C'mon now dog you've had a good run lately, don't start slipping into believing your own hype.
I'm not sure what you're trying to say ......but i'll be clear...If anybody believes Deron Williams is better than Chris Paul he or she is a complete moron....
I don't see the gulf between the two as wide as you.
I don't think D. Fish is garbage nor Livingston.
Not ready to put Paul in the same arena you are.
ok...Fish isn't "garbage" ...he's just not that talented ...I've followed his career
Livingston is garbage ..i will never understand why people think this dude is good enough to be a NBA starter ...His jumper is nasty...he's a terrible passer ...He's an ok finisher and he's slow on defense ....Devin Harris is better than Livingston.
I won't knock those who feel Paul isn't in the same league as Nash and other elite point guards ...but this nonsense about him not being better than Deron Williams is absurd
I don't see the gulf between the two as wide as you.
I don't think D. Fish is garbage nor Livingston.
Not ready to put Paul in the same arena you are.
ok...Fish isn't "garbage" ...he's just not that talented ...I've followed his career
Livingston is garbage ..i will never understand why people think this dude is good enough to be a NBA starter ...His jumper is nasty...he's a terrible passer ...He's an ok finisher and he's slow on defense ....Devin Harris is better than Livingston.
I won't knock those who feel Paul isn't in the same league as Nash and other elite point guards ...but this nonsense about him not being better than Deron Williams is absurd
The "mad potential" and "lacks that killer instinct" talk is just ignorant.
I'll take your scouting report on Livingston under advisement. I imagine you've seen way more Clips games than I have. I am mostly going on highlights.
Numbers are close on D Will and C Paul....perhaps one is flashy and one is workmanlike. Didn't see the Hornets play much this year either and wasn't Paul dinged a bit?
I'm just discussing here. I'm done on bold proclamations for now, other than I guarantee you the Spurs take the chip.
C'mon now dog you've had a good run lately, don't start slipping into believing your own hype.
I'm not sure what you're trying to say ......but i'll be clear...If anybody believes Deron Williams is better than Chris Paul he or she is a complete moron....
It depends on the system. Chris Paul wouldnt be as effective in a Jerry Sloan system. He demands his PG to play defense(oneonone/team) along w/ scoring & passing & rebounding.
Chris Paul flourishes in an open court style w/ limited banging. Dude can run an offense and can score. He reminds me of Tim Hardaway.
But Tim Hardaway was strong and could play on the block/in the paint when isolated.
Paul cant Post UP ala Payton/Kidd/Mark Jackson......even Baron Davis.
Deron is strong enuff to incorporate that into his game. And if he does Ill take that skill in the Playoffs.
So I think it depends on the system either PG plays in. And It depends on which style you prefer or think gets the best results.
If you were an NBA GM and had to pick one true point guard in the world to build a team around for the next 10 years who would you pick over Deron Williams???
acie law iv
i don't know if i'd necessarily pick him over deron williams, but i'd pick him early.
Nice call......I've watched Acie since he was a Sophmore in High School and he is the real deal......I think he can reach the same level as Deron.
After all, how many lefty point gurds with a deadly outside shot are there??
Unlike most ...i would love to see a Detroit/San Antonio finals....Detroit in six
i only agree because Detroit needs to get theirs against the spurs.
and cosign on Acie Law IV, he's gonna be dope.
And Deron Williams is nice, but I would have to give the edge to Chris Paul. He seems to be more of a break out player, a guy that can take control of a game when he needs to. Williams plays his role on a team full of good to great players.
Unlike most ...i would love to see a Detroit/San Antonio finals....Detroit in six
i only agree because Detroit needs to get theirs against the spurs.
and cosign on Acie Law IV, he's gonna be dope.
And Deron Williams is nice, but I would have to give the edge to Chris Paul. He seems to be more of a break out player, a guy that can take control of a game when he needs to. Williams plays his role on a team full of good to great players.
Is that "control of a game" only limited to scoring? Is dude catching Charges like Nash, Steals like whomever,Rebounds like Kidd?
At this point I'm not impressed w/ prolific scorers anymore. Mcgrady/Carter/etc cant get the job done. Dudes just disappoint year after year until they get old and join a contender like Stackhouse in Dallas,Finley in San Antonio, or Payton in Miami. The NBA fools you into thinking that these dudes are great when they are not as well rounded as they should be.
I guess it really comes down to the system, as you said before, more than anything else. Paul is not a strong defender, this is true. He can't post up like a J. Kidd or even an Andre Miller (one of the best post up pg's in the game). And you're right, prolific scorers can't get the job done on their own, but nobody can (except Kobe, haha). It's more about the system and the other players and how all the pieces fit. Deron is in a system where his skills fit in well. Paul is in a system that doesn't seem fully built yet. Paired with the right front court, Paul is a dangerous weapon. I guess now would be the time for D. Williams to show and prove though.
As far as stats, Pauul averaged more rebounds and steals this season than Williams, had a higher ft%, about the same in assists and slightly more in points.
The NBA fools you into thinking that the duded are great when all the not as well rounded as they should be.
also, I'd like to add that I don't see deron williams or chris paul as being superstars at all. I'm not fooled by their game at all, I like them for what they are. Neither of them are going to take a team to the finals single handedly, ever.
Deron Williams and Chris Paul don't even belong in the same discussion.
Why not?
Deron Williams belongs in the Jarrett Jack,Jamal Tinsley,Andre Miller,Chucky Atkins,TJ Ford discussion.....
Chris Paul belongs in a Steve Nash,Mike Bibby,Baron Davis,Jason Kidd,Chauncey Billups debate.
Deron is a solid point guard...not close to being a franchise dude.
I gotta completely disagree with this. Paul got all the early hype but Williams is showing what he's made of. Williams might actually have a better jump shot than Paul and he's MUCH stronger than Paul as well. I think they're both great point guards of the future.
The NBA fools you into thinking that the duded are great when all the not as well rounded as they should be.
also, I'd like to add that I don't see deron williams or chris paul as being superstars at all. I'm not fooled by their game at all, I like them for what they are. Neither of them are going to take a team to the finals single handedly, ever.
What player CAN take a team to the finals single handedly???
The NBA fools you into thinking that the duded are great when all the not as well rounded as they should be.
also, I'd like to add that I don't see deron williams or chris paul as being superstars at all. I'm not fooled by their game at all, I like them for what they are. Neither of them are going to take a team to the finals single handedly, ever.
What player CAN take a team to the finals single handedly???
Chris Paul is probably the correct answer of who would you take at the Point for the next 10 years, if not Williams...
But to say Deron isn't in his class is crazy ass talk.
Williams went for 34 points, 9 assists and 7 rebounds yesterday with ONE turnover.
And he's in his second year.
Dude has ice water in his veins and backs down from no one.
You saw what he did to Baron Davis
For the style I like to see a team play I'll take Williams, Don Nelson on the other hand would probably take Paul.
Rock, that last line. That's it.
I'm pretty sure I've made myself clear that I'm beyond that ESPN highlights shit man. Livingston got mad potential, I can tell how players move on the court. Faux, if you noticed the subtleties in my descriptions, you would have noticed I never said Paul is a slouch. I said he got game, but he is not an all-purpose player willing to do anything for the team. At least that's the impression I get. It means playing tough D, chasing loose balls, movement without the ball. "Basketball science". It's common sense basketball.
The NBA fools you into thinking that the duded are great when all the not as well rounded as they should be.
also, I'd like to add that I don't see deron williams or chris paul as being superstars at all. I'm not fooled by their game at all, I like them for what they are. Neither of them are going to take a team to the finals single handedly, ever.
What player CAN take a team to the finals single handedly???
AI in 2001
AI blew up during that run. But too bad his style won't win it all.
Chris Paul is probably the correct answer of who would you take at the Point for the next 10 years, if not Williams...
But to say Deron isn't in his class is crazy ass talk.
Williams went for 34 points, 9 assists and 7 rebounds yesterday with ONE turnover.
And he's in his second year.
Dude has ice water in his veins and backs down from no one.
You saw what he did to Baron Davis
For the style I like to see a team play I'll take Williams, Don Nelson on the other hand would probably take Paul.
Rock, that last line. That's it.
I'm pretty sure I've made myself clear that I'm beyond that ESPN highlights shit man. Livingston got mad potential, I can tell how players move on the court. Faux, if you noticed the subtleties in my descriptions, you would have noticed I never said Paul is a slouch. I said he got game, but he is not an all-purpose player willing to do anything for the team. At least that's the impression I get. It means playing tough D, chasing loose balls, movement without the ball. "Basketball science". It's common sense basketball.
I would take Fisher over Paul in a heart beat.
Yuichi, subtle is exactly what's lacking in some of these proclamations of yours.
And LOL @ "Fisher over Paul in a heartbeat". You can argue that Fish is slept on and that CP is over-rated and I'll listen, but no way can you credibly argue that CP is so over-rated and Fish so under-rated that Fish--with his whopping lifetime averages of 8.7 points and 3.3 assists--is actually the better player. And wasn't this discussion about who you'd take to build your franchise around for the next ten years? Fish won't even be in the League in five years.
Chris Paul is probably the correct answer of who would you take at the Point for the next 10 years, if not Williams...
But to say Deron isn't in his class is crazy ass talk.
Williams went for 34 points, 9 assists and 7 rebounds yesterday with ONE turnover.
And he's in his second year.
Dude has ice water in his veins and backs down from no one.
You saw what he did to Baron Davis
For the style I like to see a team play I'll take Williams, Don Nelson on the other hand would probably take Paul.
Rock, that last line. That's it.
I'm pretty sure I've made myself clear that I'm beyond that ESPN highlights shit man. Livingston got mad potential, I can tell how players move on the court. Faux, if you noticed the subtleties in my descriptions, you would have noticed I never said Paul is a slouch. I said he got game, but he is not an all-purpose player willing to do anything for the team. At least that's the impression I get. It means playing tough D, chasing loose balls, movement without the ball. "Basketball science". It's common sense basketball.
I would take Fisher over Paul in a heart beat.
Yuichi, subtle is exactly what's lacking in some of these proclamations of yours.
And LOL @ "Fisher over Paul in a heartbeat". You can argue that Fish is slept on and that CP is over-rated and I'll listen, but no way can you credibly argue that CP is so over-rated and Fish so under-rated that Fish--with his whopping lifetime averages of 8.7 points and 3.3 assists--is actually the better player. And wasn't this discussion about who you'd take to build your franchise around for the next ten years? Fish won't even be in the League in five years.
Can you read? Son said he is Beyond That ESPN Highlights Shit, Man!
You can argue that Fish is slept on and that CP is over-rated and I'll listen, but no way can you credibly argue that CP is so over-rated and Fish so under-rated that Fish--with his whopping lifetime averages of 8.7 points and 3.3 assists--is actually the better player.
Fisher is a good PG in a system where the SG handles the ball alot ala BJ Armstrong. He was crucial to those LA championship teams.
But I guarantee you no one's tweaking their Defense to dtop Fisher whereas dudes watch a whole lot of tape to study Chris Paul for thier late night defensive assignment homework.
Chris Paul is probably the correct answer of who would you take at the Point for the next 10 years, if not Williams...
But to say Deron isn't in his class is crazy ass talk.
Williams went for 34 points, 9 assists and 7 rebounds yesterday with ONE turnover.
And he's in his second year.
Dude has ice water in his veins and backs down from no one.
You saw what he did to Baron Davis
For the style I like to see a team play I'll take Williams, Don Nelson on the other hand would probably take Paul.
Rock, that last line. That's it.
I'm pretty sure I've made myself clear that I'm beyond that ESPN highlights shit man. Livingston got mad potential, I can tell how players move on the court. Faux, if you noticed the subtleties in my descriptions, you would have noticed I never said Paul is a slouch. I said he got game, but he is not an all-purpose player willing to do anything for the team. At least that's the impression I get. It means playing tough D, chasing loose balls, movement without the ball. "Basketball science". It's common sense basketball.
I would take Fisher over Paul in a heart beat.
Yuichi, subtle is exactly what's lacking in some of these proclamations of yours.
And LOL @ "Fisher over Paul in a heartbeat". You can argue that Fish is slept on and that CP is over-rated and I'll listen, but no way can you credibly argue that CP is so over-rated and Fish so under-rated that Fish--with his whopping lifetime averages of 8.7 points and 3.3 assists--is actually the better player. And wasn't this discussion about who you'd take to build your franchise around for the next ten years? Fish won't even be in the League in five years.
Fisher is slept on?? LOLozers. Where were you these past 7 years?! You talking about how many points and assists? That's some fantasy basketball shit man. If numbers don't lie, you might as well pick up Ricky Davis throw him on the Warriors and have some fun.
Comments
This sentence is VERY revealing of what type of fan you are.
Something Batmon said a few pages back.
C'mon now dog you've had a good run lately, don't start slipping into believing your own hype.
Dude
This entire thread is VERY revealing of what type of fan YOU are.
Tell the truth ...How many times have you seen Chris Paul play this year ?
I'm not sure what you're trying to say ......but i'll be clear...If anybody believes Deron Williams is better than Chris Paul he or she is a complete moron....
I don't see the gulf between the two as wide as you.
I don't think D. Fish is garbage nor Livingston.
Not ready to put Paul in the same arena you are.
ok...Fish isn't "garbage" ...he's just not that talented ...I've followed his career
Livingston is garbage ..i will never understand why people think this dude is good enough to be a NBA starter ...His jumper is nasty...he's a terrible passer ...He's an ok finisher and he's slow on defense ....Devin Harris is better than Livingston.
I won't knock those who feel Paul isn't in the same league as Nash and other elite point guards ...but this nonsense about him not being better than Deron Williams is absurd
The "mad potential" and "lacks that killer instinct" talk is just ignorant.
Numbers are close on D Will and C Paul....perhaps one is flashy and one is workmanlike. Didn't see the Hornets play much this year either and wasn't Paul dinged a bit?
I'm just discussing here. I'm done on bold proclamations for now, other than I guarantee you the Spurs take the chip.
Unlike most ...i would love to see a Detroit/San Antonio finals....Detroit in six
It depends on the system. Chris Paul wouldnt be as effective in a Jerry Sloan system. He demands his PG to play defense(oneonone/team) along w/ scoring & passing & rebounding.
Chris Paul flourishes in an open court style w/ limited banging. Dude can run an offense and can score.
He reminds me of Tim Hardaway.
But Tim Hardaway was strong and could play on the block/in the paint when isolated.
Paul cant Post UP ala Payton/Kidd/Mark Jackson......even Baron Davis.
Deron is strong enuff to incorporate that into his game. And if he does Ill take that skill in the Playoffs.
So I think it depends on the system either PG plays in. And It depends on which style you prefer or think gets the best results.
Heh. We may have to do a series bet for ol' times sake, Mr. Powers. I think y're off on this Pistons talk.
I'm not gonna count out the Lebrons just yet though, so we'll talk.....
Nice call......I've watched Acie since he was a Sophmore in High School and he is the real deal......I think he can reach the same level as Deron.
After all, how many lefty point gurds with a deadly outside shot are there??
Chris Paul is probably the correct answer of who would you take at the Point for the next 10 years, if not Williams...
But to say Deron isn't in his class is crazy ass talk.
Williams went for 34 points, 9 assists and 7 rebounds yesterday with ONE turnover.
And he's in his second year.
Dude has ice water in his veins and backs down from no one.
You saw what he did to Baron Davis
For the style I like to see a team play I'll take Williams, Don Nelson on the other hand would probably take Paul.
please be serious.
i only agree because Detroit needs to get theirs against the spurs.
and cosign on Acie Law IV, he's gonna be dope.
And Deron Williams is nice, but I would have to give the edge to Chris Paul. He seems to be more of a break out player, a guy that can take control of a game when he needs to. Williams plays his role on a team full of good to great players.
Is that "control of a game" only limited to scoring? Is dude catching Charges like Nash, Steals like whomever,Rebounds like Kidd?
At this point I'm not impressed w/ prolific scorers anymore. Mcgrady/Carter/etc cant get the job done.
Dudes just disappoint year after year until they get old and join a contender like Stackhouse in Dallas,Finley in San Antonio, or Payton in Miami. The NBA fools you into thinking that these dudes are great when they are not as well rounded as they should be.
As far as stats, Pauul averaged more rebounds and steals this season than Williams, had a higher ft%, about the same in assists and slightly more in points.
also, I'd like to add that I don't see deron williams or chris paul as being superstars at all. I'm not fooled by their game at all, I like them for what they are. Neither of them are going to take a team to the finals single handedly, ever.
I gotta completely disagree with this. Paul got all the early hype but Williams is showing what he's made of. Williams might actually have a better jump shot than Paul and he's MUCH stronger than Paul as well. I think they're both great point guards of the future.
What player CAN take a team to the finals single handedly???
AI in 2001
Rock, that last line. That's it.
I'm pretty sure I've made myself clear that I'm beyond that ESPN highlights shit man.
Livingston got mad potential, I can tell how players move on the court. Faux, if you noticed the subtleties in my descriptions, you would have noticed I never said Paul is a slouch. I said he got game, but he is not an all-purpose player willing to do anything for the team. At least that's the impression I get. It means playing tough D, chasing loose balls, movement without the ball. "Basketball science". It's common sense basketball.
I would take Fisher over Paul in a heart beat.
AI blew up during that run. But too bad his style won't win it all.
Yuichi, subtle is exactly what's lacking in some of these proclamations of yours.
And LOL @ "Fisher over Paul in a heartbeat". You can argue that Fish is slept on and that CP is over-rated and I'll listen, but no way can you credibly argue that CP is so over-rated and Fish so under-rated that Fish--with his whopping lifetime averages of 8.7 points and 3.3 assists--is actually the better player. And wasn't this discussion about who you'd take to build your franchise around for the next ten years? Fish won't even be in the League in five years.
I thought so too. We all know what Detroit can do.
I think the series depends on these factors:
1) How good is Detroit's transition D?
2) Can Wallace/Webber contain Duncan?
3) Can Ginobli/Parker slash and get fouls?
Can you read? Son said he is Beyond That ESPN Highlights Shit, Man!
Fisher is a good PG in a system where the SG handles the ball alot ala BJ Armstrong.
He was crucial to those LA championship teams.
But I guarantee you no one's tweaking their Defense to dtop Fisher whereas dudes watch a whole lot of tape to study Chris Paul for thier late night defensive assignment homework.
Fisher is slept on?? LOLozers. Where were you these past 7 years?! You talking about how many points and assists? That's some fantasy basketball shit man. If numbers don't lie, you might as well pick up Ricky Davis throw him on the Warriors and have some fun.
Fisher is the man. No discussions. End of story.
I know it's nearly impossible, but