Would happen if a major/established artist attached themself to some artists crew, like Jay Z got with Philly dudes Free and Beans and whatnot, helping push the Philly thing further? That would be decent.
The Bay is definitely up to bat though.
Well, if that Lil Jon-produced E-40 album really happens*, we could very likely see the Bay scene blow up.
*Plaese, plaese, plaese let this happen.
but what if it does happen and we all just become salty like Archaic?
"Oh MTV doesn't know shit! If you like JT but not IMP, you suck. I am God of the Bay, thou shall bow before me and I Bayknowledgy"
hahaha, but really, who's the new talent outta the bay? Cause they need somebody fresh in addition to 40 water.
Side note: where is Vallejo (sp) California? I wanna go there. I bet its crappy. I picture it as being simultaneouly small town, yet still ghetto.
Would happen if a major/established artist attached themself to some artists crew, like Jay Z got with Philly dudes Free and Beans and whatnot, helping push the Philly thing further? That would be decent.
The Bay is definitely up to bat though.
Well, if that Lil Jon-produced E-40 album really happens*, we could very likely see the Bay scene blow up.
*Plaese, plaese, plaese let this happen.
Would he be flowin' over Krunk or something more Homegrown[Bay]?
hahaha, but really, who's the new talent outta the bay? Cause they need somebody fresh in addition to 40 water.
here's a couple, though not really new talent...
Keak Da Sneak
Messy Marv
San Quinn
Turf Talk
MR Kee
Andre Nickatina
Brotha Lynch Hung (is he in jail right now, wtf?)
The Feddy- Ration
Guce
S-I-C
MAc Mall
Co-Deez
CELLSKI (easily the most underrated rapper in the bay!!)
Yukmouth/Luniz
G-Man Stan (production)
Celly Cell
Sean T
MArveless
B-LEgit
Baldhead Rick (how slept on is this cat, for real?)
Killa Kiese
The Team
Frontline/E-A-Ski
Baby Jaymes
Goapele
muthafuckin' EDDIE K!
there's plenty more
I'm not implying these artists would or will blow up, but they are still putting out good records from a Bay Area standpoint. As long as they keep getting local radio play and making a living I don't think getting national attention is much of an issue.
DJ's just need to grow some balls already and play some Keak and San Quinn and Turf Talk and Mac Dre and The Team next to some Paul Wall, TI, and 50 Cent.
More proof that you don't know what the fuck you're talking about. The major stations and club deejays have been [/b] playing Keek , Messy Marv, Federatiom etc side by side with 50, Dre, Snoop. Actually those records probally get as much radio play and request from folks.
I was playing in the WHITEST part of SF (The Marina) and I had fraty white girls and corn ball phillipino dudes asking for both "Bang It" and "Get on My Hype" in the same sentence as "Just a lil' bit" and Justin Timberlake etc...
I think you get a hard on rooting for the underdog..
And word to what Cosmo and Ross said, it'll take a major label/rapper thats recognized to really blow the bay up nationally, you know give it that video and radio push across the board to make it happen.
and quite frankly, to me the bay is already large right now. Two years ago barely anybody outside of Too Short and E-40 where getting radio love (occasionally some classics by Ray Luv etc would be thrown in) now that dudes got smart by pressing vinyl up for deejays spin and actually releasing a single then things got moving. Previously, to my knowledge almost all the bay albums where just actual cd's being sold at mom and pops and out the trunk.
back-packer scion alert [/b]
How come those other * bay area hip-hop groups don't get swept into the bandwagon-hip-journalism-flavor-of-the-year frenzy?
More proof that you don't know what the fuck you're talking about. The major stations and club deejays have been [/b] playing Keek , Messy Marv, Federatiom etc side by side with 50, Dre, Snoop. Actually those records probally get as much radio play and request from folks.
Outside of the Bay, genius. DJ's outside of the Bay need to be playing Bay ish amongst the heavy hitters. The music easily stacks up...
More proof that you don't know what the fuck you're talking about. The major stations and club deejays have been [/b] playing Keek , Messy Marv, Federatiom etc side by side with 50, Dre, Snoop. Actually those records probally get as much radio play and request from folks.
Outside of the Bay, genius. DJ's outside of the Bay need to be playing Bay ish amongst the heavy hitters. The music easily stacks up...
You're right it does, but them dudes are barely trying bother to get thur shit OUT of the bay. Sometimes you can barely find the 12'' in SF!
I mean I went to L.A. a few months ago and asked a couple of shops if they had any bay records. They where like "ummmm...we might have some Federation Donkey 12''s in clearance" When I asked for "Keek" they where like "Who"? I mean I only drove 5 hours South and the shit is like a myth to them.
Your boys from Blowed are doing the same thing, most of them aren't trying to branch out of thur precious little circle/see the big picture.
First of all, let's just get this disclaimer out of the way:
O-Dub = disconnected from the streets.
Ok, that said...
1) I find all this "New Bay" hype and "is the Bay next to blow?" questioning funny because it seems that, even IN the Bay, there's this perception that something has changed whereas, I always thought the Bay scene was healthy in and of itself, even if it wasn't commanding national attention.
1a) Sidenote, but I also find it weird that a lot of the ways in which the "New Bay" scene has been set up, it's always mentioned in conjunction with the death of Tupac...like the Bay fell off after 'Pac died. Again, O-Dub = disconnected from the streets but I find this strange since 'Pac made his biggest albums once he was in LA and Death Row-ed up, right? Moreover, it seems to me to dismiss all the other groups around during Tupac's era that were doing their thing that continued to do their thing post-Pac.
2) The Commonwealth Club in SF recently had a panel all on the Bay Area hip hop scene, moderated by Jeff Chang and featuring Davey D, Eric Arnold, Pam the Funkstress and DJ Balance (I'm forgetting someone I think). It was surprisingly...great, which is to say that it was one of the few hip-hop panels I've been to where it wasn't the same conversations over and over but instead, really in the moment and focused on the specifics of the scene rather than generalities. They usually tape these events but I don't think the audio archive is up yet.
3) All respect due to B-sides but I wouldn't really compare Houston and the Bay at all since, nationally speaking, people are acting as if Houston didn't exist before last year whereas, I think most people realize that the Bay rap scene is there even if hasn't been at the foremost of people's attention. That's not to say that Houston hasn't had a scene for YEARS...it's just to note that the Bay has been far more prominent in the national imagination for much longer. I'm being nitpicky but I just don't see the two as being very comparable besides the fact that both are local scenes but as far as local scenes go, I'd argue that the Bay has had THE most prominent local scene (outside NY/LA) over the last 20 years with the possible exception of New Orleans circa the rise of Cash Money and No Limit. Houston never had a day in the sun like that, even around the time of the Geto Boys and UGK's national fame.
3) Jazzbo's a good friend of mine so maybe I'm biased in saying this but I actually think if it wasn't for him, MTV would never have gone to Houston to begin with...and maybe that's the point. I mean, MTV are carpetbaggers - they're M-fucking-TV. Since when has MTV ever been AHEAD of the game, rather than following two steps behind? My point though is that Joey's actually pretty forward-looking and I know, from my conversations with him, that he's been on top of the Texas shit far longer than most other rap writers outside of TX. I'm certain that he convinced his MTV honchos to let him do a Houston piece and maybe that's exactly what's pissing people off - I'm sympathetic to it - but to me, Joey's not jumping on the bandwagon...he's trying to be first on the scene AS MUCH AS A MEDIA BEHEMOTH LIKE MTV CAN. He'd also be the first person to credit someone like Matt S. for being on top of this shit for so long which makes Sonzala's recent thinly-veiled rant against Jazzbo all the more incredulous. But that's a whole 'nother thread.
4) This said, I understand RG's frustration here: non-NY writers always get shit on by national (read: NY-centric) publications when they're trying to say, "hey, we got some cool shit going on here" but once those publications figure out, "hey, they got some cool shit going on there", they send in their writers and bypass whatever local talent is already there. I've always felt that way, trying to hustle work while living in the Bay and I can only imagine RG's disbelief at what's going on in Texas right now.
4a) I also think it will be very interesting to see what happens with someone like Eric Arnold over the course of the next year as the Yay is poised to re-enter the national concsciousness. He's got one of the best gigs going right now, at the East Bay Express, and more to the point, I think he's really found a perfect fit as a journalist, especially as someone who used to write nationally but has instead, found a far better gig (not necessarily pay-wise, but in terms of what he can write about) by going local.
5) As far as ignoring Good Life/Project Blowed's 10th anniversary...I don't think we really need to rehash that whole crazy thread from last year but I don't think that's indicative of a rap journalism conspiracy...I think that's reflective of hip-hop's general ignorance of its own history. I mean, recorded rap music celebrated a 25th anniversary last year but besides a few box sets and an odd VH1 or BET specical, I really don't think much was made of that. Other genres are far more conscientious of honoring its past but despite rap's cultural nostalgia (i.e. yearning for "back in the day"), its consumers could really give a fuck about what came before. And sure, it's the job of the rap journalist (or more to the point, their publications) to fill in that role but ever since the mid-90s, hip-hop journalism has largely been defined and directed by the perception of consumer interest rather than journalists and their editors taking that lead.
Of course MTV wouldn't have gone to Houston if it wasn't for Joey, I don't understand how anyone could be mad at dude. I didn't see the special but it sounds dope.
I really had no idea there was any kind of hype going on with bay area stuff. Just as a complete outsider to either scene, I saw a couple similarities.
Also, I remember hearing houston dudes talking about how they bump screw in the bay and shit, and i guess it got me thinking.
Cheers to O-dub for the in depth reply. I knew you guys have basicly grown up around it, so i was interested in your take.
I do need to get more familiar with bay area music though. time to cop that slump and grind cd.
Id also like to add that even though I love to give dude a hard time (AYO!), I do appreciate archaic's contributions to the board and i get the sense that he is a good writer and pretty well informed. Often he does jump to rediculous conclusions, but it does get people talking thus making shit more interesting around here.
I thought Zion I was from LA? and Crown City rockers are from Pasadena, hence the name.
Zion I is from Oakland and before that Atlanta.
Crown City Rockers (who used to be called Mission) are from Oakland and before that Boston.
my point being is that they've both made thur home here and been living here for a minute but they haven't been lumped into that "new bay" category/frenzy.
I thought Zion I was from LA? and Crown City rockers are from Pasadena, hence the name.
Zion I is from Oakland and before that Atlanta.
Crown City Rockers (who used to be called Mission) are from Oakland and before that Boston.
A few of them are from Pasadena, which is why the name became Crown City Rockers, Pasadena is known as Crown City. I know they moved to the bay but they rep LA pretty hard when they're down here.
I have no idea why I thought Zion I was from here though, after thinking about it I did know that they were from up north. brain fart or something.
my point being is that they've both made thur home here and been living here for a minute but they haven't been lumped into that "new bay" category/frenzy.
They don't really make hood rap.
The Coup and Paris could certainly latch on. Hobo Junction too if they could somehow resurrect themselves.
my point being is that they've both made thur home here and been living here for a minute but they haven't been lumped into that "new bay" category/frenzy.
They don't really make hood rap.
The Coup and Paris could certainly latch on.
word, them as well. I think you're right FOR ONCE! thur sound is different from the turf and slump steez and it's not getting any major radio love.
I honestly think the next album to look for is gonna be Kabinet Gang's shit. E-40's kid Droop-E and his partner B-Slimm. Droop got beats AND rhymes and Slimm is a tight, funny, lyricist.
Comments
my bad doggie. No diss intended.
hahaha, but really, who's the new talent outta the bay? Cause they need somebody fresh in addition to 40 water.
Side note: where is Vallejo (sp) California? I wanna go there. I bet its crappy. I picture it as being simultaneouly small town, yet still ghetto.
Would he be flowin' over Krunk or something more Homegrown[Bay]?
Thanks for standin' up for me, B.Cause.
Urrbody knows it's two Gs in "Hogg."
I'm sayin' though!
bwahahahaha!!!
What, you don't like his masterful lyricism?
"Oh and Alicia, you are a bitch"
Sha Shabbadoo da, shabba doo da, shabba doo da
here's a couple, though not really new talent...
Keak Da Sneak
Messy Marv
San Quinn
Turf Talk
MR Kee
Andre Nickatina
Brotha Lynch Hung (is he in jail right now, wtf?)
The Feddy- Ration
Guce
S-I-C
MAc Mall
Co-Deez
CELLSKI (easily the most underrated rapper in the bay!!)
Yukmouth/Luniz
G-Man Stan (production)
Celly Cell
Sean T
MArveless
B-LEgit
Baldhead Rick (how slept on is this cat, for real?)
Killa Kiese
The Team
Frontline/E-A-Ski
Baby Jaymes
Goapele
muthafuckin' EDDIE K!
there's plenty more
I'm not implying these artists would or will blow up, but they are still putting out good records from a Bay Area standpoint. As long as they keep getting local radio play and making a living I don't think getting national attention is much of an issue.
naw man, I dig the dude's records but to single it down to him & short dog is
I definitely remember 4-Tay and his caddy and those hats, damn. Remember when 4-Tay was on Jenny Jones doing "Player's Club"? That was awesome.
More proof that you don't know what the fuck you're talking about. The major stations and club deejays have been [/b] playing Keek , Messy Marv, Federatiom etc side by side with 50, Dre, Snoop. Actually those records probally get as much radio play and request from folks.
I was playing in the WHITEST part of SF (The Marina) and I had fraty white girls and corn ball phillipino dudes asking for both "Bang It" and "Get on My Hype" in the same sentence as "Just a lil' bit" and Justin Timberlake etc...
I think you get a hard on rooting for the underdog..
And word to what Cosmo and Ross said, it'll take a major label/rapper thats recognized to really blow the bay up nationally, you know give it that video and radio push across the board to make it happen.
and quite frankly, to me the bay is already large right now. Two years ago barely anybody outside of Too Short and E-40 where getting radio love (occasionally some classics by Ray Luv etc would be thrown in) now that dudes got smart by pressing vinyl up for deejays spin and actually releasing a single then things got moving. Previously, to my knowledge almost all the bay albums where just actual cd's being sold at mom and pops and out the trunk.
back-packer scion alert [/b]
How come those other * bay area hip-hop groups don't get swept into the bandwagon-hip-journalism-flavor-of-the-year frenzy?
*zion I, crown city rockers, goapelle, etc.....
Outside of the Bay, genius. DJ's outside of the Bay need to be playing Bay ish amongst the heavy hitters. The music easily stacks up...
You're right it does, but them dudes are barely trying bother to get thur shit OUT of the bay. Sometimes you can barely find the 12'' in SF!
I mean I went to L.A. a few months ago and asked a couple of shops if they had any bay records. They where like "ummmm...we might have some Federation Donkey 12''s in clearance" When I asked for "Keek" they where like "Who"? I mean I only drove 5 hours South and the shit is like a myth to them.
Your boys from Blowed are doing the same thing, most of them aren't trying to branch out of thur precious little circle/see the big picture.
O-Dub = disconnected from the streets.
Ok, that said...
1) I find all this "New Bay" hype and "is the Bay next to blow?" questioning funny because it seems that, even IN the Bay, there's this perception that something has changed whereas, I always thought the Bay scene was healthy in and of itself, even if it wasn't commanding national attention.
1a) Sidenote, but I also find it weird that a lot of the ways in which the "New Bay" scene has been set up, it's always mentioned in conjunction with the death of Tupac...like the Bay fell off after 'Pac died. Again, O-Dub = disconnected from the streets but I find this strange since 'Pac made his biggest albums once he was in LA and Death Row-ed up, right? Moreover, it seems to me to dismiss all the other groups around during Tupac's era that were doing their thing that continued to do their thing post-Pac.
2) The Commonwealth Club in SF recently had a panel all on the Bay Area hip hop scene, moderated by Jeff Chang and featuring Davey D, Eric Arnold, Pam the Funkstress and DJ Balance (I'm forgetting someone I think). It was surprisingly...great, which is to say that it was one of the few hip-hop panels I've been to where it wasn't the same conversations over and over but instead, really in the moment and focused on the specifics of the scene rather than generalities. They usually tape these events but I don't think the audio archive is up yet.
3) All respect due to B-sides but I wouldn't really compare Houston and the Bay at all since, nationally speaking, people are acting as if Houston didn't exist before last year whereas, I think most people realize that the Bay rap scene is there even if hasn't been at the foremost of people's attention. That's not to say that Houston hasn't had a scene for YEARS...it's just to note that the Bay has been far more prominent in the national imagination for much longer. I'm being nitpicky but I just don't see the two as being very comparable besides the fact that both are local scenes but as far as local scenes go, I'd argue that the Bay has had THE most prominent local scene (outside NY/LA) over the last 20 years with the possible exception of New Orleans circa the rise of Cash Money and No Limit. Houston never had a day in the sun like that, even around the time of the Geto Boys and UGK's national fame.
3) Jazzbo's a good friend of mine so maybe I'm biased in saying this but I actually think if it wasn't for him, MTV would never have gone to Houston to begin with...and maybe that's the point. I mean, MTV are carpetbaggers - they're M-fucking-TV. Since when has MTV ever been AHEAD of the game, rather than following two steps behind? My point though is that Joey's actually pretty forward-looking and I know, from my conversations with him, that he's been on top of the Texas shit far longer than most other rap writers outside of TX. I'm certain that he convinced his MTV honchos to let him do a Houston piece and maybe that's exactly what's pissing people off - I'm sympathetic to it - but to me, Joey's not jumping on the bandwagon...he's trying to be first on the scene AS MUCH AS A MEDIA BEHEMOTH LIKE MTV CAN. He'd also be the first person to credit someone like Matt S. for being on top of this shit for so long which makes Sonzala's recent thinly-veiled rant against Jazzbo all the more incredulous. But that's a whole 'nother thread.
4) This said, I understand RG's frustration here: non-NY writers always get shit on by national (read: NY-centric) publications when they're trying to say, "hey, we got some cool shit going on here" but once those publications figure out, "hey, they got some cool shit going on there", they send in their writers and bypass whatever local talent is already there. I've always felt that way, trying to hustle work while living in the Bay and I can only imagine RG's disbelief at what's going on in Texas right now.
4a) I also think it will be very interesting to see what happens with someone like Eric Arnold over the course of the next year as the Yay is poised to re-enter the national concsciousness. He's got one of the best gigs going right now, at the East Bay Express, and more to the point, I think he's really found a perfect fit as a journalist, especially as someone who used to write nationally but has instead, found a far better gig (not necessarily pay-wise, but in terms of what he can write about) by going local.
5) As far as ignoring Good Life/Project Blowed's 10th anniversary...I don't think we really need to rehash that whole crazy thread from last year but I don't think that's indicative of a rap journalism conspiracy...I think that's reflective of hip-hop's general ignorance of its own history. I mean, recorded rap music celebrated a 25th anniversary last year but besides a few box sets and an odd VH1 or BET specical, I really don't think much was made of that. Other genres are far more conscientious of honoring its past but despite rap's cultural nostalgia (i.e. yearning for "back in the day"), its consumers could really give a fuck about what came before. And sure, it's the job of the rap journalist (or more to the point, their publications) to fill in that role but ever since the mid-90s, hip-hop journalism has largely been defined and directed by the perception of consumer interest rather than journalists and their editors taking that lead.
oops!
DP?
AYYYYYYYOOOOOOO!!!!
Also, I remember hearing houston dudes talking about how they bump screw in the bay and shit, and i guess it got me thinking.
Cheers to O-dub for the in depth reply. I knew you guys have basicly grown up around it, so i was interested in your take.
I do need to get more familiar with bay area music though. time to cop that slump and grind cd.
I thought Zion I was from LA? and Crown City rockers are from Pasadena, hence the name.
Zion I is from Oakland and before that Atlanta.
Crown City Rockers (who used to be called Mission) are from Oakland and before that Boston.
my point being is that they've both made thur home here and been living here for a minute but they haven't been lumped into that "new bay" category/frenzy.
A few of them are from Pasadena, which is why the name became Crown City Rockers, Pasadena is known as Crown City. I know they moved to the bay but they rep LA pretty hard when they're down here.
I have no idea why I thought Zion I was from here though, after thinking about it I did know that they were from up north. brain fart or something.
They don't really make hood rap.
The Coup and Paris could certainly latch on. Hobo Junction too if they could somehow resurrect themselves.
word, them as well. I think you're right FOR ONCE! thur sound is different from the turf and slump steez and it's not getting any major radio love.