MVP canidates are allowed to slip, but need to recover.
It wasnt that he missed a free throw... he missed TWO BIG ONES, plus a picking up a tech, and playing pretty lackluster down the stretch.
I was in hyperbole mode last night, and these faults do not negate his performance this season. but all an all, MVPs dont f*k up like in a huge season game like last night.
I can't disagree. It was a huge game. But if Dirk makes one more FT than he missed in regulation and the Mavs win that makes him the MVP?
It's silly. If Nash is the MVP he's the MVP but last night shouldn't be the deciding factor.[/b]
agreed, but the "if dirk made one more ft" logic is kinda weak.
if nash was never traded, then this game wouldnt have been so big
agreed, but the "if dirk made one more ft" logic is kinda weak.
if nash was never traded, then this game wouldnt have been so big
I'm not putting it out there on some "we shoulda won business" I'm making a point about how fickle the process seems based on the points made by those who wish to discuss it. But call it weak if you will. It's just my opinion.
Nash wasn't traded. He was an FA. Phoenix offered him more money and more years and Mark Cuban declined to match.
agreed, but the "if dirk made one more ft" logic is kinda weak.
if nash was never traded, then this game wouldnt have been so big
I'm not putting it out there on some "we shoulda won business" I'm making a point about how fickle the process seems based on the points made by those who wish to discuss it. But call it weak if you will. It's just my opinion.
Nash wasn't traded. He was an FA. Phoenix offered him more money and more years and Mark Cuban declined to match.
oops... anyways, i think we are on the same side here.
Diop really has dropped about 100 lbs between two years ago in Cleveland and now. Kid's only 23 or so. He'll make a career out of being a defensive/rebounding center.
So, what, he was this guy 2 years ago?
I find that kinda hard to believe. Maybe 40-50 pounds, but well over 100? Maybe I'm wrong but that really sounded like a billwaltonism.
MVP canidates are allowed to slip, but need to recover.
It wasnt that he missed a free throw... he missed TWO BIG ONES, plus a picking up a tech, and playing pretty lackluster down the stretch.
I was in hyperbole mode last night, and these faults do not negate his performance this season. but all an all, MVPs dont f*k up like in a huge season game like last night.
I can't disagree. It was a huge game. But if Dirk makes one more FT than he missed in regulation and the Mavs win that makes him the MVP?
It's silly. If Nash is the MVP he's the MVP but last night shouldn't be the deciding factor.
If if if that's just it, he missed what was essentially the game winning shot, they lost the game, end of that argument. The truth is, Nash's stats just seemed more important in the game last night. Dirk made enough mistakes to take away from his performance, while Nash contiunually made plays to keep his team in the game when it counted all night long from free throws to assists to huge defensive plays and rebounds to 3's to layups. That is the difference in that game specifically, fuck a box score. Now, I still think Dirk and Nash are both probable candidates for the title of Most Valuable Player this season and the season isn't over. In fact, Dirk has a lot of tough games coming up right away that he can use to recover from his mistakes last night. If Dirk has one of those amazing performances that we all expect from him against the Pistons, then he saves face a bit. We'll see whats up on Sunday. Same goes for Nash, he has to continue to play at that pace for the rest of the season to compete for the MVP with Dirk. It's not over yet, and to answer your question, if Dirk improves, yes, we can all retract our idea that Nash should be the MVP. But based on last night's big game (biggest game of the regular season?), which is always a great look at things like MVP candidates, it is clear that based on their performance in this high pressure situation, Nash is the most valuable player to his team. Last night wasn't a deciding factor by any means, but it certainly did help put some things into perspective!
Diop really has dropped about 100 lbs between two years ago in Cleveland and now. Kid's only 23 or so. He'll make a career out of being a defensive/rebounding center.
So, what, he was this guy 2 years ago?
I find that kinda hard to believe. Maybe 40-50 pounds, but well over 100? Maybe I'm wrong but that really sounded like a billwaltonism.
I don't know, that guy is sitting down, is he 7'1"? Did you see Diop when he played for the Cavs? It's not a stretch to say he weighed 370 back then.
As to your other long response on the "if if if" tip I think you've missed my point but it's not worth going into. The general feeling I get when I read articles or posts on here is that very very few outside of Mavs fans really root for or appreciate Dirk's game, and furthermore relish when he comes up short and attendantly over-magnify his shortcomings. See Mavs/Suns game 2. That game was as well-played and entertaining as last night's, and Dirk hit the game-winner and it garnered all of 3 or 4 posts.
Lessons From Suns-Mavs Posted by Mike McAllister So what did we learn from the NBA's best game of this season, the Suns' 129-127 double-OT thriller that broke the Mavericks' 23-game home winning streak?
1. The West isn't over yet
Yes, the Mavs still own a 2??-game lead, and they still have a slightly easier schedule than the Suns in the final month of the season (Phoenix has a killer April with games against the Mavs, Spurs, Jazz and Rockets and two against the Lakers). And as Suns coach Mike D'Antoni points out, the Mavs may not even lose enough games the rest of the season to even give his team a chance at catching up. Still, by losing Wednesday night, the Mavs blew the opportunity to go 4?? games up and secure the tiebreaker against the Suns. And Phoenix has already shown it can get hot for long stretches at a time. "We still have the best record, but that could change quick," Mavs star Dirk Nowitzki told reporters after the game. "In the NBA, three games is nothing. That's just one week."
2. The MVP race isn't over yet
Not that it was already decided going into the game, but Nowitzki might have sealed the deal had he outdueled his friend Steve Nash and led the Mavs to victory. Instead, it was the two-time defending MVP who was more impressive, particularly in crunch time (10 points in the final minute of regulation, including the key 3-pointer to send it into OT). Yes, voting should not be based on one game, but let's be honest -- some of those undecided voters leaning Nowitzki's way may have been swayed toward Nash's direction. Or if nothing else, they must pause for further thought, if only because ...
3. Nowitzki isn't over his crunch-time missteps
My SI.com colleague Marty Burns, in analyzing the MVP race, says Nowitzki makes as many clutch shots as Nash. Perhaps that's true -- but being a crunch-time performer doesn't solely consist of nailing jumpers when the pressure's on. Consider Nash's key steal on Wednesday, as well as drawing the foul on Josh Howard that led to three free throws in the final minute of regulation. Now compare that to Nowitzki's inability to draw the foul on Shawn Marion on the game's final shot in double-OT (why did he fall away on the shot instead of leaning in?), or missing two key free throws down the stretch in regulation. To be sure, Nowitzki comes up big more times than not, but the image of his missed free throw with 3.4 seconds left in Game 3 of last year's NBA Finals still lingers. Perhaps only when he leads the Mavs to a title will it disappear.
4. Amar?? Stoudemire is officially the X-factor in the playoffs
Coming into Wednesday's game, Stoudemire had averaged just over 14 points in his last four games. Then he goes for 41 points on 16-of-19 shooting in Dallas, making the Mavs' defense look like it had returned to its Nellie days. Considering Stoudemire wasn't on the court in last year's playoffs, his ability to go off in a given game will be in the minds of every opponent. Even if Dallas holds on and hosts a Game 7 against the Suns this year, Stoudemire could make any home-court advantage obsolete.
5. The Mavs shouldn't feel too discouraged
The Suns made a bold statement by winning, but the Mavs can take solace in the fact that they turned a 16-point deficit into a 15-point lead with an amazing third quarter. And they did this without Devin Harris (injured in the first half) and Devean George (out with a sore knee). And that the Suns needed a monster game from Stoudemire, a fortunate long rebound off a Nash missed 3-pointer (credit to Marion for the hustle play) and double-OT just to subdue the home team. And that, when healthy, the Mavs still have a deeper bench. Still, a nagging feeling remains that the Mavs -- despite their best-in-NBA record, all their win streaks this season and all the chemistry that head coach Avery Johnson has developed -- remain inconsistent when it comes to closing out big games. Fortunately, they have a chance at redemption on ...
6. April 1, the biggest game of the regular season?
Dallas at Phoenix. Home-court advantage could be on the line in what has quickly turned into the NBA's best rivalry. It helps that both teams are highly entertaining, along with the Nowitzki-Nash MVP subplot. But will it be the last time the two teams meet this season? The Spurs, who should finish with the third seed, are back in championship-type form and will be a major roadblock for the second seed in the conference semifinals. And neither the Jazz nor Rockets will be pushovers in the other semi.
Diop really has dropped about 100 lbs between two years ago in Cleveland and now. Kid's only 23 or so. He'll make a career out of being a defensive/rebounding center.
So, what, he was this guy 2 years ago?
I find that kinda hard to believe. Maybe 40-50 pounds, but well over 100? Maybe I'm wrong but that really sounded like a billwaltonism.
I don't know, that guy is sitting down, is he 7'1"? Did you see Diop when he played for the Cavs? It's not a stretch to say he weighed 370 back then.
As to your other long response on the "if if if" tip I think you've missed my point but it's not worth going into. The general feeling I get when I read articles or posts on here is that very very few outside of Mavs fans really root for or appreciate Dirk's game, and furthermore relish when he comes up short and attendantly over-magnify his shortcomings. See Mavs/Suns game 2. That game was as well-played and entertaining as last night's, and Dirk hit the game-winner and it garnered all of 3 or 4 posts.
As to your other long response on the "if if if" tip I think you've missed my point but it's not worth going into. The general feeling I get when I read articles or posts on here is that very very few outside of Mavs fans really root for or appreciate Dirk's game, and furthermore relish when he comes up short and attendantly over-magnify his shortcomings. See Mavs/Suns game 2. That game was as well-played and entertaining as last night's, and Dirk hit the game-winner and it garnered all of 3 or 4 posts.
I hear ya man, I think your gripes are somewhat justified in some cases, but come on, there's a LOT of Dirk Nowitzki fans and supporters all over the world. True fans of the game appreciate the guy to no end and anybody else's opinion shouldn't matter a bit to you. Last night's game garnered a little bit more attention due to the fact that it's later in the season, and not only that, but the first time in 35 years that 2 teams went head to head with records this good after 60 games.
And honestly, I don't think peoples' distaste for Dirk is genuine, I think it's often to spite Mavs fans, haha. Dirk is great, nobody can deny that. If they try, they're just talking shit. Anyway, Sunday's game is gonna be a good one, can't wait. See if your dude can bring it back to the essence.
And let me just say this, what's more important to you, Mavs winning a Championship or Dirk getting MVP? I'd just let it happen the way it's gonna happen and focus on the success of the team. Nash is obviously going to have an edge over Dirk simply because he was MVP the last two years and has somehow improved yet again this year.
How does Amare Stoudemire not average 40 ppg? The way he was stickin 18-20 footers last night was scary. I saw he'd had some lackluster games leading up to last night. Does he stay in foul trouble? It seemed it was going that way early last night but not so eventually.
I could see that dood absolutely running the league in 3-4 years.
How does Amare Stoudemire not average 40 ppg? The way he was stickin 18-20 footers last night was scary. I saw he'd had some lackluster games leading up to last night. Does he stay in foul trouble? It seemed it was going that way early last night but not so eventually.
I could see that dood absolutely running the league in 3-4 years.
He usually is pretty good with fouls. Technicals on the other hand .... I think he's second in the league right now. The reason he doesn't score 40 is because they want to spread the ball around, and when he was missing a lot of role players developed nicely into opportunistic scorers for them. I think for the Suns it's not who scores a lot of points, but rather how quickly they can. I think their Coach wants them to score within 11 seconds.
my only complaint for amare if you can even call it that is he should be avergaing like 11-13 boards a game. but seriously that guy is a beast and he's what like 90% healthy?
How does Amare Stoudemire not average 40 ppg? The way he was stickin 18-20 footers last night was scary. I saw he'd had some lackluster games leading up to last night. Does he stay in foul trouble? It seemed it was going that way early last night but not so eventually.
I could see that dood absolutely running the league in 3-4 years.
He usually is pretty good with fouls. Technicals on the other hand .... I think he's second in the league right now. The reason he doesn't score 40 is because they want to spread the ball around, and when he was missing a lot of role players developed nicely into opportunistic scorers for them. I think for the Suns it's not who scores a lot of points, but rather how quickly they can. I think their Coach wants them to score within 11 seconds.
Pretty much. I think the Suns learned a lesson from when the Spurs beat them in the playoffs by letting Amare go off while focusing on keeping a lid on everybody else.
He usually is pretty good with fouls. Technicals on the other hand .... I think he's second in the league right now. The reason he doesn't score 40 is because they want to spread the ball around, and when he was missing a lot of role players developed nicely into opportunistic scorers for them. I think for the Suns it's not who scores a lot of points, but rather how quickly they can. I think their Coach wants them to score within 11 seconds.
Pretty much. I think the Suns learned a lesson from when the Spurs beat them in the playoffs by letting Amare go off while focusing on keeping a lid on everybody else.
Well he seemingly owns the Mavs going back to that performance during the playoff loss the first Nash Suns year. Mavs actually did a good job of holding down the other Suns besides Nash and Amare. Those cats wouldn't be denied last night though.
The most concerning aspect to the game as a Mavs fan was the fact that they couldn't put the kill-shot on another big opponent. Health and chemistry heading into May is the key other than MVPs and 70 wins. But then those are the things you think about in a long regular season.
big detroit games this weekend. My bet is the pistons lose to the mavs, but not to the suns, just cause we have a terrible record at home.
but im stoked for tonite
Right on. Dug this Roscoe quote from yesterday's Daily Dime:
Quote of the Day "I'm not scared of nobody. They should be scared of us."[/b] -- Detroit forward Rasheed Wallace, whose team improved to 4-0 on a five-game road trip that ends at Phoenix on Friday. Then it's home to play the Mavericks.
big detroit games this weekend. My bet is the pistons lose to the mavs, but not to the suns, just cause we have a terrible record at home.
but im stoked for tonite
Right on. Dug this Roscoe quote from yesterday's Daily Dime:
Quote of the Day "I'm not scared of nobody. They should be scared of us."[/b] -- Detroit forward Rasheed Wallace, whose team improved to 4-0 on a five-game road trip that ends at Phoenix on Friday. Then it's home to play the Mavericks.
Rasheed on returning to Portland: ???They???re going to boo me; I love it,??? he said. ???I wish little Napoleon didn???t make that rule because I???d be carrying that belt back in there.??? Napoleon is commissioner David Stern, who requested the Pistons refrain from bringing their 2004 championship belts, which Wallace designed and purchased for every member of the 2004 team, into road arenas
i loved that one postgame interview where he just said 'both teams played hard' hahaha that shit had me rolling! i believe he was fined for that by the league which was pretty bullshit since his statement was true.
cant wait until what he pulls out next
interviewer: sheed, what do you think attributed to your team losing tonite?
sheed: well, the other team scored more points then us.
interviewer: what do you think you and your team needs to do the next time?
sheed: we need to score more points then them.
interviewer: anything you can take from this game?
Comments
agreed, but the "if dirk made one more ft" logic is kinda weak.
if nash was never traded, then this game wouldnt have been so big
I'm not putting it out there on some "we shoulda won business" I'm making a point about how fickle the process seems based on the points made by those who wish to discuss it. But call it weak if you will. It's just my opinion.
Nash wasn't traded. He was an FA. Phoenix offered him more money and more years and Mark Cuban declined to match.
oops... anyways, i think we are on the same side here.
So, what, he was this guy 2 years ago?
I find that kinda hard to believe. Maybe 40-50 pounds, but well over 100? Maybe I'm wrong but that really sounded like a billwaltonism.
If if if that's just it, he missed what was essentially the game winning shot, they lost the game, end of that argument. The truth is, Nash's stats just seemed more important in the game last night. Dirk made enough mistakes to take away from his performance, while Nash contiunually made plays to keep his team in the game when it counted all night long from free throws to assists to huge defensive plays and rebounds to 3's to layups. That is the difference in that game specifically, fuck a box score. Now, I still think Dirk and Nash are both probable candidates for the title of Most Valuable Player this season and the season isn't over. In fact, Dirk has a lot of tough games coming up right away that he can use to recover from his mistakes last night. If Dirk has one of those amazing performances that we all expect from him against the Pistons, then he saves face a bit. We'll see whats up on Sunday. Same goes for Nash, he has to continue to play at that pace for the rest of the season to compete for the MVP with Dirk. It's not over yet, and to answer your question, if Dirk improves, yes, we can all retract our idea that Nash should be the MVP. But based on last night's big game (biggest game of the regular season?), which is always a great look at things like MVP candidates, it is clear that based on their performance in this high pressure situation, Nash is the most valuable player to his team. Last night wasn't a deciding factor by any means, but it certainly did help put some things into perspective!
I don't know, that guy is sitting down, is he 7'1"? Did you see Diop when he played for the Cavs? It's not a stretch to say he weighed 370 back then.
As to your other long response on the "if if if" tip I think you've missed my point but it's not worth going into. The general feeling I get when I read articles or posts on here is that very very few outside of Mavs fans really root for or appreciate Dirk's game, and furthermore relish when he comes up short and attendantly over-magnify his shortcomings. See Mavs/Suns game 2. That game was as well-played and entertaining as last night's, and Dirk hit the game-winner and it garnered all of 3 or 4 posts.
Lessons From Suns-Mavs
Posted by Mike McAllister
So what did we learn from the NBA's best game of this season, the Suns' 129-127 double-OT thriller that broke the Mavericks' 23-game home winning streak?
1. The West isn't over yet
Yes, the Mavs still own a 2??-game lead, and they still have a slightly easier schedule than the Suns in the final month of the season (Phoenix has a killer April with games against the Mavs, Spurs, Jazz and Rockets and two against the Lakers). And as Suns coach Mike D'Antoni points out, the Mavs may not even lose enough games the rest of the season to even give his team a chance at catching up. Still, by losing Wednesday night, the Mavs blew the opportunity to go 4?? games up and secure the tiebreaker against the Suns. And Phoenix has already shown it can get hot for long stretches at a time. "We still have the best record, but that could change quick," Mavs star Dirk Nowitzki told reporters after the game. "In the NBA, three games is nothing. That's just one week."
2. The MVP race isn't over yet
Not that it was already decided going into the game, but Nowitzki might have sealed the deal had he outdueled his friend Steve Nash and led the Mavs to victory. Instead, it was the two-time defending MVP who was more impressive, particularly in crunch time (10 points in the final minute of regulation, including the key 3-pointer to send it into OT). Yes, voting should not be based on one game, but let's be honest -- some of those undecided voters leaning Nowitzki's way may have been swayed toward Nash's direction. Or if nothing else, they must pause for further thought, if only because ...
3. Nowitzki isn't over his crunch-time missteps
My SI.com colleague Marty Burns, in analyzing the MVP race, says Nowitzki makes as many clutch shots as Nash. Perhaps that's true -- but being a crunch-time performer doesn't solely consist of nailing jumpers when the pressure's on. Consider Nash's key steal on Wednesday, as well as drawing the foul on Josh Howard that led to three free throws in the final minute of regulation. Now compare that to Nowitzki's inability to draw the foul on Shawn Marion on the game's final shot in double-OT (why did he fall away on the shot instead of leaning in?), or missing two key free throws down the stretch in regulation. To be sure, Nowitzki comes up big more times than not, but the image of his missed free throw with 3.4 seconds left in Game 3 of last year's NBA Finals still lingers. Perhaps only when he leads the Mavs to a title will it disappear.
4. Amar?? Stoudemire is officially the X-factor in the playoffs
Coming into Wednesday's game, Stoudemire had averaged just over 14 points in his last four games. Then he goes for 41 points on 16-of-19 shooting in Dallas, making the Mavs' defense look like it had returned to its Nellie days. Considering Stoudemire wasn't on the court in last year's playoffs, his ability to go off in a given game will be in the minds of every opponent. Even if Dallas holds on and hosts a Game 7 against the Suns this year, Stoudemire could make any home-court advantage obsolete.
5. The Mavs shouldn't feel too discouraged
The Suns made a bold statement by winning, but the Mavs can take solace in the fact that they turned a 16-point deficit into a 15-point lead with an amazing third quarter. And they did this without Devin Harris (injured in the first half) and Devean George (out with a sore knee). And that the Suns needed a monster game from Stoudemire, a fortunate long rebound off a Nash missed 3-pointer (credit to Marion for the hustle play) and double-OT just to subdue the home team. And that, when healthy, the Mavs still have a deeper bench. Still, a nagging feeling remains that the Mavs -- despite their best-in-NBA record, all their win streaks this season and all the chemistry that head coach Avery Johnson has developed -- remain inconsistent when it comes to closing out big games. Fortunately, they have a chance at redemption on ...
6. April 1, the biggest game of the regular season?
Dallas at Phoenix. Home-court advantage could be on the line in what has quickly turned into the NBA's best rivalry. It helps that both teams are highly entertaining, along with the Nowitzki-Nash MVP subplot. But will it be the last time the two teams meet this season? The Spurs, who should finish with the third seed, are back in championship-type form and will be a major roadblock for the second seed in the conference semifinals. And neither the Jazz nor Rockets will be pushovers in the other semi.
Jesus H. Christ Batmon, you're better than that.
Or maybe not. I'm discussing here.
I hear ya man, I think your gripes are somewhat justified in some cases, but come on, there's a LOT of Dirk Nowitzki fans and supporters all over the world. True fans of the game appreciate the guy to no end and anybody else's opinion shouldn't matter a bit to you. Last night's game garnered a little bit more attention due to the fact that it's later in the season, and not only that, but the first time in 35 years that 2 teams went head to head with records this good after 60 games.
And honestly, I don't think peoples' distaste for Dirk is genuine, I think it's often to spite Mavs fans, haha. Dirk is great, nobody can deny that. If they try, they're just talking shit. Anyway, Sunday's game is gonna be a good one, can't wait. See if your dude can bring it back to the essence.
And let me just say this, what's more important to you, Mavs winning a Championship or Dirk getting MVP? I'd just let it happen the way it's gonna happen and focus on the success of the team. Nash is obviously going to have an edge over Dirk simply because he was MVP the last two years and has somehow improved yet again this year.
One month to go and we shall see!
I could see that dood absolutely running the league in 3-4 years.
He usually is pretty good with fouls. Technicals on the other hand .... I think he's second in the league right now. The reason he doesn't score 40 is because they want to spread the ball around, and when he was missing a lot of role players developed nicely into opportunistic scorers for them. I think for the Suns it's not who scores a lot of points, but rather how quickly they can. I think their Coach wants them to score within 11 seconds.
Pretty much. I think the Suns learned a lesson from when the Spurs beat them in the playoffs by letting Amare go off while focusing on keeping a lid on everybody else.
Well he seemingly owns the Mavs going back to that performance during the playoff loss the first Nash Suns year. Mavs actually did a good job of holding down the other Suns besides Nash and Amare. Those cats wouldn't be denied last night though.
The most concerning aspect to the game as a Mavs fan was the fact that they couldn't put the kill-shot on another big opponent. Health and chemistry heading into May is the key other than MVPs and 70 wins. But then those are the things you think about in a long regular season.
(Hehehehhh...what this b*tch slappin' muhfracker DON'T know is that I'm spreading muscle-freezing ointment aaalll over him...)
[muffled]"Good luck tonight, Kobe!" [/muffled]
but im stoked for tonite
"Yeah I'm actually pretty damned good, who knew?"
My man had the highest scoring game of his career and then beat it the next game.
3 in a row batches we're playing defense now and sharing the ball more!
Right on. Dug this Roscoe quote from yesterday's Daily Dime:
Quote of the Day
"I'm not scared of nobody. They should be scared of us."[/b] -- Detroit forward Rasheed Wallace, whose team improved to 4-0 on a five-game road trip that ends at Phoenix on Friday. Then it's home to play the Mavericks.
Rasheed on returning to Portland: ???They???re going to boo me; I love it,??? he said. ???I wish little Napoleon didn???t make that rule because I???d be carrying that belt back in there.??? Napoleon is commissioner David Stern, who requested the Pistons refrain from bringing their 2004 championship belts, which Wallace designed and purchased for every member of the 2004 team, into road arenas
sheeds got quotes for days
"Little Napoleon". It's funny cos it's true.
i loved that one postgame interview where he just said 'both teams played hard' hahaha that shit had me rolling! i believe he was fined for that by the league which was pretty bullshit since his statement was true.
cant wait until what he pulls out next
interviewer: sheed, what do you think attributed to your team losing tonite?
sheed: well, the other team scored more points then us.
interviewer: what do you think you and your team needs to do the next time?
sheed: we need to score more points then them.
interviewer: anything you can take from this game?
sheed: both teams played hard.
You can be very corny sometimes.
That was the point, and you missed it.
They'll probably win but it was ugly.
And Gerald Green is the Real Deal!!!!!!!
I knew this guy had hops and could dunk, but his jumpshot(with range) is unfuckwithable. Beautiful form and great extension.
At 21 this guy is a can't miss future All-Star and possible Superstar!!
Mark, droppin' don't the real!!!!!!!! haha. League-pass is a beauty isn't it? Haven't seen enough of Gerald Green to speak on him.