Ok, so like how much memory. Interesting you list your heap as having only 512mb Ram and that's WITH[/b] a memory upgrade that you paid $50[/b] for?!!!!
You are Best Buy's dream customer.
Uneducated? Hell to the yeah!
Uh, 512 came with the laptop, I've upgraded to 2 gigs. Maybe you're reading me wrong.
- spidey
512 ram(upgradeable to 2)
Nah, I think I read you right. Upgradeable and upgraded are actually two seperate words with different meanings.
I think Spidey goes a little overboard trying to rile up the Mac heads, but c'mon. Even at the cheaper base model, Spidey could almost buy 3 of his laptop for that price. Another 6-9 months he's almost at 2 years, not bad for 7 bills. The truth is if you want good specs for a really good value, Mac may not be the choice, even if their stuff can work better, and you're kinda proving his point about not caring about specs. As someone in the electronics biz, I can tell you much of this shit is made in the same factories, whether Mac or Costco brand. I think I've seen Spidey say on here he works with computers professionally, so I'm not sure whose card you think you're pulling calling him uneducated. Also, whatever he said, talking about memory upgrades, i just doubled my desktops ram (to 4 gigs) for about 40 bucks.
Regardless, this thread is a weak place for this debate, but i think there are people (value minded, hands on computer nerds mostly) who macs are not the only option. Place and time, but damn, y'all are looking for holes in his story like he's dissing your moms....
specs, why people are so hung up on specs? At the end of the day, it's akin to a cock measuring contest. What really matters to me is how much work I can accomplish w/ any electronic good.
I know why pc users are so hung up on specs, it's because that's all there is to their computer. Fresh out the box, you can't really do much w/ it since there's nothing in it besides hardware. You are right, mac users are less hung up about specs because it's more about the overall user experience.
Different strokes for different folks. Except some people can't figure this out and have to be condescending at every opportunity.
The computers might be made in the same factories, but the r&d beforehand is certainly different. There is a reason why $500 laptops are that cheap, the cheapest components are slapped into a box w/ little regard for compatibility.
I know why pc users are so hung up on specs, it's because that's all there is to their computer. Fresh out the box, you can't really do much w/ it since there's nothing in it besides hardware.
well unless you build your own, it's hard to get a PC "fresh out the box" without a ton of MS software pre-loaded (at the very least the operating system).
that said, every PC I ever got "fresh out the box" I was able to use to access the internet, listen to music, and do word processing within about 5 minutes.
those three activities account for at least 99% of computer usage, so...I don't see how Mac has an advantage here.
I don't really care about "specs"; I'm just responding to your other point.
the apps on pc's are trial or stripped down versions. Especially the os, compare Vista home edition to Leopard. Then there's iLife....
most people only do those simple tasks (internet/wp) on their computer because they don't realize how easy it is to do other things like editing movies, burning dvd's, editing photos, etc. This is why macs are winning avg users like these over, it provides these features right out the box, integrated.
I wanted to add that the DESIGN of a computer is one of its "specs." I don't see how one can divorce it from other attributes. It may not be as technically integral to the performance of a computer but it is entirely relevant to the experience of USING a computer.
Spidey tends to sniffle at the design-element of Apple - though I have yet to see him deny that Macs, in general, are aesthetically superior to the average PC - as something superficial but that seems rather shortsighted. One reason people like Macs is because they LOOK GOOD and as a result, it is pleasurable to use it. That's an attribute not lost on product engineers even if it may get short-shrift from programmer types.
Obviously, for some consumers, looks don't matter; they want power, they want value and in those areas, I think it's fair to say that certain Apple products will come up short in comparison to others. But, with the exception of a few misses, Apple has consistently created products that simply look better than the rest: the iPod, the iMac, the aluminum powerbooks, etc. And insofar as that's true, it's one spec that deserves equal consideration with processing speed, HD memory and video resolution.
All that said, I don't care how amazing the Air looks - that shit is still hella $$$!
Planning your laptop purchase on whether your shit looks pretty or not is plain dumb in my mind and even more dumb on desktop purchases considering shit sits out of sight most of the time. I guess when most of your userbase treats your product as a fashion accessory you can get away with it. Mufuckaz are not using their Macs everyday like "Wow, my Mac is so pretty I'm so glad I bought it."
As far as specs go, before you actually go out and try a product, you have very limited information to compare it with another product. You can look at pictures and decide which one will enhance your workflow by gazing at its prettiness all day. You can read reviews which usually only cover the single product or if there is a comparison, you better hope it's between the products you are interested. This is where specs come into play.
I agree wholeheartedly with trying out whatever shit you are interesting and to go with whatever you vibe with the most. With the internet though, there is so much information out there to either narrow down your choices or become more educated while planning your purchase. Useability is #1 for me by far but after that, specs are a good way to decide on a product.
Planning your laptop purchase on whether your shit looks pretty or not is plain dumb in my mind and even more dumb on desktop purchases considering shit sits out of sight most of the time. I guess when most of your userbase treats your product as a fashion accessory you can get away with it. Mufuckaz are not using their Macs everyday like "Wow, my Mac is so pretty I'm so glad I bought it."
Do you close your eyes while eating an amazing meal?
I don't know about traveler but this is NOT aimed for students nor sensible for them. The Air is not designed to be a primary computer; it's a secondary one. MOst students I know don't have the kind of means to be able to roll with two computers.
I'd argue that the average student doesn't need what the air doesn't have: firewire and an audio input.
The lack of storage is unfortunate, but if you're not an A/V file hog you should be straight, or get time capsule. Apple is an innovator, and IMHO they're right to focus on cutting-edge wireless solutions instead of worrying about whether their laptops have firewire. More wireless storage solutions (NAS for the home market) will emerge shortly, and smaller HDs are on the way, so it will become less of an issue.
Planning your laptop purchase on whether your shit looks pretty or not is plain dumb in my mind and even more dumb on desktop purchases considering shit sits out of sight most of the time. I guess when most of your userbase treats your product as a fashion accessory you can get away with it. Mufuckaz are not using their Macs everyday like "Wow, my Mac is so pretty I'm so glad I bought it."
Do you close your eyes while eating an amazing meal?
No, but if I tried something that was not visually appealing but I enjoyed eating, it wouldn't stop me from eating it in the future.
I'd argue that the average student doesn't need what the air doesn't have: firewire and an audio input.
What is provided in the Macbook Air is perfect for a student. I don't think what it comes in is as suitable though. If it's as fragile as it looks, students will go through these in six months.
Apple is an innovator, and IMHO they're right to focus on cutting-edge wireless solutions instead of worrying about whether their laptops have firewire.
I don't know how big Apple's audio production userbase is but there's already a lot of complaints about the Firewire chipset being changed in the recent Macbook Pros. I can't even think of what would happen once they phased out Firewire which I can totally see them doing eventually. Considering that there's no PC laptop option for powered-Firewire ports, it seems like a terrible thing for audio production users. I mean, no one is going to buy Logic if they can't use their Firewire soundcards with their laptop (which they might not be able to already due to chipset changes.)
do you pose with your little white macbook in front of the mirror? adjust the angle of the screen so it's "just so"? put little heart and star stickers around the perimeter of the screen? give it a cute name like "Millie" or "Lawrence"?
I'd argue that the average student doesn't need what the air doesn't have: firewire and an audio input.
What is provided in the Macbook Air is perfect for a student. I don't think what it comes in is as suitable though. If it's as fragile as it looks, students will go through these in six months.
Being 1st gen they will probably have a higher failure rate than macbooks. Laptops are inherently prone to failure, but Apple macbooks are less than the norm. Nobody knows at this point.
Apple is an innovator, and IMHO they're right to focus on cutting-edge wireless solutions instead of worrying about whether their laptops have firewire.
I don't know how big Apple's audio production userbase is but there's already a lot of complaints about the Firewire chipset being changed in the recent Macbook Pros. I can't even think of what would happen once they phased out Firewire which I can totally see them doing eventually. Considering that there's no PC laptop option for powered-Firewire ports, it seems like a terrible thing for audio production users. I mean, no one is going to buy Logic if they can't use their Firewire soundcards with their laptop (which they might not be able to already due to chipset changes.)
This isn't a laptop geared for audio producers, so not sure what your point is. There are two others that are, one cheaper (macbook) and one more expensive (macbook pro).
Being 1st gen they will probably have a higher failure rate than macbooks. Laptops are inherently prone to failure, but Apple macbooks are less than the norm. Nobody knows at this point.
I was referring to students being a bit less careful with their possessions.
This isn't a laptop geared for audio producers, so not sure what your point is. There are two others that are, one cheaper (macbook) and one more expensive (macbook pro).
I never said it was but you were also referring to future Apple developments and if they follow up on this, they will alienate their once loyal audio production market. Like I said, I don't know how much of their marketshare exists from this but it is a concern.
I didn't say that design is the rest you MAKE the purchase. I said it was one factor that influences people's decision in what they chose to buy as a consumer. Would you buy a car based on its specs alone?
Planning your laptop purchase on whether your shit looks pretty or not is plain dumb in my mind and even more dumb on desktop purchases considering shit sits out of sight most of the time. I guess when most of your userbase treats your product as a fashion accessory you can get away with it. Mufuckaz are not using their Macs everyday like "Wow, my Mac is so pretty I'm so glad I bought it."
As far as specs go, before you actually go out and try a product, you have very limited information to compare it with another product. You can look at pictures and decide which one will enhance your workflow by gazing at its prettiness all day. You can read reviews which usually only cover the single product or if there is a comparison, you better hope it's between the products you are interested. This is where specs come into play.
I agree wholeheartedly with trying out whatever shit you are interesting and to go with whatever you vibe with the most. With the internet though, there is so much information out there to either narrow down your choices or become more educated while planning your purchase. Useability is #1 for me by far but after that, specs are a good way to decide on a product.
Comments
Nah, I think I read you right. Upgradeable and upgraded are actually two seperate words with different meanings.
"People don't read." - Cashless
Regardless, this thread is a weak place for this debate, but i think there are people (value minded, hands on computer nerds mostly) who macs are not the only option. Place and time, but damn, y'all are looking for holes in his story like he's dissing your moms....
I'd actually be interested in reading why you think I'm Best Buys dream customer.
- spidey
Will the two of you get a room already? No one else around here gives a fuck about your little beef thread.
I know why pc users are so hung up on specs, it's because that's all there is to their computer. Fresh out the box, you can't really do much w/ it since there's nothing in it besides hardware. You are right, mac users are less hung up about specs because it's more about the overall user experience.
Different strokes for different folks. Except some people can't figure this out and have to be condescending at every opportunity.
The computers might be made in the same factories, but the r&d beforehand is certainly different. There is a reason why $500 laptops are that cheap, the cheapest components are slapped into a box w/ little regard for compatibility.
Based on what you wrote in two seperate posts...
1. you had 512mb of memory
2. that you PREVIOUSLY upgraded to 512 for $50
According to what you actually wrote, that was a logical conclusion. Granted, it wasn't what you meant, but we're not telepaths here.
haha, Ok I'm done O, promise.
- spidey
well unless you build your own, it's hard to get a PC "fresh out the box" without a ton of MS software pre-loaded (at the very least the operating system).
that said, every PC I ever got "fresh out the box" I was able to use to access the internet, listen to music, and do word processing within about 5 minutes.
those three activities account for at least 99% of computer usage, so...I don't see how Mac has an advantage here.
I don't really care about "specs"; I'm just responding to your other point.
most people only do those simple tasks (internet/wp) on their computer because they don't realize how easy it is to do other things like editing movies, burning dvd's, editing photos, etc. This is why macs are winning avg users like these over, it provides these features right out the box, integrated.
Spidey tends to sniffle at the design-element of Apple - though I have yet to see him deny that Macs, in general, are aesthetically superior to the average PC - as something superficial but that seems rather shortsighted. One reason people like Macs is because they LOOK GOOD and as a result, it is pleasurable to use it. That's an attribute not lost on product engineers even if it may get short-shrift from programmer types.
Obviously, for some consumers, looks don't matter; they want power, they want value and in those areas, I think it's fair to say that certain Apple products will come up short in comparison to others. But, with the exception of a few misses, Apple has consistently created products that simply look better than the rest: the iPod, the iMac, the aluminum powerbooks, etc. And insofar as that's true, it's one spec that deserves equal consideration with processing speed, HD memory and video resolution.
All that said, I don't care how amazing the Air looks - that shit is still hella $$$!
and I don't have to be the umpteenth douche in the Mission district coffee house with a white mac laptop. now that's a bad "look."
pretty stupid argument in favor of a laptop right?
my point exactly.
nope.
fisher price "my first puter" status.
As far as specs go, before you actually go out and try a product, you have very limited information to compare it with another product. You can look at pictures and decide which one will enhance your workflow by gazing at its prettiness all day. You can read reviews which usually only cover the single product or if there is a comparison, you better hope it's between the products you are interested. This is where specs come into play.
I agree wholeheartedly with trying out whatever shit you are interesting and to go with whatever you vibe with the most. With the internet though, there is so much information out there to either narrow down your choices or become more educated while planning your purchase. Useability is #1 for me by far but after that, specs are a good way to decide on a product.
Do you close your eyes while eating an amazing meal?
I'd argue that the average student doesn't need what the air doesn't have: firewire and an audio input.
The lack of storage is unfortunate, but if you're not an A/V file hog you should be straight, or get time capsule. Apple is an innovator, and IMHO they're right to focus on cutting-edge wireless solutions instead of worrying about whether their laptops have firewire. More wireless storage solutions (NAS for the home market) will emerge shortly, and smaller HDs are on the way, so it will become less of an issue.
I don't know how big Apple's audio production userbase is but there's already a lot of complaints about the Firewire chipset being changed in the recent Macbook Pros. I can't even think of what would happen once they phased out Firewire which I can totally see them doing eventually. Considering that there's no PC laptop option for powered-Firewire ports, it seems like a terrible thing for audio production users. I mean, no one is going to buy Logic if they can't use their Firewire soundcards with their laptop (which they might not be able to already due to chipset changes.)
do you pose with your little white macbook in front of the mirror? adjust the angle of the screen so it's "just so"? put little heart and star stickers around the perimeter of the screen? give it a cute name like "Millie" or "Lawrence"?
I thought so, herb.
Being 1st gen they will probably have a higher failure rate than macbooks. Laptops are inherently prone to failure, but Apple macbooks are less than the norm. Nobody knows at this point.
This isn't a laptop geared for audio producers, so not sure what your point is. There are two others that are, one cheaper (macbook) and one more expensive (macbook pro).
I never said it was but you were also referring to future Apple developments and if they follow up on this, they will alienate their once loyal audio production market. Like I said, I don't know how much of their marketshare exists from this but it is a concern.
Compare that with my "dream" desktop coming out of high school made by Gateway that I had to reformat several times a year. Paid $2500 for that one.
Fuck a PC. Never going back. Ever.
What the fuck is this, again?![/b]
ewf. you can't blame that poor choice on anyone but yourself.
How about I liked their warranty? Will that get me off the hook?