Quite honestly, I think Saigon is absolutely right!!!! Don't get me wrong, his blanket statement is not applicable to all "down south" artists, as he acknowledged himself by singling out Outkast and David Banner. But, rap music has definitely downplayed the role of "MCin'" in terms of mic skills, clever lyrics, and delivery. This probably explains why I don't feel down south stuff, in that it largely seems stupid and infantile to me.
Dude, you are an admitted fan of the Cella Dwellas...
That's right, and at least they have (or had) flows better than those simple-Simon southern flows that are predominate these days. Why does popular have to equal stupid or simplistic? I guess it just reflects the (general lack of) intellect of the American populace nowadays (check the latest ranking of nations educationally according to the National Assessment of Educational Progress).
Peace,
Big Stacks from Kakalak
I think what Mr. Rillz was pointing out was that just being complicated doesn't make something good...
neither does just being from the south
Big_Stacks"I don't worry about hittin' power, cause I don't give 'em nuttin' to hit." 4,670 Posts
Hey,
Quite honestly, I think Saigon is absolutely right!!!! Don't get me wrong, his blanket statement is not applicable to all "down south" artists, as he acknowledged himself by singling out Outkast and David Banner. But, rap music has definitely downplayed the role of "MCin'" in terms of mic skills, clever lyrics, and delivery. This probably explains why I don't feel down south stuff, in that it largely seems stupid and infantile to me.
Dude, you are an admitted fan of the Cella Dwellas...
That's right, and at least they have (or had) flows better than those simple-Simon southern flows that are predominate these days. Why does popular have to equal stupid or simplistic? I guess it just reflects the (general lack of) intellect of the American populace nowadays (check the latest ranking of nations educationally according to the National Assessment of Educational Progress).
Peace,
Big Stacks from Kakalak
I think what Mr. Rillz was pointing out was that just being complicated doesn't make something good...
True, but I'd prefer that over rhymes that are mind-numbingly simple.
I wonder if folks called southern soul "simple simon" or stupid or whatever merely because it was less advanced or intellectual than its northern (nowigancasino) counterparts?
I think you guys are missing something.
And I don't like every (or even most) southern records.
now i'll concede that, in terms of subject matter, most southern rappers are one dimensional/"simplistic" (but this is something that arguably has plauged all subgenres of rap since it's inception), but most competant southern rappers do more interesting things with cadence and inflection than the bulk of ny boom bap rappers could dream.
why do most new york rappers stumble over triplets if they're so complex?
all this southern debate is weak...any hometown can potentially breed a talented mofocker. There's no rules. And so far N.Y. is not breeding geniuses all the time...They once was trendsetters but it' s been over for a while now. And i'm not only talking about music.
N.Y. is like any other for me and it has always been since i'm a foreigner...Cold 187um is as much valuable as RZA if you ask me. I don't say NY is the shit and L.A. sucks just because most of my favorite producers are from N.Y.
People are so quick to say that Southern fried mofockers are slower than New Yorkers. That's not true. It's just because intelligence don't sell. Being dumb is a trademark nowadays...and doin stupid rhymes that makes you laugh is the top right now. I bet you you'll find those old DJ Shadow fans arguing about how hot Lil Weezy is. So please, when being smart will be a pattern again (which basically was the thing is the 90's with all this edutainment shit), then maybe southerners will follow the trend and will preach. But yo, since 9/11 you can't preach. The whole country is so divided...All of these new rappers are Republicans for me. So where's the common ground....There's no more common values that we could "possibly" share. People are just back on some local/regional rap stuff, claiming their city because there's nothing better to do. Nobody wanna endorse America now. They just endorse cities again. Back when Rawkus was hot, this shit was gone. But it just last two years...lol (this last one was a joke, don't quote me and start some shit).
And Saigon is trying to reach the top, so any way is the good way for him, as long as he dodges the Pen, i don't see nothing wrong with controversy. Making people talk sometimes turn them smarter than what they was before the argument...
now i'll concede that, in terms of subject matter, most southern rappers are one dimensional/"simplistic" (but this is something that arguably has plauged all subgenres of rap since it's inception), but most competant southern rappers do more interesting things with cadence and inflection than the bulk of ny boom bap rappers could dream.
why do most new york rappers stumble over triplets if they're so complex?
sayin. chamillionaire uses more syllables per line than half these so-called "complex" rappers do.
Where was that hokey pokey guy from who blew up a few years back? Pretty sure that was new york. Alot of these rappers are just mad cause people got tired of their old ,played out style, and they havent been able to come with anything orginal enough to match what the south has been putting out.
You guys talking about all that complex shit sound like ynwingie malsteam fans hating on nirvana.
Where was that hokey pokey guy from who blew up a few years back? Pretty sure that was new york. Alot of these rappers are just mad cause people got tired of their old ,played out style, and they havent been able to come with anything orginal enough to match what the south has been putting out.
You guys talking about all that complex shit sound like ynwingie malsteam fans hating on nirvana.
Stop the hate on Saigon..regardless of what he says...Kid can spit...and he has a positive message..if you dont believe it download "the colour purple"
stacks i was really hoping you'd address this question:
why do most new york rappers stumble over triplets if they're so complex?
Big_Stacks"I don't worry about hittin' power, cause I don't give 'em nuttin' to hit." 4,670 Posts
stacks i was really hoping you'd address this question:
why do most new york rappers stumble over triplets if they're so complex?
Hey Noz (and others),
I don't really understand the question because I find it untrue. I can name countless MCs that don't (or didn't): Das Efx, KRS-ONE, Pharoah Monche, Prince Po, Dres, Masta Ace (think "Take a Look Around" era), Jaz, Kool G. Rap, Redman, etc. But generally, the triplet rhyme pattern is sort of played out anyway, except for "down South" types or "pimp playa" MCs. Back then, when NYC had respect, cats from other areas picked up their styles after the fact (on some mimicry). Cats need to get their facts straight.
Honestly, I think (some) dudes are on the ole' dickride, "liking what is popular right now", wishy-washy vibe. They'll probably hate the down-South shit when it goes out of style. They'll jump on the bandwagon of the next trend, and the cycle will continue. Myself, if I don't like, I don't, no matter how popular it is. Like I've said before, I never liked Naughty (mad popular back then) because I thought Kay-Gee's beats were cartoony and Vinny was lame (Treach was straight, though). Same goes with Stetsa (wack rhymes), Pac (style-related), Jay-Z (style-related, subject matter), Lords of the Underground (never liked the MCs, but nice production, though), and so on. Not a bandwagon dude, it's
I know you would like to think that people dont actually like southern rap, but consider for a moment that it just might not be for you. Isnt it at least possible that its actually good music that you dont particularly care for, for one reason or another?
Big_Stacks"I don't worry about hittin' power, cause I don't give 'em nuttin' to hit." 4,670 Posts
I know you would like to think that people dont actually like southern rap, but consider for a moment that it just might not be for you. Isnt it at least possible that its actually good music that you dont particularly care for, for one reason or another?
I don't doubt that one bit, B-sides. But, you have cats saying ridiculous stuff like Bone crushed B.I.G. on the mic, and so on. That is lunacy!!!! Such statements, to me anyway, show a lack of understanding of real MCin'. The same guys that think Lil' Wayne can rap relative to Saigon, or something. The issue is whether those same guys now jocking the South were doing so BEFORE it became popular. Will they remain down-South fans when the trend goes cold? Just a few years ago on here, those same guys didn't say shit about the South, now that music is "the shit"? It reaks of bandwagon-jumpin' to me, that's all. People can like what they like, just be true about it. I don't like it, never did, and never will. It just doesn't appeal to me. Same with my examples, I still don't like Jay-Z (all my boys think I'm nuts, too) regardless of his popularity.
I can respect your opinion. I like B.I.G.'s verse better too. But i dont think it indicates I have any greater understanding of MC'in. lil wayne IS way better than saigon though. Thats just a fact.
I know you would like to think that people dont actually like southern rap, but consider for a moment that it just might not be for you. Isnt it at least possible that its actually good music that you dont particularly care for, for one reason or another?
I don't doubt that one bit, B-sides. But, you have cats saying ridiculous stuff like Bone crushed B.I.G. on the mic, and so on. That is lunacy!!!! Such statements, to me anyway, show a lack of understanding of real MCin'.
Again: try stepping back from your conviction that BIG is the best MC on the track and actually listen to it.
JAZ-O INVENTED THE TRIPLET STYLE. FIRST NIGGA WITH AN ANIMAL ON HIS COVER TOO. YOU BITCHES (NOT EVERYBODY ON THIS THREAD, JUST THE BITCHES) KNEW I COULDN'T STAY AWAY FROM THIS NONSENSICAL SCHITT, DIDN'T YOU? SPELL MY NAME WITH TWO L'S, HOES. I LIKE SNAP MUSIC (YEAH I SAID IT YOU SAD EXCUSES FOR ASSHOLES). IT STILL[/b] IS NOT THAT REAL SCHITT. YOU WILL EVENTUALLY HAVE NO CHOICE BUT TO STOP STATING YOUR HOE-ASS, PITIFULLY IGNORANT STATEMENTS THAT DEMEAN THE SANCTITY OF THE HOLY hIp hOp OR YOU WILL BE CASTRATED COMPLETELY WITH THE HAND OF VENGEANCE. DON'T THINK YOU CAN'T BE TOUCHED, NO MATTER WHERE YOU LIVE AT I HAVE SOLDIERS READY TO RIDE FOR ME ALL OVER THE WORLD, WAITING FOR MY SIGNAL. I KEEP TRASH BAGS WITH ME. YOU DO NOT KNOW THE TRUE AND DON'T KNOW ME. DON'T MAKE ME PROVE IT, BLIND LITTLE HOES.
FIRST NIGGA WITH AN ANIMAL ON HIS MIXTAPE. BITCHES.
Comments
neither does just being from the south
True, but I'd prefer that over rhymes that are mind-numbingly simple.
Peace,
Big Stacks from Kakalak
I think you guys are missing something.
And I don't like every (or even most) southern records.
why do most new york rappers stumble over triplets if they're so complex?
And, for the piece d'resistance, turning this docile thread into a five pager...
Wait for it...
Bone ripped Biggie on "Notorious Thugs"
That's a given.
Now if BIG had done BIG instead of trying to be Biggy Bone we MIGHT have a debate.
Herm
N.Y. is like any other for me and it has always been since i'm a foreigner...Cold 187um is as much valuable as RZA if you ask me. I don't say NY is the shit and L.A. sucks just because most of my favorite producers are from N.Y.
People are so quick to say that Southern fried mofockers are slower than New Yorkers. That's not true. It's just because intelligence don't sell. Being dumb is a trademark nowadays...and doin stupid rhymes that makes you laugh is the top right now. I bet you you'll find those old DJ Shadow fans arguing about how hot Lil Weezy is. So please, when being smart will be a pattern again (which basically was the thing is the 90's with all this edutainment shit), then maybe southerners will follow the trend and will preach. But yo, since 9/11 you can't preach. The whole country is so divided...All of these new rappers are Republicans for me. So where's the common ground....There's no more common values that we could "possibly" share. People are just back on some local/regional rap stuff, claiming their city because there's nothing better to do. Nobody wanna endorse America now. They just endorse cities again. Back when Rawkus was hot, this shit was gone. But it just last two years...lol (this last one was a joke, don't quote me and start some shit).
And Saigon is trying to reach the top, so any way is the good way for him, as long as he dodges the Pen, i don't see nothing wrong with controversy. Making people talk sometimes turn them smarter than what they was before the argument...
sayin. chamillionaire uses more syllables per line than half these so-called "complex" rappers do.
You guys talking about all that complex shit sound like ynwingie malsteam fans hating on nirvana.
Glad to hear someone else say it...
Location.
if we too simple then ya'll don't get the basics
Try actually listening to the song, instead of just mindlessly adhering to your ideas of who's supposed to better.
Cosign!!!
Peace,
Big Stacks from Kakalak
Hey Noz (and others),
I don't really understand the question because I find it untrue. I can name countless MCs that don't (or didn't): Das Efx, KRS-ONE, Pharoah Monche, Prince Po, Dres, Masta Ace (think "Take a Look Around" era), Jaz, Kool G. Rap, Redman, etc. But generally, the triplet rhyme pattern is sort of played out anyway, except for "down South" types or "pimp playa" MCs. Back then, when NYC had respect, cats from other areas picked up their styles after the fact (on some mimicry). Cats need to get their facts straight.
Honestly, I think (some) dudes are on the ole' dickride, "liking what is popular right now", wishy-washy vibe. They'll probably hate the down-South shit when it goes out of style. They'll jump on the bandwagon of the next trend, and the cycle will continue. Myself, if I don't like, I don't, no matter how popular it is. Like I've said before, I never liked Naughty (mad popular back then) because I thought Kay-Gee's beats were cartoony and Vinny was lame (Treach was straight, though). Same goes with Stetsa (wack rhymes), Pac (style-related), Jay-Z (style-related, subject matter), Lords of the Underground (never liked the MCs, but nice production, though), and so on. Not a bandwagon dude, it's
Peace,
Big Stacks from Kakalak
I don't doubt that one bit, B-sides. But, you have cats saying ridiculous stuff like Bone crushed B.I.G. on the mic, and so on. That is lunacy!!!! Such statements, to me anyway, show a lack of understanding of real MCin'. The same guys that think Lil' Wayne can rap relative to Saigon, or something. The issue is whether those same guys now jocking the South were doing so BEFORE it became popular. Will they remain down-South fans when the trend goes cold? Just a few years ago on here, those same guys didn't say shit about the South, now that music is "the shit"? It reaks of bandwagon-jumpin' to me, that's all. People can like what they like, just be true about it. I don't like it, never did, and never will. It just doesn't appeal to me. Same with my examples, I still don't like Jay-Z (all my boys think I'm nuts, too) regardless of his popularity.
Peace,
Big Stacks from Kakalak
Just kidding.
yeah, what gives? Ohio is "the south" now?
Again: try stepping back from your conviction that BIG is the best MC on the track and actually listen to it.
BIG's verse is kind of embarassing.
HIP HOP STARTED IN THE WEST!!!
"channeling archaic"
I still say treachorous three did. At least rapping real fast
there's a lot of stuff going on this thread.
I HAVE SOLDIERS READY TO RIDE FOR ME ALL OVER THE WORLD, WAITING FOR MY SIGNAL. I KEEP TRASH BAGS WITH ME. YOU DO NOT KNOW THE TRUE AND DON'T KNOW ME. DON'T MAKE ME PROVE IT, BLIND LITTLE HOES.
FIRST NIGGA WITH AN ANIMAL ON HIS MIXTAPE. BITCHES.