I think it will be very Frickin' useful-and not just to sample cd types. Think of all the solo'ed piano, rhodes, guitar, string, and vocal harmony chords in your record collection (or from those multitrack sessions floating around!). You could take a track you've made entirely on keyboard and replace all your sounds with early seventies burro. Yes please.
because putting in Ahmad Jamal chords will nto work liek the sample cd crap they use in the demo. I don't know, I saw it in person and was not impressed, but just my two cents.
Really? i figured any samples relatively clean and solo'ed would work. If it doesnt work in this version, the technology definitly has crazy promise with some more work.
At least this version will be handy for figuring out dope chords from jazz records.
just the fact that i'll be able to analyze complex chords makes this program worth having.
i've been using the older version of melodyne for a while now and have mixed feelings about it. definitely dope in a lot of ways but still really troublesome in extracting the audio from the project in real time without messing up the original timing of the placement of the melo'd track.
anyone know if there's a way to melodyne the track in a daw through an insert without exporting the track completely out of the project file to melodyne? kind of like how autotune does it.
How do you figure? Im talking about morphing real sounds to midi information.
Or actually, isn't that what sheet music is for?
Writing the shit out to sheet music and hiring an orchestra? Clearly the ideal choice, but not practical for most of us bedroom/noMajorLabel types. Expensive as shit, which means less freedom to experiment as well.
How do you figure? Im talking about morphing real sounds to midi information.
Or actually, isn't that what sheet music is for?
Writing the shit out to sheet music and hiring an orchestra? Clearly the ideal choice, but not practical for most of us bedroom/noMajorLabel types. Expensive as shit, which means less freedom to experiment as well.
Yeah, I think I get it. You could transpose a sample to fit into an arrangement you've already created. I was thinking that what you were describing was a straight sample - to - MIDI application.
Yeah, I think I get it. You could transpose a sample to fit into an arrangement you've already created. I was thinking that what you were describing was a straight sample - to - MIDI application.
Exactly. Which apparently (and unfortunately) is out of the scope of this application. Im still holding out hope though.
just the fact that i'll be able to analyze complex chords makes this program worth having.
i've been using the older version of melodyne for a while now and have mixed feelings about it. definitely dope in a lot of ways but still really troublesome in extracting the audio from the project in real time without messing up the original timing of the placement of the melo'd track.
anyone know if there's a way to melodyne the track in a daw through an insert without exporting the track completely out of the project file to melodyne? kind of like how autotune does it.
they have a RTAS.VST plug in version of this, don't knwo if that will accomplish it or not but I imagine that would be the only reason someone would need an RTAS version, i assume it works like autotune in that sense.
Gamble, don't get me wrong, i'm not trying to be antagonistic or anti-new technology, but having heard the product in question in real life, i was far from impressed, as opposed to the first time i sat down behind the VP9000, which changed the way I make beats dead cold.
The science behind the programming seems pretty clear and simple to me, it analyzes the piece of music in question and isolates bands of frequencies that correspond with notes, like tuning a piano or guitar but in reverse. Now hear's the crux: I haven't heard (and am fairly sure it can not accomplish) separating two similar frequency/notes from two different instruments, something which all music other than dead dry solos while have. Even Reverb on a solo will create harmonic overtones that could fluster the program, but what happens when two different instruments are playing the same chord, or have frequencies at, say, 440? it ain't pickin' em apart, and that's why they didn't use any multiple layered instrument tracks in their demo.
And remember, the people making this stuff don't make music, they make things they think will help make better music, which is rarely the case. I remember when DAWs killed the blackface ADAT and the assumption was that music, as a whole, was going to get wAY better because now you could cut/paste and edit individual takes.
And in my opinion, there hasn't been but a handful of classics made since.
If you want to make better music, than make better music. This ain't changing a damn thing.
This program is not really catered to vinyl sample dudes. Like everyone said before its just used to correct problems while editing multi-tracked takes. Its a tool for engineers to use like autotune, when say you have a real good vocal take with great energy but has a few flaws. Instead of scratching the whole track you can patch some shit up like timing, pitch, add harmonies, etc...
I wouldnt consider this a production tool, but it perfectly could be. Just dont think that you can break down crowded samples like that cause that is virtually impossible due to the layers of other freqs(other sounds) on the stereo mix. But for single voiced isolated takes this would be cool and very helpful in studio situations where time is money.
Right. I reckon I could still say import Glenn Gould playing piano and decipher the chords and (since it is a well recorded solo instrument) change the chords.
And furthermore, I would even use some big fish audio type shit if this program works as well as it advertises. I wouldnt think twice about importing a clean violing or guitar chord and mapping it to pitches that I wanted. My beef with sample cds is that they choose the chords and playing for you - not my cup of te. With this though? those sample cds would essentially become sounds in a keyboard - the mellotron of 2008. Still seems exciting despite the limitations.
Where did you hear this stuff, Thes? NAMM? Any cool shit this year?
Well as far as cool shit goes everyone seems to have the panties in a bunch over the Anamod, which is basically a tape machine modeler using analogue computations (think DSP but without AD) that operates like an analogue computer from the early 70s. They just released a 500 series format Fairchild modeler as well. I heard that and wasn't impressed but namm is tuff to hear stuff at. IT's not cheap and there is mixed reviews but in theory it's ill - DSP with no A/d D/A.
The thing that had me all twisted in my pants was the new Mellotron, i got a chance to play it and nearly cried. I did cry when i heard it was $6500 but i'll be damned if it wasn't the greatest sounded thing I ever heard. And they got fat tape libraries for it too.
If you are not making good music now, you still won't be after you purchase this for $600.
I think this can basically summarize the past few pages of this thread.
Anyone thinking they're going to get a holy grail version of Mardi Gras with this is thinking too high but I'm sure talented samplers will be able to find a way abuse the shit out of this.
Well as far as cool shit goes everyone seems to have the panties in a bunch over the Anamod, which is basically a tape machine modeler using analogue computations (think DSP but without AD) that operates like an analogue computer from the early 70s. They just released a 500 series format Fairchild modeler as well. I heard that and wasn't impressed but namm is tuff to hear stuff at. IT's not cheap and there is mixed reviews but in theory it's ill - DSP with no A/d D/A.
The thing that had me all twisted in my pants was the new Mellotron, i got a chance to play it and nearly cried. I did cry when i heard it was $6500 but i'll be damned if it wasn't the greatest sounded thing I ever heard. And they got fat tape libraries for it too.
The anamod thing seems pretty ill. I wonder if you use it in tracking if you can run the signal hot into it to get tape style compression, but have the output from that into your daw at a reasonable volume so as not to get digital clipping etc.
Mellotron. Id kill for one. Are they producing new tape libraries? I wonder how they hold up to the og's?
would this work with violin? this is my ignorance at play here, but if there's a constant sound as in no gaps in between, does the software recognize a change in the chord?
DocMcCoy"Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,913 Posts
Isn't that what Mee-Dee is for?
How do you figure? Im talking about morphing real sounds to midi information.
Or actually, isn't that what sheet music is for?
Writing the shit out to sheet music and hiring an orchestra? Clearly the ideal choice, but not practical for most of us bedroom/noMajorLabel types. Expensive as shit, which means less freedom to experiment as well.
It could be good for figuring out arrangements of your own, though. Work it out using this, and maybe transcribe it to sheet music using Sibelius. Wouldn't reduce the cost of hiring musicians, but might make putting the charts together a lot easier.
He addresses a lot the issues that have been raised so far as reverb and full band sounds. I know that ya'll want to temper your enthusiasm over this, but this opens up all sorts of new doors so far as manipulating sampled material.
yea i kinda cant really say shit. I dont think i'll ever really use this, but man you could really get tricky with sampling.
I wonder all of the legal implications of being able to manipulate other peoples material in such a way.
Like say he took that chet baker and turned it to a middle eastern sounding scale or something... then straight released that to CD. Would anyone be able to tell? Would it be illegal?
my (dim) understanding is that there are two fees associated with sampling - one concerning composition and one concerning performance. The expensive one, i take it, is performance. It is why it is more expensive to sample a song than to do a cover version (which relates only to the composition end of the copyright). I think you would still be obligated to pay for use of the performance, no matter how drastically you changed the composition within melodyne. Just a guess.
my (dim) understanding is that there are two fees associated with sampling - one concerning composition and one concerning performance. The expensive one, i take it, is performance. It is why it is more expensive to sample a song than to do a cover version (which relates only to the composition end of the copyright). I think you would still be obligated to pay for use of the performance, no matter how drastically you changed the composition within melodyne. Just a guess.
But, someone would have to prove in a court of law that you had used that original recording, and not one that you and your compatriots recorded. When you're tweaking stuff a decent amount it gets pretty difficult to prove it one way or another. I've never had to deal with any of this stuff first hand though, so I'm just going off of my limited knowledge of the legal system. One thing though, would be identifiable artifacts in the recorded tune like syncopations, or other stylized things.
my (dim) understanding is that there are two fees associated with sampling - one concerning composition and one concerning performance. The expensive one, i take it, is performance. It is why it is more expensive to sample a song than to do a cover version (which relates only to the composition end of the copyright). I think you would still be obligated to pay for use of the performance, no matter how drastically you changed the composition within melodyne. Just a guess.
But, someone would have to prove in a court of law that you had used that original recording, and not one that you and your compatriots recorded. When you're tweaking stuff a decent amount it gets pretty difficult to prove it one way or another. I've never had to deal with any of this stuff first hand though, so I'm just going off of my limited knowledge of the legal system. One thing though, would be identifiable artifacts in the recorded tune like syncopations, or other stylized things.
Well, just like you have now, one would need an "expert" to tell the jury or judge that a phrase is sampled or replayed. This makes serious tweaking possible, so suing over a sample would be a lot harder.
I think the bottom line is that this is a something new and possibly revolutionary. We are talking about the first step here with this software. Other companies are gonna want a piece of this pie and therefore lots more development and progression thereafter from both this company and inevitably others too. All good in my opinion.
Comments
Isn't that what Mee-Dee is for?
Or actually, isn't that what sheet music is for?
Really? i figured any samples relatively clean and solo'ed would work. If it doesnt work in this version, the technology definitly has crazy promise with some more work.
At least this version will be handy for figuring out dope chords from jazz records.
i've been using the older version of melodyne for a while now and have mixed feelings about it. definitely dope in a lot of ways but still really troublesome in extracting the audio from the project in real time without messing up the original timing of the placement of the melo'd track.
anyone know if there's a way to melodyne the track in a daw through an insert without exporting the track completely out of the project file to melodyne? kind of like how autotune does it.
If you really think this software works well in the real world you need a new pair of ears.
How do you figure? Im talking about morphing real sounds to midi information.
Writing the shit out to sheet music and hiring an orchestra? Clearly the ideal choice, but not practical for most of us bedroom/noMajorLabel types. Expensive as shit, which means less freedom to experiment as well.
Yeah, I think I get it. You could transpose a sample to fit into an arrangement you've already created. I was thinking that what you were describing was a straight sample - to - MIDI application.
Exactly. Which apparently (and unfortunately) is out of the scope of this application. Im still holding out hope though.
they have a RTAS.VST plug in version of this, don't knwo if that will accomplish it or not but I imagine that would be the only reason someone would need an RTAS version, i assume it works like autotune in that sense.
Gamble, don't get me wrong, i'm not trying to be antagonistic or anti-new technology, but having heard the product in question in real life, i was far from impressed, as opposed to the first time i sat down behind the VP9000, which changed the way I make beats dead cold.
The science behind the programming seems pretty clear and simple to me, it analyzes the piece of music in question and isolates bands of frequencies that correspond with notes, like tuning a piano or guitar but in reverse. Now hear's the crux: I haven't heard (and am fairly sure it can not accomplish) separating two similar frequency/notes from two different instruments, something which all music other than dead dry solos while have. Even Reverb on a solo will create harmonic overtones that could fluster the program, but what happens when two different instruments are playing the same chord, or have frequencies at, say, 440? it ain't pickin' em apart, and that's why they didn't use any multiple layered instrument tracks in their demo.
And remember, the people making this stuff don't make music, they make things they think will help make better music, which is rarely the case. I remember when DAWs killed the blackface ADAT and the assumption was that music, as a whole, was going to get wAY better because now you could cut/paste and edit individual takes.
And in my opinion, there hasn't been but a handful of classics made since.
If you want to make better music, than make better music. This ain't changing a damn thing.
I wouldnt consider this a production tool, but it perfectly could be. Just dont think that you can break down crowded samples like that cause that is virtually impossible due to the layers of other freqs(other sounds) on the stereo mix. But for single voiced isolated takes this would be cool and very helpful in studio situations where time is money.
And furthermore, I would even use some big fish audio type shit if this program works as well as it advertises. I wouldnt think twice about importing a clean violing or guitar chord and mapping it to pitches that I wanted. My beef with sample cds is that they choose the chords and playing for you - not my cup of te. With this though? those sample cds would essentially become sounds in a keyboard - the mellotron of 2008. Still seems exciting despite the limitations.
Where did you hear this stuff, Thes? NAMM? Any cool shit this year?
Well as far as cool shit goes everyone seems to have the panties in a bunch over the Anamod, which is basically a tape machine modeler using analogue computations (think DSP but without AD) that operates like an analogue computer from the early 70s. They just released a 500 series format Fairchild modeler as well. I heard that and wasn't impressed but namm is tuff to hear stuff at. IT's not cheap and there is mixed reviews but in theory it's ill - DSP with no A/d D/A.
The thing that had me all twisted in my pants was the new Mellotron, i got a chance to play it and nearly cried. I did cry when i heard it was $6500 but i'll be damned if it wasn't the greatest sounded thing I ever heard. And they got fat tape libraries for it too.
Anyone thinking they're going to get a holy grail version of Mardi Gras with this is thinking too high but I'm sure talented samplers will be able to find a way abuse the shit out of this.
The anamod thing seems pretty ill. I wonder if you use it in tracking if you can run the signal hot into it to get tape style compression, but have the output from that into your daw at a reasonable volume so as not to get digital clipping etc.
Mellotron. Id kill for one. Are they producing new tape libraries? I wonder how they hold up to the og's?
It could be good for figuring out arrangements of your own, though. Work it out using this, and maybe transcribe it to sheet music using Sibelius. Wouldn't reduce the cost of hiring musicians, but might make putting the charts together a lot easier.
The manipulation of the chet baker sample? UNFUCKINGREAL
I wonder all of the legal implications of being able to manipulate other peoples material in such a way.
Like say he took that chet baker and turned it to a middle eastern sounding scale or something... then straight released that to CD. Would anyone be able to tell? Would it be illegal?
But, someone would have to prove in a court of law that you had used that original recording, and not one that you and your compatriots recorded. When you're tweaking stuff a decent amount it gets pretty difficult to prove it one way or another. I've never had to deal with any of this stuff first hand though, so I'm just going off of my limited knowledge of the legal system. One thing though, would be identifiable artifacts in the recorded tune like syncopations, or other stylized things.
Well, just like you have now, one would need an "expert" to tell the jury or judge that a phrase is sampled or replayed. This makes serious tweaking possible, so suing over a sample would be a lot harder.