You must admit that this shit is some ridiculous bullshit though. I can give them the whole "kill whitey" thing or whatever and chalk it up to irony, but that whole bring in a bucket of fried chicken to get free cover? How the fuck is that not considered racist when you're going to some shit called "kill whitey"?
Brian,
You'd have to appreciate that judging by some of what I've read around here, the litmus test for "is it racist?" would have to be something on the level of a lynching and even then, I could imagine someone writing in to say, "well, you know, I don't think lynching was really about race, it's really about class. After all, they lynched white people too, right?"
...what I am kind of surprised at is everyones over-reactions to them while other things such as mocking a race/ cultire of people that aren't black are looked at without any question of how fucked up they are.
Guzzo - why don't you tell everyone what you're referring to so they can see what they should really be mad about.
Like I said to you man, offense is realative. Just because you don't deem this as offensive doesn't mean it isn't to others.
And what are you going to do if people tell you "i'm offended that you're offended" when you tell them what you're angry about?
Seriously, none of us have any place to tell anyone how they should or shouldn't feel so if you don't agree, just leave it alone.
understood
the reason I am not going too public with what I'm speaking about is because I thought it was painfully obvious. On top of that I spoke with the person who posted up the offensive picture and I really don't have any issue with him beyond what we spoke on in our PM's to each other. I really don't want to put that guy on blast. My reaction is more based on the selectiveness of others who saw the image, made no comment on it, but then decided to go apeshit over this & Vitamins rap.
Self PM on blast:
Sent to: Guzzo
Ok, I saw that. I just thought it was a Jewish guy dressed as a Rabbi for Halloween.
I honestly didn't analyze the picture too much seeing as there were a million [pictures] in that thread.
BUT - now who's being hyper-sensitive when people don't show outrage over something most people I doubt even noticed?
I'm not talking shit man, but really, there's a big difference being upset about that "Kill Whitey" thing and no seeing if a guy was Jewish or not in a small picture buried in a thread full of pictures.
Ok, now everybody knows what's acceptable to get offended by.
whoa, you were offended by a guy dressing up as a rabbi for halloween? wow. And you don't see an issue with this party or vitamin's lame ass songs.
Adam, I just curious... If this were a "Fag Bash" party where straight people went and listened to disco and house music and totally "Fagged Out" without actually having to deal with real gay people... then would that offend you?
yes, but thats not really a fair example. If this were a "nigger bash" party where white people listened to rhythm & Blues and were totally "Niggered out" without having to deal with real black people I think everyone here would show offense.
But I think you guys are losing the point of where I'm coming from. I am not bothered by the party just like I wasn't bothered by Vitamins "rap". They were both done in really bad humor and I take them as nothing more than very dumb jokes that I wouldn't care about if I didn't read or hear about them here.
I just think that some people show selective offense to racism on here, and when they do show offense they go waaaaaaay too overboard with it.
yes, but thats not really a fair example. If this were a "nigger bash" party where white people listened to rhythm & Blues and were totally "Niggered out" without having to deal with real black people I think everyone here would show offense.
Just goes to show though, nothing lights out little board on FIIIIIRRRRREEEEE like a discussion about race.
That should tell all of us something about the persistance of race, racism, and passionate feelings on both.
No?
You must admit that this shit is some ridiculous bullshit though. I can give them the whole "kill whitey" thing or whatever and chalk it up to irony, but that whole bring in a bucket of fried chicken to get free cover? How the fuck is that not considered racist when you're going to some shit called "kill whitey"?
You could call it ignorant, or ignorant racism, which is different to the out and out racism that some people think needs to be present for racism to even be an issue.
I guess my viewpoint on this is a little different because some shit like this would NEVER go down in Hawaii. And if it actually did, people would be there to kill whiteyhaole[/b] for real.
yes, but thats not really a fair example. If this were a "nigger bash" party where white people listened to rhythm & Blues and were totally "Niggered out" without having to deal with real black people I think everyone here would show offense.
yes, but thats not really a fair example. If this were a "nigger bash" party where white people listened to rhythm & Blues and were totally "Niggered out" without having to deal with real black people I think everyone here would show offense.
yes, but thats not really a fair example. If this were a "nigger bash" party where white people listened to rhythm & Blues and were totally "Niggered out" without having to deal with real black people I think everyone here would show offense.
wtf? did you even read what this thread is about?
yes, but these people weren't actually out to create hatred towards blacks, as misguided and unhumorous as it was it was still an attempt to be ironically cool. Had their attept been what I stated we'd have not called it a party at all but rather a klan rally
yes, but thats not really a fair example. If this were a "nigger bash" party where white people listened to rhythm & Blues and were totally "Niggered out" without having to deal with real black people I think everyone here would show offense.
wtf? did you even read what this thread is about?
yes, but these people weren't actually out to create hatred towards blacks, as misguided and unhumorous as it was it was still an attempt to be ironically cool. Had their attept been what I stated we'd have not called it a party at all but rather a klan rally
Oops, I forgot Klan rally's always involve listening to R&B and imitating Black people.
yes, but thats not really a fair example. If this were a "nigger bash" party where white people listened to rhythm & Blues and were totally "Niggered out" without having to deal with real black people I think everyone here would show offense.
wtf? did you even read what this thread is about?
yes, but these people weren't actually out to create hatred towards blacks, as misguided and unhumorous as it was it was still an attempt to be ironically cool. Had their attept been what I stated we'd have not called it a party at all but rather a klan rally
ok but if I wanted to start a night called KillNazis as you know a harmless spoof and advertised free admission if people wore yellow stars of david on their clothes... that would be ok? You know because its you know irony?
Homie don't give them a pass because they are stupid. With your defense you are having trouble seeing the forest because of the trees.
and let me just reiterate again... Pumpsta? seriously? How could he think that name was a good idea?
Guzzo, my dude, please, please, PLEASE shut the fuck up. It's bad enough that you're a whiny attention-starved fool who uses this site like his personal emo blog, but it's even worse that there is no internal logic to the Guzzo Code of Acceptable Speech. You make me not even want to read this forum anymore.
As for "Kill Whitey" or whatever, Why is "irony" every "artsy" white dude's justification for callous disregard for the feelings and suffering of others? Fucking Vice Magazine syndrome. Move back to Kansas with that shit...
Oh God! JP's underling comes to roost. First of all get your lame self promoting garbage out of your avatar. Real good to have your place of work in the face of of people your telling to fuck off!!!! Telling some one they treat this place like there own blog when your using it to advertise is weak.
You and JP with your meanless threats of never wanting to read this forum and it's all someones fault. There are so many threads on here every weak that have nothing to do with anything so take it out on them. If your so bothered then stand by your workds and stop reading.
And finally fuck off with your Kansas comment. Have you ever been there? Just cause it's getting bad press doesn't make everyone their some sort of back woods idiot for you to have "callous disregard" for. Plenty of stupid fucked up things go on in every state. How about everytime some gets shot or mugged or raped we say "take that shit to New York".
Okay, you want it dude? Here goes...
1. I am nobody's underling hommie, I'm a fucking boss and you are some nondescript record digging fuck who has like 8 thousand posts on this site and has never said anything even remotely interesting. Me on the other hand, I make gstacks off this music shit and help alot of people out (including on this site in the process). What do you do? Besides pick fights with other posters on here who make you insecure? Probably not much, huh?
2. I actually frequently DO stop reading this site, but then I say to myself "self, I know there's alot of absolutely worthless toy fucks like Volumen on this site, but some of your friends (such as the person who started this thread) post on here too, and occassionally there are some nice topics that I like to peruse."
3. If I choose to advertise my friend's store in my avatar, what the fuck is it to you? Jealous much?
4. Please don't stand up for Guzzo, one thing I'll give him credit for is that he is more than capable of standing up for himself.
5. As for Kansas, I mean really dude, hop off my cock already man, I'm sure the people of Kansas appreciate your boosterism, but I'm engaging in the rhetorical devices of hyperbole and sarcasm, I'm not attempting to cast aspersions on the nice folks of Kansas, I'm simply illustrating my point that all of these Williamsburg hipster types came here from the midwest and basically created an enclave of fauxhemianism in someone else's neighborhood.
Seriously, you nondescript shithead, don't even address me again, ever, I won't even respond.
yes, but thats not really a fair example. If this were a "nigger bash" party where white people listened to rhythm & Blues and were totally "Niggered out" without having to deal with real black people I think everyone here would show offense.
wtf? did you even read what this thread is about?
yes, but these people weren't actually out to create hatred towards blacks, as misguided and unhumorous as it was it was still an attempt to be ironically cool. Had their attept been what I stated we'd have not called it a party at all but rather a klan rally
Opps, I forgot Klan rally's always involve listening to R&B and imitating Black people.
Dude, just stop.
Dude I'm lost then, I don't even know what y'all are showing offense to now.
look, just to make it plain and simple, I don't give a fuck what these dudes were doing, I did care that folks here were going overboard calling for ass whoopings and shit like that.
A few days ago someone posted a picture of themsevels in stereotypical hasidic clothing and called themselves a rabbi, to put it in context it would be like me dressing up in blackface and calling myself a basketball player.
Hasidic folks are not rabbi's, rabbis are rabbis
Hasidic folks are jewish and dress according to what the rule of thier religion and culture state.
No one cared about such a photo.
Vitamin makes a (bad) jokey track this place goes bat shit
Oliver posts an article about stupid white rich kids acting ironic and doing a "kill whitey" party and this place goes bat shit.
I think the selective times at which people get offended (and what the majority of those posters got offended over) is a little suspect.
Hasidic folks are jewish and dress according to what the rule of thier religion and culture state.
No one cared about such a photo.
Because most people wouldn't know the difference. I sure as hell don't. That looks like a rabbi to me. So why would I be offended?
some people say all blacks look alike, others assume that every black man must be good at sports, and even others assume that if one of them is successful he must be a rapper or a drug dealer.
do you see what I'm getting at?
anyways thats beyond the point. I'm not talking about the actual "offensive" events here. Rather I am talking about the over-reactions/non-reactions they are getting.
hey you guys. i like the tv show "so you think you can dance?" and i posted about it but no one responded but OOOOOOOOOOHHHH you guys want to talk about "the wire" and there are like 6 posts about how great the wire is. you guys are all insenstive assholes for not liking "so you think you can dance?" i have needs too dammit!
1) People get offended by racism, 2) Same people do not get offended by anti-Semitism, sexism, homophobia, etc. 3) Ergo, people should not be offended by racism.
Sorry but you have it backwards. Your point should not be, "people should chill out" but "how come people aren't making a bigger issue of these other offensive things that happen on the board."
Your idea of finding "compromise" is not to raise the level of collective outrage over things that truly are deserving of outrage but instead to say, "let's not get mad at anything." I'm sure this isn't what you intended to set out to do, but reading your comments through this whole thread, you make it seem as if it's wack to be offended by these dumb ass hipsters.
Why can't we be offended by them AND learn to bring that same level of righteous anger to the stuff you mention?
By the way, I just want to state this very plainly - the litmus test for racism should not be "does this promote an active hatred of Blackness." Rather, it should be, "is this overturning White Supremacy or does it perpetuate it?"
To bit an old Malcolm X point, if someone has a knife crammed six inches into your gut, it doesn't make sense to say something like, "well, no one's pushing the knife further in, so why are you complaining?" The issue is: "are you taking this knife out or what?"
my own feelings about this are that it's not really racist but could be perceieved by some people as being in bad taste. but it is raelly fucking lame.
real racism is my grandmother who uses the word nig*er still to describe black people.
hey you guys. i like the tv show "so you think you can dance?" and i posted about it but no one responded but OOOOOOOOOOHHHH you guys want to talk about "the wire" and there are like 6 posts about how great the wire is. you guys are all insenstive assholes for not liking "so you think you can dance?" i have needs too dammit!
My girlfriend has been loving that show. I can handle it for a little bit but damn 2 hours! Half of which is commercials. But yeah that shit is over the top like Sylvester Stalone.
hey you guys. i like the tv show "so you think you can dance?" and i posted about it but no one responded but OOOOOOOOOOHHHH you guys want to talk about "the wire" and there are like 6 posts about how great the wire is. you guys are all insenstive assholes for not liking "so you think you can dance?" i have needs too dammit!
My girlfriend has been loving that show. I can handle it for a little bit but damn 2 hours! Half of which is commercials. But yeah that shit is over the top like Sylvester Stalone.
i am outraged at the non-response i am getting. OUTRAGED!!!!![/b]
everyone needs to be on my hype or else. understood?
my own feelings about this are that it's not really racist but could be perceieved by some people as being in bad taste. but it is raelly fucking lame.
real racism is my grandmother who uses the word nig*er still to describe black people.
Why must racism always be in black & white (no pun)?
There are many degrees and levels of racism and this is indeed racist in my eyes.
Again, I don't know how anyone can read "get in free with a bucket of fried chicken" and say "oh, that's not racist, they're just being ironic"
Fuck that.
The shit is racist and a bunch of crackers dressing up and acting like what they percieve Black people to be then calling it a night and going back to happy crackerland is equally as racist. How can some of you not see that?
Does making fun of yourself simultaneously negate your other actions?
I don't think so.
Overall it just seems like it's deemed "ok" by people becuase hipsters are known douche bags and it's to be expected. But the blanket of irony only covers so much.
The biggest irony is, it seems like White people are more offended than Black people are over this.
hey you guys. i like the tv show "so you think you can dance?" and i posted about it but no one responded but OOOOOOOOOOHHHH you guys want to talk about "the wire" and there are like 6 posts about how great the wire is. you guys are all insenstive assholes for not liking "so you think you can dance?" i have needs too dammit!
My girlfriend has been loving that show. I can handle it for a little bit but damn 2 hours! Half of which is commercials. But yeah that shit is over the top like Sylvester Stalone.
i am outraged at the non-response i am getting. OUTRAGED!!!!![/b]
everyone needs to be on my hype or else. understood?
1) People get offended by racism, 2) Same people do not get offended by anti-Semitism, sexism, homophobia, etc. 3) Ergo, people should not be offended by racism.
Sorry but you have it backwards. Your point should not be, "people should chill out" but "how come people aren't making a bigger issue of these other offensive things that happen on the board."
I understand where your coming from. This is where my ideals seem to seperate form others. I've lumped all forms of prejudice based on race, culture, sex and sexual preference into one big pile. I am not expecting others to fall in line with my ideals however I don't feel like I should face mockery and insults for stating them.
those that choose to attack me because its easier to do than, lets say, talk about why my ideals of racism and hate done line up with thiers cheapen the entire discussion and, for me, cheapen themselves.
Your idea of finding "compromise" is not to raise the level of collective outrage over things that truly are deserving of outrage but instead to say, "let's not get mad at anything." I'm sure this isn't what you intended to set out to do, but reading your comments through this whole thread, you make it seem as if it's wack to be offended by these dumb ass hipsters.
Why can't we be offended by them AND learn to bring that same level of righteous anger to the stuff you mention?
I wish it were that simple, but I've learned over the last few weeks that there is a stigma attached to my posts
I really do believe that people shouldn't be so selective in what they are offended in and if that cannot stop then they should at least act accordingly with whatever the racist/ hateful thing was.
For instance, posting an article about rich whiteboys throwing a kill whitey party in a internet forum dominated by other whiteboys with very liberal viewpoints shouldn't do much more than raise awareness of these things going on. Instead it seemed to infuriate people and make them say shit like these guys should get their ass whooped. Now I don't think anyone is doing anything but posturing by stating that amongst a bunch of like minded people in a mutual appreciation group setting like soulstrut. Go down to one of these parties and state your thoughts or better yet act on them and then were getting somewhere.
In other words y'all ain't really doing much by preaching to the congegation.
By the way, I just want to state this very plainly - the litmus test for racism should not be "does this promote an active hatred of Blackness." Rather, it should be, "is this overturning White Supremacy or does it perpetuate it?"
To bit an old Malcolm X point, if someone has a knife crammed six inches into your gut, it doesn't make sense to say something like, "well, no one's pushing the knife further in, so why are you complaining?" The issue is: "are you taking this knife out or what?"
Comments
ok good, I thought I was the only one who didn't understand what that meant.
WHAT?!?!?! dammit what did I say?!?!?
Brian,
You'd have to appreciate that judging by some of what I've read around here, the litmus test for "is it racist?" would have to be something on the level of a lynching and even then, I could imagine someone writing in to say, "well, you know, I don't think lynching was really about race, it's really about class. After all, they lynched white people too, right?"
"No, no racism here."
...well, yes I can.
whoa, you were offended by a guy dressing up as a rabbi for halloween? wow. And you don't see an issue with this party or vitamin's lame ass songs.
yes, but thats not really a fair example. If this were a "nigger bash" party where white people listened to rhythm & Blues and were totally "Niggered out" without having to deal with real black people I think everyone here would show offense.
But I think you guys are losing the point of where I'm coming from. I am not bothered by the party just like I wasn't bothered by Vitamins "rap". They were both done in really bad humor and I take them as nothing more than very dumb jokes that I wouldn't care about if I didn't read or hear about them here.
I just think that some people show selective offense to racism on here, and when they do show offense they go waaaaaaay too overboard with it.
wtf? did you even read what this thread is about?
You could call it ignorant, or ignorant racism, which is different to the out and out racism that some people think needs to be present for racism to even be an issue.
free shot with can of Spam and diabetes test kit.
Yeah, I mean, its the same thing.
Dammit adam, are you high again?
hahahahahaaaa!!!!
yes, but these people weren't actually out to create hatred towards blacks, as misguided and unhumorous as it was it was still an attempt to be ironically cool. Had their attept been what I stated we'd have not called it a party at all but rather a klan rally
the irony is killing me here.
Oops, I forgot Klan rally's always involve listening to R&B and imitating Black people.
Dude, just stop.
ok but if I wanted to start a night called KillNazis as you know a harmless spoof and advertised free admission if people wore yellow stars of david on their clothes... that would be ok? You know because its you know irony?
Homie don't give them a pass because they are stupid. With your defense you are having trouble seeing the forest because of the trees.
and let me just reiterate again... Pumpsta? seriously? How could he think that name was a good idea?
Okay, you want it dude? Here goes...
1. I am nobody's underling hommie, I'm a fucking boss and you are some nondescript record digging fuck who has like 8 thousand posts on this site and has never said anything even remotely interesting. Me on the other hand, I make gstacks off this music shit and help alot of people out (including on this site in the process). What do you do? Besides pick fights with other posters on here who make you insecure? Probably not much, huh?
2. I actually frequently DO stop reading this site, but then I say to myself "self, I know there's alot of absolutely worthless toy fucks like Volumen on this site, but some of your friends (such as the person who started this thread) post on here too, and occassionally there are some nice topics that I like to peruse."
3. If I choose to advertise my friend's store in my avatar, what the fuck is it to you? Jealous much?
4. Please don't stand up for Guzzo, one thing I'll give him credit for is that he is more than capable of standing up for himself.
5. As for Kansas, I mean really dude, hop off my cock already man, I'm sure the people of Kansas appreciate your boosterism, but I'm engaging in the rhetorical devices of hyperbole and sarcasm, I'm not attempting to cast aspersions on the nice folks of Kansas, I'm simply illustrating my point that all of these Williamsburg hipster types came here from the midwest and basically created an enclave of fauxhemianism in someone else's neighborhood.
Seriously, you nondescript shithead, don't even address me again, ever, I won't even respond.
Dude I'm lost then, I don't even know what y'all are showing offense to now.
look, just to make it plain and simple, I don't give a fuck what these dudes were doing, I did care that folks here were going overboard calling for ass whoopings and shit like that.
A few days ago someone posted a picture of themsevels in stereotypical hasidic clothing and called themselves a rabbi, to put it in context it would be like me dressing up in blackface and calling myself a basketball player.
Hasidic folks are not rabbi's, rabbis are rabbis
Hasidic folks are jewish and dress according to what the rule of thier religion and culture state.
No one cared about such a photo.
Vitamin makes a (bad) jokey track this place goes bat shit
Oliver posts an article about stupid white rich kids acting ironic and doing a "kill whitey" party and this place goes bat shit.
I think the selective times at which people get offended (and what the majority of those posters got offended over) is a little suspect.
any questions?
Because most people wouldn't know the difference. I sure as hell don't. That looks like a rabbi to me. So why would I be offended?
some people say all blacks look alike, others assume that every black man must be good at sports, and even others assume that if one of them is successful he must be a rapper or a drug dealer.
do you see what I'm getting at?
anyways thats beyond the point. I'm not talking about the actual "offensive" events here. Rather I am talking about the over-reactions/non-reactions they are getting.
The fundamental flaw in your logic is this:
1) People get offended by racism,
2) Same people do not get offended by anti-Semitism, sexism, homophobia, etc.
3) Ergo, people should not be offended by racism.
Sorry but you have it backwards. Your point should not be, "people should chill out" but "how come people aren't making a bigger issue of these other offensive things that happen on the board."
Your idea of finding "compromise" is not to raise the level of collective outrage over things that truly are deserving of outrage but instead to say, "let's not get mad at anything." I'm sure this isn't what you intended to set out to do, but reading your comments through this whole thread, you make it seem as if it's wack to be offended by these dumb ass hipsters.
Why can't we be offended by them AND learn to bring that same level of righteous anger to the stuff you mention?
By the way, I just want to state this very plainly - the litmus test for racism should not be "does this promote an active hatred of Blackness." Rather, it should be, "is this overturning White Supremacy or does it perpetuate it?"
To bit an old Malcolm X point, if someone has a knife crammed six inches into your gut, it doesn't make sense to say something like, "well, no one's pushing the knife further in, so why are you complaining?" The issue is: "are you taking this knife out or what?"
have fun
http://soulstrut.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=406745&page=&view=&sb=5&o=&fpart=1&vc=1
my own feelings about this are that it's not really racist but could be perceieved by some people as being in bad taste. but it is raelly fucking lame.
real racism is my grandmother who uses the word nig*er still to describe black people.
My girlfriend has been loving that show. I can handle it for a little bit but damn 2 hours! Half of which is commercials. But yeah that shit is over the top like Sylvester Stalone.
i am outraged at the non-response i am getting. OUTRAGED!!!!![/b]
everyone needs to be on my hype or else. understood?
Why must racism always be in black & white (no pun)?
There are many degrees and levels of racism and this is indeed racist in my eyes.
Again, I don't know how anyone can read "get in free with a bucket of fried chicken" and say "oh, that's not racist, they're just being ironic"
Fuck that.
The shit is racist and a bunch of crackers dressing up and acting like what they percieve Black people to be then calling it a night and going back to happy crackerland is equally as racist. How can some of you not see that?
Does making fun of yourself simultaneously negate your other actions?
I don't think so.
Overall it just seems like it's deemed "ok" by people becuase hipsters are known douche bags and it's to be expected. But the blanket of irony only covers so much.
The biggest irony is, it seems like White people are more offended than Black people are over this.
i'd tap
i've been waiting to use that line!
and for the record, how many different ways are there to say lame?
I understand where your coming from. This is where my ideals seem to seperate form others. I've lumped all forms of prejudice based on race, culture, sex and sexual preference into one big pile. I am not expecting others to fall in line with my ideals however I don't feel like I should face mockery and insults for stating them.
those that choose to attack me because its easier to do than, lets say, talk about why my ideals of racism and hate done line up with thiers cheapen the entire discussion and, for me, cheapen themselves.
I wish it were that simple, but I've learned over the last few weeks that there is a stigma attached to my posts
I really do believe that people shouldn't be so selective in what they are offended in and if that cannot stop then they should at least act accordingly with whatever the racist/ hateful thing was.
For instance, posting an article about rich whiteboys throwing a kill whitey party in a internet forum dominated by other whiteboys with very liberal viewpoints shouldn't do much more than raise awareness of these things going on. Instead it seemed to infuriate people and make them say shit like these guys should get their ass whooped. Now I don't think anyone is doing anything but posturing by stating that amongst a bunch of like minded people in a mutual appreciation group setting like soulstrut. Go down to one of these parties and state your thoughts or better yet act on them and then were getting somewhere.
In other words y'all ain't really doing much by preaching to the congegation.
great point.
dude's take internet arguing WAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY to seriously. shits a waste of time