Whoa, take it easy. I know the guy and I wasn't even aware it made it east of Alamance County much less Australia. I am in no way entering this argument and have no desire to, that was just a question. I'm just asking because no one around here (his hometown) really checks him. If he's doing his thing overseas I'm glad for him.
Sorry man, but the vibe was lets diss the backpacking cunt from Oz.
Yeah tell Kaze he gets mad love down here. It's distributed by some mates of mine distro company that deals with all the stuff these guys on the board seem to dislike so much. The type of music that apparently died years ago. Ha! http://www.shogundist.com
This has to be one of the inane threads (and question asked) I've seen in a long time. I mean Ein, what does it really matter about the semantics b/t crunk and hip-hop? To me, it's just another permutation of the tired old, "there's rap and there's hip-hop" argument. What do these definitions matter at all?
But fuck it, since the question is asked: if you look at the evolution of hip-hop as both a musical form and street culture, crunk fits all the criteria you need, period.
And Idiotproof - I would agree that often times, people outside the U.S. have a better appreciation for American music than many Americans do. I might even as go as far to say that in some instances, they exhibit considerably better taste in American music than the average American. But the idea that the rest of the world is pursuing a hip-hop style that Americans have abandoned and that this style is more "real" is patent nonsense and frankly, an incredibly narrow worldview. If Lithuanians want to think they're keeping hip-hop alive because everyone in the States is up on crunk, that's pure illusion and far from being egalitarian, it's a form of elitism, basically saying, "we'll take and borrow the cultural styles we like but once we stop liking what you like, we're just going to claim that you've lost your way and stop borrowing." It's cool if you want to pick and chose but seriously, lose the moral authority.
This has to be one of the inane threads (and question asked) I've seen in a long time. I mean Ein, what does it really matter about the semantics b/t crunk and hip-hop? To me, it's just another permutation of the tired old, "there's rap and there's hip-hop" argument. What do these definitions matter at all?
But fuck it, since the question is asked: if you look at the evolution of hip-hop as both a musical form and street culture, crunk fits all the criteria you need, period.
And Idiotproof - I would agree that often times, people outside the U.S. have a better appreciation for American music than many Americans do. I might even as go as far to say that in some instances, they exhibit considerably better taste in American music than the average American. But the idea that the rest of the world is pursuing a hip-hop style that Americans have abandoned and that this style is more "real" is patent nonsense and frankly, an incredibly narrow worldview. If Lithuanians want to think they're keeping hip-hop alive because everyone in the States is up on crunk, that's pure illusion and far from being egalitarian, it's a form of elitism, basically saying, "we'll take and borrow the cultural styles we like but once we stop liking what you like, we're just going to claim that you've lost your way and stop borrowing." It's cool if you want to pick and chose but seriously, lose the moral authority.
I never once claimed any 'moral authority'. Now you are taking the words of the others against me. I was merely saying that the core fundamentals exist despite being repeatedly told that they are dead. How that can be misconstrued into me holding an arrogant viewpoint is ridiculous. Merely stating what exists. I never said it was more real just that there seems to be a loss of cultural values with some people. Maybe I do listen to people like Caz, Wise Intelligent, OC, Freddy Foxx, etc a bit too much, but they make a whole lot more sense to me than most. Don't go twisting my words or intent.
And for your information I don't speak for the entire world outside of the US.
Take the just posted Miami Bass thread, it died as quickly as it started. But wheres the love for that style on here?
y'all are too damn serious...y'all should do like me, post some bullshit and let's have fun out of it. Because when people get serious in here, it's looking ugly...real dumb like today's rap. I guess some people think they got some sort of "authority" due to their "position"...but please, let's keep it fun. Don't tell me people really care about such topics now. It would be sad.
Anyway, maybe we should have started by listing all the points that we currently agree on :
-hip-hop is dead
-we could care less about what is hip-hop and what's not
-anyone is entitled to their own opinion
-most people are lying when posting on Internet
-diggin' ain't shit compared to sex
feel free to add on...
PS : WHOOOOOOP THAT TRIIICK!!!
PS 2 I just finished two crunk remix for Universal...Thank you Jon. IF it wasn't for you, A&R wouldn't ask for shit.lol.
for all the traditionalists hating on crunk, mellow out... it's good, fun music (and NOT all "Tritoned out", lil Jon uses Moogs on alot of his stuff...)... the difference between crunk and "traditional" hip hop is like the difference between 50's jazz and 50's r&b. and i have both Hank Ballard and the Midniters AND Jackie MacLean in my record collection, ya know?
honestly, i got into crunk b/c i bought "put ya hood up" on the day it came out b/c the cover was dope and i knew Lil' Jon from his Capleton "wings of the morning" remix, which was STRAIGHT HIP HOP, fucking "hard to handle" sample and everything... and i loved it... that record sounds like a riot... ill...
as for the cats on here repping southern music and hating on nyc hip hop every moment, give it a rest... you have the foaming at the mouth zeal of the freshly converted... i.e. during the Rawkus thread i was amazed how many dudes were like "i used to own like the whole catalog and now it think it sucks". really? your taste was that different 6 years ago? for real? it's pretty obvious that the zeigiest right now is to be aggresively anti-intellectual, which is fine, but dudes sound like hip hop Chuck Klostermans when you start bashing "backpackers"... me feels you hate it b/c it reminds you of yourself...
This is real talk!!!
Big up the Triton AND the MPC Big up boomin' 808 kicks AND polish jazz loops Big up gettin' paid AND lurking in the underground Big up oversize white Ts AND trendy tracksuits Big up fat bootys AND skinny asses (OK, scratch that. Keep it chunky) Big up people who have consistent taste and don't hate on music they loved any amount of years ago.
And oh yeah:
Fuck the 'four elements' (or is it five now?). Don't canonize it, just do what you feel. Shit, it's just music???
Big up the Triton AND the MPC Big up boomin' 808 kicks AND polish jazz loops Big up gettin' paid AND lurking in the underground Big up oversize white Ts AND trendy tracksuits Big up fat bootys AND skinny asses (OK, scratch that. Keep it chunky) Big up people who have consistent taste and don't hate on music they loved any amount of years ago.
Yeah, let's love everything and have no opinion. Bloody foreigner...
BB: Hell yeah, I was a Swatch Watch breakdancer back in the 80's. When I grew up it was all about breakdancing, and that is one of the things that did to get in the fucking industry. Breakdancing is in my soul it is not something that goes a way. What is hip-hop without breakdancing. But to keep it real I don't compete any more my fucken' ass is too old.
BB: I have an album starring my group DSO which stands for Different Style Organization which is dropping August 26th. And I am producing an artist out of Australia. [hahahahaha I think this interview was actually done by DJ Sheep)
B: What are the first 3 things that come into your mind when you hear ???Australia????
BB: The first that comes to my mind is Reese/The Camillion, this Australian rapper that I am producing. #2nd is the Koala Bears. And #3rdly, The FUCKEN??? BIG ASS KANGAROOS. I am talking about the BIG REDS, not the ones in the Zoo???.
AND FINALLY, THE QUOTE EVERYBODY HAS BEEN WAITING FOR (via houstonsoreal)
Really to me, hip-hop is dead and gangsta rap is alive. You know what I mean? The hip-hop died with Biggie and Pac and Eazy and Trouble T-Roy and it died with Scott LaRock. Right now it???s all about gangsta rap and rap. It???s all about rap music and gangsta rap. Hip-hop is dead personally. There???s nobody making music like Run DMC. There???s nobody making music like Will Smith and Queen Latifah and Naughty by Nature back in the day and De La Soul. That was hip-hop to me. There might have been some cussing, but the story line was basically about dancing and partying. You know, like EPMD, you know what I mean? Gangsta rap, and rap music to me, the reason why I feel rap is what???s alive right now and not hip-hop because DOC said it straight for me in ???88 or ???89 when he said ???Rhythmic American Poetry, You may ask me, not many people know of me,??? so to me it???s all about Rhythmic American Poetry. We???re all black and from Africa, eventually somehow through the bloodlines, but it???s all about Rhythmic American Poetry. That???s what???s taking rap to one billion.
Hip Hop died twice? Three times, four, five? There's like a good 10 year gap between Scott La Rock dying & the others.
And who the fuck is Reese the Camillion?
So I'm to undertsand that the words of Bushwick have more credence over someone from the Bronx like Jazzy Jay who says that true hip hop is still alive. Hmm, interesting
Stein, does hip-hop have to involve sampling. peace, check....
paycheck, absolutely not. some of my fav hip hop classics are all drum machine. the reason i started this post is because i dont know about this music. i've only heard mike jones "back then" and it sounds like a sample to me. so i was wondering if i could produce this kind of music since it is so hot at the moment. i'm really sorry if CRUNK is a touchy subject to everyone. peace, stein. . .
Big up the Triton AND the MPC Big up boomin' 808 kicks AND polish jazz loops Big up gettin' paid AND lurking in the underground Big up oversize white Ts AND trendy tracksuits Big up fat bootys AND skinny asses (OK, scratch that. Keep it chunky) Big up people who have consistent taste and don't hate on music they loved any amount of years ago.
Yeah, let's love everything and have no opinion. Bloody foreigner...
Yessir, I'm just one big bucket of fuddyduddy love, and I got enough to go around. Group hug, anyone?
Stein, does hip-hop have to involve sampling. peace, check....
paycheck, absolutely not. some of my fav hip hop classics are all drum machine. the reason i started this post is because i dont know about this music. i've only heard mike jones "back then" and it sounds like a sample to me. so i was wondering if i could produce this kind of music since it is so hot at the moment. i'm really sorry if CRUNK is a touchy subject to everyone. peace, stein. . .
"Back Then," or any other Mike Jones cut = nothing to do with "crunk"
Stein, does hip-hop have to involve sampling. peace, check....
paycheck, absolutely not. some of my fav hip hop classics are all drum machine. the reason i started this post is because i dont know about this music. i've only heard mike jones "back then" and it sounds like a sample to me. so i was wondering if i could produce this kind of music since it is so hot at the moment. i'm really sorry if CRUNK is a touchy subject to everyone. peace, stein. . .
"Back Then," or any other Mike Jones cut = nothing to do with "crunk"
Something tells me you're joking.
if mike jones is not crunk i've been misinformed. only little john song i've heard is "yeah" by usher and it sounds exactly like going back to cali to me. peace, stein. .what about ying yang twins? can someone post a list of crunk artists/songs to check for?
Oh, and I would also like to add that these days there is a variety of ways to find sample based rhythmic music outside of just hip hop. So no need to fret and stuff.
I knew this girl named Heidi in the early '90s, she was cute, dating a rich old man, and driving a Caddy he gave her as a "present." She wore a Smiths shirt. It hurt to witness. Not as bad as when we got in her car (first time I saw a multi-disk CD changer) and she asked me, "Have you ever heard of Fugazi?" She proceeded to put on "Greed" and, yes, sing along. Completely void of irony.
Yes, but was this rich old man named Noam Chomsky?
Part of the problem here is that there is the specific musical style that is crunk. Then there's crunk as an all-purpose word that has become synonymous with "Southern rap" which has largely been fueled by crunk as all-purpose slang that non-rap folk think it's funny to say.
In other words, "crunk" has become the new "dope" or "fly" or "for shizzle my nizzle." This only contributes to the confusion because a lot of folks are hollering "crunk" but they're not always talking about the same thing.
I'm no expert but from what my more informed friends have told me: crunk is largely the creation of Lil Jon and as such, it should not be confused with other artists just b/c they're from the South. While Houston, Memphis, Miami, New Orleans, etc. all have highly visible regional scenes and sounds, none of these cities are associated with crunk even if artists out of these cities might be because they've recorded with Jon. I don't know if you can even say Atlanta is a "crunk city" considering how many artists out of there don't necessarily use the crunk sound but I'll let someone like Faux speak on this.
but bottomline, if you're talking about Southern rap, you can't presume that terms like "crunk" or "bounce" apply unless the song in question is actually crunk or bounce. That's like saying that Marley Marl and Mantronix made the same kind of beats just because they were both from New York.
if mike jones is not crunk i've been misinformed. only little john song i've heard is "yeah" by usher and it sounds exactly like going back to cali to me.
Stein - the main thing those two songs have in common is 1) loud horns and 2) a big fat 808 kick (and I'm not even sure "Yeah" has an 808). So really, it comes down to the horns. The drum programming - the very rhythmic essence - of the two songs are completely different. "Yeah" is, for example, considerably slower than "Going Back to Cali." I also think the former song is "looser" in feel and groove, whereas "Going back to Cali" is more hunched-shoulder. In some ways, I think "Going Back to Cali" has more in common with bounce but again, the rhythms there are quite distinct too.
I'm no expert but from what my more informed friends have told me: crunk is largely the creation of Lil Jon and as such, it should not be confused with other artists just b/c they're from the South. While Houston, Memphis, Miami, New Orleans, etc. all have highly visible regional scenes and sounds, none of these cities are associated with crunk even if artists out of these cities might be because they've recorded with Jon. I don't know if you can even say Atlanta is a "crunk city" considering how many artists out of there don't necessarily use the crunk sound but I'll let someone like Faux speak on this.
but bottomline, if you're talking about Southern rap, you can't presume that terms like "crunk" or "bounce" apply unless the song in question is actually crunk or bounce. That's like saying that Marley Marl and Mantronix made the same kind of beats just because they were both from New York.
Naw, no need for me to speak on it--you've got this exactly right. I don't think I'd use the word "crunk" as a genre tag for any artists besides Li'l Jon and his affiliates, and maybe some of the younger ATL artists that he's influenced, like Crime Mob.
And good call on the abuse of the word "bounce"--that's a specific regional form that most people not from New Orleans have never even heard.
I'm no expert but from what my more informed friends have told me: crunk is largely the creation of Lil Jon and as such, it should not be confused with other artists just b/c they're from the South. While Houston, Memphis, Miami, New Orleans, etc. all have highly visible regional scenes and sounds, none of these cities are associated with crunk even if artists out of these cities might be because they've recorded with Jon. I don't know if you can even say Atlanta is a "crunk city" considering how many artists out of there don't necessarily use the crunk sound but I'll let someone like Faux speak on this.
but bottomline, if you're talking about Southern rap, you can't presume that terms like "crunk" or "bounce" apply unless the song in question is actually crunk or bounce. That's like saying that Marley Marl and Mantronix made the same kind of beats just because they were both from New York.
Naw, no need for me to speak on it--you've got this exactly right. I don't think I'd use the word "crunk" as a genre tag for any artists besides Li'l Jon and his affiliates, and maybe some of the younger ATL artists that he's influenced, like Crime Mob.[/b]
And good call on the abuse of the word "bounce"--that's a specific regional form that most people not from New Orleans have never even heard.
Where are Crime Mob? THAT's the shit I want to hear!
And Idiotproof - I would agree that often times, people outside the U.S. have a better appreciation for American music than many Americans do. I might even as go as far to say that in some instances, they exhibit considerably better taste in American music than the average American. But the idea that the rest of the world is pursuing a hip-hop style that Americans have abandoned and that this style is more "real" is patent nonsense and frankly, an incredibly narrow worldview. If Lithuanians want to think they're keeping hip-hop alive because everyone in the States is up on crunk, that's pure illusion and far from being egalitarian, it's a form of elitism, basically saying, "we'll take and borrow the cultural styles we like but once we stop liking what you like, we're just going to claim that you've lost your way and stop borrowing." It's cool if you want to pick and chose but seriously, lose the moral authority.
Everytime I go overseas this kind of shit cracks me up. Everything they like is praised like "Its not that bling bling bullocks, real hip hop blah blah blah". I try to tell the people I meet out there that in America we really could give a fuck less about all that shit. Its doesn't matter how or what it is if its dope. I know its over simplified but it really comes down to that for me. I either like it or I don't. I don't give a fuck about if its keyboard music or if the dude studied under Melle Mel. All of that shit is irrelevant. I won't even start clowning on the "true school" hip hop of Europe. That's a whole nother thread.
Part of the problem here is that there is the specific musical style that is crunk. Then there's crunk as an all-purpose word that has become synonymous with "Southern rap" which has largely been fueled by crunk as all-purpose slang that non-rap folk think it's funny to say.
In other words, "crunk" has become the new "dope" or "fly" or "for shizzle my nizzle." This only contributes to the confusion because a lot of folks are hollering "crunk" but they're not always talking about the same thing.
I'm no expert but from what my more informed friends have told me: crunk is largely the creation of Lil Jon and as such, it should not be confused with other artists just b/c they're from the South. While Houston, Memphis, Miami, New Orleans, etc. all have highly visible regional scenes and sounds, none of these cities are associated with crunk even if artists out of these cities might be because they've recorded with Jon. I don't know if you can even say Atlanta is a "crunk city" considering how many artists out of there don't necessarily use the crunk sound but I'll let someone like Faux speak on this.
but bottomline, if you're talking about Southern rap, you can't presume that terms like "crunk" or "bounce" apply unless the song in question is actually crunk or bounce. That's like saying that Marley Marl and Mantronix made the same kind of beats just because they were both from New York.
to me crunk= chanted, shouting vocals, (usually about drinking , fucking, and getting rowdy), slow tempos, minor key progressions, fuzzed out moog basslines, heavy 808 kicks with nice programming...
tho what Oliver says is true, the "crunk" lines are pretty blurred... last time i was in atlanta a few years ago, i bought a buncha mix cd's (that i think i've lost since then... sigh...) and they would have Ying Yang Twins "say ay yi yi" (crunk) next to "gel and weave" (not crunk) by project pat...
to me anything lil jon produced from like 97-2001 is ground zero for crunk...
Comments
Yep, and because no one out here cares.... it was
A sideways graemlin would be dope, but even better would be
OUTTA POCKET
Sorry man, but the vibe was lets diss the backpacking cunt from Oz.
Yeah tell Kaze he gets mad love down here.
It's distributed by some mates of mine distro company that deals with all the stuff these guys on the board seem to dislike so much. The type of music that apparently died years ago. Ha!
http://www.shogundist.com
But fuck it, since the question is asked: if you look at the evolution of hip-hop as both a musical form and street culture, crunk fits all the criteria you need, period.
And Idiotproof - I would agree that often times, people outside the U.S. have a better appreciation for American music than many Americans do. I might even as go as far to say that in some instances, they exhibit considerably better taste in American music than the average American. But the idea that the rest of the world is pursuing a hip-hop style that Americans have abandoned and that this style is more "real" is patent nonsense and frankly, an incredibly narrow worldview. If Lithuanians want to think they're keeping hip-hop alive because everyone in the States is up on crunk, that's pure illusion and far from being egalitarian, it's a form of elitism, basically saying, "we'll take and borrow the cultural styles we like but once we stop liking what you like, we're just going to claim that you've lost your way and stop borrowing." It's cool if you want to pick and chose but seriously, lose the moral authority.
I never once claimed any 'moral authority'. Now you are taking the words of the others against me. I was merely saying that the core fundamentals exist despite being repeatedly told that they are dead. How that can be misconstrued into me holding an arrogant viewpoint is ridiculous. Merely stating what exists. I never said it was more real just that there seems to be a loss of cultural values with some people. Maybe I do listen to people like Caz, Wise Intelligent, OC, Freddy Foxx, etc a bit too much, but they make a whole lot more sense to me than most. Don't go twisting my words or intent.
And for your information I don't speak for the entire world outside of the US.
Take the just posted Miami Bass thread, it died as quickly as it started. But wheres the love for that style on here?
Anyway, maybe we should have started by listing all the points that we currently agree on :
-hip-hop is dead
-we could care less about what is hip-hop and what's not
-anyone is entitled to their own opinion
-most people are lying when posting on Internet
-diggin' ain't shit compared to sex
feel free to add on...
PS : WHOOOOOOP THAT TRIIICK!!!
PS 2 I just finished two crunk remix for Universal...Thank you Jon.
This is real talk!!!
Big up the Triton AND the MPC
Big up boomin' 808 kicks AND polish jazz loops
Big up gettin' paid AND lurking in the underground
Big up oversize white Ts AND trendy tracksuits
Big up fat bootys AND skinny asses (OK, scratch that. Keep it chunky)
Big up people who have consistent taste and don't hate on music they loved any amount of years ago.
And oh yeah:
Fuck the 'four elements' (or is it five now?).
Don't canonize it, just do what you feel. Shit, it's just music???
I thought this was Black Sabbath
Yeah, let's love everything and have no opinion. Bloody foreigner...
BB: Hell yeah, I was a Swatch Watch breakdancer back in the 80's. When I grew up it was all about breakdancing, and that is one of the things that did to get in the fucking industry. Breakdancing is in my soul it is not something that goes a way. What is hip-hop without breakdancing. But to keep it real I don't compete any more my fucken' ass is too old.
___________________________________________________________
BB: I have an album starring my group DSO which stands for Different Style Organization which is dropping August 26th. And I am producing an artist out of Australia. [hahahahaha I think this interview was actually done by DJ Sheep)
______________________________________________________________
B: Who are your top 5 favorite rappers of all time?
BB: LL Cool J, KRS-1, Dr. Dre, Snoop Dogg and Chuck D.
B: Who are the best gangsta rappers of all time?
BB: Ice T, Too Short, N.W.A., Naughty By Nature and KRS-1
______________________________________________________________
B: What are the first 3 things that come into your mind when you hear ???Australia????
BB: The first that comes to my mind is Reese/The Camillion, this Australian rapper that I am producing. #2nd is the Koala Bears. And #3rdly, The FUCKEN??? BIG ASS KANGAROOS. I am talking about the BIG REDS, not the ones in the Zoo???.
_________________________________________________________________
AND FINALLY, THE QUOTE EVERYBODY HAS BEEN WAITING FOR (via houstonsoreal)
Really to me, hip-hop is dead and gangsta rap is alive. You know what I mean? The hip-hop died with Biggie and Pac and Eazy and Trouble T-Roy and it died with Scott LaRock. Right now it???s all about gangsta rap and rap. It???s all about rap music and gangsta rap. Hip-hop is dead personally. There???s nobody making music like Run DMC. There???s nobody making music like Will Smith and Queen Latifah and Naughty by Nature back in the day and De La Soul. That was hip-hop to me. There might have been some cussing, but the story line was basically about dancing and partying. You know, like EPMD, you know what I mean? Gangsta rap, and rap music to me, the reason why I feel rap is what???s alive right now and not hip-hop because DOC said it straight for me in ???88 or ???89 when he said ???Rhythmic American Poetry, You may ask me, not many people know of me,??? so to me it???s all about Rhythmic American Poetry. We???re all black and from Africa, eventually somehow through the bloodlines, but it???s all about Rhythmic American Poetry. That???s what???s taking rap to one billion.
_________________________________________________________________
Koalas aren't bears. they are Marsupials.
Hip Hop died twice? Three times, four, five? There's like a good 10 year gap between Scott La Rock dying & the others.
And who the fuck is Reese the Camillion?
So I'm to undertsand that the words of Bushwick have more credence over someone from the Bronx like Jazzy Jay who says that true hip hop is still alive. Hmm, interesting
Hmm...I wonder what the Dollarbillster thinks of "They Reminisce Over You"...
You guys crack me up though!
Keep foaming at the mouth, it entertains me while I eat my egg burrito!
Yessir, I'm just one big bucket of fuddyduddy love, and I got enough to go around. Group hug, anyone?
There seems to be a disconnect here.
"Back Then," or any other Mike Jones cut = nothing to do with "crunk"
Something tells me you're joking.
funny how that is
"my eye muscle..."
Yes, but was this rich old man named Noam Chomsky?
In other words, "crunk" has become the new "dope" or "fly" or "for shizzle my nizzle." This only contributes to the confusion because a lot of folks are hollering "crunk" but they're not always talking about the same thing.
I'm no expert but from what my more informed friends have told me: crunk is largely the creation of Lil Jon and as such, it should not be confused with other artists just b/c they're from the South. While Houston, Memphis, Miami, New Orleans, etc. all have highly visible regional scenes and sounds, none of these cities are associated with crunk even if artists out of these cities might be because they've recorded with Jon. I don't know if you can even say Atlanta is a "crunk city" considering how many artists out of there don't necessarily use the crunk sound but I'll let someone like Faux speak on this.
but bottomline, if you're talking about Southern rap, you can't presume that terms like "crunk" or "bounce" apply unless the song in question is actually crunk or bounce. That's like saying that Marley Marl and Mantronix made the same kind of beats just because they were both from New York.
Stein - the main thing those two songs have in common is 1) loud horns and 2) a big fat 808 kick (and I'm not even sure "Yeah" has an 808). So really, it comes down to the horns. The drum programming - the very rhythmic essence - of the two songs are completely different. "Yeah" is, for example, considerably slower than "Going Back to Cali." I also think the former song is "looser" in feel and groove, whereas "Going back to Cali" is more hunched-shoulder. In some ways, I think "Going Back to Cali" has more in common with bounce but again, the rhythms there are quite distinct too.
Naw, no need for me to speak on it--you've got this exactly right. I don't think I'd use the word "crunk" as a genre tag for any artists besides Li'l Jon and his affiliates, and maybe some of the younger ATL artists that he's influenced, like Crime Mob.
And good call on the abuse of the word "bounce"--that's a specific regional form that most people not from New Orleans have never even heard.
Here's where we really miss Archaic, going out of his way to call someone a "carpetbaggeur".
Where are Crime Mob? THAT's the shit I want to hear!
And Idiotproof - I would agree that often times, people outside the U.S. have a better appreciation for American music than many Americans do. I might even as go as far to say that in some instances, they exhibit considerably better taste in American music than the average American. But the idea that the rest of the world is pursuing a hip-hop style that Americans have abandoned and that this style is more "real" is patent nonsense and frankly, an incredibly narrow worldview. If Lithuanians want to think they're keeping hip-hop alive because everyone in the States is up on crunk, that's pure illusion and far from being egalitarian, it's a form of elitism, basically saying, "we'll take and borrow the cultural styles we like but once we stop liking what you like, we're just going to claim that you've lost your way and stop borrowing." It's cool if you want to pick and chose but seriously, lose the moral authority.
Everytime I go overseas this kind of shit cracks me up. Everything they like is praised like "Its not that bling bling bullocks, real hip hop blah blah blah". I try to tell the people I meet out there that in America we really could give a fuck less about all that shit. Its doesn't matter how or what it is if its dope. I know its over simplified but it really comes down to that for me. I either like it or I don't. I don't give a fuck about if its keyboard music or if the dude studied under Melle Mel. All of that shit is irrelevant. I won't even start clowning on the "true school" hip hop of Europe. That's a whole nother thread.
to me crunk= chanted, shouting vocals, (usually about drinking , fucking, and getting rowdy), slow tempos, minor key progressions, fuzzed out moog basslines, heavy 808 kicks with nice programming...
tho what Oliver says is true, the "crunk" lines are pretty blurred... last time i was in atlanta a few years ago, i bought a buncha mix cd's (that i think i've lost since then... sigh...) and they would have Ying Yang Twins "say ay yi yi" (crunk) next to "gel and weave" (not crunk) by project pat...
to me anything lil jon produced from like 97-2001 is ground zero for crunk...
This thread was built for Archaic!
When dude referred to "Back Then" as "crunk"?
"I just want you to know that I have Salih Williams on the phone right now!"