I think Harvey's right you guys. People talking about the show in the True Detective thread? Needs to stop!
Anyone with any theories on the quantity on tampons that Det Hart was buying? Seemed abnormally large and I read somewhere that was just more of Marty's tone deafness, or preparing for some heavy blood letting. Another friend - on Facebook, natch - was theorizing that his eldest daughter, "the captain of the varsity slut team," was, well, that something bad was going to happen to her. I am dreading the prospects of that, especially in light of Rust's own demons from his lost daughter even if present-day Hart hasn't alluded to anything along those lines.
So does Marty see footage of his kid as a little kid or as a teen? Rust tells him he has to see something and then he is very upset.
I missed this - this happened in episode 6? Can you please place it for me?
white_tea said:
Anyone with any theories on the quantity on tampons that Det Hart was buying? Seemed abnormally large
lol - I took it for humour, he probably figured a box per gal but then again, three women in the house and that you should be changing those jawns every 4 or so hours, it's about right.
So does Marty see footage of his kid as a little kid or as a teen? Rust tells him he has to see something and then he is very upset.
I missed this - this happened in episode 6? Can you please place it for me?
Agreed on the question...when did this happen, again? Don't recall seeing this moment. Also, if you guys want to go crazy (or get some pretty nice clues sleuthing theories), check out the reddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/TrueDetective/
There is some nonsense on there but there is also some real gems that I missed the first time around on the episodes...
can we talk about how the stoner from dazed and confused is maybe the best actor in the world right now? and how the bartender from cheers isn't getting left too far behind?
SHIT YEAH.
Harrelson is seriously huge in this; McCounaughey has the more bravura role, but this whole show is great because it's a fucking heavyweight fight.
Might almost have to give it Harrelson on account of him being able to shine through McConaughey's glare and hold his own.
The sex scenes were stupid this episode, actually they've been so this whole show. Schoolboy goofy with the court reporter, flat between Marty and Maggie, laughable bounce bounce uh uh uh with T&A-Mobile...
There is so much heat and chemistry coming off the screen in every other scene and they can't manage to direct and shoot a decent fucking?
You knew it was going to happen as soon as Maggie walked into Rust's place and then oh right, here's some angry frustrated revenge sex. Oh here's the aftermath. Now, get out!
Even the bit where Maggie walks into the bar and gets it rolling before her ass even hits the stool.
Does this Pizzolatto dude even know a woman because he sure as hell can't write them. It is by the grace of these women's acting skills the characters are even working. I get good female characters are almost non-existent in film and tv - and that with the cop thing it's first and foremost a man's story - but sheeeeeeeeeiiit, it doesn't help that most of the females on this show are dead, demure, mute or on a pole.
Does this Pizzolatto dude even know a woman because he sure as hell can't write them. It is by the grace of these women's acting skills the characters are even working. I get good female characters are almost non-existent in film and tv - and that with the cop thing it's first and foremost a man's story - but sheeeeeeeeeiiit, it doesn't help that most of the females on this show are dead, demure, mute or on a pole.
Ah, of course! Foreshadowing Beth's special request! Detective Vintage does it again!
now i know there is some forced perspective skew going on in this shot, but unless that bar is 11 feet in diameter, pizzolato looks to be about 5' 2". now couple that with italian clich├® and every female character he writes will be one of the two mary's, the slut or the virgin mother.
I've been able to keep up via the magic of t3h 7orr3n7z0rz, and enjoyed the story so far. I have episode six downloaded but not had the time to watch it, although I think I am already up to speed after reading the posts above.
I think that was Reggie Ledoux that they offed down the farm; the fact that he didn't have the spiral tatt was a simple continuity error. I think Ledoux was a goon in a cult with the head being Tuttle. That's why Tuttle was keen to put his own team on the case, in the same way Corporates sponsor food research to find out sugar doesn't make you fat.
The cult are disposing of their laundry in ritual fashion to keep the po-po obsessing over some lone psycho and not seeing the wood for the trees. The footage of Hart's kid(s) was probably shot by the cult to be surreptitiously disclosed to Hart as a warning message.
Also, in the episode where Hart pulls up to the court secretary's place, drunk, and scatters the discarded kids bike...
Hinting that he did a drunken hit and run on Rust's daughter? The circumstances around her death haven't been expanded on fully, other than she was killed by a driver, IIRC.
I
I think that was Reggie Ledoux that they offed down the farm; the fact that he didn't have the spiral tatt was a simple continuity error. .
we were never told he had a "taft"
his cell mate called it a spiral scar and it was there, below his neck and above the giant taft on his back
briefly shown when he was cuffed and on his knees
Also, in the episode where Hart pulls up to the court secretary's place, drunk, and scatters the discarded kids bike...
Hinting that he did a drunken hit and run on Rust's daughter? The circumstances around her death haven't been expanded on fully, other than she was killed by a driver, IIRC.
Her death has not been explained- I figure it to be Rust hitting her with a car, and that shot being some earlier allusion to it.
To Bassie's point - I agree 100% on the whack ass sex scenes. Gratuitous to the point of distracting, they stand out as being a real low point in this show. The earlier one with Marty that leads to some scintillating dialogue on, "Wha? The killer struck again?" Was awful, and this weeks was so corny with the shots of the little devil. Bro, I get it. He's "sinning". Take it down like seven notches.
I think Maggie is well written, and Monaghan's performance is great. She's strong, and a no bullshit lady. But, the sex scenes and female character issues are worthy of criticism.
Cool - I'm going to put this on ice along with some other articles and the Yellow King stuff. I'm trying to not read anything about the show and just watch it 'fresh'. (It's always more fun to read reviews, etc. after seeing a movie to see how the writer saw it)
It's been hard though, I don't have a TV (why I didn't see the preview) so I have to wait for the stream site to put it up later in the week which means not looking at this thread and walking away when they start talking about it at work lol
gareth said:
I think Maggie is well written, and Monaghan's performance is great. She's strong, and a no bullshit lady. But, the sex scenes and female character issues are worthy of criticism.
Yea, I think it's Monaghan who is really saving the part and at the end of the day, she's a wife, you know? Not one woman exists independent of a man's agency on the show. I also hate how they turned her character from a strong, clear-headed person to a mess. Newsflash! Men cheat and women *don't* fall apart. I didn't even take that whole scene with Rust seriously. It was a huge character arc for both him and Maggie inconsistent to what we have been shown so far. He can keep his head fully blown on coke and booze, but a couple of drinks and a lightshow and he fucks his partner's wife in an uncontrollable fit of lust and rage? Cmon.
(Unrelated - they did the same to Jan on The Office (US). She went from a capable smart person to a raving bitch of a cartoon character. Anyway.)
I think the best Pizzolatto has done for the women is with Beth** to show that sex work is not some sort of a life sentence or end of life. She did it, she moved on and is now living the same work/party life thousands of other young people do.
About gratuitous - the scene in #3 with Cohle in the archives and they are just showing photo after photo of dead women. Totally unnecessary and cheap. For the most part, the show has an elegance; parts like this with the photos and really bad sex scenes undermine that.
edit - **I would add Jan, the trailer park madam, to the list.
Bad sex scenes? The women looked great. I didn't buy the Maggie/Rust scene until the camera panned down to her lower half; then the lust/weakness made sense. Women willfully engage in sex that they are (or think they should be) conflicted about every minute of every day, and a random peek into those different bedrooms would likely reveal and elicit the full range of human emotions and responses, from love and redemption to pure dread.
I think Harvey's right you guys. People talking about the show in the True Detective thread? Needs to stop!
Anyone with any theories on the quantity on tampons that Det Hart was buying? Seemed abnormally large and I read somewhere that was just more of Marty's tone deafness, or preparing for some heavy blood letting. Another friend - on Facebook, natch - was theorizing that his eldest daughter, "the captain of the varsity slut team," was, well, that something bad was going to happen to her. I am dreading the prospects of that, especially in light of Rust's own demons from his lost daughter even if present-day Hart hasn't alluded to anything along those lines.
I originally thought your point about Marty buying a huge pack of tampons as foreshadowing of bad things to come was laughable and ridiculous, but then again, the new police lieutenant (Vondas from the Wire) called Marty a "Human Tampon," so there might be something there.
Also, the trailer for episode 7 suggests that Marty sees something terrible...perhaps involving his daughter.
Bad sex scenes? The women looked great. I didn't buy the Maggie/Rust scene until the camera panned down to her lower half; then the lust/weakness made sense. Women willfully engage in sex that they are (or think they should be) conflicted about every minute of every day, and a random peek into those different bedrooms would likely reveal and elicit the full range of human emotions and responses, from love and redemption to pure dread.
Newsflash! Men cheat and women *don't* fall apart.
Never? I've seen it happen in real life fairly often, enough to find that scene believable. I can't be the only one here who's experienced or knows someone who's reacted crazily and/or "fallen apart" temporarily over their partner cheating. (I'm not just talking about women either.)
They discuss that in the 'extras' video. How her character did that to put the nail in the coffin, make sure there was absolutely no turning back. (Watching it now and Fukunaga says "drive him away," "destroy his (Hart's) trust in her," and "maybe make herself completely disgusting to him," all of which is understandable, though I would've added "ruined his partner-/friend?-ship" too.)
Granted, maybe I just know some really vindictive people. Ha ha. But still, I don't understand how her reaction makes her character weak. I mean, I feel like Hart is still very much the asshole in all this.
I'm less for blaming Tuttle as the mastermind behind this whole thing then I was before. He's too obvious now after the last episode. I would think that there was some cult operating within his schools and he just tried to cover it up rather then being a member.
As for what was shown in the video in the preview for next season i don't think it has to do anything with his own kids. After his reaction to finding the two kids at Ledoux's that led to his offing and his beating of the two boys found with his daughter ANY scene involving children would get a strong reaction.
i dont think we're going to get nearly the conclusion we want out of this series. the run-up has made it almost impossible to tie up all of the loose ends and winks and cues and nudges in the amount of time they've left in any kind of satisfactory way.
Newsflash! Men cheat and women *don't* fall apart.
Never? I've seen it happen in real life fairly often, enough to find that scene believable. I can't be the only one here who's experienced or knows someone who's reacted crazily and/or "fallen apart" temporarily over their partner cheating. (I'm not just talking about women either.)
They discuss that in the 'extras' video. How her character did that to put the nail in the coffin, make sure there was absolutely no turning back. (Watching it now and Fukunaga says "drive him away," "destroy his (Hart's) trust in her," and "maybe make herself completely disgusting to him," all of which is understandable, though I would've added "ruined his partner-/friend?-ship" too.)
Granted, maybe I just know some really vindictive people. Ha ha. But still, I don't understand how her reaction makes her character weak. I mean, I feel like Hart is still very much the asshole in all this.
I stopped reading the second paragrpah at "extras video".
I never said never. And I don't think I called her reaction weak, since I don't think it. I realize strong people break down, too.
I don't need this show to reflect every possibility in real life. I am talking within the parameters of the program and that the actions of the characters - both her's and Rust's - seem inconsistent/unbelievable and lazy/typical compared to how superior the show is overall.
I mean of all the storylines they could have written, *this* is why Rust and Marty stop being friends? Now, that's what's weak.
She is an otherwise even character, even partaking in the same behaviour she loathes in Marty is questionable to me. Having said that, had she had revenge/angry/hurt sex with whoever and threw it in his face at the dining table same way, it would have made more sense than the blubbering bottle-in hand mess they made her to be and that Rust decided to smash at the kitchen counter.
i dont think we're going to get nearly the conclusion we want out of this series. the run-up has made it almost impossible to tie up all of the loose ends and winks and cues and nudges in the amount of time they've left in any kind of satisfactory way.
i am officially bracing for impact at this point.
do you think we'll find out who the giant with the scarred face is?
i dont think we're going to get nearly the conclusion we want out of this series. the run-up has made it almost impossible to tie up all of the loose ends and winks and cues and nudges in the amount of time they've left in any kind of satisfactory way.
i am officially bracing for impact at this point.
do you think we'll find out who the giant with the scarred face is?
yes. but we wont like it.
my guess is it's not nearly as literal and grotesque as we've built the expectation for.
Yea, I guess I have this embodiment-of-evil, commanding persona in mind as opposed to a whimpering begging in-custody.
Lange has been the only prisoner with a personality, everyone else they have in for holding/questioning, including the two kids caught with the daughter, have been lumps of putty.
I mean of all the storylines they could have written, *this* is why Rust and Marty stop being friends? Now, that's what's weak.
To be fair to the writers, while this action may have been the fatal blow, the writers had already outlined a relationship that was waning between Marty & Rust.
I concur, it's not the most interesting part of the story line (nor do I believe it was meant to be), and for sure it could have been enhanced if the writers felt the need, but it was hardly some M. Night Shyamalan type of "wrap up a 2hr movie in 10mins" weak writing.
I suspect they just needed a viable sub-plot as to why these two persons don't have any relationship anymore - this was probably the easiest that didn't necessarily take away from the primary storyboard.
I mean of all the storylines they could have written, *this* is why Rust and Marty stop being friends? Now, that's what's weak.
To be fair to the writers, while this action may have been the fatal blow, the writers had already outlined a relationship that was waning between Marty & Rust.
(...)
I suspect they just needed a viable sub-plot as to why these two persons don't have any relationship anymore - this was probably the easiest that didn't necessarily take away from the primary storyboard.
But how about one that could have been related or added to it?
I hear you. I think it would have worked (and admittedly have been predictable in its own way) if it had to do with the job/investigation given the "type the report up"/"without me, there is no you" exchange.
Apologies - I feel like I am beating this to death. A momentary weak spot in the plot-line. I'll live.
Comments
Anyone with any theories on the quantity on tampons that Det Hart was buying? Seemed abnormally large and I read somewhere that was just more of Marty's tone deafness, or preparing for some heavy blood letting. Another friend - on Facebook, natch - was theorizing that his eldest daughter, "the captain of the varsity slut team," was, well, that something bad was going to happen to her. I am dreading the prospects of that, especially in light of Rust's own demons from his lost daughter even if present-day Hart hasn't alluded to anything along those lines.
I missed this - this happened in episode 6? Can you please place it for me?
lol - I took it for humour, he probably figured a box per gal but then again, three women in the house and that you should be changing those jawns every 4 or so hours, it's about right.
Agreed on the question...when did this happen, again? Don't recall seeing this moment. Also, if you guys want to go crazy (or get some pretty nice clues sleuthing theories), check out the reddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/TrueDetective/
There is some nonsense on there but there is also some real gems that I missed the first time around on the episodes...
Might almost have to give it Harrelson on account of him being able to shine through McConaughey's glare and hold his own.
The sex scenes were stupid this episode, actually they've been so this whole show. Schoolboy goofy with the court reporter, flat between Marty and Maggie, laughable bounce bounce uh uh uh with T&A-Mobile...
There is so much heat and chemistry coming off the screen in every other scene and they can't manage to direct and shoot a decent fucking?
You knew it was going to happen as soon as Maggie walked into Rust's place and then oh right, here's some angry frustrated revenge sex. Oh here's the aftermath. Now, get out!
Even the bit where Maggie walks into the bar and gets it rolling before her ass even hits the stool.
Does this Pizzolatto dude even know a woman because he sure as hell can't write them. It is by the grace of these women's acting skills the characters are even working. I get good female characters are almost non-existent in film and tv - and that with the cop thing it's first and foremost a man's story - but sheeeeeeeeeiiit, it doesn't help that most of the females on this show are dead, demure, mute or on a pole.
It's in the preview for next week. Rust says he needs Marty to see something and it's a video and Marty is devastated by what he sees.
Ah, of course! Foreshadowing Beth's special request! Detective Vintage does it again!
now i know there is some forced perspective skew going on in this shot, but unless that bar is 11 feet in diameter, pizzolato looks to be about 5' 2". now couple that with italian clich├® and every female character he writes will be one of the two mary's, the slut or the virgin mother.
Now, now. Isn't there enough possible conspiracy to pique your interest? ;)
i've been reading differing opinions from female critics all week.
grantlands molly lambert : http://grantland.com/hollywood-prospectus/her-looming-shadow-grows-the-women-of-true-detective/
new yorkers emily nussbaum: http://www.newyorker.com/arts/critics/television/2014/03/03/140303crte_television_nussbaum
I think that was Reggie Ledoux that they offed down the farm; the fact that he didn't have the spiral tatt was a simple continuity error. I think Ledoux was a goon in a cult with the head being Tuttle. That's why Tuttle was keen to put his own team on the case, in the same way Corporates sponsor food research to find out sugar doesn't make you fat.
The cult are disposing of their laundry in ritual fashion to keep the po-po obsessing over some lone psycho and not seeing the wood for the trees. The footage of Hart's kid(s) was probably shot by the cult to be surreptitiously disclosed to Hart as a warning message.
There's your word-of-the-day.
Hinting that he did a drunken hit and run on Rust's daughter? The circumstances around her death haven't been expanded on fully, other than she was killed by a driver, IIRC.
we were never told he had a "taft"
his cell mate called it a spiral scar and it was there, below his neck and above the giant taft on his back
briefly shown when he was cuffed and on his knees
Her death has not been explained- I figure it to be Rust hitting her with a car, and that shot being some earlier allusion to it.
To Bassie's point - I agree 100% on the whack ass sex scenes. Gratuitous to the point of distracting, they stand out as being a real low point in this show. The earlier one with Marty that leads to some scintillating dialogue on, "Wha? The killer struck again?" Was awful, and this weeks was so corny with the shots of the little devil. Bro, I get it. He's "sinning". Take it down like seven notches.
I think Maggie is well written, and Monaghan's performance is great. She's strong, and a no bullshit lady. But, the sex scenes and female character issues are worthy of criticism.
Cool - I'm going to put this on ice along with some other articles and the Yellow King stuff. I'm trying to not read anything about the show and just watch it 'fresh'. (It's always more fun to read reviews, etc. after seeing a movie to see how the writer saw it)
It's been hard though, I don't have a TV (why I didn't see the preview) so I have to wait for the stream site to put it up later in the week which means not looking at this thread and walking away when they start talking about it at work lol
Yea, I think it's Monaghan who is really saving the part and at the end of the day, she's a wife, you know? Not one woman exists independent of a man's agency on the show. I also hate how they turned her character from a strong, clear-headed person to a mess. Newsflash! Men cheat and women *don't* fall apart. I didn't even take that whole scene with Rust seriously. It was a huge character arc for both him and Maggie inconsistent to what we have been shown so far. He can keep his head fully blown on coke and booze, but a couple of drinks and a lightshow and he fucks his partner's wife in an uncontrollable fit of lust and rage? Cmon.
(Unrelated - they did the same to Jan on The Office (US). She went from a capable smart person to a raving bitch of a cartoon character. Anyway.)
I think the best Pizzolatto has done for the women is with Beth** to show that sex work is not some sort of a life sentence or end of life. She did it, she moved on and is now living the same work/party life thousands of other young people do.
About gratuitous - the scene in #3 with Cohle in the archives and they are just showing photo after photo of dead women. Totally unnecessary and cheap. For the most part, the show has an elegance; parts like this with the photos and really bad sex scenes undermine that.
edit - **I would add Jan, the trailer park madam, to the list.
I originally thought your point about Marty buying a huge pack of tampons as foreshadowing of bad things to come was laughable and ridiculous, but then again, the new police lieutenant (Vondas from the Wire) called Marty a "Human Tampon," so there might be something there.
Also, the trailer for episode 7 suggests that Marty sees something terrible...perhaps involving his daughter.
I love Reynaldo's feminine perspective.
Never? I've seen it happen in real life fairly often, enough to find that scene believable. I can't be the only one here who's experienced or knows someone who's reacted crazily and/or "fallen apart" temporarily over their partner cheating. (I'm not just talking about women either.)
They discuss that in the 'extras' video. How her character did that to put the nail in the coffin, make sure there was absolutely no turning back. (Watching it now and Fukunaga says "drive him away," "destroy his (Hart's) trust in her," and "maybe make herself completely disgusting to him," all of which is understandable, though I would've added "ruined his partner-/friend?-ship" too.)
Granted, maybe I just know some really vindictive people. Ha ha. But still, I don't understand how her reaction makes her character weak. I mean, I feel like Hart is still very much the asshole in all this.
As for what was shown in the video in the preview for next season i don't think it has to do anything with his own kids. After his reaction to finding the two kids at Ledoux's that led to his offing and his beating of the two boys found with his daughter ANY scene involving children would get a strong reaction.
i am officially bracing for impact at this point.
I stopped reading the second paragrpah at "extras video".
I never said never. And I don't think I called her reaction weak, since I don't think it. I realize strong people break down, too.
I don't need this show to reflect every possibility in real life. I am talking within the parameters of the program and that the actions of the characters - both her's and Rust's - seem inconsistent/unbelievable and lazy/typical compared to how superior the show is overall.
I mean of all the storylines they could have written, *this* is why Rust and Marty stop being friends? Now, that's what's weak.
She is an otherwise even character, even partaking in the same behaviour she loathes in Marty is questionable to me. Having said that, had she had revenge/angry/hurt sex with whoever and threw it in his face at the dining table same way, it would have made more sense than the blubbering bottle-in hand mess they made her to be and that Rust decided to smash at the kitchen counter.
do you think we'll find out who the giant with the scarred face is?
yes. but we wont like it.
my guess is it's not nearly as literal and grotesque as we've built the expectation for.
remember this guy? the guy who re-ignited cohle's downward spiral?
what kind of mask you think he was wearing when his shit caught on fire, and why?
Lange has been the only prisoner with a personality, everyone else they have in for holding/questioning, including the two kids caught with the daughter, have been lumps of putty.
To be fair to the writers, while this action may have been the fatal blow, the writers had already outlined a relationship that was waning between Marty & Rust.
I concur, it's not the most interesting part of the story line (nor do I believe it was meant to be), and for sure it could have been enhanced if the writers felt the need, but it was hardly some M. Night Shyamalan type of "wrap up a 2hr movie in 10mins" weak writing.
I suspect they just needed a viable sub-plot as to why these two persons don't have any relationship anymore - this was probably the easiest that didn't necessarily take away from the primary storyboard.
But how about one that could have been related or added to it?
I hear you. I think it would have worked (and admittedly have been predictable in its own way) if it had to do with the job/investigation given the "type the report up"/"without me, there is no you" exchange.
Apologies - I feel like I am beating this to death. A momentary weak spot in the plot-line. I'll live.