Dirty harry drums

SPlDEYSPlDEY Vegas 3,375 Posts
edited November 2007 in Strut Central
I recently was given Sudden Impact (BIG ups to Tonearm Roberry), and I was looking up the drummer the answer I got doesn't seem to sit well with me. Lalo is known for using many session musicians and hardly gives proper credit. Listening to the swing and backbeat I thought it was Purdie. Given the other session musicians I'm not sure Purdie was on board. This is the answer from the Doug Payne Lalo site."According to Lalo Schifrin, Larry Bunker and John Guerin played drums simultaneously together (although Schifrin indicates Mel Lewis, not Larry Bunker, is the second drummer during the interview contained in Warner Music France (Fr) 8573-87357-2 [CD])."Looking at Larry Bunkers track record all soft contemporary drums. No breakbeats from him. Mel lewis is definitely a good jazz drummer, and listening to a youtube video of him he definitely could've been the jazz drummer. So that leaves John Guerin. His track record includes: Frank Sinatra, Frank Zappa, Joni Mitchell, The Byrds, Thelonious Monk, Lou Rawls, George Shearing, Peggy Lee, Ella Fitzgerald, Linda Ronstadt, Nelson Riddle and others. Not too funky. The funkiest work in his discography would be working with Axelrod. So, I'm wondering if this is what I need to listen to.So, I'm looking through the Lalo session players lists, and some of the other funky drummers he worked with includes:Grady Tate - Marquis de sadeEarl Palmer - Cool hand lukeStix Hooper - Enter the DragonFor me it's a no brainer that the funky drummer is eitherEarl Palmer or John Guerin.Anybody know better or thinks otherwise?- spidey

  Comments


  • I dunno about anything about that, but I just won this poster off ebay:


  • SPlDEYSPlDEY Vegas 3,375 Posts
    If that's anything like Dirty Mary Crazy Larry than I gotta watch it!

    So... I did some E-digging and found out about



    So.. John Guerin was actually really funky on this 1972 album. SO it definitely is possible that he was ripping breakbeats in 1971 with Lalo.

    Anybody know any other stuff from Mr. Guerin that's worth checking out.

    Howard Roberts equinox express??

    Carol Kaye- first lady of pop??

    - spidey

  • I dunno about anything about that, but I just won this poster off ebay:


    now we're talking!


    that shit is sweet...

  • Here's a list I found of all Guerin's recorded works. Isn't there a "Brady Bunch" break or somthing? I seem to remember something like that...

    There's a few on there: Mystic Moods is hit n' miss, Tom Scott has his moments, I've found some Jean-Luc Ponty kinda dope, Zappa, etc...


    This is a selected discography, as listed on the site www.united-mutations.com/g/john_guerin.htm. If you have any corrections or additions to this list, please feel free to let us know: [email]justin@johnguerin.com[/email] .

    Also, check this link for a very well organized discography: Guerin at AMG All Music Guide (thanks to Dawayne Bailey)

    1966 kellaway, roger- stride!
    1966 wofford, mike- strawberry wine
    1967 wofford, mike- summer night
    1967 wofford, mike- sure thing
    1968 scott, tom- rural still life
    1968 frank zappa- lumpy gravy
    1968 monk, thelonious- monk's blues
    1969 mitchell, blue- bantu village
    1969 jean-luc ponty- canteloupe island
    1969 monkees- monkees present
    1969 frank zappa- hot rats
    1970 brady bunch- merry christmas
    1970 scott, tom- paint your wagon
    1970 various artists- zapp??d
    1970 frank zappa- chunga's revenge
    1970 nelson, oliver- black, brown and beautiful
    1971 england dan & john ford- fables
    1971 california earthquake- california earthquake
    1971 mama cass- cass elliot
    1971 rhodes, emitt- american dream
    1971 reddy, helen- helen reddy
    1971 hammer, jan- hammer
    1971 mulligan, gerry- age of steam
    1972 parsons, gram- g p
    1972 spring [1] - spring
    1972 battin, skip- skip
    1972 horn, jim- through the eye
    1972 previn, dory- mary c brown
    1972 mitchell, blue- blue's blues
    1972 roberts, howard- equinox express elevator
    1972 longet, claudine- let's spend the night together
    1972 rankin, kenny- like a seed
    1972 seals & crofts- summer breeze
    1972 brady bunch- meet the brady bunch
    1972 brady bunch- kids from the brady bunch
    1972 vaughan, sarah- with michel legrand
    1973 mcguinn, roger- roger mcguinn
    1973 parsons, gram- g.p./grievous angel
    1973 seals & crofts- diamond girl
    1973 browne, severin- severin browne
    1973 carlton, larry- singing playing
    1973 edelman, randy- laughter & tears
    1973 harris, shaun- shaun harris
    1973 muleskinner- muleskinner
    1973 taylor, allan- american album
    1973 crow [1] - david wagner d/b/a crow
    1973 everly, phil- star spangled springer
    1973 gates, david- first
    1973 williams, patrick- threshold
    1973 scott, tom- great scott
    1973 scott, tom- tom scott & la express
    1973 brady bunch- brady bunch phonographic album
    1974 batteaux- batteaux
    1974 cunha, rick- cunha songs
    1974 hagers- hagers [elektra]
    1974 horn, paul- visions
    1974 ellis, don- haiku
    1974 harrison, george- dark horse
    1974 loggins, dave- apprentice (in a musical workshop)
    1974 joni mitchell- miles of aisles (percussion, drums)
    1974 streisand, barbra- butterfly
    1974 joni mitchell- court & spark (percussion, drums)
    1974 frank zappa- apostrophe (')
    1974 scott, tom- tom cat (percussion, drums, producer)
    1975 okeefe, danny- so long harry truman
    1975 brooks, elkie- rich mans woman
    1975 edelman, randy- prime cuts
    1975 phillips, shawn- do you wonder
    1975 andersen, eric- be true to you
    1975 blue, david- com'n back for more (drums, vocals, producer)
    1975 mcrae, carmen- i am music
    1975 garthwaite, terry- terry
    1975 fire and rain- living together
    1975 garfunkel, art- breakaway
    1975 joni mitchell- hissing of summer lawns
    1975 rankin, kenny- inside
    1975 baez, joan- diamonds & rust
    1975 brown, ray- brown's bag
    1975 klemmer, john- touch
    1975 triumphant sax- triumphant sax!
    1976 melanie- photograph
    1976 la express- shadow play (drums, keyboards)
    1976 pacheco, tom- swallowed up in american heartland
    1976 sainte-marie, buffy- sweet america
    1976 spheeris, jimmie- ports of the heart
    1976 pedersen, herb- southwest
    1976 la express- l.a. express (drums, keyboards)
    1976 doheny, ned- hard candy
    1976 deardurff & joseph- deardurff and joseph
    1976 bishop, stephen- careless
    1976 franks, michael- art of tea (percussion, drums)
    1976 joni mitchell- hejira
    1976 souther, john david- black rose
    1976 lee, peggy- mirrors (percussion, drums)
    1976 klemmer, john- barefoot ballet
    1977 alessi brothers- alessi
    1977 boylan, terence- terence boylan
    1977 pacheco, tom- outsider
    1977 titus, libby- libby titus
    1977 murphy, walter- rhapsody in blue
    1977 sidran, ben- doctor is in
    1977 feldman, victor- rockavibabe
    1977 hamilton, dirk- at last
    1977 franks, michael- sleeping gypsy
    1977 joni mitchell- don juan's reckless daughter
    1977 ogerman, claus- gate of dreams
    1978 norman, neil- not of this earth
    1978 mancini, henry- theme scene
    1978 oak ridge boys- room service
    1979 franklin, rodney- in the center
    1979 garthwaite, terry- hand in glove
    1979 raitt, bonnie- glow
    1979 lee, peggy- close enough for love (percussion, drums)
    1980 kunkel, leah- i run with trouble
    1980 hamilton, dirk- thug of love
    1980 rankin, kenny- after the roses
    1980 scott, tom- best of tom scott (drums, producer)
    1981 jackson, milt- big mouth
    1981 robinson, spike- plays harry warren
    1982 joni mitchell- wild things run fast
    1982 mcferrin, bobby- bobby mcferrin
    1983 linda ronstadt- what's new
    1984 linda ronstadt- lush life
    1986 linda ronstadt- for sentimental reasons
    1986 frank zappa- apostrophe/over-nite sensation (cd two'fer release)
    1986 linda ronstadt- round midnight with nelson riddle a
    1988 rankin, kenny- silver morning
    1989 feinstein, michael- m.g.m. album
    1989 lighthouse all stars- jazz invention
    1990 franks, michael- blue pacific
    1990 raitt, bonnie- bonnie raitt collection
    1990 madonna- dick tracy: "i'm breathless"
    1990 labelle, patti- this christmas
    1991 mcferrin, bobby- many faces of bird
    1992 mcguinn, roger- born to rock & roll
    1992 feinstein, michael- pure imagination
    1993 neville, aaron- grand tour
    1993 easton, sheena- no strings
    1993 wilson, carnie and wend- hey santa!
    1993 neville, aaron- aaron neville's soulful christmas
    1993 john, elton- duets
    1993 scott, tom- reed my lips
    1994 kaye, carol- first lady of pop
    1994 bishop, stephen- on & on: the hits of stephen bishop
    1994 muleskinner- potpourri of bluegrass jam
    1994 lemel, gary- romancing the screen
    1994 everly brothers- heartaches & harmonies [box set] (percussion, drums)
    1994 rogers, kenny- timepiece
    1994 pizzarelli, john- dear mr. cole
    1994 miracle on 34th street (1994) [ost]
    1995 raitt, john- broadway legend
    1995 mcrae, carmen- best of carmen mcrae
    1996 shaken not stirred- shaken not stirred
    1996 frank zappa- the lost episodes
    1996 klemmer, john- mosaic: the best of john klemmer
    1996 minnelli, liza- gently
    1996 bread- retrospective
    1996 grace of my heart- grace of my heart (instrumental)
    1996 cole, natalie- stardust
    1996 joni mitchell- hits (percussion, drums)
    1996 joni mitchell- misses
    1996 caldwell, bobby- blue condition
    1996 monk, thelonious- this is jazz, vol. 5 (percussion)
    1996 woman's world- woman's world
    1997 rundgren, todd- very best of todd rundgren
    1997 garfield, david- tribute to jeff porcaro (tom-tom, drums)
    1997 andersen, eric- collection
    1997 frank zappa- strictly genteel
    1997 best of smooth jazz- best of smooth jazz
    1998 franks, michael- best of michael franks (percussion, drums)
    1998 barone, mike- live at donte's 1968
    1998 scott, tom- priceless jazz
    1999 frank zappa- son of cheep thrills
    greatest science fiction hits, vol.
    california earthquake- reformation
    wagner, david- d/b/a crow
    madelaine- who is she? (percussion)
    morrison, bob- friends of mine
    nevins, nancy- nancy nevins
    pulver, judy- pulver rising
    baby maker- baby maker
    secret agent file- secret agent file
    norman, neil- greatest science fiction hits, vol.
    norman, neil- greatest science fiction hits, vol.
    bird- bird
    starlight christmas- starlight christmas
    klemmer, john- best of john klemmer, vol. 1: mosai
    rankin, kenny- peaceful: the best of kenny rankin
    the mystic moods orchestra- emotions

  • I need you to show me that thing on eBay.

  • sorry man i forget but doesnt it say on the back of the record who the drummer is? i'm pretty sure its Earl Palmer

  • SPlDEYSPlDEY Vegas 3,375 Posts
    Well.. if it was on the back of the record, I might have read it the first time I looked at the record. No?

    - spidey

  • akoako https://soundcloud.com/a-ko 3,413 Posts
    thanks for posting this, i couldnt remember what this record was but i reeeally want it. all i could remember was that it was lalo schifrin and that the cover looked like that.

  • Pretty easy record to find around here, I have several if you're seriously jonesing.

    I love that moment where the drums kick in. Hard as nails.

  • DocMcCoyDocMcCoy "Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,917 Posts
    Well, to me, a drummer is a drummer. If you're a good enough player to get booked for high-profile sessions, you're going to be good enough to flip a bunch of different styles, even if the bulk of your session work might lean towards a particular style. Anyone who can play with Monk, Zappa, the Byrds and Linda Ronstadt is surely going to have enough range to knock out a few funky braeks on a Lalo Schifrin soundtrack date, so it doesn't seem at all unusual to me that it might be Guerin.

  • akoako https://soundcloud.com/a-ko 3,413 Posts
    Pretty easy record to find around here, I have several if you're seriously jonesing.

    i just might be. seriously multiple copies? i still have yet to see a copy of this in a store.

  • akoako https://soundcloud.com/a-ko 3,413 Posts
    So that leaves John Guerin.

    His track record includes: Frank Zappa, The Byrds, Lou Rawls, Peggy Lee

    these arists have albums containing DAMN funky breaks. its not totally impossible it's guerin. plus "funk" drumming isnt necessarily exclusive to the funk genre...

    can anybody post a soundclip? its been at least 2 years since ive heard this record and usually i can recognize earl palmer's playing, i might be able to offer some help .

    plus i wouldnt mind hearing it again anyway! i was flooored the first time i heard this shit.

  • SPlDEYSPlDEY Vegas 3,375 Posts
    Sure Ako,

    When my DJ gets back with my turntables, I'll have him rip it for you.

    - spidey

  • You can find those drums clean on the Dirty Harry OST on CD only & the crazy vocal...




  • you know, this are the kind of threads I like ...

    as for the drummer, I think it has little meaning goin through each drummer credits, cause it won't help.....

    it still amazes me to find out that, some of "the crusaders" members were behind some of the most raw and funkiest 70's ost....you wouldn't believe that those heard on the Shaft in Africa soundtrack, for example, are the same musicians playing on those polished, smooth, fusion-esque "Crusaders" records...

    my 2 cents is that, maybe it was John Guerin, however the kind of drummer heard on Dirty harry sounds like coming from jazz, so I wouldn' t be surprised if it was mel lewis....

  • m_dejeanm_dejean Quadratisch. Praktisch. Gut. 2,946 Posts
    I'm almost 100% sure it's John Guerin, because if you listen to other LPs featuring Guerin from around the same time ('71), it's obvious it must be him. Pretty distinctive sound to his kit (especially the toms) and the way he plays his patterns.

    Example: the Les Crane "Desiderata" LP from the same year. The beats on that sound very similar to "Scorpio" with the stop'n'go thing going on.

    John Guerin played on a lot of film and TV scores from the late 60s/early 70s. Pat Williams used him frequently too. Probably him playing on the Streets of SF theme.

    Looking at Larry Bunkers track record all soft contemporary drums. No breakbeats from him.

    Didn't someone talk about a Larry Bunker LP in a recent finds thread?

  • Sure Ako,

    When my DJ gets back with my turntables, I'll have him rip it for you.

    - spidey

    Bring over your laptop and burn it at my crib.

    I want a copy too (since I don't own the record anymore).


  • John Guerin played on a lot of film and TV scores from the late 60s/early 70s. Pat Williams used him frequently too. Probably him playing on the Streets of SF theme.


    Hey m_dejean, did you find any info on tv show sessions musicians on the net ? ...beside that DougPayne page ?
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