Dudes, I am with you. If it's me, I call in the U.S. Navy and whatever other naval fleet and whatever type of expertise with have and throw the kitchen sink at the problem. Kindly thank BP for their efforts and get them the f^ck out of there, tell them to go back to the office and wait for the bill in the mail.
Surely this will go down as the most expensive man-made disaster in history and it will result in new laws in the U.S. and elsewhere.
Friend, to be as kind as possible, this is incredibly naive.
The Navy probably has very little, if any expertise here. Their ships could be useful, though.
ALL of the oil companies should be brought in to this and all of their collective knowledge/equipment be brought to bear until the leak is stopped.
They need to call in the no limit soldiers, who are like am army, better yet a navy, and can bust a cap in that well.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
Going a bit further, we should acknowledge that our current campaign finance system demands our representatives appeal to these companies, in order to raise the money needed to get elected. In that regard, Americans can blame themselves for not demanding better from our system of government.
We could "demand" all day and night...ain't gonna do shit.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
They need to call in the no limit soldiers, who are like am army, better yet a navy, and can bust a cap in that well.
stop consorting wit them and their devlish ways. They are the enemy.
It' s hard to realize the level of irony you are swapping under you writings...
The evolving of "future laws" will surely follow the lines of such "evil things" (manipulation wise) i have written about earlier. EDIT: in fact that fiat money cheese show the same holes as you can expect from the paper those lobbyists place their laws on... don't you agree?
Can we (believing in a future of mankind) achieve a change following yesterdays pathes following yesterday folks?
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
hey Harv, that that Rand Paul BS elsewhere, adults are talking
Yes, please have your "adults" fuck with my hometown some more before any of us actually from there are allowed to speak.
- Companies being responsible for such an incredible kind of damage should be banned from future business?
You mean, like the banks? You know, the ones that were "bailed out"?
Again and again and again, the US government does not work in the interests of the people...or duh, the environment for that matter. Their agendas are on some whole other shit...and if anything we are just in their way.
So basically, stop consorting wit them and their devlish ways. They are the enemy.
I'm sorry Harvey, but what do you propose, specifically? Stop buying gas? I live in NY, and haven't bought gas for myself in years, but I don't think this is realistic for most people.
How are we going to move away from these evil oil companies and their gas? Alternative fuels? Advanced technology? Bike lanes? Provided by who? Other evil companies? The evil government? You and your wacky compatriots? C'mon, this is fantasy talk.
I agree there are changes to be made, but real change is most likely going to start within the system, not standing on the sidelines calling everyone evil..
Dudes, I am with you. If it's me, I call in the U.S. Navy and whatever other naval fleet and whatever type of expertise with have and throw the kitchen sink at the problem. Kindly thank BP for their efforts and get them the f^ck out of there, tell them to go back to the office and wait for the bill in the mail.
Surely this will go down as the most expensive man-made disaster in history and it will result in new laws in the U.S. and elsewhere.
Friend, to be as kind as possible, this is incredibly naive.
For real, what naval fleet ANYWHERE has "expertise" with capping a busted oil rig well?
Well then, share with me your ideas of fixing what went wrong.
Farm it to Exxon? Bring our own ever-ready government stalwort and also guilty party Haliburton? What's the solution?
Kevin Costner's liek the army, better yet the navy:
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From The Sunday Times May 23, 2010 Kevin Costner's clean-up operation Giant 'vacuum cleaners' built by Kevin Costner are to be tested by BP in the Gulf of Mexico this week John Harlow in Los Angeles
Giant ?vacuum cleaners? built by Kevin Costner, star of Waterworld and other ecologically-minded movies, are to be tested by BP in the Gulf of Mexico this week.
The drum-shaped machines, which suck up 200,000 gallons of oil and water a day and seperate it by centrifugal force, have been designed by Costner?s partners in Louisiana-based Ocean Therapy Solutions (OTS).
This weekend six machines are being assembled on barges moored off Louisiana. They could cast off as soon as dawn tomorrow.
Costner has also teamed up with John Houghtaling, a New Orleans trial lawyer and chief executive of OTS, to finance a documentary about the disaster to keep BP ?honest? in the clean-up operation.
?Kevin warned oil companies seven years ago they needed technology like ours, but they said another Exxon Valdez scale disaster could not happen again. This devastation is potentially far worse, and Kevin wants to make sure the oil companies do not slacken off their efforts after the media leaves,? said Houghtaling.
?This documentary will hold oil companies such as BP to account, and hopefully aid those who are now pressing for more safeguards built onto rigs and tankers.?
Last week Costner, 55, who has been helping his wife Christine prepare for the imminent birth of their third child, took a few hours off ?prenatal duty? to visit Louisiana and persuade BP executives that his machines were worth testing.
He admitted he was angry that such technology had not been deployed on oil rigs long before the disaster.
?Oil companies have not been fully prepared for such ecological disasters: oil-separating machines, which do not use harmful chemicals to break up the oil, should be mandatory on all rigs,? he said.
He told The Sunday Times how childhood memories of the 1969 Santa Barbara oil spill, when a rig leaked 100,000 barrels of oil on the Californian coast killing thousands of birds, influenced him when shooting the 1995 science fiction movie Waterworld, in which the earth was flooded after global warming.
?That is one reason why Dennis Hopper and the bad guys lived on the wreck of the Exxon Valdez,? he said, referring to the tanker that spilt 11m gallons of oil on the Alaskan coastline in 1989.
In 1993 he channelled some of his profits from the film The Bodyguard, with Whitney Houston, into a new company dedicated to more advanced ways of dealing with spills than booms, chemicals and casting bales of straw on the surface of the water.
After searching through public library archives, Costner found the solution in a device originally designed to remove radioactive materials from metals in the nuclear industry.
The actor licensed the technology and then worked with technicians to build an eight-foot high machine dubbed a ?Kevin?. He tested the washing machine-like drum on polluted rivers in South America, where it produced 99% clean water.
He wanted to sell the technology to the US Navy and cruise lines so they could clean water from ship bilges before discharging it into the sea, but in the end, disheartened by lack of interest from the oil industry, he sold the company to John Houghtaling.
They continued to work together on a range of machines, the largest of which is now called the V20. There are other similar devices around, whose inventors claim they too are ignored by the oil business, but Costner?s star power has proved irresistible.
Last week Ocean Therapy Solutions (OTS) flew engineers from the University of California, Los Angeles, to Venice, Louisiana, to help prepare up to thirty ?vacuum cleaners? for the Gulf. They are borrowing some older models back from other owners.
Houghtaling said OTS was also leasing $40,000 pollution monitoring devices from a company funded by Paul Allen, the Microsoft co-founder, to ensure that BP cannot ?roll back? on potentially-pricey promises to clean up the Gulf.
?We shall test the V20s this week and see if they can contribute,? said a BP spokesman last week. ?We are always open to fresh ideas to protect the environment, which is our first priority.?
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hey Harv, that that Rand Paul BS elsewhere, adults are talking
Yes, please have your "adults" fuck with my hometown some more before any of us actually from there are allowed to speak.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
- Companies being responsible for such an incredible kind of damage should be banned from future business?
You mean, like the banks? You know, the ones that were "bailed out"?
Again and again and again, the US government does not work in the interests of the people...or duh, the environment for that matter. Their agendas are on some whole other shit...and if anything we are just in their way.
So basically, stop consorting wit them and their devlish ways. They are the enemy.
I'm sorry Harvey, but what do you propose, specifically? Stop buying gas? I live in NY, and haven't bought gas for myself in years, but I don't think this is realistic for most people.
How are we going to move away from these evil oil companies and their gas? Alternative fuels? Advanced technology? Bike lanes? Provided by who? Other evil companies? The evil government? You and your wacky compatriots? C'mon, this is fantasy talk.
I agree there are changes to be made, but real change is most likely going to start within the system, not standing on the sidelines calling everyone evil..
We could all be driving electric vehicles by now. That is totally within the realm of possibility. But evil assholes whose agendas are more about lining their pockets than having a sensible society continue to be granted opportunity after opportunity to straight fuck us all over.
It's so far beyond negligence. But geaux right ahead and give these same proven dickheads a 1,500th shot at it. Maybe this time, they'll suddenly change their ways and start giving a shit. And maybe I have a bridge I could sell you too.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
hey Harv, that that Rand Paul BS elsewhere, adults are talking
Yes, please have your "adults" fuck with my hometown some more before any of us actually from there are allowed to speak.
I swear to god I thought that vacuum headline was from The Onion until I read "Times Online."
Jesus christ, is this what it's come to?
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
- Companies being responsible for such an incredible kind of damage should be banned from future business?
You mean, like the banks? You know, the ones that were "bailed out"?
Again and again and again, the US government does not work in the interests of the people...or duh, the environment for that matter. Their agendas are on some whole other shit...and if anything we are just in their way.
So basically, stop consorting wit them and their devlish ways. They are the enemy.
I'm sorry Harvey, but what do you propose, specifically? Stop buying gas? I live in NY, and haven't bought gas for myself in years, but I don't think this is realistic for most people.
How are we going to move away from these evil oil companies and their gas? Alternative fuels? Advanced technology? Bike lanes? Provided by who? Other evil companies? The evil government? You and your wacky compatriots? C'mon, this is fantasy talk.
I agree there are changes to be made, but real change is most likely going to start within the system, not standing on the sidelines calling everyone evil..
Okay, I gotta address this again.
Standing on the sidelines? Really? Is that all people merely trying to live their lives without getting screwed at every turn are doing? We're standing on the sidelines of where's it's really at?
Seriously, what is our system good for again? Cops that shoot first and never ask questions? Schools that would rather poison kids than teach them anything? A monetary system that strips us of any chances of attaining actual wealth? Bloated industries that are destroying both us and our environments? Putting future generations into massive debt? Going around the world and killing innocents at will?
Oh yes, please sign me up to play in that game. Sounds like a barrel of monkeys. Definitely count me in for the next meeting. I'll tell you what...I'll even bring the male prostitutes.
- Companies being responsible for such an incredible kind of damage should be banned from future business?
You mean, like the banks? You know, the ones that were "bailed out"?
Again and again and again, the US government does not work in the interests of the people...or duh, the environment for that matter. Their agendas are on some whole other shit...and if anything we are just in their way.
So basically, stop consorting wit them and their devlish ways. They are the enemy.
I'm sorry Harvey, but what do you propose, specifically? Stop buying gas? I live in NY, and haven't bought gas for myself in years, but I don't think this is realistic for most people.
How are we going to move away from these evil oil companies and their gas? Alternative fuels? Advanced technology? Bike lanes? Provided by who? Other evil companies? The evil government? You and your wacky compatriots? C'mon, this is fantasy talk.
I agree there are changes to be made, but real change is most likely going to start within the system, not standing on the sidelines calling everyone evil..
We could all be driving electric vehicles by now. That is totally within the realm of possibility. But evil assholes whose agendas are more about lining their pockets than having a sensible society continue to be granted opportunity after opportunity to straight fuck us all over.
It's so far beyond negligence. But geaux right ahead and give these same proven dickheads a 1,500th shot at it. Maybe this time, they'll suddenly change their ways and start giving a shit. And maybe I have a bridge I could sell you too.
People don't deserve to have electric cars until they fight to have them. This same logic extends to everything, including people's very lives. Evil assholes know this well.
- Companies being responsible for such an incredible kind of damage should be banned from future business?
You mean, like the banks? You know, the ones that were "bailed out"?
Again and again and again, the US government does not work in the interests of the people...or duh, the environment for that matter. Their agendas are on some whole other shit...and if anything we are just in their way.
So basically, stop consorting wit them and their devlish ways. They are the enemy.
I'm sorry Harvey, but what do you propose, specifically? Stop buying gas? I live in NY, and haven't bought gas for myself in years, but I don't think this is realistic for most people.
How are we going to move away from these evil oil companies and their gas? Alternative fuels? Advanced technology? Bike lanes? Provided by who? Other evil companies? The evil government? You and your wacky compatriots? C'mon, this is fantasy talk.
I agree there are changes to be made, but real change is most likely going to start within the system, not standing on the sidelines calling everyone evil..
Okay, I gotta address this again.
Standing on the sidelines? Really? Is that all people merely trying to live their lives without getting screwed at every turn are doing? We're standing on the sidelines of where's it's really at?
Seriously, what is our system good for again? Cops that shoot first and never ask questions? Schools that would rather poison kids than teach them anything? A monetary system that strips us of any chances of attaining actual wealth? Bloated industries that are destroying both us and our environments? Putting future generations into massive debt? Going around the world and killing innocents at will?
Oh yes, please sign me up to play in that game. Sounds like a barrel of monkeys. Definitely count me in for the next meeting. I'll tell you what...I'll even bring the male prostitutes.
You didn't answer the question.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
- Companies being responsible for such an incredible kind of damage should be banned from future business?
You mean, like the banks? You know, the ones that were "bailed out"?
Again and again and again, the US government does not work in the interests of the people...or duh, the environment for that matter. Their agendas are on some whole other shit...and if anything we are just in their way.
So basically, stop consorting wit them and their devlish ways. They are the enemy.
I'm sorry Harvey, but what do you propose, specifically? Stop buying gas? I live in NY, and haven't bought gas for myself in years, but I don't think this is realistic for most people.
How are we going to move away from these evil oil companies and their gas? Alternative fuels? Advanced technology? Bike lanes? Provided by who? Other evil companies? The evil government? You and your wacky compatriots? C'mon, this is fantasy talk.
I agree there are changes to be made, but real change is most likely going to start within the system, not standing on the sidelines calling everyone evil..
Okay, I gotta address this again.
Standing on the sidelines? Really? Is that all people merely trying to live their lives without getting screwed at every turn are doing? We're standing on the sidelines of where's it's really at?
Seriously, what is our system good for again? Cops that shoot first and never ask questions? Schools that would rather poison kids than teach them anything? A monetary system that strips us of any chances of attaining actual wealth? Bloated industries that are destroying both us and our environments? Putting future generations into massive debt? Going around the world and killing innocents at will?
Oh yes, please sign me up to play in that game. Sounds like a barrel of monkeys. Definitely count me in for the next meeting. I'll tell you what...I'll even bring the male prostitutes.
You didn't answer the question.
Yes, I did, earlier...a genuine move toward electric vehicles. Problem is, such progression gets categorically blocked by the bigwigs.
- Companies being responsible for such an incredible kind of damage should be banned from future business?
You mean, like the banks? You know, the ones that were "bailed out"?
Again and again and again, the US government does not work in the interests of the people...or duh, the environment for that matter. Their agendas are on some whole other shit...and if anything we are just in their way.
So basically, stop consorting wit them and their devlish ways. They are the enemy.
I'm sorry Harvey, but what do you propose, specifically? Stop buying gas? I live in NY, and haven't bought gas for myself in years, but I don't think this is realistic for most people.
How are we going to move away from these evil oil companies and their gas? Alternative fuels? Advanced technology? Bike lanes? Provided by who? Other evil companies? The evil government? You and your wacky compatriots? C'mon, this is fantasy talk.
I agree there are changes to be made, but real change is most likely going to start within the system, not standing on the sidelines calling everyone evil..
Okay, I gotta address this again.
Standing on the sidelines? Really? Is that all people merely trying to live their lives without getting screwed at every turn are doing? We're standing on the sidelines of where's it's really at?
Seriously, what is our system good for again? Cops that shoot first and never ask questions? Schools that would rather poison kids than teach them anything? A monetary system that strips us of any chances of attaining actual wealth? Bloated industries that are destroying both us and our environments? Putting future generations into massive debt? Going around the world and killing innocents at will?
Oh yes, please sign me up to play in that game. Sounds like a barrel of monkeys. Definitely count me in for the next meeting. I'll tell you what...I'll even bring the male prostitutes.
You didn't answer the question.
Yes, I did, earlier...a genuine move toward electric vehicles. Problem is, such progression gets categorically blocked by the bigwigs.
I'm sorry Harvey, but what do you propose, specifically? Stop buying gas? I live in NY, and haven't bought gas for myself in years, but I don't think this is realistic for most people.
How are we going to move away from these evil oil companies and their gas? Alternative fuels? Advanced technology? Bike lanes? Provided by who? Other evil companies? The evil government? You and your wacky compatriots? C'mon, this is fantasy talk.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
you drive a hybrid Harv?
Not yet...but my next vehicle will definitely be a hybrid.
LOL. for real tho, i feel where harvey is coming from, but i gotta agree with the other points. its important to divest from bullshit greedy ass systems where we can, but also to keep in mind that their system is our reality and we live in it. choose battles.divest.engage.be strategic.
but i get sick to my stomach thinking about that damn oil spill and how its gonna be business as usual for big oil,regardless.
You have always given me the impression that you "think Democracy is a joke."
To me Democracy is a work in progress. Its never a final product that just runs by itself. Without the active participation of electorate powerful interests hold sway.
To me Democracy is having patience and looking to the long view. As a someone who self identifies on the liberal side of the political equation I may loath the much of the ideology of my conservative brethren but I do respect the long term infrastructure they have built to move their agenda forward. My side is only just getting their act together in this regard.
But we liberals and conservatives are just two bases that anchor political discourse in this country. The people that decide where we are going are the middle. If you want change then you have 2 choices:
1) Take over one of the anchor points from within. This is what Thom Hartmann is advocating on the left and what the Tea Party is attempting on the right.
2) Create your own anchor point. This would be a harder way to do it, but you could create a party that is free from the history of the previous two. Usually these parties die, but sometimes they replace what has come before (see Whigs, Greens, etc).
If you have given up and you are just shouting from the sidelines then in reality you will be the butt of the jokes here. Being angry isn't enough. Being morally superior is not enough.
The other thing about Democracy, the one they don't teach you in school, its incredibility dirty. You have to make compromises with folks you don't want to compromise with to get things done. You have to accept imperfection. You also have to accept on faith that by getting dirty that ultimately things will be better.
So, circling back to the actual topic of this thread, the BP oil leak. Its a tragedy beyond imagining. We are going to have to live with the effects of it for at least this generation, if not more.
The dirty part of it is, this is the moment that can be used to effect some real change, in the long term. The Drill, Baby, Drill folks have been silenced. While the likelihood that we can stop all offshore drilling because of this catastrophe is nill, better regulations and a slow down on off shore drilling is possible now. More importantly its a time to get alternate energy laws and incentives into place so we are not driven to drill.
In the short term, I don't know what the answer for stopping this leak is going to be. Its obvious they thought it would never happen because they are desperately trying to figure it out now while ocean drowns.
In the end, we may have to nuke it like the Russians did in the Eighties. Even more joy.
Comments
The Navy probably has very little, if any expertise here. Their ships could be useful, though.
ALL of the oil companies should be brought in to this and all of their collective knowledge/equipment be brought to bear until the leak is stopped.
the Russkies
drop an A-Bomb down there - fuse that shit right up
We could "demand" all day and night...ain't gonna do shit.
Cash Money got them choppers, bruh.
It' s hard to realize the level of irony you are swapping under you writings...
The evolving of "future laws" will surely follow the lines of
such "evil things" (manipulation wise) i have written about earlier.
EDIT: in fact that fiat money cheese show the same holes
as you can expect from the paper those lobbyists place their laws on...
don't you agree?
Can we (believing in a future of mankind) achieve a change following
yesterdays pathes following yesterday folks?
Yes, please have your "adults" fuck with my hometown some more before any of us actually from there are allowed to speak.
I'm sorry Harvey, but what do you propose, specifically? Stop buying gas? I live in NY, and haven't bought gas for myself in years, but I don't think this is realistic for most people.
How are we going to move away from these evil oil companies and their gas? Alternative fuels? Advanced technology? Bike lanes? Provided by who? Other evil companies? The evil government? You and your wacky compatriots? C'mon, this is fantasy talk.
I agree there are changes to be made, but real change is most likely going to start within the system, not standing on the sidelines calling everyone evil..
Well then, share with me your ideas of fixing what went wrong.
Farm it to Exxon? Bring our own ever-ready government stalwort and also guilty party Haliburton? What's the solution?
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From The Sunday Times
May 23, 2010
Kevin Costner's clean-up operation
Giant 'vacuum cleaners' built by Kevin Costner are to be tested by BP in the Gulf of Mexico this week
John Harlow in Los Angeles
Giant ?vacuum cleaners? built by Kevin Costner, star of Waterworld and other ecologically-minded movies, are to be tested by BP in the Gulf of Mexico this week.
The drum-shaped machines, which suck up 200,000 gallons of oil and water a day and seperate it by centrifugal force, have been designed by Costner?s partners in Louisiana-based Ocean Therapy Solutions (OTS).
This weekend six machines are being assembled on barges moored off Louisiana. They could cast off as soon as dawn tomorrow.
Costner has also teamed up with John Houghtaling, a New Orleans trial lawyer and chief executive of OTS, to finance a documentary about the disaster to keep BP ?honest? in the clean-up operation.
?Kevin warned oil companies seven years ago they needed technology like ours, but they said another Exxon Valdez scale disaster could not happen again. This devastation is potentially far worse, and Kevin wants to make sure the oil companies do not slacken off their efforts after the media leaves,? said Houghtaling.
?This documentary will hold oil companies such as BP to account, and hopefully aid those who are now pressing for more safeguards built onto rigs and tankers.?
Last week Costner, 55, who has been helping his wife Christine prepare for the imminent birth of their third child, took a few hours off ?prenatal duty? to visit Louisiana and persuade BP executives that his machines were worth testing.
He admitted he was angry that such technology had not been deployed on oil rigs long before the disaster.
?Oil companies have not been fully prepared for such ecological disasters: oil-separating machines, which do not use harmful chemicals to break up the oil, should be mandatory on all rigs,? he said.
He told The Sunday Times how childhood memories of the 1969 Santa Barbara oil spill, when a rig leaked 100,000 barrels of oil on the Californian coast killing thousands of birds, influenced him when shooting the 1995 science fiction movie Waterworld, in which the earth was flooded after global warming.
?That is one reason why Dennis Hopper and the bad guys lived on the wreck of the Exxon Valdez,? he said, referring to the tanker that spilt 11m gallons of oil on the Alaskan coastline in 1989.
In 1993 he channelled some of his profits from the film The Bodyguard, with Whitney Houston, into a new company dedicated to more advanced ways of dealing with spills than booms, chemicals and casting bales of straw on the surface of the water.
After searching through public library archives, Costner found the solution in a device originally designed to remove radioactive materials from metals in the nuclear industry.
The actor licensed the technology and then worked with technicians to build an eight-foot high machine dubbed a ?Kevin?. He tested the washing machine-like drum on polluted rivers in South America, where it produced 99% clean water.
He wanted to sell the technology to the US Navy and cruise lines so they could clean water from ship bilges before discharging it into the sea, but in the end, disheartened by lack of interest from the oil industry, he sold the company to John Houghtaling.
They continued to work together on a range of machines, the largest of which is now called the V20. There are other similar devices around, whose inventors claim they too are ignored by the oil business, but Costner?s star power has proved irresistible.
Last week Ocean Therapy Solutions (OTS) flew engineers from the University of California, Los Angeles, to Venice, Louisiana, to help prepare up to thirty ?vacuum cleaners? for the Gulf. They are borrowing some older models back from other owners.
Houghtaling said OTS was also leasing $40,000 pollution monitoring devices from a company funded by Paul Allen, the Microsoft co-founder, to ensure that BP cannot ?roll back? on potentially-pricey promises to clean up the Gulf.
?We shall test the V20s this week and see if they can contribute,? said a BP spokesman last week. ?We are always open to fresh ideas to protect the environment, which is our first priority.?
Contact our advertising team for advertising and sponsorship in Times Online, The Times and The Sunday Times, or place your advertisement.
Times Online Services: Dating | Jobs | Property Search | Used Cars | Holidays | Births, Marriages, Deaths | Subscriptions | E-paper
News International associated websites: Milkround | Globrix
Copyright 2010 Times Newspapers Ltd.
This service is provided on Times Newspapers' standard Terms and Conditions. Please read our Privacy Policy.To inquire about a licence to reproduce material from Times Online, The Times or The Sunday Times, click here.This website is published by a member of the News International Group. News International Limited, 1 Virginia St, London E98 1XY, is the holding company for the News International group and is registered in England No 81701. VAT number GB 243 8054 69.
We could all be driving electric vehicles by now. That is totally within the realm of possibility. But evil assholes whose agendas are more about lining their pockets than having a sensible society continue to be granted opportunity after opportunity to straight fuck us all over.
It's so far beyond negligence. But geaux right ahead and give these same proven dickheads a 1,500th shot at it. Maybe this time, they'll suddenly change their ways and start giving a shit. And maybe I have a bridge I could sell you too.
See: I got a right to be hostile.
Jesus christ, is this what it's come to?
Okay, I gotta address this again.
Standing on the sidelines? Really? Is that all people merely trying to live their lives without getting screwed at every turn are doing? We're standing on the sidelines of where's it's really at?
Seriously, what is our system good for again? Cops that shoot first and never ask questions? Schools that would rather poison kids than teach them anything? A monetary system that strips us of any chances of attaining actual wealth? Bloated industries that are destroying both us and our environments? Putting future generations into massive debt? Going around the world and killing innocents at will?
Oh yes, please sign me up to play in that game. Sounds like a barrel of monkeys. Definitely count me in for the next meeting. I'll tell you what...I'll even bring the male prostitutes.
You didn't answer the question.
Yes, I did, earlier...a genuine move toward electric vehicles. Problem is, such progression gets categorically blocked by the bigwigs.
Not yet...but my next vehicle will definitely be a hybrid.
principled apathy
Doing nothing is still better than being a dick like you.
saving the world here
for real tho, i feel where harvey is coming from, but i gotta agree with the other points. its important to divest from bullshit greedy ass systems where we can, but also to keep in mind that their system is our reality and we live in it.
choose battles.divest.engage.be strategic.
but i get sick to my stomach thinking about that damn oil spill and how its gonna be business as usual for big oil,regardless.
You have always given me the impression that you "think Democracy is a joke."
To me Democracy is a work in progress. Its never a final product that just runs by itself. Without the active participation of electorate powerful interests hold sway.
To me Democracy is having patience and looking to the long view. As a someone who self identifies on the liberal side of the political equation I may loath the much of the ideology of my conservative brethren but I do respect the long term infrastructure they have built to move their agenda forward. My side is only just getting their act together in this regard.
But we liberals and conservatives are just two bases that anchor political discourse in this country. The people that decide where we are going are the middle. If you want change then you have 2 choices:
1) Take over one of the anchor points from within. This is what Thom Hartmann is advocating on the left and what the Tea Party is attempting on the right.
2) Create your own anchor point. This would be a harder way to do it, but you could create a party that is free from the history of the previous two. Usually these parties die, but sometimes they replace what has come before (see Whigs, Greens, etc).
If you have given up and you are just shouting from the sidelines then in reality you will be the butt of the jokes here. Being angry isn't enough. Being morally superior is not enough.
The other thing about Democracy, the one they don't teach you in school, its incredibility dirty. You have to make compromises with folks you don't want to compromise with to get things done. You have to accept imperfection. You also have to accept on faith that by getting dirty that ultimately things will be better.
So, circling back to the actual topic of this thread, the BP oil leak. Its a tragedy beyond imagining. We are going to have to live with the effects of it for at least this generation, if not more.
The dirty part of it is, this is the moment that can be used to effect some real change, in the long term. The Drill, Baby, Drill folks have been silenced. While the likelihood that we can stop all offshore drilling because of this catastrophe is nill, better regulations and a slow down on off shore drilling is possible now. More importantly its a time to get alternate energy laws and incentives into place so we are not driven to drill.
In the short term, I don't know what the answer for stopping this leak is going to be. Its obvious they thought it would never happen because they are desperately trying to figure it out now while ocean drowns.
In the end, we may have to nuke it like the Russians did in the Eighties. Even more joy.
My two cents.