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Is Rap REALLY Youth Music?

Phill_MostPhill_Most 4,594 Posts
edited August 2005 in Music Talk
I mean, I'm pretty damn old and I still love rap. As are a lot of other old fucks that I know. We grew up with this shit, what are we supposed to listen to now, fucking Kenny G??? pop tarts need not reply
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  • marumaru 1,450 Posts
    i'm not really old but i've talked about this with friends and we don't see ourselves ever outgrowing rap.
  • DORDOR Two Ron Toe 9,903 Posts
    Just as long as you never say it's too loud.. Then sir you have a problem...



    Maybe you should switch to some mozart.



    Keep on doin' ur thing!!!





    Funny thing.. Guess what just came on my winamp player?



    Phill Most Chill - That Girl





  • DJ_EnkiDJ_Enki 6,473 Posts
    I mean, I'm pretty damn old and I still love rap. As are a lot of other old fucks that I know. We grew up with this shit, what are we supposed to listen to now, fucking Kenny G???

    pop tarts need not reply

    In general, no, it's not youth music. But in terms of who the biggest consumers are, yeah, it's mostly youth music.
  • andyhoopsandyhoops 154 Posts
    in my eyes it was (mostly) youth music in the beginning but now everyone is all grown up. hip-hop is too huge for this not to happen.

    listen to whatever the fuck you want.
  • Mr_Lee_PHDMr_Lee_PHD 2,042 Posts
    I reckon whatever you have grown up liking, you'll always like.



    I bet when we are older, we'll all hate the new jawn and be reminiscing about when Hip Hop was the bomb.
  • Salary_DizSalary_Diz 735 Posts
    Maybe, but I can't really listen to Kiddy Rap.

    I need grown folk rap.
  • faux_rillzfaux_rillz 14,343 Posts
    I mean, I'm pretty damn old and I still love rap. As are a lot of other old fucks that I know. We grew up with this shit, what are we supposed to listen to now, fucking Kenny G???

    pop tarts need not reply

    Man, it's youth music and always has been. Doesn't mean that older folks can't enjoy it, but there's a reason why every rapper lies about their age.

    And there's a reason why I always see grumpy old f**ks here and elsewhere complaining about the decline in quality in rap over time. The quality hasn't changed, but the music has--it's been driven in different directions by younger artists and audiences. I don't know of anybody that's straight up turned their back on rap, but there's plenty of people on here that prefer to live in the past and listen to boring azz retro-hop because they can't identify with the same sh!t that the younger people who are driving the market are feeling.
  • Mr_Lee_PHDMr_Lee_PHD 2,042 Posts
    "Kid, I remember when everbody was rocking Adidas with them phat ass laces and bumping Big Daddy Kane up out they boomboxes, yaoming?"
  • slushslush 691 Posts
    im finding that as im getting older, a lot of rap is less immediately impactful to me. For example the first time i heard gucci manne, "WHAT IS THIS SHIT... WHAT THE FUCK." but then a week or so later when im all relaxed it hits me and im more inclined to bounce
  • Sun_FortuneSun_Fortune 1,374 Posts
    I go both ways on this one.

    At times, I think I can't really hear the new shit coming out because my ears are older and all the stuff I hear seems so simple. But then I think of the popular rap in like 92 which was like KidnPlay, Heavy D, Vanilla Ice, Hammer etc., and I think what it must have felt like to 25 year old doods then. It must have felt like the end of the world. But people always had to dig deeper to find the music they like. These days Im having a hard time finding new rap because Im still looking in the same area which mostly leads to retro stuff. I would like to look more in the places that others have, like the south and the bay and europe and whatnot, but I just dont feel like it as much. But I know that if I did I would find new shit that moved me.
  • edpowersedpowers 4,437 Posts

    Man, it's youth music and always has been. Doesn't mean that older folks can't enjoy it, but there's a reason why every rapper lies about their age.

    And there's a reason why I always see grumpy old f**ks here and elsewhere complaining about the decline in quality in rap over time. The quality hasn't changed, but the music has--it's been driven in different directions by younger artists and audiences. I don't know of anybody that's straight up turned their back on rap, but there's plenty of people on here that prefer to live in the past and listen to boring azz retro-hop because they can't identify with the same sh!t that the younger people who are driving the market are feeling.

  • spaceghostspaceghost 605 Posts




    now that[/b] we are older, we all hate the new jawn and are[/b] reminiscing about when Hip Hop was the bomb.
  • Phill_MostPhill_Most 4,594 Posts
    I mean, I'm pretty damn old and I still love rap. As are a lot of other old fucks that I know. We grew up with this shit, what are we supposed to listen to now, fucking Kenny G???

    pop tarts need not reply

    Man, it's youth music and always has been. Doesn't mean that older folks can't enjoy it, but there's a reason why every rapper lies about their age.

    And there's a reason why I always see grumpy old f**ks here and elsewhere complaining about the decline in quality in rap over time. The quality hasn't changed, but the music has--it's been driven in different directions by younger artists and audiences. I don't know of anybody that's straight up turned their back on rap, but there's plenty of people on here that prefer to live in the past and listen to boring azz retro-hop because they can't identify with the same sh!t that the younger people who are driving the market are feeling.

    FINALLY somebody who has it all figured out!

    Check back in 20 years and see if you still feel the same way. Not saying that you won't, but... check back in 20 years and see if you still feel the same way.

    Will there even be any rap as we know it in 20 years? (Hmmm, this could make a good thread topic...)

    BTW, I agree completely that the quality of today's rap has not declined one bit. I would even take that further and say that the quality is FAR better today than it has ever been in it's history. Let's take a closer look at this, shall we? For example-

    50 Cent 2005 vs. Rakim 1987
    Young Jeezy 2005 vs. KRS One 1987
    Slim Thug 2005 vs. Ice Cube 1990
    Mike Jones 2005 vs. Scarface 1991
    Dipset 2005 vs. Public Enemy 1988
    The Game 2005 vs. Kool G Rap 1989

    I don't have to continue, do I? 2005 wins, hands down... it's not even close.




  • Salary_DizSalary_Diz 735 Posts
    Can you recomend some (current) music that is not youth music?

    Just curious really.....
  • Salary_DizSalary_Diz 735 Posts
    I mean, I'm pretty damn old and I still love rap. As are a lot of other old fucks that I know. We grew up with this shit, what are we supposed to listen to now, fucking Kenny G???

    pop tarts need not reply

    Man, it's youth music and always has been. Doesn't mean that older folks can't enjoy it, but there's a reason why every rapper lies about their age.

    And there's a reason why I always see grumpy old f**ks here and elsewhere complaining about the decline in quality in rap over time. The quality hasn't changed, but the music has--it's been driven in different directions by younger artists and audiences. I don't know of anybody that's straight up turned their back on rap, but there's plenty of people on here that prefer to live in the past and listen to boring azz retro-hop because they can't identify with the same sh!t that the younger people who are driving the market are feeling.

    FINALLY somebody who has it all figured out!

    Check back in 20 years and see if you still feel the same way. Not saying that you won't, but... check back in 20 years and see if you still feel the same way.

    Will there even be any rap as we know it in 20 years? (Hmmm, this could make a good thread topic...)

    BTW, I agree completely that the quality of today's rap has not declined one bit. I would even take that further and say that the quality is FAR better today than it has ever been in it's history. Let's take a closer look at this, shall we? For example-

    50 Cent 2005 vs. Rakim 1987
    Young Jeezy 2005 vs. KRS One 1987
    Slim Thug 2005 vs. Ice Cube 1990
    Mike Jones 2005 vs. Scarface 1991
    Dipset 2005 vs. Public Enemy 1988
    The Game 2005 vs. Kool G Rap 1989

    I don't have to continue, do I? 2005 wins, hands down... it's not even close.






    such a smartass!!
  • BrianBrian 7,618 Posts
    WU TANG IS FOR THE CHILDREN
  • faux_rillzfaux_rillz 14,343 Posts
    I mean, I'm pretty damn old and I still love rap. As are a lot of other old fucks that I know. We grew up with this shit, what are we supposed to listen to now, fucking Kenny G???

    pop tarts need not reply

    Man, it's youth music and always has been. Doesn't mean that older folks can't enjoy it, but there's a reason why every rapper lies about their age.

    And there's a reason why I always see grumpy old f**ks here and elsewhere complaining about the decline in quality in rap over time. The quality hasn't changed, but the music has--it's been driven in different directions by younger artists and audiences. I don't know of anybody that's straight up turned their back on rap, but there's plenty of people on here that prefer to live in the past and listen to boring azz retro-hop because they can't identify with the same sh!t that the younger people who are driving the market are feeling.

    FINALLY somebody who has it all figured out!

    Check back in 20 years and see if you still feel the same way. Not saying that you won't, but... check back in 20 years and see if you still feel the same way.

    Will there even be any rap as we know it in 20 years? (Hmmm, this could make a good thread topic...)

    BTW, I agree completely that the quality of today's rap has not declined one bit. I would even take that further and say that the quality is FAR better today than it has ever been in it's history. Let's take a closer look at this, shall we? For example-

    50 Cent 2005 vs. Rakim 1987
    Young Jeezy 2005 vs. KRS One 1987
    Slim Thug 2005 vs. Ice Cube 1990
    Mike Jones 2005 vs. Scarface 1991
    Dipset 2005 vs. Public Enemy 1988
    The Game 2005 vs. Kool G Rap 1989

    I don't have to continue, do I? 2005 wins, hands down... it's not even close.

    But, Phill, what do you foresee happening over the next twenty years that would cause me to rethink this?

    I mean, I've already been superannuated by rap--most of the MCs I'm checking for are already substantially younger than me. It's not as if I'm going to reach some turning point after which I'll be an old man in rap terms--I've already hit it.

    And what you're doing--comparing a five year span to a seven month one--isn't exactly fair.
  • faux_rillzfaux_rillz 14,343 Posts
    Can you recomend some (current) music that is not youth music?

    Just curious really.....

    Common

    See?

    Old people rap is not a good look.
  • bull_oxbull_ox 5,056 Posts
    Common

    See?

    Old people rap is not a good look.

    I'm worried that we're going to be seeing a lot more music made for the aging rap fan who's turned off by the rowdy youth of today... the muzak of tomorrow, perhaps...
  • BsidesBsides 4,244 Posts
    ughhh... can we stop posting carrot top in this thread please?


    rappin is for the children man.


  • dayday 9,611 Posts

    And what you're doing--comparing a five year span to a seven month one--isn't exactly fair.

    Faux, you don't think at this stage of their careers that these same dudes in comparison haven't been rapping as long as the one's they're being compared to?

    Skills are skills and some things get better over time but not that better.

    Mike Jones vs. Scarface?

    They could switch places in time and dude would still shut WHO? MIKE JONES. MIKE WHO? down.
  • Young_PhonicsYoung_Phonics 8,039 Posts

    Man, it's youth music and always has been. Doesn't mean that older folks can't enjoy it, but there's a reason why every rapper lies about their age.

    And there's a reason why I always see grumpy old f**ks here and elsewhere complaining about the decline in quality in rap over time. The quality hasn't changed, but the music has--it's been driven in different directions by younger artists and audiences. I don't know of anybody that's straight up turned their back on rap, but there's plenty of people on here that prefer to live in the past and listen to boring azz retro-hop because they can't identify with the same sh!t that the younger people who are driving the market are feeling.


    FAUX_RILLZ= THE OLD DUDE IN THE CLUB


  • volumenvolumen 2,532 Posts
    Common

    See?

    Old people rap is not a good look.

    I'm worried that we're going to be seeing a lot more music made for the aging rap fan who's turned off by the rowdy youth of today... the muzak of tomorrow, perhaps...


    Yea, it's called downtempo.........

    Music is music and it's for everyone. But kids usually fuel what's going on cuz they are the ones standing around screaming and setting trends. Just like any music different lyric topics can reach different people. Young people may get into mindless "let's party" lyrics but the grown ups like to get freaky every now and then. I think a lot of it is image as well. Lot's of people get all stuffy as they get older and they wouldn't want their co-workers to know they "get crunk". But as soon as it's Friday night they let loose. It's all relative really.
  • faux_rillzfaux_rillz 14,343 Posts

    And what you're doing--comparing a five year span to a seven month one--isn't exactly fair.

    Faux, you don't think at this stage of their careers that these same dudes in comparison haven't been rapping as long as the one's they're being compared to?

    Skills are skills and some things get better over time but not that better.

    Mike Jones vs. Scarface?

    They could switch places in time and dude would still shut WHO? MIKE JONES. MIKE WHO? down.

    I'm not sure what you're asking.

    What I'm saying is that Phill's argument that rap used to be better because there were more quality releases during the five year span from 1987 to 1991, than there have been during that seven months that have so far elapsed in 2005, is flawed.

    As far as rappers getting better over time, for the most part I don't think that they do, which is further evidence that rap is youth music. Most dudes kick in the door with a style when they're young, and then gradually fall off (or at least fail to evolve at the same rate that rap as a whole is evolving).
  • dayday 9,611 Posts

    And what you're doing--comparing a five year span to a seven month one--isn't exactly fair.

    Faux, you don't think at this stage of their careers that these same dudes in comparison haven't been rapping as long as the one's they're being compared to?

    Skills are skills and some things get better over time but not that better.

    Mike Jones vs. Scarface?

    They could switch places in time and dude would still shut WHO? MIKE JONES. MIKE WHO? down.

    I'm not sure what you're asking.

    What I'm saying is that Phill's argument that rap used to be better because there were more quality releases during the five year span from 1987 to 1991, than there have been during that seven months that have so far elapsed in 2005, is flawed.

    As far as rappers getting better over time, for the most part I don't think that they do, which is further evidence that rap is youth music. Most dudes kick in the door with a style when they're young, and then gradually fall off (or at least fail to evolve at the same rate that rap as a whole is evolving).

    Ok, I misunderstood the 5 yrs. vs. 7 months comment.

    I agree about the style thing. Anybody else ever cringe when they hear older MCs try to adopt whatever the current style is?
  • faux_rillzfaux_rillz 14,343 Posts

    And what you're doing--comparing a five year span to a seven month one--isn't exactly fair.

    Faux, you don't think at this stage of their careers that these same dudes in comparison haven't been rapping as long as the one's they're being compared to?

    Skills are skills and some things get better over time but not that better.

    Mike Jones vs. Scarface?

    They could switch places in time and dude would still shut WHO? MIKE JONES. MIKE WHO? down.

    I'm not sure what you're asking.

    What I'm saying is that Phill's argument that rap used to be better because there were more quality releases during the five year span from 1987 to 1991, than there have been during that seven months that have so far elapsed in 2005, is flawed.

    As far as rappers getting better over time, for the most part I don't think that they do, which is further evidence that rap is youth music. Most dudes kick in the door with a style when they're young, and then gradually fall off (or at least fail to evolve at the same rate that rap as a whole is evolving).

    Ok, I misunderstood the 5 yrs. vs. 7 months comment.

    I agree about the style thing. Anybody else ever cringe when they hear older MCs try to adopt whatever the current style is?

    Most cringeworthy thing I've heard in the past year or so: that "They call me big el-lay, big el-lay..." terd.

    Don't do it to yourself, Todd. You're one of the greats.
  • Salary_DizSalary_Diz 735 Posts
    OK if you take what phill said and apply it from 2000 to 2005 rather than 7 months.... well, make up your own mind.

    is it phill or phil? hmm. maybe its soullman.
  • bull_oxbull_ox 5,056 Posts
    I agree about the style thing. Anybody else ever cringe when they hear older MCs try to adopt whatever the current style is?

    On the flip side of that though, we're also in age of the respected veteran MC who still makes good records (and they occasionally even sell)... BITD a dude was old after 5 years or whatever...

    A lot of the better dudes around now have been releasing records for 8-12 years and rapping for who knows how long before that...
  • Young_PhonicsYoung_Phonics 8,039 Posts

    And what you're doing--comparing a five year span to a seven month one--isn't exactly fair.

    Faux, you don't think at this stage of their careers that these same dudes in comparison haven't been rapping as long as the one's they're being compared to?

    Skills are skills and some things get better over time but not that better.

    Mike Jones vs. Scarface?

    They could switch places in time and dude would still shut WHO? MIKE JONES. MIKE WHO? down.

    I'm not sure what you're asking.

    What I'm saying is that Phill's argument that rap used to be better because there were more quality releases during the five year span from 1987 to 1991, than there have been during that seven months that have so far elapsed in 2005, is flawed.

    As far as rappers getting better over time, for the most part I don't think that they do, which is further evidence that rap is youth music. Most dudes kick in the door with a style when they're young, and then gradually fall off (or at least fail to evolve at the same rate that rap as a whole is evolving).

    Ok, I misunderstood the 5 yrs. vs. 7 months comment.

    I agree about the style thing. Anybody else ever cringe when they hear older MCs try to adopt whatever the current style is?

    Most cringeworthy thing I've heard in the past year or so: that "They call me big el-lay, big el-lay..." terd.

    Don't do it to yourself, Todd. You're one of the greats.


    Uh...I guess when dude dropped that "butt dog ass" track of "Hey Love" in 95 you thought dude still had it?

    P.S.
    "Headsprung"=white girl cat nip
  • SonicReducerSonicReducer 421 Posts
    Can you recomend some (current) music that is not youth music?

    Just curious really.....

    Smooth Motherfucking Jazz

    In fact, the common trend is to re-do current hip hop and R&B tracks smooth jazz style, all sophisticated and instrumental and grovery, so the urban 35+ professionals can feel young without any youthful angst, cursing, or crude titty talk.

    Honestly, we sell alot of this on CD at the store I work at and not too many younger people ask about or purchase Kim Waters, Brian Culbertson, Alex Bugnon, Fourplay, Paul Hardcastle, or Down To The Bone.

    Also there is another trend in R&B I like to call "grown up music" like Pieces Of A Dream, Will Downing, Gary Taylor, and Kem. Real smooth, quiet storm-like, lights down low, make some sweet love type stuff.

    I don't really recommend it (outside of my main man Kem) unless you're trying to unwind after a stressful day at the office and want to hear mindless, uncomplicated elevator music jazz with a drum machine beat or are trying to get in the panties of woman over 40.

    Seriously, if we didn't sell records and booty music mix CDs at my store, I could probably go for days at work without seeing anyone under 40 years old.

    SONIC
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