Another thing that is bullshit about the soda ban is that dudes who want a bazillion ounces of soda is that they can still get it, but will just have to make multiple purchases of smaller sizes, so you haven't limited the person's soda intake, only multiplied the amount garbage produced by one person. This will practically increase waste via plastic bottles, styrofoam cups, etc exponentially.
Just tax the shit out of it instead of piling the garbage higher.
I agree with that. It's not like anyone went after cigarettes by mandating that cartons can only contain 2 cigarettes.
you should've seen the commercials that ran against the soda tax. HouseMAAHM like whoa talmbout "stop Albany from making food (!) more expensive for my kids."
I remember those, righteous mom unpacking the grocery bag and shaking the receipt in her fist...
If I'm not mistaken, it's politically much easier to pass a law limiting the size of the containers than it is to slap on a new tax.
all that starbucks bullshit is much more expensive than soda and has much less of an effect on the average americans diet. last time i checked soda was the biggest source of calories in the average american diet. Soda!!!! people dont want a nanny state when it comes to their lack of self control and shit personal habits but they will most certainly run to nanny when it comes time to pay health bills. typical bullshit philosophy that has ruined our environment and economy....privatize profit (or pleasure) and socialize the costs
Your Starbucks defense is weak.
That stuff needs to face the same restrictions you would put on soda.
Otherwise you are saying protect the poor from themselves, but the rich should be able to do what they want.
Starbucks is the new Coke. Kids are drinking it daily. Starbucks may look all nice and Norman Rockwell now, but they are evil.
Also, energy drinks, sports drinks and flavored malt beverages... And what ever they think up tomorrow.
I'm not saying I am for or against a ban/tax/regulations, but if you are going to do it treat all high caloric drinks the same.*
all that starbucks bullshit is much more expensive than soda and has much less of an effect on the average americans diet. last time i checked soda was the biggest source of calories in the average american diet. Soda!!!! people dont want a nanny state when it comes to their lack of self control and shit personal habits but they will most certainly run to nanny when it comes time to pay health bills. typical bullshit philosophy that has ruined our environment and economy....privatize profit (or pleasure) and socialize the costs
Your Starbucks defense is weak.
No it's not. How many people are getting obese on weird coffee drinks? This bill is designed to curb obesity, not mete out social justice.
There are a shocking number of people who drink a gallon or more of soda a day - nobody is drinking two gallons of frappucinos a day.
People should remember that the issue here isn't simply how we consume but also - and just as important - our increasing sedentary lifestyles. I could be wrong but while it seems easier to regulate the former, the latter is a lot trickier to deal with.
I'm living this right at the moment since I literally just got in my glucose test from this morning and I'm prediabetic. Among other things, that means I need to try to both drop 15 lbs and start regular exercise. I, at least, have the luxury of time to do these things but it's not so simple for many others.
all that starbucks bullshit is much more expensive than soda and has much less of an effect on the average americans diet. last time i checked soda was the biggest source of calories in the average american diet. Soda!!!! people dont want a nanny state when it comes to their lack of self control and shit personal habits but they will most certainly run to nanny when it comes time to pay health bills. typical bullshit philosophy that has ruined our environment and economy....privatize profit (or pleasure) and socialize the costs
Your Starbucks defense is weak.
No it's not. How many people are getting obese on weird coffee drinks? This bill is designed to curb obesity, not mete out social justice.
There are a shocking number of people who drink a gallon or more of soda a day - nobody is drinking two gallons of frappucinos a day.
You do realize that the giant size mocha-whatever bullshit with whipped cream clocks in at over a thousand calories...which could mean over half your calories for the day depending on your size. I don't think the people drinking these things are counting them as half of their food for the day. They are contributing to unhealthy habits in a big way.
Was just listening to the NPR report on this soda issue and they were interviewing someone and the person was complaining about it and said something to the effect of "if we can't drink as much soda now, what are we supposed to drink?" in a very flabbergasted tone. Facepalm.
As far as the exercise thing, my wife and I joined the Y last month and us going together has been great. I went from doing nothing exercise-wise to swimming over 15 laps a day before work. My first day of swimming I felt like I was going to have a heart attack after 2 laps. Having someone to get out of bed with at 5:45 and be accountable to has made it very easy. On the odd day where our schedules don't allow our morning trip to the Y, I get very down about not exercising. I never thought I would get bummed about not being able to exercise.
As far as the exercise thing, my wife and I joined the Y last month and us going together has been great. I went from doing nothing exercise-wise to swimming over 15 laps a day before work. My first day of swimming I felt like I was going to have a heart attack after 2 laps. Having someone to get out of bed with at 5:45 and be accountable to has made it very easy. On the odd day where our schedules don't allow our morning trip to the Y, I get very down about not exercising. I never thought I would get bummed about not being able to exercise.
Sounds like you've got yourself a positive addiction, which is a very good thing according to William Glasser.
As far as the exercise thing, my wife and I joined the Y last month and us going together has been great. I went from doing nothing exercise-wise to swimming over 15 laps a day before work. My first day of swimming I felt like I was going to have a heart attack after 2 laps. Having someone to get out of bed with at 5:45 and be accountable to has made it very easy. On the odd day where our schedules don't allow our morning trip to the Y, I get very down about not exercising. I never thought I would get bummed about not being able to exercise.
Is he the guy who theorized that it takes 27 days to develop a habit?
Sounds like you've got yourself a positive addiction, which is a very good thing according to William Glasser.
A tax on soda is a tax on the poor and uneducated. Anyone with decent income will likely not feel the effect. Poor people will and they're doubly fucked if they're uneducated in nutritional matters and therefore completely addicted to soda without knowing how bad it is for them.
A tax on soda is a tax on the poor and uneducated. Anyone with decent income will likely not feel the effect. Poor people will and they're doubly fucked if they're uneducated in nutritional matters and therefore completely addicted to soda without knowing how bad it is for them.
I agree with the first line but let's not get bogged down in this specific legislation.
The bigger questions are:
1) Is obesity a public health crisis, on that impinges not just directly on the obese but on the rest of society through any variety of costs?
2) If it is, what responsibility - as a society - do we have in dealing with it? What steps are reasonable and which are not?
I'd like to see Rock take a swing at these questions, in particular.
You could argue that the lottery is a tax on the poor and uneducated as well, but no one wants to get rid of that...it funds schools, it's a good thing in a sense and a bad thing. The same could be said for soda...it's a moment of pleasure in one sense, but bad for you.
Should the fact that the poor would be affected more adversely by a tax trump the fact that diabetes also affects the poor more than the well-off and educated? Is livelihood more important than health?
1) Is obesity a public health crisis, on that impinges not just directly on the obese but on the rest of society through any variety of costs?
We'll find out in a few weeks if the healthcare legislation gets overturned. I want to say no. Insurers can charge a fatty premium and be done with it.
2) If it is, what responsibility - as a society - do we have in dealing with it? What steps are reasonable and which are not?
I definitely think that there should be a strong emphasis on proper nutrition in public schools. Beyond that, I'm quite okay with letting people be free to do what they want to do and accept whatever consequences come attached.
all that starbucks bullshit is much more expensive than soda and has much less of an effect on the average americans diet. last time i checked soda was the biggest source of calories in the average american diet. Soda!!!! people dont want a nanny state when it comes to their lack of self control and shit personal habits but they will most certainly run to nanny when it comes time to pay health bills. typical bullshit philosophy that has ruined our environment and economy....privatize profit (or pleasure) and socialize the costs
Your Starbucks defense is weak.
No it's not. How many people are getting obese on weird coffee drinks?
Excellent question. My guess is a lot more than we think. And more and more everyday as these drinks become a daily habit for more and more people.
2007 stat was soda's account for 10% of calories in the average american diet.
soda is dirt cheap...partially because corn subsidies (sacred cow of every farm bill) allow junkfood and soda manufacturers to sweeten their products for practically nothing. we are already using our taxpayer dollars to make this crap cheap and ubiquitous. either restructure the subsidies (politically impossible) or tax soda to raise money for preventative health measures: k-12 & adult education, healthy food access, etc
the argument that a tax on soda is a tax on the poor is boooooooooooolshitttt. like hookup said, diabetes is a tax on the poor too...much bmore significant than whatever spare change gets added to the price of a liter bottle. the people getting hurt are the processed food manufacturers whose products will get further branded as unhealthy and will be (barely) less affordable.
This repeats a point made earlier but going after beverage size is MUCH easier than trying to get the corn subsidy repealed. The latter, if it were to happen, would jack up the cost of corn syrup and that cascading effect would likely increase the cost of sodas as well. The difference is which approach is more politically feasible.
I definitely think that there should be a strong emphasis on proper nutrition in public schools.
If I recall your answer to the financial crisis was more financial education in public schools.
Both ideas are good, but you may be giving public schools too much credit in their ability to effect change.
Yeah brah, that was totally my sole answer, bro.
I'm just pinpointing where many disadvantaged youth can become educated on things they may not have. I advocate full disclosure and some sort of baseline knowledge so people are able to make informed decisions. I'd rather not assume that people are too stupid to make their own decisions and live with the results.
Why don't we just ban that shit instead if we really cared about people's health? Right now it only makes it more expensive for business owners and consumers with government taking a little rake on increased prices.
The worst part of this for me is, ya'll talking about what we as a society can do. What you can do is talk to the person you have a problem with. Tell your neighbor your born skinny always will be skinny ass thinks he should lose a few pounds, as you drive a few hours to a dusty basement you're going to spend the entire day in. Why the runaround with the law? Can't you tell that makes the situation worse? It's just laziness.
I have a feeling a lot of you avoid smokers and fat people like the plague. (and delete their posts)
Anecdotally speaking, I see a lot of obese people wilding out with the sugary Starbucks drinks. I don't have any statistics about chocofrappalattes versus Pepsi or whatever, but it's certainly an issue and will continue to grow as the drinks (and franchises) proliferate.
@Rob, I do avoid smokers like the plague. The smell makes me nauseous. I used to smoke, too.
Anecdotally speaking, I see a lot of obese people wilding out with the sugary Starbucks drinks. I don't have any statistics about chocofrappalattes versus Pepsi or whatever, but it's certainly an issue and will continue to grow as the drinks (and franchises) proliferate.
@Rob, I do avoid smokers like the plague. The smell makes me nauseous. I used to smoke, too.
I don't know where to start. You clearly hate fat people as an ambiguous group and feel self righteous about your decision to quit smoking.
Anecdotally speaking, I see a lot of obese people wilding out with the sugary Starbucks drinks. I don't have any statistics about chocofrappalattes versus Pepsi or whatever, but it's certainly an issue and will continue to grow as the drinks (and franchises) proliferate.
@Rob, I do avoid smokers like the plague. The smell makes me nauseous. I used to smoke, too.
I don't know where to start. You clearly hate fat people as an ambiguous group and feel self righteous about your decision to quit smoking.
When I quit smoking it wasn't because how expensive it had gotten. They kept raising the price and I kept buying. Ive never met anybody who got skinny because being fat was just too damn expensive.
A tax on soda is a tax on the poor and uneducated. Anyone with decent income will likely not feel the effect. Poor people will and they're doubly fucked if they're uneducated in nutritional matters and therefore completely addicted to soda without knowing how bad it is for them.
education is the key
a list of some of those ingredients would maybe cause some to pause,
maybe those cig style warnings on the soda
corporations & lobbyists have an unfair influence on public health policies
Comments
I remember those, righteous mom unpacking the grocery bag and shaking the receipt in her fist...
If I'm not mistaken, it's politically much easier to pass a law limiting the size of the containers than it is to slap on a new tax.
Your Starbucks defense is weak.
That stuff needs to face the same restrictions you would put on soda.
Otherwise you are saying protect the poor from themselves, but the rich should be able to do what they want.
Starbucks is the new Coke. Kids are drinking it daily. Starbucks may look all nice and Norman Rockwell now, but they are evil.
Also, energy drinks, sports drinks and flavored malt beverages... And what ever they think up tomorrow.
I'm not saying I am for or against a ban/tax/regulations, but if you are going to do it treat all high caloric drinks the same.*
*Single ingredient 100% fruit juice gets a pass.
No it's not. How many people are getting obese on weird coffee drinks? This bill is designed to curb obesity, not mete out social justice.
There are a shocking number of people who drink a gallon or more of soda a day - nobody is drinking two gallons of frappucinos a day.
On a recent trip to the states I was shocked at how massive the coffee options were.
If you need a caffeine hit, this is all you need:
This is just ridiculous and the sugar high is probably greater than whatever caffeine you get out of it.
I'm living this right at the moment since I literally just got in my glucose test from this morning and I'm prediabetic. Among other things, that means I need to try to both drop 15 lbs and start regular exercise. I, at least, have the luxury of time to do these things but it's not so simple for many others.
You do realize that the giant size mocha-whatever bullshit with whipped cream clocks in at over a thousand calories...which could mean over half your calories for the day depending on your size. I don't think the people drinking these things are counting them as half of their food for the day. They are contributing to unhealthy habits in a big way.
Was just listening to the NPR report on this soda issue and they were interviewing someone and the person was complaining about it and said something to the effect of "if we can't drink as much soda now, what are we supposed to drink?" in a very flabbergasted tone. Facepalm.
Sounds like you've got yourself a positive addiction, which is a very good thing according to William Glasser.
Remove anything off that list that has absolutely no adverse effect on society or other non-participating individuals.
Then think of what kind of law or tax can be implemented to discourage or pay for the adverse effects.
Call me when you need a rope to climb back up your slippery slope.
I agree with the first line but let's not get bogged down in this specific legislation.
The bigger questions are:
1) Is obesity a public health crisis, on that impinges not just directly on the obese but on the rest of society through any variety of costs?
2) If it is, what responsibility - as a society - do we have in dealing with it? What steps are reasonable and which are not?
I'd like to see Rock take a swing at these questions, in particular.
Should the fact that the poor would be affected more adversely by a tax trump the fact that diabetes also affects the poor more than the well-off and educated? Is livelihood more important than health?
I definitely think that there should be a strong emphasis on proper nutrition in public schools. Beyond that, I'm quite okay with letting people be free to do what they want to do and accept whatever consequences come attached.
If I recall your answer to the financial crisis was more financial education in public schools.
Both ideas are good, but you may be giving public schools too much credit in their ability to effect change.
Excellent question. My guess is a lot more than we think. And more and more everyday as these drinks become a daily habit for more and more people.
soda is dirt cheap...partially because corn subsidies (sacred cow of every farm bill) allow junkfood and soda manufacturers to sweeten their products for practically nothing. we are already using our taxpayer dollars to make this crap cheap and ubiquitous. either restructure the subsidies (politically impossible) or tax soda to raise money for preventative health measures: k-12 & adult education, healthy food access, etc
the argument that a tax on soda is a tax on the poor is boooooooooooolshitttt. like hookup said, diabetes is a tax on the poor too...much bmore significant than whatever spare change gets added to the price of a liter bottle. the people getting hurt are the processed food manufacturers whose products will get further branded as unhealthy and will be (barely) less affordable.
I laughed at this and the girlfriend asked what was funny. For some reason Strut humor escapes her, which is beyond me.
This is assuming 3x2's response was facetious.
I'm just pinpointing where many disadvantaged youth can become educated on things they may not have. I advocate full disclosure and some sort of baseline knowledge so people are able to make informed decisions. I'd rather not assume that people are too stupid to make their own decisions and live with the results.
Why don't we just ban that shit instead if we really cared about people's health? Right now it only makes it more expensive for business owners and consumers with government taking a little rake on increased prices.
Yeah, selling a $2 pack of cigarettes for $11 is a great way to help poor people and their addiction.
I have a feeling a lot of you avoid smokers and fat people like the plague. (and delete their posts)
@Rob, I do avoid smokers like the plague. The smell makes me nauseous. I used to smoke, too.
I don't know where to start. You clearly hate fat people as an ambiguous group and feel self righteous about your decision to quit smoking.
Ha! that's definitely what it is.
LET US BE FAT!!
education is the key
a list of some of those ingredients would maybe cause some to pause,
maybe those cig style warnings on the soda
corporations & lobbyists have an unfair influence on public health policies