Eminem's mark has been made on pop culture; Atmosphere's has been made on the indie-rock/college underground. They get college radio spins, sell records, and fill venues. To all those reactionary kids who distrust music they feel is "corporate," Atmosphere is an alternative with indie credibilty. None of my friends are fans, but i think we've all at least heard them. The point i tried to make is that there are plenty of people who turn on their tv or radio, hear and think, "rap is crap." then they hear slug, a guy who looks like them and talks about his problems with girls (just like their favorite rock bands), and think "this must be real rap; i like this!"
Well that is true, but I think that is less a question of "transcending" rap than it is of never having really intersected with it to begin with. It's not as if those guys actually had a large following made up of rap fans prior to being adopted by indie rock dudes.
It's not as if those guys actually had a large following made up of rap fans prior to being adopted by indie rock dudes.
that may be, i don't really know either way. but they must have at least thought tthemsevles to be b-boys when they were out painting freights and listening to nas or whatever.
maybe some songs by LL Cool J, Snoop, or Ice Cube. they've done all those shitty movies. (once again, not sure how "trancendent" that is)
Eminem's mark has been made on pop culture; Atmosphere's has been made on the indie-rock/college underground. They get college radio spins, sell records, and fill venues. To all those reactionary kids who distrust music they feel is "corporate," Atmosphere is an alternative with indie credibilty. None of my friends are fans, but i think we've all at least heard them. The point i tried to make is that there are plenty of people who turn on their tv or radio, hear and think, "rap is crap." then they hear slug, a guy who looks like them and talks about his problems with girls (just like their favorite rock bands), and think "this must be real rap; i like this!"
Well that is true, but I think that is less a question of "transcending" rap than it is of never having really intersected with it to begin with. It's not as if those guys actually had a large following made up of rap fans prior to being adopted by indie rock dudes.
faux you are way off base with this one. ignorance about rhymesayers might make you a better person, but thinking that that ignorance gives you an opinion on their product, we'll that's just stupid.
I say "Fight The Power" would fall into the transcendent category b/c I remember Boots talkin about how this song caused people in Oakland to fight back against the police.
Eminem's mark has been made on pop culture; Atmosphere's has been made on the indie-rock/college underground. They get college radio spins, sell records, and fill venues. To all those reactionary kids who distrust music they feel is "corporate," Atmosphere is an alternative with indie credibilty. None of my friends are fans, but i think we've all at least heard them. The point i tried to make is that there are plenty of people who turn on their tv or radio, hear and think, "rap is crap." then they hear slug, a guy who looks like them and talks about his problems with girls (just like their favorite rock bands), and think "this must be real rap; i like this!"
Well that is true, but I think that is less a question of "transcending" rap than it is of never having really intersected with it to begin with. It's not as if those guys actually had a large following made up of rap fans prior to being adopted by indie rock dudes.
faux you are way off base with this one. ignorance about rhymesayers might make you a better person, but thinking that that ignorance gives you an opinion on their product, we'll that's just stupid.
No. I. am. not.
And you really are not the dude to try and step to me on some rap shit.
I've never offered an opinion on their product and I really don't have one, beyond a relative certainty that it is not for me.
What I have done is offered a perspective on their audience, and if you're really going to try to argue that point with me then you're, uh, more detached from reality than most people on SoulStrut.
Aight Big Phil, i think i understand what you mean by "transcending"....so here are a few that come to my mind... am i on the right track or waaaay off..??
digital underground - humpty dance naughty by nature - hip hop hooray and opp salt n pepa - push it biz markie - just a friend
Book
House of Pain - Jump around Back by dope demand - King Bee walk this way - run dmc
For what it's worth Daniel Slug and them have been doing this shit for a loooong time. I first met those dudes back in like 1997-8 and they were big then, headlining sxsw showcases and shit. They had been on the road and buzzed about for a year prior.
Dudes are cool as hell and not concerned with whether or not they appear to be "hip-hop" to people like you. I give them hella respect for doing them, not trying to be something they're not.
Their impact is less about the older post-indie-college kids you speak of, and much more about the kids who found them when they were 14 and hadn't really heard any hip-hop. In their ability to transcend the "traditional" hip-hop audience, they've brought kids who might otherwise not be listening to it at all and now are checking for other (albeit similar-themed) hip-hop. I think that's the definition of what we're talking about here, don't you?
Dudes are cool as hell and not concerned with whether or not they appear to be "hip-hop" to people like you. I give them hella respect for doing them, not trying to be something they're not. Their impact is less about the older post-indie-college kids you speak of, and much more about the kids who found them when they were 14 and hadn't really heard any hip-hop.
I would also add that most of my west coast non-Soulstrut folks love all that stuff. And they are normal music fans (by that I mean people who own hundreds of CDs, go to shows, but don't make music or obsessively follow artists, etc.) who are also fans of Wu-Tang, Jay-Z, 2Pac, Biggie, 50 and the like. Most of the Atmosphere/Slug/Anticon fans I know have a pretty well-rounded idea of rap-related shit.
It seems like the normal Soulstrut "backpack" "scion-hop" "sellout" "keyboard beats" "BITD" -driven discussions here argue minutia that isn't argued as much in the real world. While I enjoy the debate, I don't think my dudes in California could give a fuck if The Game is using keyboard beats on his new album or if Slug is playing Scion-sponsored events.
As far as transcending, I tend to think of what shows up on parental radars, like missbassie spoke of. My mom knows PE, Snoop, Biggie and 2pac, but doesn't know Wu-Tang or Jay-Z. I imagine in a few years some more will sink in, surely Jay-Z, but I doubt my mom will ever know who Atmosphere is.
Not to say my mother is a good barometer of transcendence, but I think looking through her eyes is a good gague.
This post is too ambiguious. Classics within the genre vs. Classic that grew larger than the genre? Cheesy shit like Funky Cold Medina, Men in Black,Whoop there it is, vs Walk this way,Dont Belive the Hype,In da club. Transcending, meaning leaving the genre. ICE ICE baby.
A-ight, THIS is one of the main ones that I was thinking of when I brought this subject up. Run and D had messed around with rock previously, but "Walk This Way" really knocked down the wall (as shown vividly in the video BTW) and paved the way for all the rock-n-rap hybrids that we see right to this day.
I can dig some of the songs people have suggested thus far. For me, though, if it's "transcending" hip hop (in other words, surpassing the confines of the hip hop realm and becoming bigger than hip hop, if that isn't too condescending a thought) it's gotta be a pretty huge record. It's gotta kinda shake up the world like Ali knocking out Liston. But it's cool to see how different people interpret the use of that word "transcending"... there's really a lot of ways to look at it.
For what it's worth Daniel Slug and them have been doing this shit for a loooong time. I first met those dudes back in like 1997-8 and they were big then, headlining sxsw showcases and shit. They had been on the road and buzzed about for a year prior.
Dudes are cool as hell and not concerned with whether or not they appear to be "hip-hop" to people like you. I give them hella respect for doing them, not trying to be something they're not.
Their impact is less about the older post-indie-college kids you speak of, and much more about the kids who found them when they were 14 and hadn't really heard any hip-hop. In their ability to transcend the "traditional" hip-hop audience, they've brought kids who might otherwise not be listening to it at all and now are checking for other (albeit similar-themed) hip-hop. I think that's the definition of what we're talking about here, don't you?
Thanks for taking the time to write this. Atmosphere seems to catch a lot of unnecessary and undeserved shit 'round these parts.
And Dibbs, if you're reading this, please take note that I stuck up for you guys and leave me off the "internet shit-talkers who I will track down and feed their own teeth to" list. I don't need "SERVED - TTT" stamped across my forehead.
Comments
Well that is true, but I think that is less a question of "transcending" rap than it is of never having really intersected with it to begin with. It's not as if those guys actually had a large following made up of rap fans prior to being adopted by indie rock dudes.
that may be, i don't really know either way. but they must have at least thought tthemsevles to be b-boys when they were out painting freights and listening to nas or whatever.
maybe some songs by LL Cool J, Snoop, or Ice Cube. they've done all those shitty movies. (once again, not sure how "trancendent" that is)
faux you are way off base with this one. ignorance about rhymesayers might make you a better person, but thinking that that ignorance gives you an opinion on their product, we'll that's just stupid.
No. I. am. not.
And you really are not the dude to try and step to me on some rap shit.
I've never offered an opinion on their product and I really don't have one, beyond a relative certainty that it is not for me.
What I have done is offered a perspective on their audience, and if you're really going to try to argue that point with me then you're, uh, more detached from reality than most people on SoulStrut.
Fuck The Police-NWA
Agreed on Fight The Power, Rebirth of Slick, Self Destruction,The Message,Humpty Dance and Cop Killer.
Nuthin But a G Thang-changed hip hop and pop music as we know it
Hit Em Up Pt 1&2-got a few dudes killed (maybe?)
Who Shot Ya-see above
I was gonna say Bring The Noise Remix w/Anthrax-mixed bonafide heavy metal with hip hop. But it didn't really do much.
Peace!
T.N.
There was a Hit Em Up Pt. 2???
House of Pain - Jump around
Back by dope demand - King Bee
walk this way - run dmc
Dudes are cool as hell and not concerned with whether or not they appear to be "hip-hop" to people like you. I give them hella respect for doing them, not trying to be something they're not.
Their impact is less about the older post-indie-college kids you speak of, and much more about the kids who found them when they were 14 and hadn't really heard any hip-hop. In their ability to transcend the "traditional" hip-hop audience, they've brought kids who might otherwise not be listening to it at all and now are checking for other (albeit similar-themed) hip-hop. I think that's the definition of what we're talking about here, don't you?
2Pac didn't get it all wrapped up in part 1
I would also add that most of my west coast non-Soulstrut folks love all that stuff. And they are normal music fans (by that I mean people who own hundreds of CDs, go to shows, but don't make music or obsessively follow artists, etc.) who are also fans of Wu-Tang, Jay-Z, 2Pac, Biggie, 50 and the like. Most of the Atmosphere/Slug/Anticon fans I know have a pretty well-rounded idea of rap-related shit.
It seems like the normal Soulstrut "backpack" "scion-hop" "sellout" "keyboard beats" "BITD" -driven discussions here argue minutia that isn't argued as much in the real world. While I enjoy the debate, I don't think my dudes in California could give a fuck if The Game is using keyboard beats on his new album or if Slug is playing Scion-sponsored events.
As far as transcending, I tend to think of what shows up on parental radars, like missbassie spoke of. My mom knows PE, Snoop, Biggie and 2pac, but doesn't know Wu-Tang or Jay-Z. I imagine in a few years some more will sink in, surely Jay-Z, but I doubt my mom will ever know who Atmosphere is.
Not to say my mother is a good barometer of transcendence, but I think looking through her eyes is a good gague.
Anyone who can get soccer moms to by her albums and US to buy her albums... and still work with the likes of Fatman Scoop...
Plus at least a couple of her singles will be considered 'oldies' of the future...
A-ight, THIS is one of the main ones that I was thinking of when I brought this subject up. Run and D had messed around with rock previously, but "Walk This Way" really knocked down the wall (as shown vividly in the video BTW) and paved the way for all the rock-n-rap hybrids that we see right to this day.
I can dig some of the songs people have suggested thus far. For me, though, if it's "transcending" hip hop (in other words, surpassing the confines of the hip hop realm and becoming bigger than hip hop, if that isn't too condescending a thought) it's gotta be a pretty huge record. It's gotta kinda shake up the world like Ali knocking out Liston. But it's cool to see how different people interpret the use of that word "transcending"... there's really a lot of ways to look at it.
Thanks for taking the time to write this. Atmosphere seems to catch a lot of unnecessary and undeserved shit 'round these parts.
And Dibbs, if you're reading this, please take note that I stuck up for you guys and leave me off the "internet shit-talkers who I will track down and feed their own teeth to" list. I don't need "SERVED - TTT" stamped across my forehead.
And oh yeah, Cas is my friend.
Really.
Herm
Two german records:
Advanced Chemistry "Fremd Im Eigenen Land"
Der Blitzmob "Die Organisation"
You should check them out, on soulseek or something. Those records definitely changed Hip Hop in Germany.