DocMcCoy"Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,913 Posts
DustedDon said:
That "Conquer The World" compilation is fascinating. Given how prolific so many r&b labels were back then, I always thought that the reason for the comparatively small amount of obscurities on PIR/PIR-related labels was because, as covered in Frederic Dannen's essential book Hit Men, Gamble & Huff spent so much on payola that their hits-to-bricks ratio was phenomenally good, even by the standards of the day. That said, there used to be a spot in central London where the owner had come up on hundreds of mid-to-late-period PIR promo 45s in mint condition and was knocking them out at five for a tenner. Apart from that Patti Labelle tune that Nelly sampled and a few other things like MFSB's When Your Love Is Gone, most of the titles didn't register with me at all. Then that comp came out and I started to wonder how many of the o.g.'s I'd left sitting in those boxes in Soho a couple of years earlier.
I didn't see dude say anything about "black music". But I sure saw a few of you dudes bring it there. I didn't realize you had to be down with all "black music" to be, you know, really down. In fact, I didn't realize people still thought of "black music" as a category unto itself.
But a thread is easier, and provides a chance for some palaver.
Is that the old speak I detect, Gunslinger? Honor thy fathers face.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
DOPE.
DocMcCoy"Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,913 Posts
DB_Cooper said:
I didn't see dude say anything about "black music". But I sure saw a few of you dudes bring it there. I didn't realize you had to be down with all "black music" to be, you know, really down. In fact, I didn't realize people still thought of "black music" as a category unto itself.
OK, how many white artists do you know on PIR? If you can name one, it'll be the first one I ever heard of. To that end, I don't see anything wrong in bringing it there, as you put it. It's hardly the first time anyone's used the generic term "black music" to describe a particular set of musical idioms such as those exemplified by PIR and its roster. Kind of a strange thing to pull someone up about, if you ask me, but whatever.
I didn't see dude say anything about "black music". But I sure saw a few of you dudes bring it there. I didn't realize you had to be down with all "black music" to be, you know, really down. In fact, I didn't realize people still thought of "black music" as a category unto itself.
OK, how many white artists do you know on PIR? If you can name one, it'll be the first one I ever heard of. To that end, I don't see anything wrong in bringing it there, as you put it. It's hardly the first time anyone's used the generic term "black music" to describe a particular set of musical idioms such as those exemplified by PIR and its roster. Kind of a strange thing to pull someone up about, if you ask me, but whatever.
Dick Jensen
Soul Survivors
DocMcCoy"Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,913 Posts
stratasphere said:
Dick Jensen
Soul Survivors
Well, that there's the something new you learn every day. I was aware of the Soul Survivors connection with Gamble & Huff but I never knew they recorded for PIR, and I've never heard of Dick Jensen at all.
I didn't see dude say anything about "black music". But I sure saw a few of you dudes bring it there. I didn't realize you had to be down with all "black music" to be, you know, really down. In fact, I didn't realize people still thought of "black music" as a category unto itself.
OK, how many white artists do you know on PIR? If you can name one, it'll be the first one I ever heard of. To that end, I don't see anything wrong in bringing it there, as you put it. It's hardly the first time anyone's used the generic term "black music" to describe a particular set of musical idioms such as those exemplified by PIR and its roster. Kind of a strange thing to pull someone up about, if you ask me, but whatever.
It might be a cultural thing, but I never hear folks talking about "Black music" these days. And it strikes me as an antiquated idea that all music made by Black people is of a type and classification of its own. I just don't look at ASAP Rocky, Bad Brains, and Teddy Pendergrass as occupying the same musical genre or conceptual sphere. And outside of music nerds like us, I don't really know many folks who are fans of all three. So drawing the corollary of "if you're into Black music, how are not already into PIR?" seems pretty specious to me.
Not calling you racist or anything???it just seemed like a strange way of looking at the question.
I didn't see dude say anything about "black music". But I sure saw a few of you dudes bring it there. I didn't realize you had to be down with all "black music" to be, you know, really down. In fact, I didn't realize people still thought of "black music" as a category unto itself.
OK, how many white artists do you know on PIR? If you can name one, it'll be the first one I ever heard of. To that end, I don't see anything wrong in bringing it there, as you put it. It's hardly the first time anyone's used the generic term "black music" to describe a particular set of musical idioms such as those exemplified by PIR and its roster. Kind of a strange thing to pull someone up about, if you ask me, but whatever.
It might be a cultural thing, but I never hear folks talking about "Black music" these days. And it strikes me as an antiquated idea that all music made by Black people is of a type and classification of its own. I just don't look at ASAP Rocky, Bad Brains, and Teddy Pendergrass as occupying the same musical genre or conceptual sphere. And outside of music nerds like us, I don't really know many folks who are fans of all three. So drawing the corollary of "if you're into Black music, how are not already into PIR?" seems pretty specious to me.
Not calling you racist or anything???it just seemed like a strange way of looking at the question.
Music made by Black People?? If u wanna make take that negatively u can.
The music was made when there were distinctions especially on the radio. Just because weve grown doesnt change its context.
I didn't see dude say anything about "black music". But I sure saw a few of you dudes bring it there. I didn't realize you had to be down with all "black music" to be, you know, really down. In fact, I didn't realize people still thought of "black music" as a category unto itself.
OK, how many white artists do you know on PIR? If you can name one, it'll be the first one I ever heard of. To that end, I don't see anything wrong in bringing it there, as you put it. It's hardly the first time anyone's used the generic term "black music" to describe a particular set of musical idioms such as those exemplified by PIR and its roster. Kind of a strange thing to pull someone up about, if you ask me, but whatever.
It might be a cultural thing, but I never hear folks talking about "Black music" these days. And it strikes me as an antiquated idea that all music made by Black people is of a type and classification of its own. I just don't look at ASAP Rocky, Bad Brains, and Teddy Pendergrass as occupying the same musical genre or conceptual sphere. And outside of music nerds like us, I don't really know many folks who are fans of all three. So drawing the corollary of "if you're into Black music, how are not already into PIR?" seems pretty specious to me.
Not calling you racist or anything???it just seemed like a strange way of looking at the question.
Music made by Black People?? If u wanna make take that negatively u can.
The music was made when there were distinctions especially on the radio. Just because weve grown doesnt change its context.
No, I get that. I'm talking about the modern-day context of the elegantly-named BallzDeep asking someone on May 10, 2012 what's good on PIR, and someone saying "How are you into 'Black music' and not already into PIR?" I doubt if you asked the elegantly-named BallzDeep what sort of music he likes, he'd answer "Black music".
I didn't see dude say anything about "black music". But I sure saw a few of you dudes bring it there. I didn't realize you had to be down with all "black music" to be, you know, really down. In fact, I didn't realize people still thought of "black music" as a category unto itself.
OK, how many white artists do you know on PIR? If you can name one, it'll be the first one I ever heard of. To that end, I don't see anything wrong in bringing it there, as you put it. It's hardly the first time anyone's used the generic term "black music" to describe a particular set of musical idioms such as those exemplified by PIR and its roster. Kind of a strange thing to pull someone up about, if you ask me, but whatever.
It might be a cultural thing, but I never hear folks talking about "Black music" these days. And it strikes me as an antiquated idea that all music made by Black people is of a type and classification of its own. I just don't look at ASAP Rocky, Bad Brains, and Teddy Pendergrass as occupying the same musical genre or conceptual sphere. And outside of music nerds like us, I don't really know many folks who are fans of all three. So drawing the corollary of "if you're into Black music, how are not already into PIR?" seems pretty specious to me.
Not calling you racist or anything???it just seemed like a strange way of looking at the question.
Michael Pedicin Jr. Not one of the stars of the PIR roster but he was on it.
Black music isn't a term you hear so much these days but it only ever referred to the music's origin, not the performer's. Being a fan of Latin music and not knowing Fania is the same thing.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
What's all this we've grown into stupid talk today?
kinda funny how this thread started with and idiotic question but then turned into a pretty good discussion on classic PIR records and than quickly fell into an argument about race. classic soul strut.
I didn't see dude say anything about "black music". But I sure saw a few of you dudes bring it there. I didn't realize you had to be down with all "black music" to be, you know, really down. In fact, I didn't realize people still thought of "black music" as a category unto itself.
OK, how many white artists do you know on PIR? If you can name one, it'll be the first one I ever heard of. To that end, I don't see anything wrong in bringing it there, as you put it. It's hardly the first time anyone's used the generic term "black music" to describe a particular set of musical idioms such as those exemplified by PIR and its roster. Kind of a strange thing to pull someone up about, if you ask me, but whatever.
It might be a cultural thing, but I never hear folks talking about "Black music" these days. And it strikes me as an antiquated idea that all music made by Black people is of a type and classification of its own. I just don't look at ASAP Rocky, Bad Brains, and Teddy Pendergrass as occupying the same musical genre or conceptual sphere. And outside of music nerds like us, I don't really know many folks who are fans of all three. So drawing the corollary of "if you're into Black music, how are not already into PIR?" seems pretty specious to me.
Not calling you racist or anything???it just seemed like a strange way of looking at the question.
Music made by Black People?? If u wanna make take that negatively u can.
The music was made when there were distinctions especially on the radio. Just because weve grown doesnt change its context.
No, I get that. I'm talking about the modern-day context of the elegantly-named BallzDeep asking someone on May 10, 2012 what's good on PIR, and someone saying "How are you into 'Black music' and not already into PIR?" I doubt if you asked the elegantly-named BallzDeep what sort of music he likes, he'd answer "Black music".
One cat mentioned PI being important to Black Music History.
Stacks asked how does one dig for Soul w/out Context.
I dont see any real sweeping statement as "into Black Music".
kinda funny how this thread started with and idiotic question but then turned into a pretty good discussion on classic PIR records and than quickly fell into an argument about race. classic soul strut.
Yeah, I totally derailed this shit in classic fashion. Sorry, dudes.
But if you're one of those "I miss teh Golden Age of Soulsturt" folks, enjoy! After all, we are on a forum that specializes in music and race relations.
Perhaps you feel PI is a little too smooth for your taste in soul? If that is the case, might I suggest Bunny Sigler's PI releases...he was still kinda stuck in a rawer, 60s sound while on PI, not as lush or orchestrated as other PI stuff...
What's all this we've grown into stupid talk today?
Grown Folks Music = Old Black Music?
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
batmon said:
HarveyCanal said:
What's all this we've grown into stupid talk today?
Grown Folks Music = Old Black Music?
Young people like to fashion themselves as patently colorblind, although they aren't half as much as they think they are...in addition to ignoring a ton of history in the process.
What's all this we've grown into stupid talk today?
Grown Folks Music = Old Black Music?
Young people like to fashion themselves as patently colorblind, although they aren't half as much as they think they are...in addition to ignoring a ton of history in the process.
What's all this we've grown into stupid talk today?
Grown Folks Music = Old Black Music?
Young people like to fashion themselves as patently colorblind, although they aren't half as much as they think they are...in addition to ignoring a ton of history in the process.
Who said anything about Bad Brains or ASAP Rocky??
All I meant is that when it comes to songs on black radio - now dubbed urban - or records that sold well to black audiences, I can't think of a more definitive sound from the 70s than PIR, except perhaps James Brown (who by the time of PIR's rise was playing catch-up tbh).
If you are into disco and soul and you are not hip to PIR's status as Black Popular Music, you're missing the context (cross-thread pollination alert). It's the kind of misunderstanding that allows you to post a thread on soulstrut asking whether there is "anything good" on the label.
If you were to turn on any Urban (ahem) Adult-Contemporary Station you would hear several good to great songs from PIR within the hour.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
Plaese to never say "filed" again. Any of you. Just a friendly request as hearing y'all say that over the years makes me drown koala bear babies in pig vomit.
Comments
That "Conquer The World" compilation is fascinating. Given how prolific so many r&b labels were back then, I always thought that the reason for the comparatively small amount of obscurities on PIR/PIR-related labels was because, as covered in Frederic Dannen's essential book Hit Men, Gamble & Huff spent so much on payola that their hits-to-bricks ratio was phenomenally good, even by the standards of the day. That said, there used to be a spot in central London where the owner had come up on hundreds of mid-to-late-period PIR promo 45s in mint condition and was knocking them out at five for a tenner. Apart from that Patti Labelle tune that Nelly sampled and a few other things like MFSB's When Your Love Is Gone, most of the titles didn't register with me at all. Then that comp came out and I started to wonder how many of the o.g.'s I'd left sitting in those boxes in Soho a couple of years earlier.
Is that the old speak I detect, Gunslinger? Honor thy fathers face.
OK, how many white artists do you know on PIR? If you can name one, it'll be the first one I ever heard of. To that end, I don't see anything wrong in bringing it there, as you put it. It's hardly the first time anyone's used the generic term "black music" to describe a particular set of musical idioms such as those exemplified by PIR and its roster. Kind of a strange thing to pull someone up about, if you ask me, but whatever.
Dick Jensen
Soul Survivors
Well, that there's the something new you learn every day. I was aware of the Soul Survivors connection with Gamble & Huff but I never knew they recorded for PIR, and I've never heard of Dick Jensen at all.
It might be a cultural thing, but I never hear folks talking about "Black music" these days. And it strikes me as an antiquated idea that all music made by Black people is of a type and classification of its own. I just don't look at ASAP Rocky, Bad Brains, and Teddy Pendergrass as occupying the same musical genre or conceptual sphere. And outside of music nerds like us, I don't really know many folks who are fans of all three. So drawing the corollary of "if you're into Black music, how are not already into PIR?" seems pretty specious to me.
Not calling you racist or anything???it just seemed like a strange way of looking at the question.
Music made by Black People?? If u wanna make take that negatively u can.
The music was made when there were distinctions especially on the radio. Just because weve grown doesnt change its context.
No, I get that. I'm talking about the modern-day context of the elegantly-named BallzDeep asking someone on May 10, 2012 what's good on PIR, and someone saying "How are you into 'Black music' and not already into PIR?" I doubt if you asked the elegantly-named BallzDeep what sort of music he likes, he'd answer "Black music".
Michael Pedicin Jr. Not one of the stars of the PIR roster but he was on it.
Black music isn't a term you hear so much these days but it only ever referred to the music's origin, not the performer's. Being a fan of Latin music and not knowing Fania is the same thing.
One cat mentioned PI being important to Black Music History.
Stacks asked how does one dig for Soul w/out Context.
I dont see any real sweeping statement as "into Black Music".
Yeah, I totally derailed this shit in classic fashion. Sorry, dudes.
But if you're one of those "I miss teh Golden Age of Soulsturt" folks, enjoy! After all, we are on a forum that specializes in music and race relations.
Grown Folks Music = Old Black Music?
Young people like to fashion themselves as patently colorblind, although they aren't half as much as they think they are...in addition to ignoring a ton of history in the process.
Did you just call me racist, old man?
"Im Post-Racial!"
Who said anything about Bad Brains or ASAP Rocky??
All I meant is that when it comes to songs on black radio - now dubbed urban - or records that sold well to black audiences, I can't think of a more definitive sound from the 70s than PIR, except perhaps James Brown (who by the time of PIR's rise was playing catch-up tbh).
If you are into disco and soul and you are not hip to PIR's status as Black Popular Music, you're missing the context (cross-thread pollination alert). It's the kind of misunderstanding that allows you to post a thread on soulstrut asking whether there is "anything good" on the label.
If you were to turn on any Urban (ahem) Adult-Contemporary Station you would hear several good to great songs from PIR within the hour.
How?
Whats wrong with asking what you guys have filed on PIR?
Most of the stuff isn't really my thing with all the production touches.
Anyway, some nice lesser known recommendations.
Nice gunslinger reference.
that's not true. DB Cooper mentioned him
:P