the new Black Sabbath

spc

http://www.factmag.com/2013/04/18/listen-to-black-sabbaths-new-nine-minute-single-god-is-dead/

Good song, but I'd really wanted it to sound like early 70s, engineering-wise.

volumen

Hardly anyone even has that equipment . You get that sound playing live onto a 4 track through an old board. Everybody is on the couch going through Pro Tools on a Mac now.

I read it was the Rage drummer on this track. Is he on the whole LP? I know Bill didn't like his contract but I thought it was just for touring. That's going to suck. The Rage drummer is good but Bill Ward is the king.

AndreBreton

That song would be a lot better with a different drummer.

kala

spc said:

http://www.factmag.com/2013/04/18/listen-to-black-sabbaths-new-nine-minute-single-god-is-dead/

Good song, but I'd really wanted it to sound like early 70s, engineering-wise.

likewise
i am really surprised rick rubin didn't go full on 2 inch 24 track with this

PrimeCutsLtd

looks like morticians did their make up.

HarveyCanal

volumen said:

The Rage drummer is good.

No, he's the most simplistically boring drummer ever, best highlighted by any given Audioslave track.

Bon Vivant

HarveyCanal said:

volumen said:

The Rage drummer is good.

No, he's the most simplistically boring drummer ever, best highlighted by any given Audioslave track.

This is not incorrect. Especially the Audioslave mention.

That said, they are playing in my neck of the woods this summer. Might go, if I can get some shrooms.

Horseleech

This is just OK, the production isn't the best, especially the drum sound.

I would still go see them live, as long as Ozzy stays sober they could be pretty good. If Bill Ward comes back they could be great, pay dude already!

volumen

HarveyCanal said:

volumen said:

The Rage drummer is good.

No, he's the most simplistically boring drummer ever, best highlighted by any given Audioslave track.

Ever? Really. I would say he's average. And basically your saying the guys in Black Sabbath are idiots and couldn't pick a good drummer. You think they wanted to stick it to Bill by picking a bad drummer?

I didn't like Audioslave either but Chris C was just as much to blame for that. Who wants to hear Rage style music with a grunge crooner?

AndreBreton

For me it's about the timing.
The drummer doesn't create any tension in the space.
It just chugs along mechanically, filling a void in the sound with no feeling.
I guess it aint got that swing.

Horseleech

AndreBreton said:

For me it's about the timing.
The drummer doesn't create any tension in the space.
It just chugs along mechanically, filling a void in the sound with no feeling.
I guess it aint got that swing.

Yeah, this is something that drummers of Ward's generation understood that many new drummers don't.

I'm really tired of hearing dudes who just hit really hard and think they're playing like John Bonham, when really their mechanical drum bass patterns are just nailing things to the floor instead of making them move. I think a lot of it has to do with the fact that the older school dudes had at a least a feel for jazz drumming and rudiments, while most new rock drummers don't have a clue.

Drummers like Bill Ward know how to play songs, while most modern dudes can only play beats. A generalization, I know, but one that holds true way too often, imo.

volumen

Horseleech said:

AndreBreton said:

For me it's about the timing.
The drummer doesn't create any tension in the space.
It just chugs along mechanically, filling a void in the sound with no feeling.
I guess it aint got that swing.

Yeah, this is something that drummers of Ward's generation understood that many new drummers don't.

I'm really tired of hearing dudes who just hit really hard and think they're playing like John Bonham, when really their mechanical drum bass patterns are just nailing things to the floor instead of making them move. I think a lot of it has to do with the fact that the older school dudes had at a least a feel for jazz drumming and rudiments, while most new rock drummers don't have a clue.

Drummers like Bill Ward know how to play songs, while most modern dudes can only play beats. A generalization, I know, but one that holds true way too often, imo.

I agree, I think your Jazz comment it the key. Those guys listened to Jazz and Funk while they invented Heavy Metal. Now the metal drummers just listen to metal and think it's all about noise and speed and endless double bass. That can be good but not always.

DocMcCoy

Horseleech said:

I think a lot of it has to do with the fact that the older school dudes had at a least a feel for jazz drumming and rudiments, while most new rock drummers don't have a clue.

Pretty much all of the great rock drummers of the 60s came up playing jazz one way or another, or at least listening to it - Mitch Mitchell, Jon Hiseman, Ian Paice, Ginger Baker, Charlie Watts, and so on. Apart from anything else, it gave them a sense of dynamics that very few modern rock wallopers seem to have. Dynamics nowadays has been reduced to quietLOUDquiet.

I may have mentioned this once before, but I remember reading an interview with Steve Harris at the start of Iron Maiden's career, where he cited the Scorpions and Blue Oyster Cult as key influences. I've always seen that as a bit of a turning point, where a generation of rock musicians were coming through who apparently didn't really listen to any other music apart from the kind they played. So now you have the Mike Portnoys and Dave Grohls and Travis Barkers who are all fine drummers, and who I imagine would all cite people like Bonham as an influence, but who probably don't listen to people like Kenny Clarke or Max Roach. I mean, Topper Headon of the Clash always said his favourite drummer was Elvin Jones. There isn't the same kind of connection between modern rock music and black music anymore.

StoneHands

Old equipment isnt even the issue here. You can mix this down right in Pro-Tools, give it alot more kick very easily. The 70's "sound" is as dependent on the engineers' 'ear' as it is on say , tape.