does Kelefa Sanneh have issues?

rootlesscosmorootlesscosmo 12,848 Posts
edited March 2006 in Strut Central
I think this fool Matisyahu sucks.But this article seems to have some whole other undertones going on.Anyway, just wondering if anyone had any thoughts. Not trying to start a race riot here either by the way.March 8, 2006Reggae Review | MatisyahuDancehall With a Different Accent By KELEFA SANNEHOn Monday night, America's most popular reggae singer took the stage wearing a black hat and a long black coat, but it wasn't a costume. The singer is Matisyahu, a former hippie from White Plains. Once he followed Phish. Now he follows the teachings of Hasidic Judaism. And tons of fans follow him. Monday's concert was the first of two sold-out shows at the Hammerstein Ballroom. And yesterday he released his major-label debut album, "Youth" (JDub/Or/Epic), which is all but certain to enter the pop charts near the top. The record is dull, and the concert was often worse.Still, once you hear Matisyahu's music, you may wonder why someone didn't think of this sooner. The plaintive, minor-key melodies of reggae aren't so far removed from the melodies Matisyahu would have heard, and sung, when he attended the Carlebach Shul, on the Upper West Side. And the imagery of Rastafarianism borrows heavily from Jewish tradition: Matisyahu is by no means the first reggae star to sing of Mount Zion, although he might be the first one who has had a chance to go there.Matisyahu's black hat also helps obscure something that might otherwise be more obvious: his race. He is a student of the Chabad-Lubavitch philosophy, but he is also a white reggae singer with an all-white band, playing (on Monday night, anyway) to an almost all-white crowd. Yet he has mainly avoided thorny questions about cultural appropriation. He looks like an anomaly, but if you think of him as a white pop star drawing from a black musical tradition, then he may seem like a more familiar figure.His sound owes a lot to early dancehall reggae stars like Barrington Levy and Eek-a-Mouse, who delivered half-sung lyrics over bass-heavy grooves. On "Youth," which was mainly produced by Bill Laswell, he is sometimes accompanied by electronics and backup vocals. The Hammerstein concert was sparser: a three-man band played the music while Matisyahu sang and twisted and hopped. His heavy-handed lyrics (like "Fan the fire for the flame of the youth"), delivered in a slightly Jamaican-inflected accent, don't benefit from the stripped-down arrangements. And while he worked hard to entertain ??? rapping in double-time, beat-boxing, showing off some exuberant, high-stepping dance moves ??? he rarely sounded like the musical conqueror he wants to be. Perhaps Matisyahu's fans aren't familiar with a little-known group of performers who still make great reggae records: Jamaicans. [/b] Maybe they are waiting for a shopping list of the best recent reggae CD's from Jamaica. So here's a start: Richie Spice, "Spice in Your Life" (Fifth Element); Luciano, "Lessons of Life" (Shanachie); Sizzla, "Da Real Thing" (VP).Matisyahu has built a following by bypassing reggae fanatics (many of his fans come from the jam-band world). That explains why he outsells and outdraws his Jamaican counterparts. And it may also explain why some listeners find his music so exciting. Certainly no one seemed disappointed after Monday's concert. And as the crowd filed out, a wry young black woman working the door could be overheard singing to herself. It was a line from an older reggae song: "Could You Be Loved," by Bob Marley. "Don't let them fool you," she sang.
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  Comments


  • mannybolonemannybolone Los Angeles, CA 15,025 Posts
    Why would K have to have issues for pointing out what would be a fucking obvious point to make by anyone discussing this artist: he's a white dude doing reggae. I mean, I know Snow pretty much broke that ground 15 years ago but it's sort of the white elephant (pun intended) in the room.

    I don't think K is saying, "a white Jew shouldn't be doing reggae." I think he's suggesting, however, "this dude is wack yet successful but if you really like reggae, maybe you should see what Jamaicans do with their own musical culture." It's no different than giving Eric Clapton a sideways glance and suggest people listen to Robert Johnson first if they want to understand what the blues are about.

  • rootlesscosmorootlesscosmo 12,848 Posts
    maybe.

    it just seems like the obvious point to make. is no one talking about the fact that this guy is white, and thus is sanneh making some bold statement here? no, he's not. he's basically hating on a white guy for performing a black art. sorry, but that's just boring to me.

    the article seems to boil down to the fact that the author doesn't like this artist or his album or his concert. fine. but that's not really what the article is about. the author seems less concerned with this artist and his music and more concerned with (read: mad at) dude's success. so he writes an article about why people who like reggae shouldn't like this guy.

    plus sanneh says it himself: this fool doesn't have real reggae heads for fans. so why bother directing them to cop the new sizzla album? i don't think anyone would argue with the fact that Jamaicans make good reggae music. to point that out is pretty patronizing. none of the white folks at dude's concert would read this review and be like, "word? Jamaican people make reggae, too? man, I'ma have to go get me some of that." that's obviously not what it's about for the deadheads who go see this guy. and the author knows this. he's just mad.

    sorry if that's your hommie by the way, but I always thought this author sucked.

  • keithvanhornkeithvanhorn 3,855 Posts
    that article misses the point. matisyahu is bringing reggae to a crowd who doesn't buy luciano and capleton albums, but might now that they have been introduced to a new genre. no shit he isn't that good. no shit there are "original" reggae artists who are much better. when did matisyahu claim to be the godfather of reggae?

    imo, the tone of this article would be ok if matisyahu had appropriated reggae music and was offering it as some new made-up genre (hassidic-ton?). he is not doing that!

    i can't say that i am a fan of dude's music, but he definitely "keeps it real" as far as his lyrics go. not surpisingly, the author of this article doesnt even mention the fact that matisyahu is speaking on issues that much of his listeners (fellow hebrews) can relate to.


  • Tuff_GongTuff_Gong 627 Posts
    I dunno if the writer has "issues", but he certainly doesn't like Matisyahu and seems to bear a grudge against those that do. It's a bit presumptuous of him to assume that because somebody likes Matisyahu they're unaware of Jamaican artists. I'm white and a fan of reggae and I like Matisyahu; I'm also well aware of the Jamaican artists making music. What, one has to be from Jamaica in order to appreciate and play reggae? And if I don't happen to agree with the writer's opinion that the artists listed are better than Matisyahu then what? Personally I don't like Sizzla all that much if only because of his sad, rampant homophobia.

    Personally I resisted even giving Matisyahu a chance for a long time. Just based on the concept -- a strict Hasidic Jew singing reggae and working in elements of rap -- I thought for sure it had to be a joke. Then a friend of mine who would be the last person in the world to buy into something like that said that he'd heard Matisyahu and he was really good. At that point I figured it wouldn't hurt to check his music out and while at a campus music store they had "Live At Stubbs" on a listening station back about 6 months ago. I listened and was impressed enough that I walked out having purchased a copy of the CD. Is Matisyahu the greatest thing I've ever heard? No, he's not going to go down as one of the reggae greats of all time. Totally discrediting his music because he's white and the fact that some people who like him might not know of or even care about active Jamaican musicians? Well, that seems silly to me. You're going to fault Matisyahu for the prospective ignorance of his fans? Yeah, that's stupid. It's also stupid to assume that because one is white and at a Matisyahu concert that they're completely unaware of Jamaican artists. Does liking one preclude liking the other? Sounds to me like Kelefa Sanneh simply holds a grudge against people who are unaware of the Jamaican artists he thinks are better and more authentic than Matisyahu. He's certainly entitled to his opinion.

    And that bit at the end about the black lady at the door supposedly singing the line from "Could You Be Loved"? That sounds a bit too convenient to have really happened. Sounds like a bit of poetic license to end the article to me.

  • d_wordd_word 666 Posts
    I thought this article was great.

    he's basically hating on a white guy for performing a black art.

    Sanneh's sayin far more interesting things than that. One part you bolded yourself:

    Perhaps Matisyahu's fans aren't familiar with a little-known group of performers who still make great reggae records: Jamaicans.

    It's some sad-assed shit that the top selling reggae artist in America is white. Why? Because he is not sellin so much cause he is better, but because the audience feels that they can "relate" to him better. That's some bullshit. Meanwhile contemporary reggae made by Jamaicans gets ignored or dismissed. This is a racial issue. Sanneh is pointing this out.

  • d_wordd_word 666 Posts
    Folks, folks, why go for the margarine when you can have the butter?


  • keithvanhornkeithvanhorn 3,855 Posts

    It's some sad-assed shit that the top selling reggae artist in America is white. Why? Because he is not sellin so much cause he is better, but because the audience feels that they can "relate" to him better. That's some bullshit. Meanwhile contemporary reggae made by Jamaicans gets ignored or dismissed. This is a racial issue. Sanneh is pointing this out.

    I thought "relating" to music/art/literature has just as much to do with your appreciation of it than the objective quality of the work. There are a lot of paintings/books/movies that are critically acclaimed but are just not my cup of tea. Why is it even relevant that there is better reggae music made by jamaicans? Certain people, mainly white people (many of them jews), are feeling this dude. Enough said. NOt to reiterate my earlier post, but the bottom line is that matisyahu is not passing himself off as anything but a hassidic guy who likes reggae music and sings about things relevant to him....which are apparently relevant to his fans as well.

    Finallly, even if people are only buying his shit cause he is white (which is very possible for some), what is the harm? he is exposing people to new music and the chances are that if they like his shit, they will be interested in buying other reggae.

  • Tuff_GongTuff_Gong 627 Posts
    I thought this article was great.

    he's basically hating on a white guy for performing a black art.

    Sanneh's sayin far more interesting things than that. One part you bolded yourself:

    Perhaps Matisyahu's fans aren't familiar with a little-known group of performers who still make great reggae records: Jamaicans.

    It's some sad-assed shit that the top selling reggae artist in America is white. Why? Because he is not sellin so much cause he is better, but because the audience feels that they can "relate" to him better. That's some bullshit. Meanwhile contemporary reggae made by Jamaicans gets ignored or dismissed. This is a racial issue. Sanneh is pointing this out.

    I don't really think it's a racial issue though, I think it's a culture issue. Do you really think people would make a conscious effort to not buy similar music by Jamaican artists if they were aware of those artists? The difference between Matisyahu and the Jamaican artists is that Matisyahu has a video getting regular play on MTV (or so I've heard, don't watch MTV) and I've seen all kinds of articles about Matisyahu in music mags and on music websites. What's being done to promote the Jamaican artists? Probably not a lot because they're in Jamaica. It's a proximity thing. If they wanna come over here and build up a fanbase and get as popular as Matisyahu is, more power to them. I don't think people aren't buying albums by those artists because they're black, they're not buying the albums because they're not aware of them. Let's be honest here, the average music buyer is not a huge music nerd like a lot of us on sites like this tend to be; they have to be force-fed the music they buy by being made aware of it in the media. I don't see a whole lot of stories about most Jamaican artists in magazines or on websites (unless it's negative press like Sizzla got not too long ago, for instance).

    Besides, why is it bullshit if they think they can relate to Matisyahu better? You think your average American is going to relate to a Jamaican artist talking about growing up in Kingstown ghettos or something? Again, I maintain it's cultural more than racial. Most people aren't ignoring or dismissing reggae made by Jamaicans; you can't ignore or dismiss what you're not aware of in the first place. If a true Jamaican artist gets the proper hype behind them and people like the music enough it'll catch on. Look at Sean Paul. I don't personally care for his music (or dancehall in general) but he seemed to catch on just fine.

  • d_wordd_word 666 Posts
    Finallly, even if people are only buying his shit cause he is white (which is very possible for some), what is the harm?

    It is a sign that racism is a heavy force even with young popular music audiences. This is something many people, including many NYTimes readers, would rather not realize.

    Dealing with shit like this is a great way to write a concert review. I think it is a great article.

    And BTW I think Matisyahu is okay, nothing personal against him. I didn't get the impression that Sanneh had anything personal against the artist either, did you?

  • keithvanhornkeithvanhorn 3,855 Posts
    Finallly, even if people are only buying his shit cause he is white (which is very possible for some), what is the harm?

    It is a sign that racism is a heavy force even with young popular music audiences. This is something many people, including many NYTimes readers, would rather not realize.


    you needed matisyahu's record sales to tell you that there is racisim? my point was that the positive EFFECT of him selling these hassidic-ton records is that more people will be put-on to reggae. now what is the negative effect?

  • BrianBrian 7,618 Posts
    my point was that the positive EFFECT of him selling these hassidic-ton records is that more people will be put-on to reggae.
    Yeah, right. This is the kind of shit people listen to so that they can act like they're all diverse and shit. If having a copy of Bob Marley's Legend wasn't enough to act like they are down with Reggae, this is. I can totally see people namedropping him on some "Oh, and I listen to some Jewish music too!" shit.

  • d_wordd_word 666 Posts
    you needed matisyahu's record sales to tell you that there is racisim? my point was that the positive EFFECT of him selling these hassidic-ton records is that more people will be put-on to reggae. now what is the negative effect?


    That's fine that you're talking about the optimistic 'effect.' But what you are talking about was acknowledged in the article.

    Maybe they are waiting for a shopping list of the best recent reggae CD's from Jamaica. So here's a start: Richie Spice, "Spice in Your Life" (Fifth Element); Luciano, "Lessons of Life" (Shanachie); Sizzla, "Da Real Thing" (VP).


    But the review was about a brother who shows up to a reggae gig in NY and sees a white band with an almost all white crowd and so he asks "why?"

    I think that's a great question to ask.

  • keithvanhornkeithvanhorn 3,855 Posts


    But the review was about a brother who shows up to a reggae gig in NY and sees a white band with an almost all white crowd and so he asks "why?"

    I think that's a great question to ask.

    answer: racisim + jews relating to his lyrics/showing support for a fellow hebrew + word of mouth recommendations to come see this novelty act

    i'm not trying to come off as matisyahu's personal defense team, but this article picks an easy target and misses badly.

  • keithvanhornkeithvanhorn 3,855 Posts
    my point was that the positive EFFECT of him selling these hassidic-ton records is that more people will be put-on to reggae.
    Yeah, right. This is the kind of shit people listen to so that they can act like they're all diverse and shit. If having a copy of Bob Marley's Legend wasn't enough to act like they are down with Reggae, this is. I can totally see people namedropping him on some "Oh, and I listen to some Jewish music too!" shit.

    this music is authentic for what it is. not jamaican reggae, but an adaptation of reggae style lyrics and beats. to each his own. not everyone cares to delve deep into the history of music, nor should they be required to. its entertainment, right?

  • d_wordd_word 666 Posts
    Did you not like the article simply because it was cynical about Matisyahu's popularity, or is there something more specific you want to get at? (serious question)

  • keithvanhornkeithvanhorn 3,855 Posts
    Did you not like the article simply because it was cynical about Matisyahu's popularity, or is there something more specific you want to get at? (serious question)

    i don't like it because i don't agree that Matisyahu is appropriating jamaican reggae music and offering up some sort of inauthentic replica for white folks that can be easily digested. while the end of my last sentence might be true, i think matisyahu is authentic in his music and image. what is the harm if he borrows from reggae, so long as he doesn't pass it off as his own genre. that is my basic problem with this article.

  • d_wordd_word 666 Posts
    Did you not like the article simply because it was cynical about Matisyahu's popularity, or is there something more specific you want to get at? (serious question)

    i don't like it because i don't agree that Matisyahu is appropriating jamaican reggae music and offering up some sort of inauthentic replica for white folks that can be easily digested. while the end of my last sentence might be true, i think matisyahu is authentic in his music and image. what is the harm if he borrows from reggae, so long as he doesn't pass it off as his own genre. that is my basic problem with this article.

    I missed the part where the article claims that "Matisyahu is appropriating jamaican reggae music." (The closest it comes is pointing out that no one has asked about this yet. Far from the same thing.)

    You'll also notice that the cynical parts are when the writer is talking about the audience.

    I came to this thread cause the original post asked if the writer "has issues" and "other undertones." If he does have these they are on point and correct.

  • keithvanhornkeithvanhorn 3,855 Posts


    I missed the part where the article claims that "Matisyahu is appropriating jamaican reggae music." (The closest it comes is pointing out that no one has asked about this yet. Far from the same thing.)

    "Yet he has mainly avoided thorny questions about cultural appropriation. He looks like an anomaly, but if you think of him as a white pop star drawing from a black musical tradition, then he may seem like a more familiar figure."

  • d_wordd_word 666 Posts


    I missed the part where the article claims that "Matisyahu is appropriating jamaican reggae music." (The closest it comes is pointing out that no one has asked about this yet. Far from the same thing.)

    "Yet he has mainly avoided thorny questions about cultural appropriation. He looks like an anomaly, but if you think of him as a white pop star drawing from a black musical tradition, then he may seem like a more familiar figure."

    Well, I think we are on different pages. There's far different tones to each of those examples.

    What part of "a white pop star drawing from a black musical tradition, then he may seem like a more familiar figure." don't you like? You sayin it ain't true?!??!

  • keithvanhornkeithvanhorn 3,855 Posts


    I missed the part where the article claims that "Matisyahu is appropriating jamaican reggae music." (The closest it comes is pointing out that no one has asked about this yet. Far from the same thing.)

    "Yet he has mainly avoided thorny questions about cultural appropriation. He looks like an anomaly, but if you think of him as a white pop star drawing from a black musical tradition, then he may seem like a more familiar figure."

    Well, I think we are on different pages. There's far different tones to each of those examples.

    What part of "a white pop star drawing from a black musical tradition, then he may seem like a more familiar figure." don't you like? You sayin it ain't true?!??!

    It is true, but the author intentionally said that "he has mainly avoided" questions about appropriation, which to me, coupled with the next quoted sentence, means that he is implying that if it looks like a duck and acts like a duck.....

    Why plant this negative seed? He could have just as easily distinguished matisyahu as being a positive example of an artist paying tribute to a genre of music without trying to act like he made his own or reps something that he is not.

  • d_wordd_word 666 Posts
    Okay, here's an article that plants a "negative seed" that's good times to read, if you haven't seen it already:


    *** [i]

    "What's Left After Bling, Boasts and Odd Beats"
    NYTIMES
    By KELEFA SANNEH

    Published: February 16, 2005

    Why is it so hard to be an underground hip-hop hero? Perhaps because the mainstream hip-hop heroes have already claimed so much of the best turf for themselves.

    "I like 99 rappers, but Jay-Z ain't one," Sage Francis declared at the Bowery Ballroom on Wednesday night. And to prove it, he steered clear of all things Jay-Z-ish. That meant no slick outfits (the rapper and his band all wore black jumpsuits), no jewelry, no high-life boasts or low-life threats. But it also meant no impossibly smooth stanzas filled with hidden jokes and counterrhythms; no mesmerizing stories or irresistible refrains; no state-of-the-art beats or propulsive club tracks.

    What was left? Lots of bitter sarcasm, for starters. Mr. Francis, a white rapper, has built his career on a foundation of rage and disillusionment: when he said, "This song is about how awesome guns are," listeners knew he meant the opposite; when he began the show with a verse that started, "I used to think that rappers had it figured out," everyone knew that he was about to explain how wrong he'd been.

    Mr. Francis has spent the past few years amassing a cult of fans who prefer the overwrought to the overproduced. He delivers his heavy-handed barrages with the single-minded fury of a punk rock singer, which might be one reason that his new album, "A Healthy Distrust," was released by the punk label Epitaph. (To get a taste of the fractious, obsessive world of Sage Francis fans, visit the energetic Internet forum, inhalerproductions.com/forum/index.php, that he calls home.

    The album has lots of densely written rhymes and even a tune or two (the indie-rock singer Will Oldham contributes a chorus), but it's still no fun to listen to: there are some clever couplets ("In a world where the girls got retro tattoos/ All I've got is a gut and Velcro black shoes"), but his harangues don't give them room to breathe.

    At Bowery Ballroom, Mr. Francis's backup rappers (two women, one man) sometimes added some playful energy by pairing off, boy-against-girl, trading gruff lines for sing-song ones. But the most ambitious new songs sounded even worse live. A drawn-out version of "Sun Vs Moon" only highlighted the ill-considered lyrics: "God's not a woman/ He's a big white guy in the sky/ And the deserts are reflections of his eyes." (And he wonders why some rappers stick with crime and clubs?)

    This was a night overrun with words, so perhaps it's no surprise that the highlight was all words: an a cappella version of "Slow Down Gandhi," his bitter but ambivalent protest poem. Whispering and shouting and singing and talking, Mr. Francis lambasted both warmongers and pacifists, getting closer and closer to his perverse goal: he's a rapper who dreams of being a lecturer.[i]

  • keithvanhornkeithvanhorn 3,855 Posts
    Okay, here's an article that plants a "negative seed" that's good times to read, if you haven't seen it already:


    "What's Left After Bling, Boasts and Odd Beats"
    NYTIMES
    By KELEFA SANNEH


    Dude, are you the author (Kelefa)? If so, don't take too much offense to my criticism, i've been at work since 9am yesterday (east coast time), so im basically just irritable and anxious to hate.

  • d_wordd_word 666 Posts
    S'all gravy doud! ....

  • FatbackFatback 6,746 Posts
    His taste is suspect* sometimes, but overall he's one of the better music writers at the NYT or anywhere.

    *you could argue very diverse.

  • hassidic-ton


    I like K's work at the Times. Dude seems to truly like music, which is really rare these days.

    As for Matisyahu....what makes his whole image and audience somewhat 'ironic', at least in New York, is this:

    Cown Heights Riots

  • faux_rillzfaux_rillz 14,343 Posts
    Jamaicans make good the only reggae music.

    I foresee high levels of asshurtedness in the future of this thread...

  • djannadjanna 1,543 Posts
    When I found out that dude wasn't raised Hasidic, but became one after jam-banding it up for years and finding G-d I kind of lost any interest I had in him. I thought the whole thing that was cool that a guy raised in that environment would become a reggae/beatboxer, but eh.

    It's a hell of a gimmick and dude wouldn't be anywhere without that beard and hat, yaoming?

  • This dude is what's known as a b'al tshuvah, essentially someone who comes into the religious fold later on in life. They are often the most zealous practioners of their religion, because they are "filled with religious fervor" (read: insecure about their place in the community or making up for whatever deficit in their lives lead them to convert to begin with). I'm sure I'll catch hell for saying this, but the Lubavitchers are basically a destructive insular cult of personality, based around their so-called messiah Menachem Schneirson. I think the actual[/b] unspoken issue here is the support that this tool receives from Chabad (the social arm of the sect) because they see him as a great ad for their fringe beliefs: doud is a phishead from a toney suburb who got all geeked about the mystical aspects of chasidic judaism and these cats figure that he can open the floodgates to thousands of similarly-situated schmucks.
    Beyond that man, I don't see anything remotely wrongheaded about Sanneh's article. He's simply pointing out (quite accurately) a phenomenon that might be unknown and interesting to Times readers. Besides Matisyahu sucks and his whole appeal is based on his freakshow status: stoned jam-band creeps are all like "dude he's part of an exotic spirtual group and he's got like a long beard and stuff". The music is laughable at best, but beyond that there's nothing[/b] more comical than a lubavitcher appropriating West Indian culture or trying to make comparisons between being a rasta and a chasid, because these dudes have the most[/b] contentious relationship with their West Indian neighbors that you ever seen. Why get up in arms because Kalefah pointed out the hypocrisy and absurdity of the situation? Seems like great journalism to me.

  • This dude is what's known as a b'al tshuvah, essentially someone who comes into the religious fold later on in life. They are often the most zealous practioners of their religion, because they are "filled with religious fervor" (read: insecure about their place in the community or making up for whatever deficit in their lives lead them to convert to begin with). I'm sure I'll catch hell for saying this, but the Lubavitchers are basically a destructive insular cult of personality, based around their so-called messiah Menachem Schneirson. I think the actual[/b] unspoken issue here is the support that this tool receives from Chabad (the social arm of the sect) because they see him as a great ad for their fringe beliefs: doud is a phishead from a toney suburb who got all geeked about the mystical aspects of chasidic judaism and these cats figure that he can open the floodgates to thousands of similarly-situated schmucks.
    Beyond that man, I don't see anything remotely wrongheaded about Sanneh's article. He's simply pointing out (quite accurately) a phenomenon that might be unknown and interesting to Times readers. Besides Matisyahu sucks and his whole appeal is based on his freakshow status: stoned jam-band creeps are all like "dude he's part of an exotic spirtual group and he's got like a long beard and stuff". The music is laughable at best, but beyond that there's nothing[/b] more comical than a lubavitcher appropriating West Indian culture or trying to make comparisons between being a rasta and a chasid, because these dudes have the most[/b] contentious relationship with their West Indian neighbors that you ever seen.[/b] Why get up in arms because Kalefah pointed out the hypocrisy and absurdity of the situation? Seems like great journalism to me.

  • djannadjanna 1,543 Posts


    I agree. And I don't imagine you getting any hell around here for calling out a religious fringe group. Us secular Jews don't really identify with those dudes, at least I don't. I mean, they are kind of crazy. Messiahs, women wearing wigs, arranged marriages, big hats etc etc. I don't mean to clown, but they are a peculiar bunch and very set in their ways. Plus the women seem to get a bad deal in that community.
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