Why do any of us really care who anyone is anointing as a hip hop savior?
That seems so early 2000s.
Drake may be undeserving but...so what? How does this herald any worse doom that hip-hop hasn't already suffered via the last 10 years?
this misses the point - as someone said upthread, his popularity is very real. He is by almost any measure, enormously successful. The one remaining measure is album sales, and while I hope that the record will flop I wouldn't bet money on it. For what it's worth, this seems to be the least important metric of the music industry these days anyway.
What anointing him the savior of anything does is legitimize him. Given the quality of people around him, I don't think he's going anywhere, and nobody seems willing to point out the utter hypocrisy inherent in his shtick.
Fair enough.
I just think we've been through this same variety of argument since, well, the birth of hip-hop. Drake practically just plays a role in that never-ending recycling of "undeserving popular rapper". It's almost mechanical.
There has never before been a rapper who makes such bad music who has achieved the same degree of influence/importance within hip-hop. Ever.
Also, my issue isn't that he's "wack" by the conventional meaning of the word. He's a decent enough technical rapper. I object mostly to the overarching concept of Drake; slightly less so, to the sheer calculated-ness of his career thus far. This is music industry cynicism at its absolute height.
Why do any of us really care who anyone is anointing as a hip hop savior?
That seems so early 2000s.
Drake may be undeserving but...so what? How does this herald any worse doom that hip-hop hasn't already suffered via the last 10 years?
this misses the point - as someone said upthread, his popularity is very real. He is by almost any measure, enormously successful. The one remaining measure is album sales, and while I hope that the record will flop I wouldn't bet money on it. For what it's worth, this seems to be the least important metric of the music industry these days anyway.
What anointing him the savior of anything does is legitimize him. Given the quality of people around him, I don't think he's going anywhere, and nobody seems willing to point out the utter hypocrisy inherent in his shtick.
Fair enough.
I just think we've been through this same variety of argument since, well, the birth of hip-hop. Drake practically just plays a role in that never-ending recycling of "undeserving popular rapper". It's almost mechanical.
There has never before been a rapper who makes such bad music who has achieved the same degree of influence/importance within hip-hop. Ever.
I dont know anyone who likes this dude yet he's supposedly large?
I dunno. Cats were hanging on to 50 Cent years after the skreets gave up on him.
Where is Drake's influential fan base? Becky? 20 year old "College Dropout is my GOAT" dude?
Raleek from building 5 could care less about the NY Times.
DocMcCoy"Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,913 Posts
DJ_Enki said:
If Murder Dog had writing quality to match its enthusiasm, it'd be an amazing magazine.
Murder Dog became impossible to find over here after Tower and Borders closed down, but it never bothered me all that much that the writing wasn't always up to snuff. It always felt more like a 'zine to me anyway, but in the best possible way - like a rap version of Maximum Rock'n'Roll or something. For me, being able to read about artists and records and scenes that weren't getting coverage in any other rap publication on my radar was enough. But the design was a fucking nightmare. When every interview is laid out in such a way that you can't distinguish between question and answer, it becomes a real headache to read, no matter how compelling the content is.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
batmon said:
Where is Drake's influential fan base? Becky? 20 year old "College Dropout is my GOAT" dude?
The biggest Drake fan I know is a 20-something light-skinned lesbian stud who pulls fine chicks and stage manages most rap concerts in town.
Where is Drake's influential fan base? Becky? 20 year old "College Dropout is my GOAT" dude?
Girls, certain women, ironic music listeners, industry types, Canadians/Toronto folk who will support because they want to see one of our own do good, even if he isn't any good, and the most important of all, because it's where the bucks are at, teenagers.
There's two things going on that I can see - there's probably more than two things, but I'll leave it up to the brainiacs on the Board to identify - the rap world Drake and the pop world Drake. We on the Board are fixated on the rap Drake.
I was in the car with my friend and his 17yr old son on Sunday when the Drake LP came out and got played from start to finish***. The 14 and 15yr old kids I work with love him, too. Other than the usual obstacles the rap and its players face, I don't see a whole lot of difference between his popularity and the other teen market acts. The Miley Cyruses and the Justin Beavers.
***(Listen, I try to talk about what I love more than what I hate, but it's hard to hold back on this one. It was not my car, not my ipod and not my son, so it's not like I could reach over and pull the plug like I wanted to, but this is some UNLISTENABLE shit. His voice...I mean...the tone is terrible, he's whining, you want to slap him. I admire the patience of parents everywhere.)
To speak to his popularity within rap, I wonder if that's not so much folks cosigning his music but a result of how everyone is up in everyone's (show) business these days. And why not get a taste of that teen market money?
Where is Drake's influential fan base? Becky? 20 year old "College Dropout is my GOAT" dude?
Girls, certain women, ironic music listeners, industry types, Canadians/Toronto folk who will support because they want to see one of our own do good, even if he isn't any good, and the most important of all, because it's where the bucks are at, teenagers.
There's two things going on that I can see - there's probably more than two things, but I'll leave it up to the brainiacs on the Board to identify - the rap world Drake and the pop world Drake. We on the Board are fixated on the rap Drake.
I was in the car with my friend and his 17yr old son on Sunday when the Drake LP came out and got played from start to finish***. The 14 and 15yr old kids I work with love him, too. Other than the usual obstacles the rap and its players face, I don't see a whole lot of difference between his popularity and the other teen market acts. The Miley Cyruses and the Justin Beavers.
***(Listen, I try to talk about what I love more than what I hate, but it's hard to hold back on this one. It was not my car, not my ipod and not my son, so it's not like I could reach over and pull the plug like I wanted to, but this is some UNLISTENABLE shit. His voice...I mean...the tone is terrible, he's whining, you want to slap him. I admire the patience of parents everywhere.)
The teens in my building cant stand dude. They think the transformers commercial is trash and Drake is gay.
Where is Drake's influential fan base? Becky? 20 year old "College Dropout is my GOAT" dude?
Girls, certain women, ironic music listeners, industry types, Canadians/Toronto folk who will support because they want to see one of our own do good, even if he isn't any good, and the most important of all, because it's where the bucks are at, teenagers.
There's two things going on that I can see - there's probably more than two things, but I'll leave it up to the brainiacs on the Board to identify - the rap world Drake and the pop world Drake. We on the Board are fixated on the rap Drake.
I was in the car with my friend and his 17yr old son on Sunday when the Drake LP came out and got played from start to finish***. The 14 and 15yr old kids I work with love him, too. Other than the usual obstacles the rap and its players face, I don't see a whole lot of difference between his popularity and the other teen market acts. The Miley Cyruses and the Justin Beavers.
***(Listen, I try to talk about what I love more than what I hate, but it's hard to hold back on this one. It was not my car, not my ipod and not my son, so it's not like I could reach over and pull the plug like I wanted to, but this is some UNLISTENABLE shit. His voice...I mean...the tone is terrible, he's whining, you want to slap him. I admire the patience of parents everywhere.)
The teens in my building cant stand dude. They think the transformers commercial is trash and Drake is gay.
I am not doubting you at all, but teens do a lot of public trashing and secret admiring.
Even still, I bet they have one or two songs they love that has him on at least one verse, you know? Cripes, the students I mentioned will cut Minaj up til I'm crying from laughing, but who do you think is all over their ipods?
Why do any of us really care who anyone is anointing as a hip hop savior?
That seems so early 2000s.
Drake may be undeserving but...so what? How does this herald any worse doom that hip-hop hasn't already suffered via the last 10 years?
this misses the point - as someone said upthread, his popularity is very real. He is by almost any measure, enormously successful. The one remaining measure is album sales, and while I hope that the record will flop I wouldn't bet money on it. For what it's worth, this seems to be the least important metric of the music industry these days anyway.
What anointing him the savior of anything does is legitimize him. Given the quality of people around him, I don't think he's going anywhere, and nobody seems willing to point out the utter hypocrisy inherent in his shtick.
Fair enough.
I just think we've been through this same variety of argument since, well, the birth of hip-hop. Drake practically just plays a role in that never-ending recycling of "undeserving popular rapper". It's almost mechanical.
There has never before been a rapper who makes such bad music who has achieved the same degree of influence/importance within hip-hop. Ever.
Also, my issue isn't that he's "wack" by the conventional meaning of the word. He's a decent enough technical rapper. I object mostly to the overarching concept of Drake; slightly less so, to the sheer calculated-ness of his career thus far. This is music industry cynicism at its absolute height.
Seriously. Loved this quote about the made-in-a-test-tube So Far Gone:
???That was supposed to be the wild and crazy project we did to get that out of our system before we put out a really generic rap album,??? said Oliver el-Khatib, Drake???s longtime friend and de facto creative consultant.
What was the last album targeted to the urban teen demographic?
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
Seems to me that a lot of Drake fans are just trying to get near his fame. A Drake show is a happening event, so why would they even think to not go see it? The fervor over where the official Drake afterparty would be, and that's without Drake even performing at it, here in Austin a couple of weeks back was ridiculous. And that was far from just teenagers doing that fervoring.
What was the last album targeted to the urban teen demographic?
They dont buy music. They just rip shit from the 'net.
I just dont even think they think in terms of "the album".
A couple of tracks off the internet and its a wrap. And getting tickets to see Drake at MSG would be a joke.
I'm just thinking about what Bassie said about pop Drake vs rap Drake, which I think its pop Drake through and through posing as rap Drake. I think urban teens see through that shit real quick, whereas some suburban teens eat it up. And well, I'm just trying to follow the money. Like Jonny said, this is the industry at its most cynical.
Might be worth mentioning that non-suburban teens listen to pop, too.
The students I'm talking about are also ripping songs and are getting subsidized bus tickets and lunches, so you're not going to be seeing them front row centre at the next Drake show.
If my friends are at all representative then I would guess that over 80% of black male college student who consider themselves rap fans believe that Drake has the best flow and lyrics in the game right now. No joke. I know many mid-to-late 20 year old rap fans that ride too. For what it's worth, it's definitely not just teenagers, beckies and other assorted females.
You may not be feeling dude. Your friends may not be feeling dude.
But he is undeniably huge, including with young people around the way.
This isn't really up for debate.
I will not pretend to have quizzed the teens in my neighborhood as to exactly what mix of emotions motivate them to play his music, and to what degree the love is leavened with hate--I'll leave those inquiries to the one Shied--but there's no denying that they play it.
i get the problem with the nyt article, but what is so wrong with his music? "best i ever had", "juice", "money to blow" - these are bad commercial rap songs...as compared to what?
While I truly don't understand how he got big (really not a diss, I just don't know), any industry dudes are going to ride for him right now just because he's as close as a sure shot that the industry can get right now.
i get the problem with the nyt article, but what is so wrong with his music? "best i ever had", "juice", "money to blow" - these are bad commercial rap songs...as compared to what?
You clearly don't "get the problem with the article," since one of the chief issues with it is its failure to go in on his music.
gave the album a listen and dude is mediocre as hell. period. he can't sing that well, and he REALLY can't rap. he's just a bland stale hamburger from mcdonalds.
jay-z wrote drake's verse on light up right? i'd love to know the list of ghostwriters that worked on this thing.
if they swapped out drake for the dream i'd probably enjoy this record.
Comments
Also, my issue isn't that he's "wack" by the conventional meaning of the word. He's a decent enough technical rapper. I object mostly to the overarching concept of Drake; slightly less so, to the sheer calculated-ness of his career thus far. This is music industry cynicism at its absolute height.
I dont know anyone who likes this dude yet he's supposedly large?
I dunno. Cats were hanging on to 50 Cent years after the skreets gave up on him.
Where is Drake's influential fan base? Becky? 20 year old "College Dropout is my GOAT" dude?
Murder Dog became impossible to find over here after Tower and Borders closed down, but it never bothered me all that much that the writing wasn't always up to snuff. It always felt more like a 'zine to me anyway, but in the best possible way - like a rap version of Maximum Rock'n'Roll or something. For me, being able to read about artists and records and scenes that weren't getting coverage in any other rap publication on my radar was enough. But the design was a fucking nightmare. When every interview is laid out in such a way that you can't distinguish between question and answer, it becomes a real headache to read, no matter how compelling the content is.
The biggest Drake fan I know is a 20-something light-skinned lesbian stud who pulls fine chicks and stage manages most rap concerts in town.
Girls, certain women, ironic music listeners, industry types, Canadians/Toronto folk who will support because they want to see one of our own do good, even if he isn't any good, and the most important of all, because it's where the bucks are at, teenagers.
There's two things going on that I can see - there's probably more than two things, but I'll leave it up to the brainiacs on the Board to identify - the rap world Drake and the pop world Drake. We on the Board are fixated on the rap Drake.
I was in the car with my friend and his 17yr old son on Sunday when the Drake LP came out and got played from start to finish***. The 14 and 15yr old kids I work with love him, too. Other than the usual obstacles the rap and its players face, I don't see a whole lot of difference between his popularity and the other teen market acts. The Miley Cyruses and the Justin Beavers.
***(Listen, I try to talk about what I love more than what I hate, but it's hard to hold back on this one. It was not my car, not my ipod and not my son, so it's not like I could reach over and pull the plug like I wanted to, but this is some UNLISTENABLE shit. His voice...I mean...the tone is terrible, he's whining, you want to slap him. I admire the patience of parents everywhere.)
The teens in my building cant stand dude. They think the transformers commercial is trash and Drake is gay.
GOLD.
I am not doubting you at all, but teens do a lot of public trashing and secret admiring.
Even still, I bet they have one or two songs they love that has him on at least one verse, you know? Cripes, the students I mentioned will cut Minaj up til I'm crying from laughing, but who do you think is all over their ipods?
Seriously. Loved this quote about the made-in-a-test-tube So Far Gone:
What was the last album targeted to the urban teen demographic?
They dont buy music. They just rip shit from the 'net.
I just dont even think they think in terms of "the album".
A couple of tracks off the internet and its a wrap. And getting tickets to see Drake at MSG would be a joke.
I'm just thinking about what Bassie said about pop Drake vs rap Drake, which I think its pop Drake through and through posing as rap Drake. I think urban teens see through that shit real quick, whereas some suburban teens eat it up. And well, I'm just trying to follow the money. Like Jonny said, this is the industry at its most cynical.
The students I'm talking about are also ripping songs and are getting subsidized bus tickets and lunches, so you're not going to be seeing them front row centre at the next Drake show.
Post-Hip Hop??
You may not be feeling dude. Your friends may not be feeling dude.
But he is undeniably huge, including with young people around the way.
This isn't really up for debate.
I will not pretend to have quizzed the teens in my neighborhood as to exactly what mix of emotions motivate them to play his music, and to what degree the love is leavened with hate--I'll leave those inquiries to the one Shied--but there's no denying that they play it.
You clearly don't "get the problem with the article," since one of the chief issues with it is its failure to go in on his music.
Seriously, maybe leave rap alone.
jay-z wrote drake's verse on light up right? i'd love to know the list of ghostwriters that worked on this thing.
if they swapped out drake for the dream i'd probably enjoy this record.
Note that the new album is less rap than r&b. It's like prog pop, but I really like most of it.
BAN
You're spending too much time in this thread, Faux. You're obsession is transparent.