The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo/Stieg Larsson

13

  Comments


  • DrWuDrWu 4,021 Posts
    bassie said:
    DocMcCoy said:
    My film studies lecturer always told me it's a bad sign when the first thing anyone says about a film is how good the cinematography or production design is, but both are excellent - it's certainly a very good-looking film, but for one which deals to a large degree in the furthest extremes of passion, it's crucially short on warmth.

    I would say that about Winterbottom's films as a general rule.

    I thought 24 Party People was an exception to this. One of my favorite films of the decade.

    Was 9 Songs released in N. America?

    I've seen about a third of his movies, liked them all.

  • faux_rillzfaux_rillz 14,343 Posts
    DrWu said:
    bassie said:
    DocMcCoy said:
    My film studies lecturer always told me it's a bad sign when the first thing anyone says about a film is how good the cinematography or production design is, but both are excellent - it's certainly a very good-looking film, but for one which deals to a large degree in the furthest extremes of passion, it's crucially short on warmth.

    I would say that about Winterbottom's films as a general rule.

    I thought 24 Party People was an exception to this. One of my favorite films of the decade.

    I will not say that Party People is the worst movie I have ever seen, but it was certainly up there. Absolutely unwatchable.

  • DrWuDrWu 4,021 Posts
    faux_rillz said:
    DrWu said:
    bassie said:
    DocMcCoy said:
    My film studies lecturer always told me it's a bad sign when the first thing anyone says about a film is how good the cinematography or production design is, but both are excellent - it's certainly a very good-looking film, but for one which deals to a large degree in the furthest extremes of passion, it's crucially short on warmth.

    I would say that about Winterbottom's films as a general rule.

    I thought 24 Party People was an exception to this. One of my favorite films of the decade.

    I will not say that Party People is the worst movie I have ever seen, but it was certainly up there. Absolutely unwatchable.

    I am not going to say that Faux Rillz is one the most boring internet trolls I have ever encountered but he's right up there. Totally ignorable.

  • bassiebassie 11,710 Posts
    DrWu said:
    bassie said:
    DocMcCoy said:
    My film studies lecturer always told me it's a bad sign when the first thing anyone says about a film is how good the cinematography or production design is, but both are excellent - it's certainly a very good-looking film, but for one which deals to a large degree in the furthest extremes of passion, it's crucially short on warmth.

    I would say that about Winterbottom's films as a general rule.

    I thought 24 Party People was an exception to this. One of my favorite films of the decade.

    Was 9 Songs released in N. America?

    I've seen about a third of his movies, liked them all.

    Dispassionate film-making does not equate poor film making to me. But it needs to make sense for the subject, and I think it does for the Winterbottom films I have seen.

    Party People is not really a film that requires a lot of emotion or heat imo. I am sure there will be many who disagree, but Factory as a label, and the following music scene that was so intertwined with synthetic drugs, does not need a lot of warm feelings to properly tell the story. And the most emotional aspect of the film, - Curtis' death - was not really packed with a lot of heart...not for me anyway.

    Code 46 was a very good story and again, it made sense that it was as icey as it was.

    I have yet to see Killer - and aside from Winterbottom's general style - I wonder if that chill is necessary for the psychology of the film.

  • DocMcCoyDocMcCoy "Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,913 Posts
    faux_rillz said:
    DrWu said:
    bassie said:
    DocMcCoy said:
    My film studies lecturer always told me it's a bad sign when the first thing anyone says about a film is how good the cinematography or production design is, but both are excellent - it's certainly a very good-looking film, but for one which deals to a large degree in the furthest extremes of passion, it's crucially short on warmth.

    I would say that about Winterbottom's films as a general rule.

    I thought 24 Party People was an exception to this. One of my favorite films of the decade.

    I will not say that Party People is the worst movie I have ever seen, but it was certainly up there. Absolutely unwatchable.

    It relies a lot upon the degree of familiarity the viewer has with both the mythology of Factory Records and the Manchester music scene from the late 70s to the early 90s, as well as the numerous in-jokes that are dotted throughout the film. At times it assumes a bit too much. I liked it because I know the music, the characters, the places and the stories inside out, so for me the interest lay in how they put those things across. I can easily imagine that it'd seem like an incoherent mess to a viewer who perhaps didn't have that advantage.

  • DrWuDrWu 4,021 Posts
    DocMcCoy said:
    faux_rillz said:
    DrWu said:
    bassie said:
    DocMcCoy said:
    My film studies lecturer always told me it's a bad sign when the first thing anyone says about a film is how good the cinematography or production design is, but both are excellent - it's certainly a very good-looking film, but for one which deals to a large degree in the furthest extremes of passion, it's crucially short on warmth.

    I would say that about Winterbottom's films as a general rule.

    I thought 24 Party People was an exception to this. One of my favorite films of the decade.

    I will not say that Party People is the worst movie I have ever seen, but it was certainly up there. Absolutely unwatchable.

    It relies a lot upon the degree of familiarity the viewer has with both the mythology of Factory Records and the Manchester music scene from the late 70s to the early 90s, as well as the numerous in-jokes that are dotted throughout the film. At times it assumes a bit too much. I liked it because I know the music, the characters, the places and the stories inside out, so for me the interest lay in how they put those things across. I can easily imagine that it'd seem like an incoherent mess to a viewer who perhaps didn't have that advantage.

    This might be the nicest way anyone has ever called another strutter Disconnected. I'd like to request that the disconnected graemlin should be changed to Faux wearing a Joy Division shirt while popping some ecstasy and playing maracas.

  • AlmondAlmond 1,427 Posts
    Wu, you're on a roll.



    Haven't seen any of the movies yet. Heard they are OK. Boob job is weird because it doesn't add much to the books unless she smothers Zala with her C cups later. I can see Hollywood movie producers loving the extra cleavage. Maybe Larsson was thinking ahead. Shit does happen. I have a friend ( a respected novelist) who just had a book optioned in Hollywood. On her next project she purposely put Johnny Depp to give it more commercial appeal.

    The boobs don't make it into the Swedish version, Wu. Maybe in the American version. You sound like you will be very surprised when you find out about Zala. Spoiler: she will not smother him with her Cs.

  • AlmondAlmond 1,427 Posts
    DB_Cooper said:
    faux_rillz said:
    Electrode said:
    Reading is reading: it doesn't matter if it's Dostoyevsky, The Bible, Victor Canning or whatever vampire/wizard/etc book is hot at the moment.

    That's ridiculous--it only makes any kind of sense in the context of people who are barely literate.

    QUIT YUCKING MY YUM.

    Haha! Some people are born yum yuckers. You can spot them very early on; they only eat certain foods (mac n cheese with pepper) and think all the activities in school are stupid. They sulk on the playground and think they're too cool to smile in their school pictures. Then their moms get mad because they paid for ugly pictures.

  • LoopDreamsLoopDreams 1,195 Posts
    Just finished the 3rd book.... it's garbage. Kinda spead read it, but I had to find out if he had the balls to kill Blomkvist.


    Read this this book this year, it's better then Larson: darker, deeper, creepier, etc...
    img src="blood_spilt_larsson_20081030" alt="" />

  • DocMcCoyDocMcCoy "Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,913 Posts
    DocMcCoy said:
    faux_rillz said:
    DrWu said:
    bassie said:
    DocMcCoy said:
    My film studies lecturer always told me it's a bad sign when the first thing anyone says about a film is how good the cinematography or production design is, but both are excellent - it's certainly a very good-looking film, but for one which deals to a large degree in the furthest extremes of passion, it's crucially short on warmth.

    I would say that about Winterbottom's films as a general rule.

    I thought 24 Party People was an exception to this. One of my favorite films of the decade.

    I will not say that Party People is the worst movie I have ever seen, but it was certainly up there. Absolutely unwatchable.

    It relies a lot upon the degree of familiarity the viewer has with both the mythology of Factory Records and the Manchester music scene from the late 70s to the early 90s, as well as the numerous in-jokes that are dotted throughout the film. At times it assumes a bit too much. I liked it because I know the music, the characters, the places and the stories inside out, so for me the interest lay in how they put those things across. I can easily imagine that it'd seem like an incoherent mess to a viewer who perhaps didn't have that advantage.

    This might be the nicest way anyone has ever called another strutter Disconnected. I'd like to request that the disconnected graemlin should be changed to Faux wearing a Joy Division shirt while popping some ecstasy and playing maracas.

    Oh, I'd be wary of making too many assumptions about Faux if I were you. Given his well-documented industrial noisenik past, it wouldn't come as a total shock if it was revealed that there was the odd New Order or Section 25 album hiding away in a neglected corner of Chez Regatta.

  • faux_rillzfaux_rillz 14,343 Posts
    DocMcCoy said:
    faux_rillz said:
    DrWu said:
    bassie said:
    DocMcCoy said:
    My film studies lecturer always told me it's a bad sign when the first thing anyone says about a film is how good the cinematography or production design is, but both are excellent - it's certainly a very good-looking film, but for one which deals to a large degree in the furthest extremes of passion, it's crucially short on warmth.

    I would say that about Winterbottom's films as a general rule.

    I thought 24 Party People was an exception to this. One of my favorite films of the decade.

    I will not say that Party People is the worst movie I have ever seen, but it was certainly up there. Absolutely unwatchable.

    It relies a lot upon the degree of familiarity the viewer has with both the mythology of Factory Records and the Manchester music scene from the late 70s to the early 90s, as well as the numerous in-jokes that are dotted throughout the film. At times it assumes a bit too much. I liked it because I know the music, the characters, the places and the stories inside out, so for me the interest lay in how they put those things across. I can easily imagine that it'd seem like an incoherent mess to a viewer who perhaps didn't have that advantage.

    This might be the nicest way anyone has ever called another strutter Disconnected. I'd like to request that the disconnected graemlin should be changed to Faux wearing a Joy Division shirt while popping some ecstasy and playing maracas.

    Oh, I'd be wary of making too many assumptions about Faux if I were you. Given his well-documented industrial noisenik past, it wouldn't come as a total shock if it was revealed that there was the odd New Order or Section 25 album hiding away in a neglected corner of Chez Regatta.

    I did once own that 2CD New Order retrospective Substance as well as several Joy Division albums. I have a marginal interest in that scene, but I thought the film failed to congeal.

  • DrWuDrWu 4,021 Posts
    DocMcCoy said:
    faux_rillz said:
    DrWu said:
    bassie said:
    DocMcCoy said:
    My film studies lecturer always told me it's a bad sign when the first thing anyone says about a film is how good the cinematography or production design is, but both are excellent - it's certainly a very good-looking film, but for one which deals to a large degree in the furthest extremes of passion, it's crucially short on warmth.

    I would say that about Winterbottom's films as a general rule.

    I thought 24 Party People was an exception to this. One of my favorite films of the decade.

    I will not say that Party People is the worst movie I have ever seen, but it was certainly up there. Absolutely unwatchable.

    It relies a lot upon the degree of familiarity the viewer has with both the mythology of Factory Records and the Manchester music scene from the late 70s to the early 90s, as well as the numerous in-jokes that are dotted throughout the film. At times it assumes a bit too much. I liked it because I know the music, the characters, the places and the stories inside out, so for me the interest lay in how they put those things across. I can easily imagine that it'd seem like an incoherent mess to a viewer who perhaps didn't have that advantage.

    This might be the nicest way anyone has ever called another strutter Disconnected. I'd like to request that the disconnected graemlin should be changed to Faux wearing a Joy Division shirt while popping some ecstasy and playing maracas.

    Oh, I'd be wary of making too many assumptions about Faux if I were you. Given his well-documented industrial noisenik past, it wouldn't come as a total shock if it was revealed that there was the odd New Order or Section 25 album hiding away in a neglected corner of Chez Regatta.

    Haha, we all know that young pup has major eyeliner and kufi skeletons hanging in his closet. Please revise new disconnected graemlin to include this information.

  • DrWuDrWu 4,021 Posts
    bassie said:
    DrWu said:
    bassie said:
    DocMcCoy said:
    My film studies lecturer always told me it's a bad sign when the first thing anyone says about a film is how good the cinematography or production design is, but both are excellent - it's certainly a very good-looking film, but for one which deals to a large degree in the furthest extremes of passion, it's crucially short on warmth.

    I would say that about Winterbottom's films as a general rule.

    I thought 24 Party People was an exception to this. One of my favorite films of the decade.

    Was 9 Songs released in N. America?

    I've seen about a third of his movies, liked them all.

    Dispassionate film-making does not equate poor film making to me. But it needs to make sense for the subject, and I think it does for the Winterbottom films I have seen.

    Party People is not really a film that requires a lot of emotion or heat imo. I am sure there will be many who disagree, but Factory as a label, and the following music scene that was so intertwined with synthetic drugs, does not need a lot of warm feelings to properly tell the story. And the most emotional aspect of the film, - Curtis' death - was not really packed with a lot of heart...not for me anyway.

    Code 46 was a very good story and again, it made sense that it was as icey as it was.

    I have yet to see Killer - and aside from Winterbottom's general style - I wonder if that chill is necessary for the psychology of the film.

    Granted no one would mistake 24PP for an Oliver Stone film and the Curtis death scene is shot in a dispassionate manner but there is still a certain esprit to this film. Winterbottom delves into the spiritual aspects behind music, the absolute devotion that it created for the Wilson. I think the concert scenes carry quite a bit of emotional weight in this regard.

    I get your point overall. Mighty Heart would have been a 20 hanky episode in most anyone else's hands.

  • rootlesscosmorootlesscosmo 12,848 Posts
    Haven't read the book but man the Swedish movie version sucked. I saw it this weekend.



    SPOILERS
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    My chief gripes:

    - The five murders of the Jewish women aka the whole underlying plot of the movie: HOW exactly does Harriet discover them? There is zero indication of this in her journal. I mean, it took a genius private investigator and and award-winning journalist weeks to figure it out. And furthermore why doesn't she explain how she discovered them when she comes back from Aus? And yo: why didn't she TELL anyone that her father and brother were potential serial killers? I dunno, maybe a letter to the police along with all those flowers she was sending? Coulda saved dozens of innocent murder victims over the course of like 40 yrs. And it's ultimately pretty lame that the murders apparently have no real connection to her disappearance; rather, they were merely an unrelated side hustle on the part of her brother and father, the rapes having been the actual reason she leaves.

    - The brutal ass rape/probation officer subplot: This was utterly superfluous porn. What's that? The point of all this was to show why she distrusted men you say? Well she already distrusted men; that aspect of her character was firmly in place. Those scenes were just totally unnecessary. That screen time and energy should have been invested in the dad/mom thing. After all, THATS why she apparently distrusts men in the first place. As the movie stands, there's (as I recall) only ONE flashback of her killing her dad. As a result of that incident (presumably the very reason for her entire persona) getting such short shrift, the eventual emotional impact of her visiting her mother is virtually nil. Imagine if the time/energy (20? 30 whole movie minutes?) spent on the legal guardian anal rape porn scenes were in fact devoted to setting up the mom/dad history, which, in contrast to the legal guardian anal rape porn scenes, were actually important to the story.

    - The cheeky heist/money embezzlement thing at the end was royally lame. Was that supposed to be some sort of "fuck yeah!" moment? Dude was already in jail! It was an unnecessary piling on of comeuppance for the guy who was already going to prison, made all the more lame by the fact that we already happen to know that she cares nothing for money. Or maybe it was some sort of weak way of wrapping up her 'relationship' with Mikael, a way she could ride into the sunset, obviating the need for them to face their feelings for each other? Lame. Not to mention pretty implausible that, as an alleged master of surveillance, tattoo girl allows herself to get caught on tape in broad daylight embezzling millions of dollars.

    oh, and with a grand total of about 8 characters in the movie, I was able to narrow down the potential culprits to around 2 by the movie's midway point, and down to a grand total of 1 about a half hour before the movie wrapped. So even if you leave aside my other gripes, the whole movie is utterly weak as a mystery (which I am assuming it's intended to be).

    I guess I'm willing to give the author of the book the benefit of the doubt, and assume that lots of necessary plot elements were cut from the movie. But boy-oh-boy did the movie suck.

  • AlmondAlmond 1,427 Posts
    Hey Rootless, interesting to hear your comments about the movie. I saw it after having read the book, so everything made sense to me. However, the book is EXTREMELY DETAILED, so the movie inevitably left some stuff out and I can definitely see how the film left holes here and there. I feel like the movie would only be worthwhile for those who want to see the book "come to life," but since I already knew what happened, it was boring to watch, and really long.

    I wouldn't recommend reading the book after watching the movie since you already know what happens. In the book, the murders and whatnot come out of fucking nowhere. Larsson's style is less about subtle foreshadowing and more about random curve balls. The novel explains more how Harriet found out about the serial murders, and the uncovering of the mystery is outlined almost too slowly. In the book, Lisbeth actually refers to Harriet as "Harriet Fcking Vanger" due to the fact that though she was the victim, she perpetuated the cover-up of the crime. I actually had a hard time with that, too, but that was the author's intent. It would be corny to make the ending too satisfying.

    The Wennerstrom affair is much more detailed in the book, while it's only a side note in the movie.

    I would recommend The Girl Who Played with Fire if you're still interested, but I wouldn't bother with the movie. It's more disappointing than Dragon.

  • u dudes read like bitches. My moms reading this right now

  • gravelheadwrapgravelheadwrap corn 948 Posts
    I'm about 3/4s through Girl With The Dragon Tattoo. Read a few spoilers for the entire series here and am doing my best to forget. Like Almond said, this is probably one of the better works of fiction I've read in a long time. Excited to move on to the next book. Blomkvist is awesome.

  • DB_CooperDB_Cooper Manhatin' 7,823 Posts
    Ex-Boyfriend said:
    u dudes read like bitches.

    UNDERRATED POAST

  • Fantastic film! Gonna go check out "The Girl Who Played With Fire" this weekend.

  • bassiebassie 11,710 Posts
    Has anyone here read any Elfriede Jelinek? I was looking for The Piano Player (Haneke's The Piano Teacher was made from it) and found another one called Greed instead. I can handle some non-linear, stream of consciousness stuff, but I can't tell WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON in this book. There is the lightest thread of a story emerging - and I would be totally lost if not for the small summary on the back of the book - otherwise, huh??????

    I am tempted to Google it and see if there is anything to help, but that will end up giving too much away I think.
    Strutters - any insight?

  • dukeofdelridgedukeofdelridge urgent.monkey.mice 2,453 Posts


    just to keep it soul strut

  • AlmondAlmond 1,427 Posts
    Just finished the third book, The Girl Who Kicked the Hornet's Nest. It lacked the bite its predecessors had and seemed more like a continuation of the 2nd than an entity of its own. Larsson took goddamn forever to get to the trial. Poison Pen and old men on dialysis and all those cops whose names I couldn't keep track of only stalled the plot's progression. How does an endorphin addicted woman fall for the out-of-shape Blomqvist who has let his hygiene go while in pursuit of the Salander story? That man needs to change his panties more often.

    The Sapo stuff was just boring enough to sound official, and official-sounding enough to be interesting. This book took me 3 weeks to get through and now I'm behind on all my summer reading and music (sorry Bassie).

    I'm getting tired of Lisbeth's little act. Her social awkwardness seems more of a tireless effort than an actual ineptness. Suggestions that she may have Asperger's Syndrome seem to lack weight in lieu of her uncanny ability to read people and situations rationally.

  • AlmondAlmond 1,427 Posts
    Did you make that graphic, Duke? I like it and am glad that you are revisiting the glory of literacy.

  • dukeofdelridgedukeofdelridge urgent.monkey.mice 2,453 Posts
    Almond said:
    Did you make that graphic, Duke? I like it and am glad that you are revisiting the glory of literacy.

    I didn't make it. I took it from here. I plan on reading the books, as they do sound up my alley, but right now I'm stuck on some sci-fi.

    In my neighborhood, "Girl with the dragon tattoo" books are definitely the DaVinci Code of the now: every second person seems to have one of the three in their hands. More than a few of these people definitely haven't read a book in a while, quite possibly six years.

    I thought it was a funny fake cover, albeit unnecessarily mean spirited. I'm of the mind that people reading is better than people not reading.

  • AlmondAlmond 1,427 Posts
    I've only read trash this year. 14 books. I'll squeeze in some classics, I swear.

  • Options
    Hey Almond,
    Maybe try out Mark Helprin

    A Winter's Tale
    Soldier of the Great War
    and my fav, Freddy and Fredricka

    Later,
    Lilmonstu

  • Options
    A Winter's Tale is fun because it does cool things with light and dark.

    Freddy and Fredericka is hilarious, with great romantic comedy.

    If you are would prefer a book that mentions music and records then I would recommend Ghostwritten by David Mitchell.

  • DB_CooperDB_Cooper Manhatin' 7,823 Posts
    Almond said:
    I've only read trash this year. 14 books. I'll squeeze in some classics, I swear.

    I dare you to read James Joyce.


  • rootlesscosmorootlesscosmo 12,848 Posts
    dukeofdelridge said:


    just to keep it soul strut

    ha!

  • just peeped the Swedish sequel (hornet's nest).

    SPOILERS
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    Just about as weak as the first one.

    The entire movie consists of homegirl sitting in hospital >> going to jail >> getting acquitted at trial. No real development of anything, no twists, no nothing.

    And what's the defense's secret weapon, the climatic revelation that the entire movie builds up to?

    DRUMROLL.....YES you guessed it! It's the very same anal rape porn scene the first movie revolved around!

    My only question is how are they going to work the anal rape porn scene into the THIRD movie?! I can't wait to find out.
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