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Abelton Q (tech-audio-R)

DuderonomyDuderonomy Haut de la Garenne 7,794 Posts
edited April 2010 in Strut Central
My set-up:Pristine breakbeat raer vinyls-->Stanton carts & needles-->Vestax 07Pro-->Audacity-->Abelton 5.6.6 (or something)I'd noticed my recordings sounded muddy as hell, and somebody told me to change the carts once I realised I haven't done so in ten+ years, and already a dramatic difference, which makes me wonder how much better it might sound with a better cartridge set-up; do Shures give the best soundquality in relation to money spent?Having listened to the WAV exported from Audacity*, I'm pleased with the results, however in Ableton, I notice it gets a bit tinny and loses some sound dynamics, and I remember reading somewhere on the innerwebs that the WARP function on Ableton tends to give sound clips a 'tinny sheen'. Is there any way to avoid this? Should I switch to cubase or fruitloops or something (I don't use Ableton for DJing, just making mixes, possibly production). *Audacity suggests exporting WAVs at 16bit rather than 32bit float. What should I export a WAV from Audacity to Abelton as? Will a 32bit float sound any different than 16bit when opened in Audacity?
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  • finelikewinefinelikewine "ONCE UPON A TIME, I HAD A VINYL." http://www.discogs.com/user/permabulker 1,416 Posts

    vinyls


  • DuderonomyDuderonomy Haut de la Garenne 7,794 Posts

    vinyls





  • jammyjammy remixing bongo rock... 813 Posts
    Turn warp off in the edit window down the bottom. Your sound card will play a big part! Do you have a decent one?
  • neil_somethingneil_something 993 Posts
    Your sound card will play a big part! Do you have a decent one?

    This.

    (Soundblaster sound cards are not very good)
  • lefunkmoblefunkmob 28 Posts
    Soundcard and all related things aside, the audio engine of older versions of ableton especially with warp engaged sounds like shit. So for recording use something like wavelab(pc), audacity, peak(mac) or cubase or at least turn warp of and never ever forget that!

    When you use ableton then record in 44.1Khz even if your interface support higher samplerates. The samplerate-conversion is mad shitty in older versions of ableton(do you see a pattern here).
  • DuderonomyDuderonomy Haut de la Garenne 7,794 Posts
    Do later versions of Ableton sound better when you use the Warp function?

  • DuderonomyDuderonomy Haut de la Garenne 7,794 Posts
    Turn warp off in the edit window down the bottom. Your sound card will play a big part! Do you have a decent one?

    No warping? Urghh. That makes a lot of things... easier (creating loops from funk records that are on beat for instance). I guess I could un-warp everything, and chop the shit out of clips and stuff, but that could really slow things down.

    My sound blaster looks like this (although possible blue if memory serves correct)

  • lefunkmoblefunkmob 28 Posts

    Do later versions of Ableton sound better when you use the Warp function?


    (crack-ed-versions floating around anywhere?)

    yes & (*ahem* *cough* yes *cough*)

    Version 7 already was a big upgrade and 8 is even better.
  • DuderonomyDuderonomy Haut de la Garenne 7,794 Posts

    Oh...

























    pm'd.
  • DuderonomyDuderonomy Haut de la Garenne 7,794 Posts
    Your sound card will play a big part! Do you have a decent one?

    This.

    (Soundblaster sound cards are not very good)

    Neil, can you recommend a good sound card? Doesn't have to be top-of-the-line as I'm not DJing with it, does need to be USB/laptop rather than a, uhmm, the other type... ideally something I might be able to pick up second-hand or something.
  • neil_somethingneil_something 993 Posts
    if you're hoping to get something cheap or second hand i would suggest one of the m-audio soundcards...

    something like this (although this appears to be firewire rather than usb): http://www.dv247.com/computer-hardware/m...nterface--57220

    essentially you should look for something that has good digital converters. apogee cards have a very good reputation but they are either very expensive or mac only.
  • DuderonomyDuderonomy Haut de la Garenne 7,794 Posts

    Something like this then?

    http://www.dv247.com/computer-hardware/cakewalk-ua-25ex--69236
  • BeatnicholasBeatnicholas 1,005 Posts
    tbh i've never been that fond of the sound of the ableton engine. the dither is not that nice sounding to my ear. i know some people that get good results using it in timeline mode pure as a recorder in its own right. (ie don't use clip mode, don't record with audacity, just record straight into ableton in the timeline view).
  • BeatnicholasBeatnicholas 1,005 Posts
    also the vestax as good as it is for mixing tends to add a lot of distortion as you layer samples. your better off buying a project turntable and a preamp box that you record through. i find that when i sample off the project i get less rumble and better harmonics at the top.
  • DuderonomyDuderonomy Haut de la Garenne 7,794 Posts
    tbh i've never been that fond of the sound of the ableton engine. the dither is not that nice sounding to my ear. i know some people that get good results using it in timeline mode pure as a recorder in its own right. (ie don't use clip mode, don't record with audacity, just record straight into ableton in the timeline view).

    Eh? You can record into Abelton? Didn't know that, or is this later versions?

    A friend said he can give me a copy of Abelton 7, and said that personally he thought they made too many (unecessary) changes to version 8, but if you can record with 7 I'll give that a go.

    Project turntable? Is this a brand, or a type of turntable?
  • doomdoom 305 Posts
    tbh i've never been that fond of the sound of the ableton engine. the dither is not that nice sounding to my ear. i know some people that get good results using it in timeline mode pure as a recorder in its own right. (ie don't use clip mode, don't record with audacity, just record straight into ableton in the timeline view).

    Eh? You can record into Abelton? Didn't know that, or is this later versions?

    A friend said he can give me a copy of Abelton 7, and said that personally he thought they made too many (unecessary) changes to version 8, but if you can record with 7 I'll give that a go.

    Project turntable? Is this a brand, or a type of turntable?

    Im having the same problem with the Live engine, but I do all my work in Live now. Just too many advantages that would make it stupid to produce in any other platform for me. I chop all my breaks and sounds to the samplers. Leaving all sounds unaltered by the live "engine". Using it more like a classic sequencer. But with the benefit of the other functions for sample selection etc. I have stepped up my game so many levels this year thanks to Live. Dont think I could have developed as fast as a songwriter, arranger, mixer and whatnot on any other platform.
  • DuderonomyDuderonomy Haut de la Garenne 7,794 Posts
    tbh i've never been that fond of the sound of the ableton engine. the dither is not that nice sounding to my ear. i know some people that get good results using it in timeline mode pure as a recorder in its own right. (ie don't use clip mode, don't record with audacity, just record straight into ableton in the timeline view).


    Im having the same problem with the Live engine, but I do all my work in Live now. Just too many advantages that would make it stupid to produce in any other platform for me. I chop all my breaks and sounds to the samplers. Leaving all sounds unaltered by the live "engine".

    Dumb questions: how do you do this? Are you talking about using a different program to chop and arrange samples, and then import the loops/arrangements into Abelton?


    Using it more like a classic sequencer. But with the benefit of the other functions for sample selection etc. I have stepped up my game so many levels this year thanks to Live. Dont think I could have developed as fast as a songwriter, arranger, mixer and whatnot on any other platform.

    I agree that it's a great program, so would be keen to deal with any annoying sound issues rather than switch to, say, cubase or reason.
  • BeatnicholasBeatnicholas 1,005 Posts
    duder, you press tab so that it switches views. then you just do everything in there, it behaves more like cubase.

    its a powerful program, i guess all these things are about what works for you.
  • jammyjammy remixing bongo rock... 813 Posts
    Insert warp markers across drum transients, right click, slice to new midi track. Bingo. YouTube is your friend
  • DuderonomyDuderonomy Haut de la Garenne 7,794 Posts

    OK, will check that out.

    RE: Sound cards - Professional Audio Interface E-Mu 0404 Usb

    any good for ?100 secondhand?
  • doomdoom 305 Posts
    Insert warp markers across drum transients, right click, slice to new midi track. Bingo. YouTube is your friend

    wrd.. and when in arrangement view you can just record samples, select parts you want a sample of, and drag it to the sampler. leaving out the need for wavelab, sound forge or similiar applications.
  • E_DailyE_Daily 812 Posts
    A good a/d converter is key here.
    Also when doing Ableton style editing and everything live on the fly it helps when the card is able to operate smoothly at low latency.

    This means that when you trigger drums or vsti via midi your soundcard will play it within a "few" ms.

    Good for productions are values at and below 256 ms

    I used to tell people to look at the m-audio stuff for budget. I havn't been looking at the market in years though. Not sure if I'm still up to the times

    Check for compability too.
    Sometimes it helps to comb the net for users that are running a stable system and are happy with it.
    Confident is the grown man buying way
  • spelunkspelunk 3,400 Posts
    I would not buy a single m-audio product.

    Ableton + NI Maschine is the truth and with the new versions it is finally working full steam for me just as I get ready to move.

    The problems arise when people try to mix and master in Ableton which is just misguided.
  • E_DailyE_Daily 812 Posts
    Yeah I hear good things about maschine. It's a controller and software based device though. So comparing it to a sound card is senseless

    The m-audio driver windows are a bit strange but I know several people doing great music with their cards for years. Again, there might be much better stuff out there I'm not too familiar with as I went steep on a RME solution which has been probably the best computer related studio product I have ever bought. I havn't had to buy a new soundcard in over 6 years now apart from maybe a new pciE to keep up to date.

    But this is if youre ready to spend some stacks. I'm not telling you these two are the way to go, its just both systems that I see working on a daily basis instead of something I read online.
  • Mike_BellMike_Bell 5,736 Posts


    Ableton + NI Maschine is the truth and with the new versions it is finally working full steam for me just as I get ready to move.

    I would imagine that your workflow is lighting fast with Maschine linked up with Ableton (8?)
  • spelunkspelunk 3,400 Posts


    Ableton + NI Maschine is the truth and with the new versions it is finally working full steam for me just as I get ready to move.

    I would imagine that your workflow is lighting fast with Maschine linked up with Ableton (8?)

    Yeah, it works out quite nicely. Add the Serato Bridge and it becomes pretty phenomenal.

    As for soundcards the Apogee duet is the way to go for 2-in/2-out.
  • E_DailyE_Daily 812 Posts
    Great converters on the apogee too
  • BsidesBsides 4,244 Posts
    ableton is so nice! just picking it up now.

    I know Im late with it, but version 8 is crazy
  • jammyjammy remixing bongo rock... 813 Posts
    Don't upgrade to 8.1, as they have done alot of 'max for live' implementing and it seems to be causing issues for alot of people
  • DuderonomyDuderonomy Haut de la Garenne 7,794 Posts
    tbh i've never been that fond of the sound of the ableton engine. the dither is not that nice sounding to my ear. i know some people that get good results using it in timeline mode pure as a recorder in its own right. (ie don't use clip mode, don't record with audacity, just record straight into ableton in the timeline view).

    Had a stab at recording into Ableton, couldn't get anything nice from that. Worth a go though!
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