that summer when the remixes to nappy heads and vocab dropped, that was pretty huge. if the fugees stuck to the og formula, i'm sure they'd be huge again.
But as you state, those were both remixes. I bought the album off the strength of those singles and was floored by how awful it was. So if they stuck to their original formula, they'd still be horrible.
Also: "15 years ago" is better than "now"?
i cant believe that was 15 years ago, wow, and you weren't the only one who got suckered into buying the album off those radio singles, which unbeknownst to most, were actually remixes. to their credit, they released a remix album not too long after their album dropped.
If she was ever going to make important music again, she would have done it by now--she's done. This is an artistically incapacitating level of crazy.
Please to see: Sly Stone.
Or Lee Perry.
Over time, casual fans tend to compress an artist's insanity into that same artist's period of artistic productivity and to conclude that their craziness was part and parcel of their genius, but the fact is that real craziness is pretty much incapacitating. Like, Perry--whom people like to view as some sort of mad shaman figure, a perception which is informed by no small measure of racism--but who ceased entirely to make great music once he went mad nearly thirty years ago.
Paul McCartney had some million sellers and you can bet nobody kept measuring those records - saleswise - up against the Beatles.
On the contrary, pretty much everything McCartney's done as a solo act has lived in the shadow of the Beatles.
Not really. R. Meltzer remembers being in a record store ca. '76 and seeing two girls, maybe 13-14 years old, pick up a Beatles album, look at the cover, and go "hey, Paul McCartney was in another band before Wings!" And that was a running joke for the remainder of the seventies. That's how large McCartney was.
Even when he's had really big sellers, like "Mull of Kintyre" (which, although a b-side in the US, sold over two million copies in the UK, more than any Beatles single ever did), he's had to endure some people[/b] dismissing them as trite, no matter how popular they were with the public.[/b]
I'm not a huge fan of (most of) his solo stuff either, but the fact remains: if McCartney played a show tomorrow and didn't do any Beatles songs, no one would notice. Sure "some people" might talk about it, but "the public" would be satisfied.
If she was ever going to make important music again, she would have done it by now--she's done. This is an artistically incapacitating level of crazy.
Please to see: Sly Stone.
Or Lee Perry.
Over time, casual fans tend to compress an artist's insanity into that same artist's period of artistic productivity and to conclude that their craziness was part and parcel of their genius, but the fact is that real craziness is pretty much incapacitating. Like, Perry--whom people like to view as some sort of mad shaman figure, a perception which is informed by no small measure of racism--but who ceased entirely to make great music once he went mad nearly thirty years ago.
DocMcCoy"Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,913 Posts
Not really. R. Meltzer remembers being in a record store ca. '76 and seeing two girls, maybe 13-14 years old, pick up a Beatles album, look at the cover, and go "hey, Paul McCartney was in another band before Wings!" And that was a running joke for the remainder of the seventies. That's how large McCartney was.
I wouldn't dispute for a moment that, more so than the other Beatles, McCartney had a particularly impressive career after they split. I remember "Band On The Run" being everywhere when I was a kid, and post-Beatles songs like "Maybe I'm Amazed" and "Every Night" are up there with his best for me. But, in spite of all that, people never really stopped asking him if the Beatles were gonna reform until Lennon got murdered. That band cast a big shadow, and it still does.
I'm not a huge fan of (most of) his solo stuff either, but the fact remains: if McCartney played a show tomorrow and didn't do any Beatles songs, no one would notice. Sure "some people" might talk about it, but "the public" would be satisfied.
That's testament to the depth of his catalogue, no doubt, and I'm sure there's still a hardcore who'd be content with a set full of Wings/solo tunes. But the biggest show he's done in the UK in recent years - headlining the main stage on Saturday night at Glastonbury 2004 - featured a fair few Beatles songs.
All that said, having grown up listening to them, I do sometimes forget that there's an entire generation who know him only for what he did after the Beatles split.
"According to sources at Lauryn Hill???s Norway concert this weekend, her crazy demands are even more out of control. Apparently she demanded that all her security guards be black, none of them could look at her???even from backstage, no one around her could speak to her unless she speaks to them first, and no one could walk past her backstage. Chick clearly has some issues.
When one security guard forgot one of the rules and said something to her, she allegedly lost her damn mind and started throwing water bottles at him. And after the power went out in the venue???Lauryn refused to continue once the power came back on. Folks had to get a refund."
and yeah Lee Perry didnt really recover from his bat shit crazy behavior like burning down his legendary studio cause it was possessed by evil spirts. He stills tours with Dub is a Weapon but the show is
Don't forget that Lauren tried to rip off the entire supporting cast of her solo record, was sued, and had to cough up a good bit of credit - and dough - to the people who *actually* did the music on it.
saying. I always bring this up to people who consider her to have been some amazing artist (mostly women). I'm always like "have you ever heard of James Poyser, etc? like the ones who actually wrote and performed her album?" blank stares.
BTW I suggest people riding for "the Score" pop it in the deck tonight for a little revisitation. my experience has been that it holds up very poorly. it brings a nostalgic smile to my face I suppose, but the music is mostly corny.
So here's the breakdown. Lauryn didn't want to be sold at Walmart. Wyclef is too cheesy for her to comeback with the Fugees. She has enough money to play house all day and she dresses like a hobo. OK. I don't feel like we've gotten to the core of it. And I don't feel like going to the library to check out Toure's book. Has she ever discussed her absence? Can I get a show of hands who bought that 'Unplugged' record? I did.
"According to sources at Lauryn Hill???s Norway concert this weekend, her crazy demands are even more out of control. Apparently she demanded that all her security guards be black, none of them could look at her???even from backstage, no one around her could speak to her unless she speaks to them first, and no one could walk past her backstage. Chick clearly has some issues.
When one security guard forgot one of the rules and said something to her, she allegedly lost her damn mind and started throwing water bottles at him. And after the power went out in the venue???Lauryn refused to continue once the power came back on. Folks had to get a refund."
and yeah Lee Perry didnt really recover from his bat shit crazy behavior like burning down his legendary studio cause it was possessed by evil spirts. He stills tours with Dub is a Weapon but the show is
I'm not saying these anecdotes are untrue necessarily, but why is it that every "batshit-crazy-racist-Lauryn-hill" story inevitably originates from alleged events in a Nordic country? it's weird, it's always like "Lauryn Hill's comback tour was off to a fine start this Saturday at the Ingrid Bergman Theater in Stockholm before she allegedly beat three white kids to death....."
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
BTW I suggest people riding for "the Score" pop it in the deck tonight for a little revisitation. my experience has been that it holds up very poorly. it brings a nostalgic smile to my face I suppose, but the music is mostly corny.
Oh yeah, you LOVED IT back in the gap, but ONLY NOW is it corny...
BTW I suggest people riding for "the Score" pop it in the deck tonight for a little revisitation. my experience has been that it holds up very poorly. it brings a nostalgic smile to my face I suppose, but the music is mostly corny.
Yeah, I agree. I noticed the same thing on a recent listen.
oh no you don't. Simone was not crazy - she was ornery, rude and pissed off. I know you're talking about behaviour and not artistic merit, but a couple of strong records and strange behaviour does not a Nina Simone comparison warrant.
Plus, Simone would NEVER leave the house looking like this.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
BTW I suggest people riding for "the Score" pop it in the deck tonight for a little revisitation. my experience has been that it holds up very poorly. it brings a nostalgic smile to my face I suppose, but the music is mostly corny.
Yeah, I agree. I noticed the same thing on a recent listen.
Okay, so what's y'all's excuses for not realizing such an obvious thing back when the album first came out?
BTW I suggest people riding for "the Score" pop it in the deck tonight for a little revisitation. my experience has been that it holds up very poorly. it brings a nostalgic smile to my face I suppose, but the music is mostly corny.
Yeah, I agree. I noticed the same thing on a recent listen.
Okay, so what's y'all's excuses for not realizing such an obvious thing back when the album first came out?
Its an album u cant listen to st8 thru, but the handfull of songs are very good.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
what's that little man?
You and your Becky-rated rap collection both heard me.
BTW I suggest people riding for "the Score" pop it in the deck tonight for a little revisitation. my experience has been that it holds up very poorly. it brings a nostalgic smile to my face I suppose, but the music is mostly corny.
Yeah, I agree. I noticed the same thing on a recent listen.
Okay, so what's y'all's excuses for not realizing such an obvious thing back when the album first came out?
Wait, I'm NOT the only one who hated that album when it came out?
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
what's that little man?
You and your Becky-rated rap collection both heard me.
sport, I don't even own "the Score," which is probably more than you can say for yourself.
I have never owned it, nor would I ever recommend that people revisit it.
I'm glad that it provides you memories of the old school though...
You and your Becky-rated rap collection both heard me.
sport, I don't even own "the Score," which is probably more than you can say for yourself.
I have never owned it, nor would I ever recommend that people revisit it.
I'm glad that it provides you memories of the old school though...
oh man I don't know why I bother: I suggested that people revisit it because I think it sucks. did you miss that part?
and yeah, when I hear that album I remember being in high school and it playing all over the Frickin' place. just like when you hear that Four Non Blondes song you think of the time you lost your virginity at the Lilith Fair(e) and you sigh nostalgically.
enjoy those memories, harv: no one can take them away from you.
oh no you don't. Simone was not crazy - she was ornery, rude and pissed off. I know you're talking about behaviour and not artistic merit, but a couple of strong records and strange behaviour does not a Nina Simone comparison warrant.
nina simone suffered from a fairly serious bi-polar disorder and was medicated accordingly. lauryn hill is obviously talanted but her demons seem to be haunting her in similar fashion: paranoia, delusions and mania. nina simone was not just defiant and different and neither is lauren hill. that said that doen;t make either of them crazy per se.
oh no you don't. Simone was not crazy - she was ornery, rude and pissed off. I know you're talking about behaviour and not artistic merit, but a couple of strong records and strange behaviour does not a Nina Simone comparison warrant.
nina simone suffered from a fairly serious bi-polar disorder and was medicated accordingly. lauryn hill is obviously talanted but her demons seem to be haunting her in similar fashion: paranoia, delusions and mania. nina simone was not just defiant and different and neither is lauren hill. that said that doen;t make either of them crazy per se.
Agreed on the 'crazy' part, poor choice of words - edit - to be clear, I am not using the word crazy to characterize bi-polar disorder/manic depression....still, I find the comparison a stretch. (I had to remove the picture, I can't keep looking at that.)
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
what's that little man?
You and your Becky-rated rap collection both heard me.
sport, I don't even own "the Score," which is probably more than you can say for yourself.
I have never owned it, nor would I ever recommend that people revisit it.
I'm glad that it provides you memories of the old school though...
oh man I don't know why I bother: I suggested that people revisit it because I think it sucks. did you miss that part?
and yeah, when I hear that album I remember being in high school and it playing all over the Frickin' place. just like when you hear that Four Non Blondes song you think of the time you lost your virginity at the Lilith Fair(e) and you sigh nostalgically.
enjoy those memories, harv: no one can take them away from you.
Good...ultimately I'm glad that we can agree that The Score is lame.
But dude, you are giving up way too much of yourself to suggest that I even know anything about Four Non Blondes and Lilith Fair. You're by my best guess about 6 years too late and of course way too Becky-ish (as always with you) on that one.
I did see the Fugees on that first Smokin' Grooves tour though...for whatever that's worth.
Comments
i cant believe that was 15 years ago, wow, and you weren't the only one who got suckered into buying the album off those radio singles, which unbeknownst to most, were actually remixes. to their credit, they released a remix album not too long after their album dropped.
Or Lee Perry.
Over time, casual fans tend to compress an artist's insanity into that same artist's period of artistic productivity and to conclude that their craziness was part and parcel of their genius, but the fact is that real craziness is pretty much incapacitating. Like, Perry--whom people like to view as some sort of mad shaman figure, a perception which is informed by no small measure of racism--but who ceased entirely to make great music once he went mad nearly thirty years ago.
Not really. R. Meltzer remembers being in a record store ca. '76 and seeing two girls, maybe 13-14 years old, pick up a Beatles album, look at the cover, and go "hey, Paul McCartney was in another band before Wings!" And that was a running joke for the remainder of the seventies. That's how large McCartney was.
I'm not a huge fan of (most of) his solo stuff either, but the fact remains: if McCartney played a show tomorrow and didn't do any Beatles songs, no one would notice. Sure "some people" might talk about it, but "the public" would be satisfied.
he would still sell out the 20,000 seat arena at $100 a head.
I wouldn't dispute for a moment that, more so than the other Beatles, McCartney had a particularly impressive career after they split. I remember "Band On The Run" being everywhere when I was a kid, and post-Beatles songs like "Maybe I'm Amazed" and "Every Night" are up there with his best for me. But, in spite of all that, people never really stopped asking him if the Beatles were gonna reform until Lennon got murdered. That band cast a big shadow, and it still does.
That's testament to the depth of his catalogue, no doubt, and I'm sure there's still a hardcore who'd be content with a set full of Wings/solo tunes. But the biggest show he's done in the UK in recent years - headlining the main stage on Saturday night at Glastonbury 2004 - featured a fair few Beatles songs.
All that said, having grown up listening to them, I do sometimes forget that there's an entire generation who know him only for what he did after the Beatles split.
When one security guard forgot one of the rules and said something to her, she allegedly lost her damn mind and started throwing water bottles at him. And after the power went out in the venue???Lauryn refused to continue once the power came back on. Folks had to get a refund."
and yeah Lee Perry didnt really recover from his bat shit crazy behavior like burning down his legendary studio cause it was possessed by evil spirts. He stills tours with Dub is a Weapon but the show is
saying. I always bring this up to people who consider her to have been some amazing artist (mostly women). I'm always like "have you ever heard of James Poyser, etc? like the ones who actually wrote and performed her album?" blank stares.
BTW I suggest people riding for "the Score" pop it in the deck tonight for a little revisitation. my experience has been that it holds up very poorly. it brings a nostalgic smile to my face I suppose, but the music is mostly corny.
I'm not saying these anecdotes are untrue necessarily, but why is it that every "batshit-crazy-racist-Lauryn-hill" story inevitably originates from alleged events in a Nordic country? it's weird, it's always like "Lauryn Hill's comback tour was off to a fine start this Saturday at the Ingrid Bergman Theater in Stockholm before she allegedly beat three white kids to death....."
Oh yeah, you LOVED IT back in the gap, but ONLY NOW is it corny...
Yeah, I agree. I noticed the same thing on a recent listen.
oh no you don't. Simone was not crazy - she was ornery, rude and pissed off. I know you're talking about behaviour and not artistic merit, but a couple of strong records and strange behaviour does not a Nina Simone comparison warrant.
Plus, Simone would NEVER leave the house looking like this.
Okay, so what's y'all's excuses for not realizing such an obvious thing back when the album first came out?
Its an album u cant listen to st8 thru, but the handfull of songs are very good.
You and your Becky-rated rap collection both heard me.
sport, I don't even own "the Score," which is probably more than you can say for yourself.
Wait, I'm NOT the only one who hated that album when it came out?
I have never owned it, nor would I ever recommend that people revisit it.
I'm glad that it provides you memories of the old school though...
I heard Z-Ro liked it.
oh man I don't know why I bother: I suggested that people revisit it because I think it sucks. did you miss that part?
and yeah, when I hear that album I remember being in high school and it playing all over the Frickin' place. just like when you hear that Four Non Blondes song you think of the time you lost your virginity at the Lilith Fair(e) and you sigh nostalgically.
enjoy those memories, harv: no one can take them away from you.
Wow the snobbery in here is, how you say? To Perfection!
nina simone suffered from a fairly serious bi-polar disorder and was medicated accordingly. lauryn hill is obviously talanted but her demons seem to be haunting her in similar fashion: paranoia, delusions and mania. nina simone was not just defiant and different and neither is lauren hill. that said that doen;t make either of them crazy per se.
Agreed on the 'crazy' part, poor choice of words - edit - to be clear, I am not using the word crazy to characterize bi-polar disorder/manic depression....still, I find the comparison a stretch. (I had to remove the picture, I can't keep looking at that.)
Good...ultimately I'm glad that we can agree that The Score is lame.
But dude, you are giving up way too much of yourself to suggest that I even know anything about Four Non Blondes and Lilith Fair. You're by my best guess about 6 years too late and of course way too Becky-ish (as always with you) on that one.
I did see the Fugees on that first Smokin' Grooves tour though...for whatever that's worth.
The Score=Aged poorly (The song that Diamond D did is still kind of hard)
I was recently looking at B+'s portfolio and found this, I've never seen these photos:
^^^^
damn, in the preview function the photos where side by side, now it just looks like a magician saw'd the lady in half.