CDs will become obsolete. Vinyl will remain collectible. In my opinion, anyways. This collecting thing continues to grow partially because[/b] record companies constantly undermining vinyl as a medium and despite technology continuing to replace itself with better, newer, faster, stronger media.
Oh, you mean like how 78s stayed collectible when 33s fell out of favor? Wait a minute...
And I think the scarcity (yet still somewhat available) has helped 12" records immensely. It's a novel, hip thing to have records, or to DJ. Well, it was.
You can thank DJing for helping out "modern" 33s/45s to remain popular well beyond their deathtoll.
Digital DJing may kill that though, you'll no longer need records to scratch and mix.
And let me make it clear that I'm not picking on Bay shit: I've only heard a little, but what I have heard has a whole lot of character. I don't know why people don't talk more about said character.
James, honestly with all the blud and UHHHHHH VIRGEN and yeeeeee and livin layvish and what is it though and top floor of the mark hopkins going on on this site... I'm surprised you haven't noticed how much that character has infiltrated...
The basic factors that contribute to high prices on Northern Soul 45s also apply to rap rarities, but the demographic that the latter appeals to is less monied
....save for the temperal component which Northern has a decade+ lead in (and all the ramifications there of, snowball is larger ).
I think labels will continue to press vinyl on hip-hop, but in increasingly small quantity. It's nuts, big dude DJs out here get serviced with memory sticks now - my dude walks into the club, plugs the stick into the DJ's laptop, DJ throws it on Serato, my dude leaves with the stick and heads to the next spot. Crazy.
see, theres no fun in that though. Saves record labels alot of $$ though!
I bet the label ain't thrilled when that shit ends up on soulseek, tho. All this digital shit is costing people millions. It makes music accessible, but no longer profitable. Something's gonna give. I'd sooner worry about the death of music as a commercially viable artform than the demise of a medium.
That being said, I also don't think vinyl is going anywhere. There are alot of dudes here who are in their 20's. CD has been the dominante medium since before they were born & yet what are they buying today?
That being said, I also don't think vinyl is going anywhere. There are alot of dudes here who are in their 20's. CD has been the dominante medium since before they were born & yet what are they buying today?
yeah, but if the labels are losing revenue due to downloading, don't you think that at some point they are going have to reconsider the cost effectiveness of vinyl? Especially for promos. I'm sure a lot of your A-list DJ guys use CD players or Serato or something, so the memory stick technique (no homo) makes more sense for them. They'd probably appreciate not having crap promos clog up the crib anymore.
The increasingly widespread monomaniacal pursuit of records that are unknown but not too unknown--lest their cachet not be recognized--depresses the fuck out of me. Many such afflicted walk among us.
James, honestly with all the blud and UHHHHHH VIRGEN and yeeeeee and livin layvish and what is it though and top floor of the mark hopkins going on on this site... I'm surprised you haven't noticed how much that character has infiltrated...
That's talk from it, though--"what it do" on some talk about it?
Also: A quick soulstrut search reveals that most of those terms in your post appear only in your post, Big Apple. I have to say that right about now you're coming off more than a little like an unappealing cross between Eddie from my high school (slang perpetrator of the highest order: "I can't believe you haven't heard it...I mean, yeah, I made it up, but everybody says it...no, really...") and Paul from my high school (dude went to community college one state over, but still came back to the high-school parking lot every Friday after school to, you know, "hang"). You might wanna look into that. Start speaking real words, make some friends at your new school, yunno?
And peacefulrotation: Nah, I'm not pointing fingers. Plus, I think you're in a rough position: By all accounts you are That Guy for the Bay rapps, so when the dry-as-toast nuts-and-bolts/dead-wax/commerce issues comes up, I suspect that you're one of a few that can address them, so I knock not your hustle. I was speaking more generally; it just seems like Bay rap gets repped hard (ahem, "hoard") on here, but not very deeply. Maybe it's all circular, though: Maybe the fact that these records are so hard to come by means that very few people have them, and the smaller the group, the more likely that conversations will be on some not-very-expansive "You know this shit?" "Yeah, that shit is the shit!" type shit. I suspect you'd get that with any regional/niche scene, though (see deepfunk), so again, I'm not trying to single y'all out.
I'm no wordsmith so I think the best solution for this is to post some mp3's up with the raer scans. I will feebly mention that I'm usually trying to work when fucking around on this site so spending an hour (I'm a dimwit) trying to eloquently bottle the essence of "Turf Shit" in a paragraph is something I should probably avoid. Actually I should generally just avoid reading most threads. I agree that materialism runs amok in the record nerd landscape and I like many others are trying to come to terms with it. I like the pretty pictures and packaging, but I love the music.
here's B-Legit and E-40's new slap (rick rock, who else?)
Oh, you mean like how 78s stayed collectible when 33s fell out of favor? Wait a minute...
If you're implying they're not, 78s are INSANELY collectible...
A few, most of them are garbage. You can buy 78s by the pound.
GW: sorry dude youre really wrong this time. its just a format that youre not familiar with. i usually agree with what you write and find most of the shit you write comical as FUCK! however, youre wrong. you just dont know the scene and most people dont. i only know very little but what i know has gotten me some nice $$$.
and most records are garbage... there are only a few that are good. so while youre sentence makes sense you should be impling this to ALL genres of music.
Oh, you mean like how 78s stayed collectible when 33s fell out of favor? Wait a minute...
If you're implying they're not, 78s are INSANELY collectible...
A few, most of them are garbage. You can buy 78s by the pound.
GW: sorry dude youre really wrong this time. its just a format that youre not familiar with. i usually agree with what you write and find most of the shit you write comical as FUCK! however, youre wrong. you just dont know the scene and most people dont. i only know very little but what i know has gotten me some nice $$$.
and most records are garbage... there are only a few that are good. so while youre sentence makes sense you should be impling this to ALL genres of music.
Perhaps I am off. My mom has a mad collection of 78s... I mean like 1910's, 1920s 78s... not really worth much though.
But yeah, thinking back most records in general probably aren't worth much.
I still stick to the notion that the market is much smaller, though.
Actually, I didn't go. I lost the inner battle with myself about preserving an important part of history to me vs. how many damn pictures of other peoples paintings do I need. Really, I'm just waiting to hear if any of it is actually good before I go out of my way to document it.
either that or I was just lazy and didn't buy that raer random rap record, err I mean I didn't go to the "graffiti event."
James I think what you see is more like a desire to keep that shit in my lexicon. I nearly lost it when I first moved out here back in 1995. But in all seriousness, the quoted post wasn't said with any seriousness.
Anyway, Josh is right, it is really hard to put all that Yay-ology into a paragraph that you in Chicago can read and get the gist. Bay Area rap is hella self-referential (hence the self-referentiality in my posts) and basically only concerns itself with Bay subjects, Bay sales, and Bay styles. At the risk of sounding elitist (when have I ever cared about that risk) it is definitely something you have to see and feel to "get". Not in terms of enjoying the music, but in terms of understanding the culture that gives it birth.
Right now, actually, I hear a lot of diluted production that sounds like it could be coming out of the South or the East Coast (well, considering that NYC has been aping everyone else for some time now). I am not so hot on that. But I can't be mad at folks wanting to get bigger...
James I think what you see is more like a desire to keep that shit in my lexicon. I nearly lost it when I first moved out here back in 1995. But in all seriousness, the quoted post wasn't said with any seriousness.
Nor was mine ("i_kid.gif"). I know just what you mean about preserving the tongue, believe me.
At the risk of sounding elitist (when have I ever cared about that risk) it is definitely something you have to see and feel to "get". Not in terms of enjoying the music, but in terms of understanding the culture that gives it birth.
Well, one, I suspect that any devout exponent of any scene would say the same thing (when I lived in quarter-horse Anderson, SC, I had some dude tell me that I probably wouldn't "get" motherfucking half-horse forty-five-minutes-away Spartanburg, SC hip-hop), so it stands to reason that the Bay would feel the same. Don't get me wrong, though: I'm all for that kind of local pride, all day; it beats the shit out of scenes that shit on dudes until they go somewhere else and get famous, and then shit on them for not "giving back" (what's good, Chicago?).
And, two, I'm not looking for the keys to the city, and I'm not expecting to be handed any "understanding [of] the culture that gives it birth." I'd just like to hear knowledgeable folks speak on what some of this shit actually, you know, sounds like, and what they think of it. I'm unable to see this whole (and I'm not aiming this at you, Jonny) "If you don't know, there's no way I can tell you" horseshit as anything other than lazy, a cop-out, and a pox upon a generation that already shits on interest and enthusiasm far too much. As abstract and ephemeral as some of its effects may be, this music shit is not pixie dust: it is audible words and music, it's able to be perceived by humans, and is thus capable of being talked about by those who feel so inclined, no matter where the fuck it comes from. I'm sure there's blogs o' plenty out there, but I'm equally sure that they're preaching to the choir. Dudes that feel so strongly enough about their city, their music, and/or their city's music to rep it loudly and publicly, but don't quite feel strongly enough to try to explain it (or, shit, even to just make it alluring) to the uninitiated come off as half-steppers at worst and blocked sparks at best. I mean, where is the Bob Bannister of Bay rap--or New York rap, or Chicago rap, or motherfucking Spartanburg rap--up in here?
I think the first thing to understand is that slang for beats - "slap" or "blap" - is very literal. It's a squishy, digital feeling, too key-based to be sampled, too in the pocket to be Neptunes, and not techno enough to be Lil jon (although the techno presets are getting used more, thanks to him). It's the FUNK, in the most RickyVincent-Zapp-Cameo sense and the least chickenscratch-rare45-drumbreak sense.
The flow is alternately rapid fire and slow, loping - Keak is a perfect example of town shit, mixture of local slang, flow shifting like gears, or more like a sideshow - in Oakland they gas break dip and then scrape* (ie, gassing, breaking, causing the car to dip, and then spinning a donut and peeling off). Of course, the real Bay shit almost needs the MC to be unintelligable to other parts of the country, and Keak is no exception. Dude sounds like a rapping cookie monster.
The slang is crucial. It's major important to have new slang at all times in the Bay Area, it's kind of what we're known for. I have to be in touch regularly with dudes out there or else I fall behind and can't understand a thing.
* The scrape is a couple different things, from what I understand - it can be the wheels bigger than the wells (40 says "we still doing it out here, riding Buick LeSabres/putting dubs on them bitches and calling 'em scrapers") or from a car with the back lowered, scraping the ground.
James I think what you see is more like a desire to keep that shit in my lexicon. I nearly lost it when I first moved out here engaged in some intensive college-age self-exploration and went to far as to purchase Da Boogiemonsters album back in 1995.
James I think what you see is more like a desire to keep that shit in my lexicon. I nearly lost it when I first moved out here engaged in some intensive college-age self-exploration and went to far as to purchase Da Boogiemonsters album back in 1995.
If he still had that lp today, I bet he could get 50 bucks on it. Seems to be popular with some folks.
I think the first thing to understand is that slang for beats - "slap" or "blap" - is very literal. It's a squishy, digital feeling, too key-based to be sampled, too in the pocket to be Neptunes, and not techno enough to be Lil jon (although the techno presets are getting used more, thanks to him). It's the FUNK, in the most RickyVincent-Zapp-Cameo sense and the least chickenscratch-rare45-drumbreak sense.
The flow is alternately rapid fire and slow, loping - Keak is a perfect example of town shit, mixture of local slang, flow shifting like gears, or more like a sideshow - in Oakland they gas break dip and then scrape* (ie, gassing, breaking, causing the car to dip, and then spinning a donut and peeling off). Of course, the real Bay shit almost needs the MC to be unintelligable to other parts of the country, and Keak is no exception. Dude sounds like a rapping cookie monster.
The slang is crucial. It's major important to have new slang at all times in the Bay Area, it's kind of what we're known for. I have to be in touch regularly with dudes out there or else I fall behind and can't understand a thing.
* The scrape is a couple different things, from what I understand - it can be the wheels bigger than the wells (40 says "we still doing it out here, riding Buick LeSabres/putting dubs on them bitches and calling 'em scrapers") or from a car with the back lowered, scraping the ground.
I appreciate your taking the time to put that together, for real.
But just so I'm clear: I'm not asking to be provided with a thumbnail sketch of whatever culture begat whatever record is being discussed; any scene worth talking about is, as you've pointed out, messy enough and self-referential enough that it resists easy translation. At the core, all I'm saying (all's I'm saying, even) is that I wish that folks talked more about why they like or dislike a record. If talking about it means you need to get into cultural context (e.g. "This shit is a step past than his last shit because it's more sample-based than you usually hear out here in the Bay/up here in New York/down here motherfucking Spartanburg"), then do that shit, if it doesn't, then don't. Whatever the case, if you're out of grade school, then you're old enough to have something better than "Yo, that shit is dope/wack/expensive!"
And I know full well that I'm being incredibly idealistic with all this, but fuck it, I'm a romantic.
...
And two side notes:
1. My first real Bay rap What-The-Fuck moment: Several years back, I heard some record where a dude pronounced "sports car" like "spores core." That's what's up.
2. The Boogiemonsters always confound my searches for Beginning Of The End records, so fuck those dudes.
Comments
Oh, you mean like how 78s stayed collectible when 33s fell out of favor? Wait a minute...
And I think the scarcity (yet still somewhat available) has helped 12" records immensely. It's a novel, hip thing to have records, or to DJ. Well, it was.
You can thank DJing for helping out "modern" 33s/45s to remain popular well beyond their deathtoll.
Digital DJing may kill that though, you'll no longer need records to scratch and mix.
have I been a bad boy?
....save for the temperal component which Northern has a decade+ lead in (and all the ramifications there of, snowball is larger
K.
If you're implying they're not, 78s are INSANELY collectible...
I bet the label ain't thrilled when that shit ends up on soulseek, tho. All this digital shit is costing people millions. It makes music accessible, but no longer profitable. Something's gonna give. I'd sooner worry about the death of music as a commercially viable artform than the demise of a medium.
That being said, I also don't think vinyl is going anywhere. There are alot of dudes here who are in their 20's. CD has been the dominante medium since before they were born & yet what are they buying today?
yeah, but if the labels are losing revenue due to downloading, don't you think that at some point they are going have to reconsider the cost effectiveness of vinyl? Especially for promos. I'm sure a lot of your A-list DJ guys use CD players or Serato or something, so the memory stick technique (no homo) makes more sense for them. They'd probably appreciate not having crap promos clog up the crib anymore.
location!!!
A few, most of them are garbage. You can buy 78s by the pound.
That's talk from it, though--"what it do" on some talk about it?
Also: A quick soulstrut search reveals that most of those terms in your post appear only in your post, Big Apple. I have to say that right about now you're coming off more than a little like an unappealing cross between Eddie from my high school (slang perpetrator of the highest order: "I can't believe you haven't heard it...I mean, yeah, I made it up, but everybody says it...no, really...") and Paul from my high school (dude went to community college one state over, but still came back to the high-school parking lot every Friday after school to, you know, "hang"). You might wanna look into that. Start speaking real words, make some friends at your new school, yunno?
And peacefulrotation: Nah, I'm not pointing fingers. Plus, I think you're in a rough position: By all accounts you are That Guy for the Bay rapps, so when the dry-as-toast nuts-and-bolts/dead-wax/commerce issues comes up, I suspect that you're one of a few that can address them, so I knock not your hustle. I was speaking more generally; it just seems like Bay rap gets repped hard (ahem, "hoard") on here, but not very deeply. Maybe it's all circular, though: Maybe the fact that these records are so hard to come by means that very few people have them, and the smaller the group, the more likely that conversations will be on some not-very-expansive "You know this shit?" "Yeah, that shit is the shit!" type shit. I suspect you'd get that with any regional/niche scene, though (see deepfunk), so again, I'm not trying to single y'all out.
I'm no wordsmith so I think the best solution for this is to post some mp3's up with the raer scans. I will feebly mention that I'm usually trying to work when fucking around on this site so spending an hour (I'm a dimwit) trying to eloquently bottle the essence of "Turf Shit" in a paragraph is something I should probably avoid. Actually I should generally just avoid reading most threads.
here's B-Legit and E-40's new slap (rick rock, who else?)
http://s30.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=3BHKV1O2TBCXP27ARDVZ95KRIC
bonus: Hoardthrob (5 minute slaptogether)
http://s28.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=2V57J99J0C8YM1MRWEN6275OF1
GW: sorry dude youre really wrong this time. its just a format that youre not familiar with. i usually agree with what you write and find most of the shit you write comical as FUCK! however, youre wrong. you just dont know the scene and most people dont. i only know very little but what i know has gotten me some nice $$$.
and most records are garbage... there are only a few that are good. so while youre sentence makes sense you should be impling this to ALL genres of music.
My man. I think that was all pretty eloquent.
Thanks for the mp3s.
Perhaps I am off. My mom has a mad collection of 78s... I mean like 1910's, 1920s 78s... not really worth much though.
But yeah, thinking back most records in general probably aren't worth much.
I still stick to the notion that the market is much smaller, though.
Hi, Rob. Not enough.
Word I receive is that you were in my neck of the woods for what I believe was described to me as "a grafitti event." How'd that go?
either that or I was just lazy and didn't buy that raer random rap record, err I mean I didn't go to the "graffiti event."
Anyway, Josh is right, it is really hard to put all that Yay-ology into a paragraph that you in Chicago can read and get the gist. Bay Area rap is hella self-referential (hence the self-referentiality in my posts) and basically only concerns itself with Bay subjects, Bay sales, and Bay styles. At the risk of sounding elitist (when have I ever cared about that risk) it is definitely something you have to see and feel to "get". Not in terms of enjoying the music, but in terms of understanding the culture that gives it birth.
Right now, actually, I hear a lot of diluted production that sounds like it could be coming out of the South or the East Coast (well, considering that NYC has been aping everyone else for some time now). I am not so hot on that. But I can't be mad at folks wanting to get bigger...
blah
Nor was mine ("i_kid.gif"). I know just what you mean about preserving the tongue, believe me.
Well, one, I suspect that any devout exponent of any scene would say the same thing (when I lived in quarter-horse Anderson, SC, I had some dude tell me that I probably wouldn't "get" motherfucking half-horse forty-five-minutes-away Spartanburg, SC hip-hop), so it stands to reason that the Bay would feel the same. Don't get me wrong, though: I'm all for that kind of local pride, all day; it beats the shit out of scenes that shit on dudes until they go somewhere else and get famous, and then shit on them for not "giving back" (what's good, Chicago?).
And, two, I'm not looking for the keys to the city, and I'm not expecting to be handed any "understanding [of] the culture that gives it birth." I'd just like to hear knowledgeable folks speak on what some of this shit actually, you know, sounds like, and what they think of it. I'm unable to see this whole (and I'm not aiming this at you, Jonny) "If you don't know, there's no way I can tell you" horseshit as anything other than lazy, a cop-out, and a pox upon a generation that already shits on interest and enthusiasm far too much. As abstract and ephemeral as some of its effects may be, this music shit is not pixie dust: it is audible words and music, it's able to be perceived by humans, and is thus capable of being talked about by those who feel so inclined, no matter where the fuck it comes from. I'm sure there's blogs o' plenty out there, but I'm equally sure that they're preaching to the choir. Dudes that feel so strongly enough about their city, their music, and/or their city's music to rep it loudly and publicly, but don't quite feel strongly enough to try to explain it (or, shit, even to just make it alluring) to the uninitiated come off as half-steppers at worst and blocked sparks at best. I mean, where is the Bob Bannister of Bay rap--or New York rap, or Chicago rap, or motherfucking Spartanburg rap--up in here?
Damn, I gotta get some lunch.
The flow is alternately rapid fire and slow, loping - Keak is a perfect example of town shit, mixture of local slang, flow shifting like gears, or more like a sideshow - in Oakland they gas break dip and then scrape* (ie, gassing, breaking, causing the car to dip, and then spinning a donut and peeling off). Of course, the real Bay shit almost needs the MC to be unintelligable to other parts of the country, and Keak is no exception. Dude sounds like a rapping cookie monster.
The slang is crucial. It's major important to have new slang at all times in the Bay Area, it's kind of what we're known for. I have to be in touch regularly with dudes out there or else I fall behind and can't understand a thing.
* The scrape is a couple different things, from what I understand - it can be the wheels bigger than the wells (40 says "we still doing it out here, riding Buick LeSabres/putting dubs on them bitches and calling 'em scrapers") or from a car with the back lowered, scraping the ground.
WAIT. Wasn't one of the dudes named "Plex"? ???? Wow
If he still had that lp today, I bet he could get 50 bucks on it. Seems to be popular with some folks.
I appreciate your taking the time to put that together, for real.
But just so I'm clear: I'm not asking to be provided with a thumbnail sketch of whatever culture begat whatever record is being discussed; any scene worth talking about is, as you've pointed out, messy enough and self-referential enough that it resists easy translation. At the core, all I'm saying (all's I'm saying, even) is that I wish that folks talked more about why they like or dislike a record. If talking about it means you need to get into cultural context (e.g. "This shit is a step past than his last shit because it's more sample-based than you usually hear out here in the Bay/up here in New York/down here motherfucking Spartanburg"), then do that shit, if it doesn't, then don't. Whatever the case, if you're out of grade school, then you're old enough to have something better than "Yo, that shit is dope/wack/expensive!"
And I know full well that I'm being incredibly idealistic with all this, but fuck it, I'm a romantic.
...
And two side notes:
1. My first real Bay rap What-The-Fuck moment: Several years back, I heard some record where a dude pronounced "sports car" like "spores core." That's what's up.
2. The Boogiemonsters always confound my searches for Beginning Of The End records, so fuck those dudes.
is "houser" a strictly bay word? always wondered....