Bush caught on tape talking on Katrina
Guzzo
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"no one could have anticipated that the levees...yadda yadda" BULLSHIT!http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11627394/Updated: 7:12 p.m. ET March 1, 2006WASHINGTON - In dramatic and sometimes agonizing terms, federal disaster officials warned President Bush and his homeland security chief before Hurricane Katrina struck that the storm could breach levees, put lives at risk in New Orleans??? Superdome and overwhelm rescuers, according to confidential video footage.Bush didn???t ask a single question during the final briefing before Katrina struck on Aug. 29, but he assured soon-to-be-battered state officials: ???We are fully prepared.???The footage ??? along with seven days of transcripts of briefings obtained by The Associated Press ??? show in excruciating detail that while federal officials anticipated the tragedy that unfolded in New Orleans and elsewhere along the Gulf Coast, they were fatally slow to realize they had not mustered enough resources to deal with the unprecedented disaster.Linked by video, Bush???s confidence on Aug. 28 starkly contrasts with the dire warnings his disaster chief and a cacophony of federal, state and local officials provided during the four days before the storm.Brown???s fears voicedA top hurricane expert voiced ???grave concerns??? about the levees and then-Federal Emergency Management Agency chief Michael Brown told the president and Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff that he feared there weren???t enough disaster teams to help evacuees at the Superdome.???I???m concerned about ... their ability to respond to a catastrophe within a catastrophe,??? Brown told his bosses the afternoon before Katrina made landfall.The White House and Homeland Security Department urged the public Wednesday not to read too much into the video footage. ???I hope people don???t draw conclusions from the president getting a single briefing,??? presidential spokesman Trent Duffy said, citing a variety of orders and disaster declarations Bush signed before the storm made landfall. ???He received multiple briefings from multiple officials, and he was completely engaged at all times.??? Homeland Security spokesman Russ Knocke said his department would not release the full set of videotaped briefings, saying most transcripts from the sessions were provided to congressional investigators months ago. Homeland Security: ???Nothing new??? on tapes???There???s nothing new or insightful on these tapes,??? Knocke said. ???We actively participated in the lessons-learned review and we continue to participate in the Senate???s review and are working with them on their recommendation.??? New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin, a critic of the administration???s Katrina response, had a different take after watching the footage Wednesday afternoon from an AP reporter???s camera. ???I have kind a sinking feeling in my gut right now,??? Nagin said. ???I was listening to what people were saying ??? they didn???t know, so therefore it was an issue of a learning curve. You know, from this tape it looks like everybody was fully aware.??? Some of the footage and transcripts from briefings on Aug. 25-31 conflict with the defenses that federal, state and local officials have made in trying to deflect blame and minimize the political fallout from the failed Katrina response:Homeland Security officials have said the ???fog of war??? blinded them early on to the magnitude of the disaster. But the video and transcripts show federal and local officials discussed threats clearly, reviewed long-made plans and understood Katrina would wreak devastation of historic proportions. ???I???m sure it will be the top 10 or 15 when all is said and done,??? the National Hurricane Center???s Max Mayfield warned the day Katrina lashed the Gulf Coast.???I don???t buy the ???fog of war??? defense,??? Brown told the AP in an interview Wednesday. ???It was a fog of bureaucracy.???Bush declared four days after the storm, ???I don???t think anybody anticipated the breach of the levees??? that gushed deadly floodwaters into New Orleans. But the transcripts and video show there was plenty of talk about that possibility ??? and Bush was worried too.White House deputy chief of staff Joe Hagin, Louisiana Gov. Kathleen Blanco and Brown discussed fears of a levee breach the day the storm hit.???I talked to the president twice today, once in Crawford and then again on Air Force One,??? Brown said. ???He???s obviously watching the television a lot, and he had some questions about the Dome, he???s asking questions about reports of breaches.???Louisiana officials angrily blamed the federal government for not being prepared, but the transcripts show they were still praising FEMA as the storm roared toward the Gulf Coast and even two days afterward. ???I think a lot of the planning FEMA has done with us the past year has really paid off,??? Col. Jeff Smith, Louisiana???s emergency preparedness deputy director, said during the Aug. 28 briefing.It wasn???t long before Smith and other state officials sounded overwhelmed.???We appreciate everything that you all are doing for us, and all I would ask is that you realize that what???s going on and the sense of urgency needs to be ratcheted up,??? Smith said Aug. 30.
Comments
Both had grand ideas, Reagan - end the Cold War, Bush get rid of Saddam, but really had no idea about Russia and Iraq other than their governments were bad. They both left all the details to their aides and staff and were removed from any kind of serious decisions. I've read about several briefings Bush had on Iraq where he never said a thing. Both are leaders with their ideas, but not managers where they know or care about how their ideas are carried out.
This Katrina footage seems to fit into that mold. Bush is told about what could happen but he's removed from the details and reality of what happens on the ground.
the buzz from local fema/dhs workers is we are lucky it was not worse considering
what goes on
you are also right about the wire, balto school skeez will rock
His presidency in a nutshell.
Bush jr makes Ronald Reagan look like fucking Winston Churchill by comparison.
I agree with everything said so far, and don't doubt that this is yet another smoking gun that the American public, along with the media, will ignore. But isn't this really the main problem with much of republican agenda, the lack of any concern or vision, beyond politics, of how these decisions affect real people. "Cutting taxes stimulates the economy" is repeated constantly as gospel, but there is little discussion when healthcare and education are cut year after year. This applies to social security, education, Iraq, perscription drug plan etc. I had a republican friend recently tell me how Social Security has been a failure for decades, oblivious to the fact that its widely considered one of the most succesfull and popular federal programs ever. The real point, I told him, is that in the end for all his "concern" about the programs effectiveness, the Republican leadership's solution is almost never to actually fix a program, but to scale it back or eliminate it. The only time they throw money at a problem is when their caught with their pants down, like in N'awlins....
I'm not trying to get into a Katrina debate here. But Reagan really did end the cold war, despite a revolt of the expert class.
That doesn't contradict my point though, that both presidents had the same style.
you mean effective?
I'd give more of the credit to Gorbachev's glasnost and perestroika. But, yeah, compared to Bush Ronnie looks like an intellectual collossus.
Gorbachav never wanted to dissolve the Soviet Union. Yeltsin ended up doing that. Reagan from the gittyup said his goal was to end the evil empire.
Bush can get a pass on Katrina and still be the worst president evar.
Reagan on the other hand....to say one person ended the cold war is stupid. As if Reagan and his supporters were the only ones doing anything to end the cold war?
Come on.
But if you insist on a narrow view of why the cold war ended think about this...The cold war ended itself because its only possible outcome was to destroy the planet through nuclear war.
The way these fucktard neo-cons try to prop Reagan up as the "greatest American evar"* is simply a part of their scheme for a permanent ruling class.
But look at them! After ten years in power they are fucking crumbling.
*e.g., rememebr this crap?
1 Ronald Reagan
2 Abraham Lincoln
3 Martin Luther King
4 George Washington
5 Benjamin Franklin
6 George W Bush
7 Bill Clinton
8 Elvis Presley
9 Oprah Winfrey
10 Franklin D Roosevelt
http://dsc.discovery.com/convergence/greatestamerican/greatestamerican.html
You are ofcourse correct. There are numerous factors contributing to the collapse of the soviet union. A big factor was the Reagan presidency. In 1981 he signed an executive order reversing the prior policy of Republicans and Democrats known as detante. He provided aid to Lech Walesa's strikers; Afghan rebels (but not bin laden see other thread); constantly announced his intentions to bring down the evil empire; utilized the Helsinki process to secure the release of dissidents like Sharansky and Solzeneitzin; pressured Western Europe not to allow the construction of a pipeline connecting their refineries to Russia's oil wells; placed the pershings in western germany; "tear down this wall;" I could go on.
Now the funny thing is that at the time, all of these policies were criticized by the arms control experts, foreign embassies, international relations professors as a dangerous course leading to mutually assured destruction. Mondale campaigned against what he called Reagan's adventurism. So I think it's fair to credit these policies with having some effect on the outcome of the cold war, considering that at the time his critics thought them so noteworthy and different.
And please share the fortune cookie or dental filling from whence you learned of the neocon plan to create a "permanent ruling class." Have you noticed that America has had such a thing since before it's founding.
Are you high on crack?
Sababbaba will destroy you.
Does't anyone else see this as a major smoking gun?
1. Bush, on tape, is notified about how serious the situation is with the levees
2. Nothing is done about it, bush remains on vacation freaking out more about Cindy Sheehan than about the possible loss of one of Americas biggest ports & city
3. Katrina comes and damn near washes away a metropolis
4. Bush, sensing americas disapproval of his handling of the situation goes on ABC and claims no one had ay idea that the levess could be breeched. Trying to maintain some "If I didn't know about it none of the bad stuff can possibly be my fault
5. Bush holds a press conference from New Orleans (in a work shirt) promising tons of money to rebuild the city
6. Six months later there are still people who ain't got shit from Fema and no government care outside of signs in front of their home saying this property will be bulldozed (before FEMA can see their situation)
conclusion: Bush lied on tape trying to play up some innocence on a situation he more than knew about and did nothing about (and in some cases a half year later, still hasn't done anyting).
Peoples lives are still ruined FEMA was ineffective, Bush, as Chief executive was inneffective and all we know is Bush claims ignorance as a defense (quite pathetic for a world leader).
IMPEACH THE FUCKER!
The tape is no smoking gun, just more evidence that Bush's management style is, despite Sabadaba's approval, highly INeffective. And that he talked out his ass to that stupid, stupid Diane Sawyer.
You're right. Poor word choice. I meant "a permanent republican majority"...not that it's so very different from "permanent ruling class." But I'll give you that semantic detail.
And don't try to tell us shit like this is rare:
"The Republican Party is a permanent majority for the future of this country," House Majority Leader Tom DeLay, R-Texas, said Wednesday [11/5/2004] "We're going to be able to lead this country in the direction we've been dreaming of for years..."
ugh.
This is possibly the best thing I will read all day. Not only is it a rare admission from a conservative that a ruling class/political aristoracy exists. It also contradicts the conservative mantra that anyone can achieve anything if they work hard enough.
Thanks.
That fat drunkard Yeltsin did nothing other than follow the previous administration's work to its ineluctable conclusion. Gorbachev didn't want to dissolve the Soviet Union but he accepted the inevitability of its dissolution in pushing through the economic reforms that he did. I know where you're going with this, Vitamin, but I just can't agree that Cowboy Ron was the lone saviour of the Western World.
I also find it rather sad that much of the right-wing defense of these tapes is basically an extended parsing of "topping" levees versus "breaching" them. "They talked about topping the levees in that tape, so Bush wasn't lying when he said nobody anticipated the levees being breached...." Just shut the fuck up. That's like engaging in a vigorous debate about what caliber bullet was used to shoot somebody to death instead of actually solving the murder.
I WILL DESTROY YOU
The american public has become desensitized to smoking guns of all types, please turn to Fox News for instructions on how to react to the most recent...
Also, are we to believe that communism was doing a-ok until Reagan's cowboy act? I don't think the existence of detractors proves anything. Seems to me like his tough talk may have helped, but more likely it was the straw that broke the camels back, Soviet foundation was weakening, and all it needed was a nudge. Also, for all his "evil empire" scpiel, he sure supported a lot of dictators...
And Enki, yes it is terrifying to think that ol' Brownie now appears to have been more on the ball than most. Anyone get the feeling that Bush was pissed to have been pulled from his vacation ranch activities for the conference call, he barely said a word. Some afternoon drinkin' perhaps? Why is it that everytime Bush goes on his summer vacation the country crumbles a little...
While this may have been accelerated as a result of policy, policy alone would not have been enough.
That is briefly what I understood of the events.
For real. One could give Bin Laden as much (if not more) credit for wrecking the USSR...speaking of camels.
Or Yakov Smirnoff.
YS--"In my country, we saying 'Tear down you wall' is funny jokes."
RR--laughs and farts
Seriously. It's like Vincent Vega going to the bathroom in Pulp Fiction. Every time he does, something really bad happens.
i hope journalists grab onto this story with at least as much vigor as they did the much less consequential but more sensational 'cheney blasts dude in face' one.
Oh, it's possible, and it's already happening. Like I said above, a big part of it is a ridiculous parsing of "topping" versus "breaching" as though the physical result--a whole shitload of water going where it's not supposed to go--is changed. I've seen some people stick by the story that Bush is the only government person on any level who did anything to help, a spin that's even more pathetic now than it was when Katrina first hit. And, of course, the right wing will still lay 90 percent of the blame at the feet of Ray Nagin with the other 10 percent going to the Democratic state government.
When you fix "facts" around opinions rather than opinions around real facts, anything is possible.
I have a TV in my office and I've been watching news since 9 this morning. I don't think I've seen them even bring it up.
News like this isn't quite as important as finding Natalee Holloways killer in Aruba