking. But the point is, neither label was consistent 100% of the time. Most labels aren't. And I'm a major fan of both Stax and Hi, but I'm willing to look the other way when it comes to their turds. They had way too many good records going in their favor. Stax and Hi might be underrated compared to Motown, but otherwise get as much positive attention as they deserve.
but it seems as if anyone I ever come across when I ask them about jazz musicians they'll say Coltrane. Then I'll ask them what their favorite song of his was, and they never have an answer. I feel as if Coltrane has been that reliable answer some people use to let others know how diverse their taste in music is, when it really isn't.
Sounds like nervous dinner party talk from people eagre to impress. Speak to anyone who knows and they can justify Coltrane's greatness pretty effortlessly. I think he derserves his rep - he started a whole new movement - you can't say that about just any artist. But inevitably it shadows other brilliant saxophonists from the same era, sometimes unfairly
David Axelrod when they say "... great Axelrod production". Come off it. Anything produced by him post 70 just sounds like anyone else. Particularly his mid seventies Cannonball stuff on fantasy.
I'm not agree with the Prince choice. I think that he is a genius pop songwriter and a very good musician, if he could dance like MJ he definetely would kick he in the ass.
Other choices are really right and made me laugh: U2, Coldplay and Lenny Kravitz (agree with all, but I have to say that first Lenny album, 'Let Love Rule' it's a good album).
My adds are Sade, Norah Jones and of course, The Strokes.
James Brown, Marvin Gaye, Fela Kuti, Arthur Verocai,DJ Premier...
...just kidding.
Cosign on 2Pac and the Beach Boys. And although it's an over-obvious choice: Lady Gaga. I'm sure everyone in here agrees that she is utter bullshit but it makes me sick how otherwise respectable adults are praising her because of her "artsy approach". :talib:
Maybe a little out there for this convo, but love this anecdote from Stevie Nicks about Prince...
"I phoned Prince out of the blue, hummed a melody, and he listened," says Nicks of the latter hit's gestation. "I hung up, and he came over within the hour. He listened again, and I said, 'Do you hate it?' He said, 'No,' and walked over to the synthesizers that were set up, was absolutely brilliant for about twenty five minutes, and then left. He was so uncanny, so wild, he spoiled me for every band I've ever had because nobody can exactly re-create - not even with two piano players-what Prince did all by his little self.
~Stevie Nicks, Rock Lives, by Timothy White,1991"
That's a massive record. Dude wrote and executed it within a few hours, out of the blue. He's a prodigy, and has a gift for song writing. He has a sound that's all his own and is instantly identifiable. If you're not into it, fair enough. But "overrated"? Why, because he went on to make "7"? (which is a straight banger, btw)
Certain artists are of course going to have holes in their careers, they can't sound the way you remember them to forever. They might veer from what it is that you love about them -- that would just make those works not for you. But does that make them "overrated"??? Think that's the wrong choice of words. I don't "Iron Flag", but does that make Wu-Tang overrated? Weird comparison, but think that paints the picture sort of well.
Michael Jackson came up with the bassline for Billie Jean while driving on Ventura Blvd -- just randomly popped into his head. He's probably the most talented dancer/performer, as well, and sounded like no one else. Dude was extremely visual, helping to concept basically all of his music videos (Smooth Criminal, Captain Eo, etc). So, not your cup of tea, totally get it -- you can't please all of the people all of time. But "overrated"? This sort of goes back to the way the word "classic" was being thrown around here.
As a whole, the entire Stax label (not counting Volt and subsidiaries).
Seems like a facetious argument. There was absolutely no separation between the Volt and Stax labels artistically and personnel-wise for non-reissue cuts. Stax alone produced an unfathomable amount of great material, especially from 1968 on.
I'm not being facetious. I think Stax is completely and totally overrated. I also think Hi is overrated. I say this as a lover of most things Memphis, too...it's one of my favorite cities. And the comment that there was "absolutely no separation between Volt and Stax artistically" is uninformed. The Dramatics are from the same fabric as Eddie Floyd or Rufus Thomas? William Bell and 24K Black are related artistically or personnel-wise? Where your argument does hold up is that many things in the Volt catalog stink as much as in the main Stax catalog. Shack anyone? Perhaps a little Hot Sauce? Maybe a bit of Margie Joseph or some Newcomers?
And my comment was not made off-the-cuff, I just listened to hundreds of Stax singles this past week and everything was just stale. I fully understand Estelle and Jim's role in the history of music, but for me their output is grossly overesteemed.
If mofos can say that Coltrane and Dylan are overrated, I can more than put Stax on the fire.
cosine on the prince hate - no denying the dudes musicality, but his catalogue is straight up meh - he has no undisputable transcendental floor burning classics imo - all the prince 'bangers' have a kitschy poppy edge that make em iffy. And his whole sense of style and content is straight up wack - the man does not know how to dress and his whole decadent sexy message is some bs. Im afraid hes just not that clever.
Also cosine madonna - being a pop culturre icon does not a great musician make - madonna and great musician do not fit in the same sentence.
To the dude hatting on Bob Marley - saying bob is overrated nixes your opinion holmes. Like the sad faced clowns on here riding for Goodie Mob like they're some great underrated hip hop group - get a clue.
but it seems as if anyone I ever come across when I ask them about jazz musicians they'll say Coltrane. Then I'll ask them what their favorite song of his was, and they never have an answer. I feel as if Coltrane has been that reliable answer some people use to let others know how diverse their taste in music is, when it really isn't.
Sounds like nervous dinner party talk from people eagre to impress. Speak to anyone who knows and they can justify Coltrane's greatness pretty effortlessly. I think he derserves his rep - he started a whole new movement - you can't say that about just any artist. But inevitably it shadows other brilliant saxophonists from the same era, sometimes unfairly
Oh no. I'm a fan, and I can justify my fandom. But I just mentioned him because so many who aren't familiar with him AT ALL mention him as some reference point to sound as if they have eclectic tastes in jazz music. I don't think he's overrated, though.
but it seems as if anyone I ever come across when I ask them about jazz musicians they'll say Coltrane. Then I'll ask them what their favorite song of his was, and they never have an answer. I feel as if Coltrane has been that reliable answer some people use to let others know how diverse their taste in music is, when it really isn't.
Sounds like nervous dinner party talk from people eagre to impress. Speak to anyone who knows and they can justify Coltrane's greatness pretty effortlessly. I think he derserves his rep - he started a whole new movement - you can't say that about just any artist. But inevitably it shadows other brilliant saxophonists from the same era, sometimes unfairly
Oh no. I'm a fan, and I can justify my fandom. But I just mentioned him because so many who aren't familiar with him AT ALL mention him as some reference point to sound as if they have eclectic tastes in jazz music. I don't think he's overrated, though.
I was referring to the "others" not you. Re-read my post - that's exactly what I said in the first place
cosine on the prince hate - no denying the dudes musicality, but his catalogue is straight up meh - he has no undisputable transcendental floor burning classics imo
this is fucking hilarious....
DocMcCoy"Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,913 Posts
DustedDon said:
staxwax said:
cosine on the prince hate - no denying the dudes musicality, but his catalogue is straight up meh - he has no undisputable transcendental floor burning classics imo
this is fucking hilarious....
This whole thread is fucking hilarious, and not in a good way, either.
You can sum it up thus; "I can't fathom the popularity of/critical reverence accorded to [Artist X], and consequently I consider him/her/them overrated". I mean, no more than three or four contributors have even attempted to justify their selections. If you're going to post up on a public forum and say some stupid-ass shit like "Prince is overrated", "Bob Dylan is overrated" or "Bob Marley is overrated", you should at least be able to say why.
cosine on the prince hate - no denying the dudes musicality, but his catalogue is straight up meh - he has no undisputable transcendental floor burning classics imo
this is fucking hilarious....
This whole thread is fucking hilarious, and not in a good way, either.
You can sum it up thus; "I can't fathom the popularity of/critical reverence accorded to [Artist X], and consequently I consider him/her/them overrated". I mean, no more than three or four contributors have even attempted to justify their selections. If you're going to post up on a public forum and say some stupid-ass shit like "Prince is overrated", "Bob Dylan is overrated" or "Bob Marley is overrated", you should at least be able to say why.
It's pretty easy to say why, but it's also meaningless and a waste of time on boards, because it's not like explaining why is going to prevent the usual (and silly) bent reactions.
I love Dylan and Coltrane but I'm not going to waste my time ever again trying to convince people who don't that they're "wrong." They're not wrong, they just like different shit than I do. Fine with me, why should I care? Likewise I think the Ramones by themselves are better than any ten rappers combined, but I don't care if people disagree.
And I think Beck blows huge bloody stool-infested chunks, but no, I'm not interested in revisiting his scatalogue disc by hideous disc to justify the opinion.
cosine on the prince hate - no denying the dudes musicality, but his catalogue is straight up meh - he has no undisputable transcendental floor burning classics imo - all the prince 'bangers' have a kitschy poppy edge that make em iffy. And his whole sense of style and content is straight up wack - the man does not know how to dress and his whole decadent sexy message is some bs. Im afraid hes just not that clever.
this is bad enough, but coupled with this
To the dude hatting on Bob Marley - saying bob is overrated nixes your opinion holmes. Like the sad faced clowns on here riding for Goodie Mob like they're some great underrated hip hop group - get a clue.
Comments
So happy to see 2pac cosiners here -- never ever understood that. Same goes for Dylan. Whiney dudes with guitars all deserve the Jon Belushi treatment, IMO.
But Michael Jackson??? Prince??? Are those just social experiments?
Nah dude it's just people on the internet.
This thread would be boring if we did not attempt to kill gods.
That said, the mention of Coltrane bothers me more than MJ or Prince. Prince's early work is a+ classic, but lets be honest after the mid 90's = very uneven. Much of Prince's continued relevance in pop culture has alot to do w his theatrics, the personality, his various dalliances with the media etc. Bottom line his discography is mad patchy. MJ had more quality control but this was probably because he didnt record as much. Prince is overrated, but MJ or Coltrane ? Thats crazy talk.
Yes this dude for real!! Honestly there are a few NAGL on this list but everybody has their opinion.
Eminem being #1 overrated by far
Biggie
&
"The Boss"!!
I feel this thread is sort of like that GURU thread. Dudes just bashing the guys music and never listened to an entire Gangstarr album. I agree MJ & Coltrane being labeled overrated!!! I don't know about that one there.
Seems like a facetious argument. There was absolutely no separation between the Volt and Stax labels artistically and personnel-wise for non-reissue cuts. Stax alone produced an unfathomable amount of great material, especially from 1968 on.
I think I'd be more inclined to say that post 1970 HI is more overrated at this point. They put out a lot of turds in their time.
And that's why Dylan plugged in and went "rock & roll." This man wasn't your typical passive folkie and shouldn't be seen in that light.
Dante's comment made no sense whatsoever, IMO. When he wrote what he wrote, I thought that was just a case of a wax hound wishing he ran the world. You know, that kind of revisionist "if Capsoul Records were played nationwide, we'd forget about Motown" kind of thinking. But the point is, neither label was consistent 100% of the time. Most labels aren't. And I'm a major fan of both Stax and Hi, but I'm willing to look the other way when it comes to their turds. They had way too many good records going in their favor. Stax and Hi might be underrated compared to Motown, but otherwise get as much positive attention as they deserve.
Sounds like nervous dinner party talk from people eagre to impress. Speak to anyone who knows and they can justify Coltrane's greatness pretty effortlessly. I think he derserves his rep - he started a whole new movement - you can't say that about just any artist. But inevitably it shadows other brilliant saxophonists from the same era, sometimes unfairly
Other choices are really right and made me laugh: U2, Coldplay and Lenny Kravitz (agree with all, but I have to say that first Lenny album, 'Let Love Rule' it's a good album).
My adds are Sade, Norah Jones and of course, The Strokes.
...just kidding.
Cosign on 2Pac and the Beach Boys. And although it's an over-obvious choice: Lady Gaga. I'm sure everyone in here agrees that she is utter bullshit but it makes me sick how otherwise respectable adults are praising her because of her "artsy approach". :talib:
But the right one, another bold one from me Micheal Jackson.
:weaksauce:
Madlib
The Doors
"I phoned Prince out of the blue, hummed a melody, and he listened," says Nicks of the latter hit's gestation. "I hung up, and he came over within the hour. He listened again, and I said, 'Do you hate it?' He said, 'No,' and walked over to the synthesizers that were set up, was absolutely brilliant for about twenty five minutes, and then left. He was so uncanny, so wild, he spoiled me for every band I've ever had because nobody can exactly re-create - not even with two piano players-what Prince did all by his little self.
~Stevie Nicks, Rock Lives, by Timothy White,1991"
That's a massive record. Dude wrote and executed it within a few hours, out of the blue. He's a prodigy, and has a gift for song writing. He has a sound that's all his own and is instantly identifiable. If you're not into it, fair enough. But "overrated"? Why, because he went on to make "7"? (which is a straight banger, btw)
Certain artists are of course going to have holes in their careers, they can't sound the way you remember them to forever. They might veer from what it is that you love about them -- that would just make those works not for you. But does that make them "overrated"??? Think that's the wrong choice of words. I don't "Iron Flag", but does that make Wu-Tang overrated? Weird comparison, but think that paints the picture sort of well.
Michael Jackson came up with the bassline for Billie Jean while driving on Ventura Blvd -- just randomly popped into his head. He's probably the most talented dancer/performer, as well, and sounded like no one else. Dude was extremely visual, helping to concept basically all of his music videos (Smooth Criminal, Captain Eo, etc). So, not your cup of tea, totally get it -- you can't please all of the people all of time. But "overrated"? This sort of goes back to the way the word "classic" was being thrown around here.
And my comment was not made off-the-cuff, I just listened to hundreds of Stax singles this past week and everything was just stale. I fully understand Estelle and Jim's role in the history of music, but for me their output is grossly overesteemed.
If mofos can say that Coltrane and Dylan are overrated, I can more than put Stax on the fire.
We need locations back on this forum.
Also cosine madonna - being a pop culturre icon does not a great musician make - madonna and great musician do not fit in the same sentence.
To the dude hatting on Bob Marley - saying bob is overrated nixes your opinion holmes. Like the sad faced clowns on here riding for Goodie Mob like they're some great underrated hip hop group - get a clue.
B/W
Prince has no "indubitable" dancefloor bangers.
Oh no. I'm a fan, and I can justify my fandom. But I just mentioned him because so many who aren't familiar with him AT ALL mention him as some reference point to sound as if they have eclectic tastes in jazz music. I don't think he's overrated, though.
I was referring to the "others" not you. Re-read my post - that's exactly what I said in the first place
this is fucking hilarious....
This whole thread is fucking hilarious, and not in a good way, either.
You can sum it up thus; "I can't fathom the popularity of/critical reverence accorded to [Artist X], and consequently I consider him/her/them overrated". I mean, no more than three or four contributors have even attempted to justify their selections. If you're going to post up on a public forum and say some stupid-ass shit like "Prince is overrated", "Bob Dylan is overrated" or "Bob Marley is overrated", you should at least be able to say why.
It's pretty easy to say why, but it's also meaningless and a waste of time on boards, because it's not like explaining why is going to prevent the usual (and silly) bent reactions.
I love Dylan and Coltrane but I'm not going to waste my time ever again trying to convince people who don't that they're "wrong." They're not wrong, they just like different shit than I do. Fine with me, why should I care? Likewise I think the Ramones by themselves are better than any ten rappers combined, but I don't care if people disagree.
And I think Beck blows huge bloody stool-infested chunks, but no, I'm not interested in revisiting his scatalogue disc by hideous disc to justify the opinion.
man. kill yourself.