A leader??? Is anybody really looking at Kanye west as any kind of a "leader"??? He's a rap producer / rapper / pop artist. He just made a very courageous statement that needed to be said and he should be commended for it, that's all. I don't think anybody's looking at Kanye West, or any other rap dude, to be their savior. If that's what it is then we're in a lot more trouble than we think we are.
Some of his prior moves might be questionable, but he's quickly turning into a cultural terrorist that will stir up the masses. Which other entertainer would have done it ?
Kanye is the new Messiah.
Saying.
I hate to break to some of you, but Kanye West is not Jesus.
Just to try and keep things in perspective...
He did an incredibly important and brave thing that will hopefully resonate with this country, but saying "George Bush doesn't care about Black people", no matter how important it was, doesn't mean dude is gonna save the world.
Some of his prior moves might be questionable, but he's quickly turning into a cultural terrorist that will stir up the masses. Which other entertainer would have done it ?
Kanye is the new Messiah.
Saying.
I hate to break to some of you, but Kanye West is not Jesus.
Just to try and keep things in perspective... He did an incredibly important and brave thing that will hopefully resonate with this country, but saying "George Bush doesn't care about Black people", no matter how important it was, doesn't mean dude is gonna save the world. He said what needed to be said and that' it.
It is an important feature of the idealogical system to impose on people the feeling that they really are incompetent to deal with complex and important issues: they'd better leave it to the captain. One device is to develop a star system, an array of figures who are often media creations or creations of the academic propoganda establishment, whose deep insights we are supposed to admire and to whom we must happily and confidently assign the right to control our lives and to control international affairs..." --Noam Chomsky, The Chomsky Reader
What's really telling is that the first voices from the whole of the creative community to call this whole shitshow for what it is were the Time Magazine-approved acceptable face of non-threatening rap music and a French-Canadian lounge singer. Where were all those Serious Rock Musicians With Something Important To Say?
What's really telling is that the first voices from the whole of the creative community to call this whole shitshow for what it is were the Time Magazine-approved acceptable face of non-threatening rap music and a French-Canadian lounge singer. Where were all those Serious Rock Musicians With Something Important To Say?
Maybe at least in part because the mainstream media didn't want people to hear what those serious musicians had to say? Believe me, Kanye blindsided their asses. They didn't see that coming at all.
DocMcCoy"Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,913 Posts
What's really telling is that the first voices from the whole of the creative community to call this whole shitshow for what it is were the Time Magazine-approved acceptable face of non-threatening rap music and a French-Canadian lounge singer. Where were all those Serious Rock Musicians With Something Important To Say?
Maybe at least in part because the mainstream media didn't want people to hear what those serious musicians had to say? Believe me, Kanye blindsided their asses. They didn't see that coming at all.
True indeed. And while I don't want to seem like I'm beating up on the likes of Bono or Chris Martin, who do at least seem to put their money where their mouths are when it comes to issues they feel are important, it just goes to show how much more impact it's possible for a performer to have when they're so obviously speaking from the heart as Kanye was. A lot of your conscious, socially-aware rockers are great at the whole College Debating Society thing, where you have all the facts at your fingertips, and make a clear and articulate case for the cause, but sometimes I wish they'd ease back on the diplomacy and say what's really on their minds. Too aware of the potential risks, maybe?
my feeling is that its more imporant for these "dixie chick" type acts to speak up than say any politically motivated "underground" act, in light of the demographics that they reach. Its unfortunate, but there is no way the impact of say Dead Prez speaking out would match Celine Dione for some of these people. That said however, all these acts need to speak up, and some always have, but unfortunately don't have the platform that others do. There are tons of rap songs cutting up Bush, doesnt mean the general public has heard them.
I tuned into this telethon thing a little late. I heard Kanye speaking from the heart, but I think it was after the Bush attack. Then I heard Aaron Neville sing Amazing Grace, then some guy apoligised for Kanye's remarks, then Faith Hill sang Prescious Lord then some more small talk, then Harry Connick lead everyone in a horrible version of Saints. I saw Wynton and Sonny Stitt (?!?).
Anyway I'm on hijack here.
What did you all think of the performances?
Of the 3 I saw Faith Hill was by far the best. When Aaron Neville singing Amazing Grace doesn't move me something is wrong. I'm afraid he has fallen so deeply in love with his vibrato that he has forgotten how to deliver a song.
I heard Aaron also sang Louisiana 1927. Was that great? Or was it just more vibrato.
everyone was saying that he was going to alienate and piss off folls, but i haven't heard any hating. has there been any significant backlash against kanye? is the man untouchable?!
everyone was saying that he was going to alienate and piss off folls, but i haven't heard any hating. has there been any significant backlash against kanye? is the man untouchable?!
everyone was saying that he was going to alienate and piss off folls, but i haven't heard any hating. has there been any significant backlash against kanye? is the man untouchable?!
With rap being the #1 stunna in this country you would think other people would be speaking on this (much respect to Chuck D who is doing just that). Kanye isn't the only dude with a podium, but thank God he did what he did cause right now, he has the biggest one.
that link shows that its only been some fuckball bloggers/alternative media types (the right has alt media too) that are trying to put down kanye, while even a respectable news source (pretty respectable) like LA Times supports him. i don't watch much fox news, but i haven't heard coming from those pundit types about kanye's kamments either.
It is an important feature of the idealogical system to impose on people the feeling that they really are incompetent to deal with complex and important issues: they'd better leave it to the captain. One device is to develop a star system, an array of figures who are often media creations or creations of the academic propoganda establishment, whose deep insights we are supposed to admire and to whom we must happily and confidently assign the right to control our lives and to control international affairs..." --Noam Chomsky, The Chomsky Reader
Chomsky talking about "creations of the academic propoganda establishment"
condi said "he don't have one racist bone in his body"...And we all know that. It's not the bone lady, it's the brain. Condi tought racism was bone-related, poor girl...
now i really appreciated Kanye appearance, but yo, let me go on T.V., i got some shit to say too. And i bet you a LOT of people got shit to say. They just don't have the ooportunity to appear live on T.V. like that...Or when they have the oportunity, they are edited. Prime exmaple is Mayor Nagin speech. He said way more than Kanye but nobody is talking about "i'm gonna buy Nagin next LP when it's out".
DocMcCoy"Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,913 Posts
condi said "he don't have one racist bone in his body"...And we all know that. It's not the bone lady, it's the brain. Condi tought racism was bone-related, poor girl...
now i really appreciated Kanye appearance, but yo, let me go on T.V., i got some shit to say too. And i bet you a LOT of people got shit to say. They just don't have the ooportunity to appear live on T.V. like that...Or when they have the oportunity, they are edited. Prime exmaple is Mayor Nagin speech. He said way more than Kanye but nobody is talking about "i'm gonna buy Nagin next LP when it's out".
Well, I wonder why that might be?
Seriously, though, how often do you hear people criticise performers for not using their public position as a means to say something worthwhile? I don't really get the point you're trying to make here - Ray Nagin should get a record deal? Ordinary people should be allowed to go on telethons and put world leaders on blast? Not that I want to get in an argument about it, but...y'know?
Kanye said more in 2 minutes than Mayor Nagin did with that 20 minute cuss fest...if you ask me Mayor Nagin's motives/agenda should be questioned more than Kanye's[/b]
What's really telling is that the first voices from the whole of the creative community to call this whole shitshow for what it is were the Time Magazine-approved acceptable face of non-threatening rap music and a French-Canadian lounge singer. Where were all those Serious Rock Musicians With Something Important To Say?
Other rappers have said similar things but not received as much attention, probably because they were said in less high profile forums.
Both Puffy and David Banner were on the radio in Atlanta talking real talk.
Kanye said more in 2 minutes than Mayor Nagin did with that 20 minute cuss fest...if you ask me Mayor Nagin's motives/agenda should be questioned more than Kanye's[/b]
Just got an email from a friend who has been living in New Orleans, in the 9th Ward. She said that during the evacuation proceedings, that the City was busy getting stuff ready for Tourists first and hadn't even begun to deal with the people in the 9th Ward. No new info there, but it was a good reminder of how ALL levels of the government failed in this thing, State, Local AND Federal.
If so, it's telling that he can't come up with a more definitive word than "think".
He's your own damn son--you should know.
If my memory serves me correctly, those were his literal words. Did anybody else catch the interview?
"I don't think that's true..."
The transcript is here --not exactly how drewn remembers it, but I do recall GHWB's inflection to be rather unconvincing:
G. BUSH: Sure. I don't think -- certainly I'm not satisfied but I'm just talking about the blame game and there was one particularly vicious comment that the president didn't care, was insensitive on ethnicity.
KING: Yes.
G. BUSH: Insensitive about race. Now that one hurt because I know this president and I know he does care and you know what can he do? He can just go out and do what he's doing today, showing that the federal government is involved, has been involved, will continue to be involved.
...
KING: How did you react, Barbara, when race was brought up and someone mentioned that your son doesn't care?
B. BUSH: I don't believe that. I really didn't hear it. I'm going to tell you the truth but I don't believe it. I know it's not true and of course as George says if you want to really get in trouble criticize my son to me.
KING: I know.
B. BUSH: But I really didn't hear that at all today. People came up to me all day long and said "God bless your son," people of different races and it was very, very moving and touching and they felt like when he flew over that it made all the difference in their lives so I just don't hear that.
KING: What's it like when you talk to him? How does he react talking to his mother about this kind of pressure that's on him?
B. BUSH: You know he's very strong, Larry, and he's doing the best he can. He encourages me when I get down a little bit but he's a very strong man full of faith truthfully.
everyone was saying that he was going to alienate and piss off folls, but i haven't heard any hating. has there been any significant backlash against kanye? is the man untouchable?!
They replayed the speech on my local (San Antonio) Hip Hop station this morning twice.
After the second time, they took a caller and the first question was "How much of what Kanye said do you think is true?"
The caller replied that the amount of time it took to respond to a national tragedy compared to the time it takes to go to war (a few hours to respond to war) is pertty telling.
Then they stopped asking questions and the disc jockey said that even though he doesn't particularly like Bush, nor did he vote for him, that he doesn't think this is a time for criticising him.
WTF????!!!! and this is from our hip hop station who can't stop talking about how REAL they are everyday!
If this is how someone who "doesn't like" bush could respond, imagine how those outisde of the hip hop community will respond. I fear that this may not have as much impact as we would like, Americans are too brainwashed with this "I must stand behind my man in all times of trouble" bs.
Comments
Saying.
I hate to break to some of you, but Kanye West is not Jesus.
Just to try and keep things in perspective...
He did an incredibly important and brave thing that will hopefully resonate with this country, but saying "George Bush doesn't care about Black people", no matter how important it was, doesn't mean dude is gonna save the world.
He said what needed to be said and that' it.
but for real, have you seen the celine clip on cnn? i can't stand her, but respect due, plus she was on of the first to donate 1 million .
here's a link to the moving footage (the way she addressed the looting was VERY VERY well put...glad she went nuts on a cnn)
http://dynamic.cnn.com/apps/tp/video/bestoftv/2005/09/03/lkl.celine.dion.cnn/video.ws.asx?NGUserID=aa50b10-28251-1125678751-2&adDEmas=deReg%3AR00%26deBand%3Ahi%26deDom%3A%3F%26deSic%3D0%26deCoun%3Aca
I am djsheep
And I saw you in the new Qbert DVD.
They should have just had a section where they showed his entire routine. There was waaaaaaaaay too much talking in that shyte.
What's really telling is that the first voices from the whole of the creative community to call this whole shitshow for what it is were the Time Magazine-approved acceptable face of non-threatening rap music and a French-Canadian lounge singer. Where were all those Serious Rock Musicians With Something Important To Say?
Maybe at least in part because the mainstream media didn't want people to hear what those serious musicians had to say? Believe me, Kanye blindsided their asses. They didn't see that coming at all.
True indeed. And while I don't want to seem like I'm beating up on the likes of Bono or Chris Martin, who do at least seem to put their money where their mouths are when it comes to issues they feel are important, it just goes to show how much more impact it's possible for a performer to have when they're so obviously speaking from the heart as Kanye was. A lot of your conscious, socially-aware rockers are great at the whole College Debating Society thing, where you have all the facts at your fingertips, and make a clear and articulate case for the cause, but sometimes I wish they'd ease back on the diplomacy and say what's really on their minds. Too aware of the potential risks, maybe?
True, but when you're on the cover of Time one week and dropping science to millions about our wicked president the next, that sir, is
Anyway I'm on hijack here.
What did you all think of the performances?
Of the 3 I saw Faith Hill was by far the best. When Aaron Neville singing Amazing Grace doesn't move me something is wrong. I'm afraid he has fallen so deeply in love with his vibrato that he has forgotten how to deliver a song.
I heard Aaron also sang Louisiana 1927. Was that great? Or was it just more vibrato.
Tell It Like It Is.
Dan
http://www.allhiphop.com/hiphopnews/?ID=4795
With rap being the #1 stunna in this country you would think other people would be speaking on this (much respect to Chuck D who is doing just that).
Kanye isn't the only dude with a podium, but thank God he did what he did cause right now, he has the biggest one.
that link shows that its only been some fuckball bloggers/alternative media types (the right has alt media too) that are trying to put down kanye, while even a respectable news source (pretty respectable) like LA Times supports him.
i don't watch much fox news, but i haven't heard coming from those pundit types about kanye's kamments either.
Chomsky talking about "creations of the academic propoganda establishment"
that, my friends, is
The sad part about this shit was G. H. W. B's reaction on Larry King Live last night.
L.K. - "Well, what do you think about the criticism from the fellow who said your son doesn't care about blacks?"
G.H.W.B. - "Wellll, I don't think thaaats true..."
I mean damn, you can't come up with a more convincing answer than that??
now i really appreciated Kanye appearance, but yo, let me go on T.V., i got some shit to say too. And i bet you a LOT of people got shit to say. They just don't have the ooportunity to appear live on T.V. like that...Or when they have the oportunity, they are edited. Prime exmaple is Mayor Nagin speech. He said way more than Kanye but nobody is talking about "i'm gonna buy Nagin next LP when it's out".
Well, I wonder why that might be?
Seriously, though, how often do you hear people criticise performers for not using their public position as a means to say something worthwhile? I don't really get the point you're trying to make here - Ray Nagin should get a record deal? Ordinary people should be allowed to go on telethons and put world leaders on blast? Not that I want to get in an argument about it, but...y'know?
Kanye said more in 2 minutes than Mayor Nagin did with that 20 minute cuss fest...if you ask me Mayor Nagin's motives/agenda should be questioned more than Kanye's[/b]
Other rappers have said similar things but not received as much attention, probably because they were said in less high profile forums.
Both Puffy and David Banner were on the radio in Atlanta talking real talk.
Just got an email from a friend who has been living in New Orleans, in the 9th Ward. She said that during the evacuation proceedings, that the City was busy getting stuff ready for Tourists first and hadn't even begun to deal with the people in the 9th Ward. No new info there, but it was a good reminder of how ALL levels of the government failed in this thing, State, Local AND Federal.
Are those his literal words?
If so, it's telling that he can't come up with a more definitive word than "think".
He's your own damn son--you should know.
If my memory serves me correctly, those were his literal words. Did anybody else catch the interview?
"I don't think that's true..."
If Kanye had said "George Bush goes out of his way to be mean to Black People", you could have an argument that that may or may not be actually true.
But he said George Bush doesn't CARE about them....that part is pretty hard to argue against.
If my memory serves me correctly, those were his literal words. Did anybody else catch the interview?
"I don't think that's true..."
The transcript is here --not exactly how drewn remembers it, but I do recall GHWB's inflection to be rather unconvincing:
G. BUSH: Sure. I don't think -- certainly I'm not satisfied but I'm just talking about the blame game and there was one particularly vicious comment that the president didn't care, was insensitive on ethnicity.
KING: Yes.
G. BUSH: Insensitive about race. Now that one hurt because I know this president and I know he does care and you know what can he do? He can just go out and do what he's doing today, showing that the federal government is involved, has been involved, will continue to be involved.
...
KING: How did you react, Barbara, when race was brought up and someone mentioned that your son doesn't care?
B. BUSH: I don't believe that. I really didn't hear it. I'm going to tell you the truth but I don't believe it. I know it's not true and of course as George says if you want to really get in trouble criticize my son to me.
KING: I know.
B. BUSH: But I really didn't hear that at all today. People came up to me all day long and said "God bless your son," people of different races and it was very, very moving and touching and they felt like when he flew over that it made all the difference in their lives so I just don't hear that.
KING: What's it like when you talk to him? How does he react talking to his mother about this kind of pressure that's on him?
B. BUSH: You know he's very strong, Larry, and he's doing the best he can. He encourages me when I get down a little bit but he's a very strong man full of faith truthfully.
They replayed the speech on my local (San Antonio) Hip Hop station this morning twice.
After the second time, they took a caller and the first question was "How much of what Kanye said do you think is true?"
The caller replied that the amount of time it took to respond to a national tragedy compared to the time it takes to go to war (a few hours to respond to war) is pertty telling.
Then they stopped asking questions and the disc jockey said that even though he doesn't particularly like Bush, nor did he vote for him, that he doesn't think this is a time for criticising him.
WTF????!!!! and this is from our hip hop station who can't stop talking about how REAL they are everyday!
If this is how someone who "doesn't like" bush could respond, imagine how those outisde of the hip hop community will respond. I fear that this may not have as much impact as we would like, Americans are too brainwashed with this "I must stand behind my man in all times of trouble" bs.
That's a frightening comment right there.
I hope Kanye lays low for a bit.
Let's not forget ol' pappy's roots...
I think its safe to say Kanye is gonna have a nice little file on him just like John Lennon & Charlie Chaplin.
crossing the gub'ment as an individual usually ends up pretty ugly