this issue is about a poorly planned optional war that has already killed more people than every single person on this board will ever meet in their lives X 10.
what kind of dumbass lets it become about whether or not Sheenan lets her (ex)husband pee on her?
"Enlarged image of President Bush, center, kissing Cindy Sheehan among family members in 2004. Left to right: Janey, Carly, Patrick, President Bush, Cindy and Andy at Ft. Lewis in Washington State"
The right, and others who are easily fooled, will argue about her, background, her family, the people around her, why her son signed up, what it means to be a soldier and the role of US support for Israel. The point of all this argueing is so Cindy Sheehan can't be heard.
Shut up and listen to her.
well sum up what she is saying, other than her belief that we are only protecting israel, what else is she saying that so urgently needs to be heard?
this issue is about a poorly planned optional war that has already killed more people than every single person on this board will ever meet in their lives X 10.
what kind of dumbass lets it become about whether or not Sheenan lets her (ex)husband pee on her?
The right, and others who are easily fooled, will argue about her, background, her family, the people around her, why her son signed up, what it means to be a soldier and the role of US support for Israel. The point of all this argueing is so Cindy Sheehan can't be heard.
Shut up and listen to her.
well sum up what she is saying, other than her belief that we are only protecting israel, what else is she saying that so urgently needs to be heard?
That mother's sons are being sent into hell where there is a good chance (1/30 and dropping) that they will die.
Aren't your side the ones who need to explain this?
WMD Gassed his own people with our hardware (check) Foothold for Democracy ... slipping fast Cheap Oil Fight them there so we don't fight them here Bin Laden Bin Laden 9/11 9/11
"Enlarged image of President Bush, center, kissing Cindy Sheehan among family members in 2004. Left to right: Janey, Carly, Patrick, President Bush, Cindy and Andy at Ft. Lewis in Washington State"
Am I emotional? Yes, my first born was murdered. Am I angry? Yes, he was killed for lies and for a PNAC Neo-Con agenda to benefit Israel. My son joined the army to protect America, not Israel. Am I stupid? No, I know full well that my son, my family, this nation and this world were betrayed by George Bush who was influenced by the neo-con PNAC agendas after 9/11. We were told that we were attacked on 9/11 because the terrorists hate our freedoms and democracy ??? not for the real reason, because the Arab Muslims who attacked us hate our middle-eastern foreign policy.
Hate to burst your bubble, twiddlestick, but Sheehan never said this. The quote was invented by the right-wing sleeze machine in a "letter" she sent to ABC News, which she never sent, but was "forwarded by a friend (someone she didn't know)." Hitchens was too drunk to fact check and he got punk'd. When asked about the quote by Anderson Cooper on CNN, she denies saying it: sorry foll
I challenge you to find confirmation of it anywhere outside the right wing blogosphere.
Dude, little secret... These wingnuts lie a lot and they'll smear anyone who steps in front of them. Don't believe the hype.
riddle me this - if this is a red-herring, who's behind it?
This has already been discussed at length in this thread. Take your right hand off the keyboard, your left hand out of your pants, grab a heavy object and bang on head until unconscious.
You don???t mind if I call you George do you? When you sent me a letter offering your condolences on the death of my son, Spc. Casey Austin Sheehan, in the illegal and unjust war on Iraq, you called me Cindy, so I naturally assume we are on a first name basis.
George, it has been seven months today since your reckless and wanton foreign policies killed my son, my big boy, my hero, my best-friend: Casey. It has been seven months since your ignorant and arrogant lack of planning for the peace murdered my oldest child. It has been two days since your dishonest campaign stole another election???but you all were way more subtle this time than in 2000, weren???t you? You hardly had to get the Supreme Court of the United States involved at all this week.
You feel so proud of yourself for betraying the country again, don???t you? You think you are very clever because you pulled the wool over the eyes of some of the people again. You think that you have some mandate from God???that you can ???spend your political capital??? any way that you want. George you don???t care or even realize that 56,000,000 plus citizens of this country voted against you and your agenda. Still, you are going to continue your ruthless work of being a divider and not a uniter. George, in 2000 when you stole that election and the Democrats gave up, I gave up too. I had the most ironic thought of my life then: "Oh well, how much damage can he do in four years?" Well, now I know how much you have damaged my family, this country, and this world. If you think I am going to allow you another four years to do even more damage, then you truly are mistaken. I will fight for a true vote count and if that fails, your impeachment. Also, the impeachment of your Vice President. The only thing is, I'm not politically savvy, and I don't have a Karl Rove to plan my strategy, but I do have a big mouth and a righteous cause, which still mean something in this country, I hope.
All of this lying, fooling, and betraying must be ???hard work??? George. You really think you know what hard work is?
George, let me tell you what ???hard work??? really is.
Hard work is seeing your oldest son, your brave and honorable man-child go off to a war that had, and still has, no basis in reality. Hard work is worrying yourself gray and not being able to sleep for 2 weeks because you don???t know if your child is safe.
Hard work is seeing your son???s murder on CNN one Sunday evening while you???re enjoying the last supper you???ll ever truly enjoy again.
Hard work is having three military officers come to your house a few hours later to confirm the aforementioned murder of your son???your first born???your kind and gentle sweet baby.
Hard work is burying your child 46 days before his 25th birthday. Hard work is holding your other three children as they lower the body of their big ???baba??? into the ground. Hard work is not jumping in the grave with him and having the earth cover you both.
But, Dear George, do you know what the hardest work of all is? Trying to digest the fact that the leader of the country that your family has fought for and died for, for generations, lied to you and betrayed your dear boy???s sense of honor and exploited his courage and exploited his loyalty to his buddies. Hard work is having your country abandon you after they killed your son. Hard work is coming to the realization that your son had his future robbed from him and that you have had your son's future and future grand-children stolen from you. Hard work is knowing that there are so many people in this world that have prospered handsomely from your son's death.
George, I must confess that I and my family worked very HARD to re-defeat you this time, but you refuse to stay defeated. Well, we are watching you very carefully. We are going to do everything in our power to have you impeached for misleading the American people into a disastrous war and for mis-using and abusing your power as Commander-in-Chief. We are going to scream until our last breath to bring the rest of our babies home from this quagmire of a war that you have gotten our country in to: before too many more families learn the true meaning of Hard Work. We know it is going to be an uphill battle, knowing how Republican Congress is, but thanks to you, we know the meaning of Hard Work and we???re not afraid of hard work at all.
The 56,000,000 plus citizens who voted against you and your agenda have given me a mandate to move forward with my agenda. Also, thanks to you and your careless domestic policies, I am unemployed, so this will be my full-time job. Being your political downfall will be the most noble accomplishment of my life and it will bring justice for my son and 1125 (so far) other brave Americans and tens of thousands of innocent Iraqis your lies have killed. By the way, George, how many more innocent Iraqis are your policies going to kill before you convince them that you are better than Saddam? How many more of their cities are you going to level before you consider that they are liberated? If you really had any moral values, or if you were an honorable man at all you would resign. My son was a man who had high moral values and true courage. Humanity lost a bright light on April 04, 2004. I will live the rest of my life missing Casey desperately. Thank you for that, George. Have a nice day.
God Bless America!! We surely need it!
Cindy Sheehan Broken hearted mother of a True American Hero: Spc Casey Austin Sheehan, KIA 04/04/04 Sadr City, Baghdad "When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love has always won. There have been tyrants and murderers and for a time they seem invincible but in the end, they always fall - think of it, always."
If you are still for this war, you either have psychological deficinecies or you need to get to your local recruitment office and sign up FAST! They need you!
I know there is a large silent majority out there, especially on the Strut, but what is up with some of the future leaders of the free world? You support the opposite of what your country was founded on. If you lived in Soviet Russia you'd all have red stars and weekend dachas given to you by a grateful politburo. Bushco won't even be so generous... tools you are, critical thinkers not.
The right, and others who are easily fooled, will argue about her, background, her family, the people around her, why her son signed up, what it means to be a soldier and the role of US support for Israel. The point of all this argueing is so Cindy Sheehan can't be heard.
Shut up and listen to her.
well sum up what she is saying, other than her belief that we are only protecting israel, what else is she saying that so urgently needs to be heard?
Forget summing it up. Listen to what she is saying:
I felt like I was in Bizarro World as I heard George speak about 9/11 five times and mention terrorism 31 times, even though these rationales for war have been disproved repeatedly. I think George thinks that since we believed him once about terrorism vis a vis Iraq, that we must therefore be gullible enough to believe him this time. I don???t know, and I am not a professional pundit, but my theory is he might have mentioned 9/11 to manipulate our emotions and maybe even frighten us a little again?
The thing that struck me when I was watching that vacuous man giving his hollow speech was the fact that he could have always replaced the word ???terrorists??? with the phrase: ???my moronic and callous foreign policies.??? For example, when he said that terrorists spread death and destruction on the streets of Baghdad and kill innocent people, he could have just as easily said: ???My moronic and callous foreign policies spread death and destruction on the streets of Baghdad and kill innocent people.??? When he said that we need to stop terrorists from toppling governments in the region, he could have just as easily said: ???We need to stop my moronic and callous foreign policies from toppling governments in the region.??? People have characterized the speech-lite in many ways, but if I had to pick a few words to describe it, I would say: ???Hypocritical, manipulative, condescending, meaningless drivel.???
I sat through an entire hour in the CNN studio in DC hearing not one person say that the invasion was a mistake and if it was a mistake, then our troops should be brought home immediately. Even the ???Democratic??? Senators (Kerry and Bayh) that were on the program just gave their recipes for ???success??? in Iraq, which did not include any exit strategies. The guest host for that hour was Bob Costas and he asked one guest, Sen. John McCain, an intriguing question: ???If you could push Button One and have an eventual wonderful outcome in Iraq, or if you could push Button Two and never have had it happen, which one would you pick???? Of course, Sen. McCain chose Button One. He hasn???t had a loved one killed in this enormous tragedy of a war, nor does he have a loved one in harm???s way. It has not affected him personally one bit. What skin is it off McCain???s teeth if our troops remain for a highly unlikely rosy outcome at the cost of thousands of more lives? I would push the button that would bring back my son, Casey, and the tens of thousands of the other victims who have been killed for nothing but outright lies and bald-faced betrayals. I would push the button that would give Iraq back its power, water, and their infrastructure.
My absolute favorite guest of the evening was Sen. John Warner, powerful Chair of the Senate Armed Disservices Committee. Of course, he fell in lockstep behind his fuehrer and praised the speech and how, although we have ???all??? paid a terrible price for this invasion and occupation, bringing freedom and democracy to the Iraqi people is worth all the sacrifices that the world is making. I sat in the Green Room with Sen. Warner???s entourage. I wondered (even out loud) what price they have paid for our administration???s misdeeds in Iraq. They all looked like happy, well-fed, well-dressed, well-educated, and well-hydrated Americans. They looked to me like they had plenty of electricity to blow dry their hair and charge their cell phones and lap tops. They looked like they had quite a nice supply of clean drinking water and fresh food. I sincerely doubt if any of them had a loved one ripped from their lives by a car bomb, IED, or bullet in an ambush. I wondered who the ???we??? was that John Warner spoke of. I spoke with John Warner after his interview and told him unless he was prepared to sacrifice even a good night???s sleep over this senseless and criminal war, then he should work on ending it, not prolonging the carnage. He told me that I was ???entitled to my opinion,??? but he would respectfully have to disagree with me. That was awfully Constitutional of him!
I finally got on to speak for my 82 seconds (all the time Larry King Live could spare for the peace message) about how this war is a catastrophe and how we should bring the troops home and quit forcing the Iraqi people to pay for our government???s hubris and quit forcing innocent children to suffer so we can fight terrorism somewhere besides America. How absolutely racist and immoral is it to take America???s battles to another land and make an entire country pay for the crimes of others? To me, this is blatant genocide. How dare we export our patriotic brand of flag waving death and devastation to a people who have been through so much already? It wasn???t bad enough that our sanctions killed tens of thousands of Iraqis before we even started an active aggression on them, now we have to create confusion, chaos, and disorder there. How dare our president, Congress, and we Americans allow this to continue?
After my brief advocacy for peace, my position was refuted by another Mom whose son was killed in Iraq in 2003 who said she ???totally disagrees??? with me and ???feels sorry??? for me. Well, you know what? I feel ache for her blindness and for the millions of sheeple who have had the wool pulled over their eyes by the bunch of hypocritical, bad shepherds who are running disastrous herd over the world. I have distressing news for the Soccer Safety Moms and the NASCAR Dads who are such ardent supporters of this administration and war: Your grandchildren and children who will be entering Kindergarten this fall will be fighting George???s endless war if he gets his way and is allowed to continue spreading the cancer of imperialism in the Middle-East. Donny Rumsfeld said we could be in Iraq for another dozen years. Does anybody think with all the billions of dollars that are being poured into constructing super-sized bases in Iraq that the war machine plans on relinquishing the cash-cow that is that poor, unfortunate land anytime soon? Think about it when you tuck your child into bed tonight.
I heard George and the Senators say that evening the sacrifices we as Americans have had to make for Iraq are ???worth it.??? I really would like to know who has benefited and profited from Iraq and who has really had to sacrifice anything. I know it was ???worth it??? to Dick Cheney who was the CEO of Halliburton, (of no-bid contract fame) which has raped billions of dollars from our government, from the people of Iraq, and from our soldiers who are not getting what they need to survive in a combat zone. It is ???worth it??? to Black Water Security Co. who sends one thousand dollar a day mercenaries to Iraq, funded by the War Department. It is ???worth it??? to L. Paul Bremer who slunk out of Iraq with 8.8 BILLION dollars missing from the Provisional authority. It is also ???worth it??? to the other companies and individuals who have been enriched by feeding our children to the military industrial complex. By George, I think we have found the people who think this war is ???worth it.??? But, is it worth it to George Bush who was counting on this unlawful and unprincipled aggression in Iraq to give him ???political??? capital? Instead, if poll numbers are any good indication, Americans are withdrawing their assent for George and they are withdrawing their consent for him to wage eternal war on humanity.
As I s
at in the Green Room of CNN, I was saddened and troubled by George???s call for us Americans to fly the flag proudly on the 4th to honor our troops. For one thing, the American flag is not a magical token that can bring armor to the troops who are still dying without the protection. The flag is not a faith healer that can restore limbs and eyesight to the ones who have been maimed forever. The flag is not a genie in a bottle that can blink her eyes and bring our children home from this horrible blunder that they are suffering for and being slaughtered for. But, as for me, I will never be able to celebrate another patriotic holiday without mourning what this nation has stolen from my family. I will never be able to look at an American flag without thinking of the uniform my son wore proudly that displayed that same symbol and the evil ones who desecrated and defiled the stars and stripes by lying us into the invasion of Iraq. No, Casey???s sacrifice was not ???worth it??? and George needs to do more than wave his flag and manipulate our sense of patriotism. He needs to march his girls to a recruitment center and send them to Iraq to fight the terrorists that his moronic and callous foreign policies have recruited or he needs to wake up and smell the apple pie and bring our other sons and daughters home, now! Cindy Sheehan
one fo the reasons I keep coming back to soulstrut is cause the political discussions are always so well articulated on both sides, and although this board is leans extremely to the left even the right wingers seem to be able to express themselves well. Those that want to participate in a political argument ehre should give the same respect that they want to recieve.
Now for my two cents:
Cindy Sheehan is asking for something that is impossible, she wants a face-to-face meeting so that Bush will essentially apologize for sending her son off to be killed. If bush or his handlers allwoed such a meeting to take place the apology she wants would never come. The president has been pressured by much bigger fish than the mother of a dead solider to say that he made a mistake and he ain't going to fold on his stance now.
Its sad to watch a mother in pain over the death of her child, and it's horrific to see news outlets take her crusade and dirty it up by mentioning she is getting a divorce. People need to simplify the cause instead of convoluding it with all this outside mess.
Larry: I agree with you in most of what you say, but even Cindy Sheehan has muddled her own cause by accepting the aid of people like Michael Moore, a man with an unbelieve bias that will not garner much sympathy with those who may have cared more when it was just a mother of a dead soldier who wanted to have private audience with the president to ask some questions
sorry, just posting what I find no comment on all this TX madness
Question everything. Deepstank is right, they are scum and will smear you next.
Who else have they fucked over?
Max Cleland (self-inflicted multiple amputations) John Kerry (rice shrapnel) Paul Hackett (wuss) Scott Ritter (kiddie porn) John McCain ("black" (shudder) baby)
There's plenty more.... meanwhile criminals convicted of treasonous activity against their own govt, and accused of war crimes in international court, are in the cabinet. But they get a pass from all the Yale-cheerleader cheerleaders.
Classy. So I guess logic dictates that she must be a David Duke supporter? Or were you implying something else? And I guess the fact that her husband files for divorce means she's wrong too? Or maybe he's just a jackass?
I find it really disgusting the way the right is attacking this woman, as if confronting Bush on any of his bullshit is tantamount to treason.
Fuck him, fuck his stupid war, and fuck all of those that have fallen into lockstep behind him (bunch of lemmings).
Never said she was a David Duke supporter, quit using those mcgriddles for glasses larry, i think its funny that Duke has jumped on her "peace train" after she maid her comments about israel, and the thing about her husband was interesting but really has nothing to to do with nothing...
hitch is
Cindy Sheehan's Sinister Piffle What's wrong with her Crawford protest. By Christopher Hitchens Posted Monday, Aug. 15, 2005, at 11:50 AM PT [/b]
Here is an unambivalent statement: "The moral authority of parents who bury children killed in Iraq is absolute."
And, now, here's another:
Am I emotional? Yes, my first born was murdered. Am I angry? Yes, he was killed for lies and for a PNAC Neo-Con agenda to benefit Israel. My son joined the army to protect America, not Israel. Am I stupid? No, I know full well that my son, my family, this nation and this world were betrayed by George Bush who was influenced by the neo-con PNAC agendas after 9/11. We were told that we were attacked on 9/11 because the terrorists hate our freedoms and democracy ??? not for the real reason, because the Arab Muslims who attacked us hate our middle-eastern foreign policy.
Her knack for PR doesn't make her argument persuasive
The first statement comes from Maureen Dowd, in her New York Times column of Aug. 10. The second statement comes from Cindy Sheehan, whose son Casey was killed in Iraq last year. It was sent to the editors of ABC's Nightline on March 15. In her article, Dowd was arguing that Sheehan's moral authority was absolute.
I am at a complete loss to see how these two positions can be made compatible. Sheehan has obviously taken a short course in the Michael Moore/Ramsey Clark school of Iraq analysis and has not succeeded in making it one atom more elegant or persuasive. I dare say that her "moral authority" to do this is indeed absolute, if we agree for a moment on the weird idea that moral authority is required to adopt overtly political positions, but then so is my "moral" right to say that she is spouting sinister piffle. Suppose I had lost a child in this war. Would any of my critics say that this gave me any extra authority? I certainly would not ask or expect them to do so. Why, then, should anyone grant them such a privilege?
Sheehan has met the president before and has favored us with two accounts of the meeting, one fairly warm and the other distinctly cold. I have no means of knowing which mood reflected her real state of mind, but she now thinks she is owed another session with him, presumably in order to tell him what she asserted to the Nightline team. In pursuit of this, she has set up camp near Bush's ranch in Crawford, Texas, and announced that she will not leave until she gets some more face-time with our chief executive. This qualifies her to be described by Dowd as "a 48-year-old Californian with a knack for P.R." Well, I think I have to concede that if Dowd says you have a knack for PR, you have acquired one even if you didn't have one before. (I am not entirely certain, for example, that the above letter to ABC News would count as a delicate illustration of the said "knack.")
The president has compromised by sending his national-security adviser, Stephen Hadley, down that Crawford road to meet the PR-knackish Cindy. Not good enough, exclaims Dowd. Hadley was pro-war and has even been described as a neocon! Clearly, then, the Sheehan demand is liable to expand the more it is met. President Bush must either find a senior staff member who opposes the war and then send him or her down the track to see if that will do. Or else he must, like the Emperor Henry of old, stage his own Canossa and attend on her himself, abject apologies at the ready. After all, we mustn't forget that we are dealing???as was that emperor in his dispute with Pope Gregory???with "an absolute moral authority."
What dreary sentimental nonsense this all is, and how much space has been wasted on it. Most irritating is the snide idea that the president is "on vacation" and thus idly ignoring his suffering subjects, when the truth is that the members of the media???not known for their immunity to the charm of Martha's Vineyard or Cape Cod in the month of August???are themselves lazing away the season with a soft-centered nonstory that practically, as we like to say in the trade, "writes itself." Anyway, Sheehan now says that if need be she will "follow" the president "to Washington," so I don't think the holiday sneer has much life left in it.
There are, in fact, some principles involved here. Any citizen has the right to petition the president for redress of grievance, or for that matter to insult him to his face. But the potential number of such people is very large, and you don't have the right to cut in line by having so much free time that you can set up camp near his drive. Then there is the question of civilian control over the military, which is an authority that one could indeed say should be absolute. The military and its relatives have no extra claim on the chief executive's ear. Indeed, it might be said that they have less claim than the rest of us, since they have voluntarily sworn an oath to obey and carry out orders. Most presidents in time of war have made an exception in the case of the bereaved???Lincoln's letter to the mother of two dead Union soldiers (at the time, it was thought that she had lost five sons) is a famous instance???but the job there is one of comfort and reassurance, and this has already been discharged in the Sheehan case. If that stricken mother had been given an audience and had risen up to say that Lincoln had broken his past election pledges and sought a wider and more violent war with the Confederacy, his aides would have been quite right to show her the door and to tell her that she was out of order.
Finally, I think one must deny to anyone the right to ventriloquize the dead. Casey Sheehan joined up as a responsible adult volunteer. Are we so sure that he would have wanted to see his mother acquiring "a knack for P.R." and announcing that he was killed in a war for a Jewish cabal? (a claim that has brought David Duke flying to Ms. Sheehan's side.) This is just as objectionable, on logical as well as moral grounds, as the old pro-war argument that the dead "must not have died in vain." I distrust anyone who claims to speak for the fallen, and I distrust even more the hysterical noncombatants who exploit the grief of those who have to bury them.
I'm listening to Cindy Sheehan. Now I have listened to Hitchen's.
We were told that we were attacked on 9/11 because the terrorists hate our freedoms and democracy ??? not for the real reason, because the Arab Muslims who attacked us hate our middle-eastern foreign policy.
Note that Hitchens never once address what Cindy Sheehan is saying. He attacks her in every way he can. But he never address what she is saying. Sadly that is what the attackers on this board are doing too.
one fo the reasons I keep coming back to soulstrut is cause the political discussions are always so well articulated on both sides, and although this board is leans extremely to the left even the right wingers seem to be able to express themselves well. Those that want to participate in a political argument ehre should give the same respect that they want to recieve.
Now for my two cents:
Cindy Sheehan is asking for something that is impossible, she wants a face-to-face meeting so that Bush will essentially apologize for sending her son off to be killed. If bush or his handlers allwoed such a meeting to take place the apology she wants would never come. The president has been pressured by much bigger fish than the mother of a dead solider to say that he made a mistake and he ain't going to fold on his stance now.
Its sad to watch a mother in pain over the death of her child, and it's horrific to see news outlets take her crusade and dirty it up by mentioning she is getting a divorce. People need to simplify the cause instead of convoluding it with all this outside mess.
Larry: I agree with you in most of what you say, but even Cindy Sheehan has muddled her own cause by accepting the aid of people like Michael Moore, a man with an unbelieve bias that will not garner much sympathy with those who may have cared more when it was just a mother of a dead soldier who wanted to have private audience with the president to ask some questions
Adam, Suppose what Mrs. Sheehan wants is impossible. That, in and of itself, and the reasons why it is so, is the big problem. How many more people will die because Bush can't admit he made a mistake? How pathological is that??? Say what you want about Michael Moore (and this isn't really about him), but keep in mind that his public image is as much the product of his demonization by the right wing in this country as it is of his own words and actions. I agree that this discussion has had it's ugly moments, but I think that's because there's so much at stake here. I simply cannot understand why anyone with access to information would step up to defend the status quo in this situation. It boggles the mind, and the degree to which the President and his proxys will resort to character assassination to muddy the waters of discourse ought to disgust everyone, not just those on the left. Larry
My biggest prob with Sheehan is why should she get anymore coverage or have any more importance put on her opinion of the war than any other mother who has had their son die in Iraq, should a mother that believes the cause in Iraq is just get put on television everyday, you dudes would shitting your pants with anger if that was the case. The stuff she is saying is no diffenrent than what has been said a million times before, and the anti war groups have finally found thier poster child for thier cause, this makes me sick, just as sick as when I see wounded soldiers with "patriotic" country music playing in the background
My biggest prob with Sheehan is why should she get anymore coverage or have any more importance put on her opinion of the war than any other mother who has had their son die in Iraq
Comments
what kind of dumbass lets it become about whether or not Sheenan lets her (ex)husband pee on her?
stop the war
"Enlarged image of President Bush, center, kissing Cindy Sheehan among family members in 2004. Left to right: Janey, Carly, Patrick, President Bush, Cindy and Andy at Ft. Lewis in Washington State"
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=45800
The war is fucked[/b]
The people running the war are fucked[/b]
They don't apparently care[/b]
The situation is getting worse[/b]
They don't care about that either[/b]
We need to get out[/b]
My paraphrase, of course...
yes. now i am interested.
BINGO-ROONY...[/b]
That mother's sons are being sent into hell where there is a good chance (1/30 and dropping) that they will die.
Aren't your side the ones who need to explain this?
WMDGassed his own people with our hardware (check)
Foothold for Democracy ... slipping fast
Cheap OilFight them there so we don't fight them hereBin Laden Bin Laden 9/11 9/11More right wing spin. What was she supposed to do, poke him in the eye? You guys are fucking sad...*
*and appear to be devoid of the kind of critical thinking skills that make sites like WorldNetDaily set off the bullshit alarm...
Hate to burst your bubble, twiddlestick, but Sheehan never said this. The quote was invented by the right-wing sleeze machine in a "letter" she sent to ABC News, which she never sent, but was "forwarded by a friend (someone she didn't know)." Hitchens was too drunk to fact check and he got punk'd. When asked about the quote by Anderson Cooper on CNN, she denies saying it:
sorry foll
I challenge you to find confirmation of it anywhere outside the right wing blogosphere.
Dude, little secret... These wingnuts lie a lot and they'll smear anyone who steps in front of them. Don't believe the hype.
This has already been discussed at length in this thread. Take your right hand off the keyboard, your left hand out of your pants, grab a heavy object and bang on head until unconscious.
November 4, 2004
Dear George,
You don???t mind if I call you George do you? When you sent me a letter offering your condolences on the death of my son, Spc. Casey Austin Sheehan, in the illegal and unjust war on Iraq, you called me Cindy, so I naturally assume we are on a first name basis.
George, it has been seven months today since your reckless and wanton foreign policies killed my son, my big boy, my hero, my best-friend: Casey. It has been seven months since your ignorant and arrogant lack of planning for the peace murdered my oldest child. It has been two days since your dishonest campaign stole another election???but you all were way more subtle this time than in 2000, weren???t you? You hardly had to get the Supreme Court of the United States involved at all this week.
You feel so proud of yourself for betraying the country again, don???t you? You think you are very clever because you pulled the wool over the eyes of some of the people again. You think that you have some mandate from God???that you can ???spend your political capital??? any way that you want. George you don???t care or even realize that 56,000,000 plus citizens of this country voted against you and your agenda. Still, you are going to continue your ruthless work of being a divider and not a uniter. George, in 2000 when you stole that election and the Democrats gave up, I gave up too. I had the most ironic thought of my life then: "Oh well, how much damage can he do in four years?" Well, now I know how much you have damaged my family, this country, and this world. If you think I am going to allow you another four years to do even more damage, then you truly are mistaken. I will fight for a true vote count and if that fails, your impeachment. Also, the impeachment of your Vice President. The only thing is, I'm not politically savvy, and I don't have a Karl Rove to plan my strategy, but I do have a big mouth and a righteous cause, which still mean something in this country, I hope.
All of this lying, fooling, and betraying must be ???hard work??? George. You really think you know what hard work is?
George, let me tell you what ???hard work??? really is.
Hard work is seeing your oldest son, your brave and honorable man-child go off to a war that had, and still has, no basis in reality. Hard work is worrying yourself gray and not being able to sleep for 2 weeks because you don???t know if your child is safe.
Hard work is seeing your son???s murder on CNN one Sunday evening while you???re enjoying the last supper you???ll ever truly enjoy again.
Hard work is having three military officers come to your house a few hours later to confirm the aforementioned murder of your son???your first born???your kind and gentle sweet baby.
Hard work is burying your child 46 days before his 25th birthday. Hard work is holding your other three children as they lower the body of their big ???baba??? into the ground. Hard work is not jumping in the grave with him and having the earth cover you both.
But, Dear George, do you know what the hardest work of all is? Trying to digest the fact that the leader of the country that your family has fought for and died for, for generations, lied to you and betrayed your dear boy???s sense of honor and exploited his courage and exploited his loyalty to his buddies. Hard work is having your country abandon you after they killed your son. Hard work is coming to the realization that your son had his future robbed from him and that you have had your son's future and future grand-children stolen from you. Hard work is knowing that there are so many people in this world that have prospered handsomely from your son's death.
George, I must confess that I and my family worked very HARD to re-defeat you this time, but you refuse to stay defeated. Well, we are watching you very carefully. We are going to do everything in our power to have you impeached for misleading the American people into a disastrous war and for mis-using and abusing your power as Commander-in-Chief. We are going to scream until our last breath to bring the rest of our babies home from this quagmire of a war that you have gotten our country in to: before too many more families learn the true meaning of Hard Work. We know it is going to be an uphill battle, knowing how Republican Congress is, but thanks to you, we know the meaning of Hard Work and we???re not afraid of hard work at all.
The 56,000,000 plus citizens who voted against you and your agenda have given me a mandate to move forward with my agenda. Also, thanks to you and your careless domestic policies, I am unemployed, so this will be my full-time job. Being your political downfall will be the most noble accomplishment of my life and it will bring justice for my son and 1125 (so far) other brave Americans and tens of thousands of innocent Iraqis your lies have killed. By the way, George, how many more innocent Iraqis are your policies going to kill before you convince them that you are better than Saddam? How many more of their cities are you going to level before you consider that they are liberated? If you really had any moral values, or if you were an honorable man at all you would resign. My son was a man who had high moral values and true courage. Humanity lost a bright light on April 04, 2004. I will live the rest of my life missing Casey desperately. Thank you for that, George. Have a nice day.
God Bless America!! We surely need it!
Cindy Sheehan
Broken hearted mother of a True American Hero: Spc Casey Austin Sheehan, KIA 04/04/04 Sadr City, Baghdad
"When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love has always won. There have been tyrants and murderers and for a time they seem invincible but in the end, they always fall - think of it, always."
- Gandhi
I know there is a large silent majority out there, especially on the Strut, but what is up with some of the future leaders of the free world? You support the opposite of what your country was founded on. If you lived in Soviet Russia you'd all have red stars and weekend dachas given to you by a grateful politburo. Bushco won't even be so generous... tools you are, critical thinkers not.
vomit
Oh look...yet more vomit...
no comment on all this TX madness
The Axis of Weazel (RNC, Rove, Swiftyesque Shadow Groups) are behind it.
riddle? fuck outta here. their tactics are well known. when they are called out they attack the messenger.
the content of Sheenan's argument is solid.
but this is image media politics. facts are itches.
Forget summing it up. Listen to what she is saying:
I felt like I was in Bizarro World as I heard George speak about 9/11 five times and mention terrorism 31 times, even though these rationales for war have been disproved repeatedly. I think George thinks that since we believed him once about terrorism vis a vis Iraq, that we must therefore be gullible enough to believe him this time. I don???t know, and I am not a professional pundit, but my theory is he might have mentioned 9/11 to manipulate our emotions and maybe even frighten us a little again?
The thing that struck me when I was watching that vacuous man giving his hollow speech was the fact that he could have always replaced the word ???terrorists??? with the phrase: ???my moronic and callous foreign policies.??? For example, when he said that terrorists spread death and destruction on the streets of Baghdad and kill innocent people, he could have just as easily said: ???My moronic and callous foreign policies spread death and destruction on the streets of Baghdad and kill innocent people.??? When he said that we need to stop terrorists from toppling governments in the region, he could have just as easily said: ???We need to stop my moronic and callous foreign policies from toppling governments in the region.??? People have characterized the speech-lite in many ways, but if I had to pick a few words to describe it, I would say: ???Hypocritical, manipulative, condescending, meaningless drivel.???
I sat through an entire hour in the CNN studio in DC hearing not one person say that the invasion was a mistake and if it was a mistake, then our troops should be brought home immediately. Even the ???Democratic??? Senators (Kerry and Bayh) that were on the program just gave their recipes for ???success??? in Iraq, which did not include any exit strategies. The guest host for that hour was Bob Costas and he asked one guest, Sen. John McCain, an intriguing question: ???If you could push Button One and have an eventual wonderful outcome in Iraq, or if you could push Button Two and never have had it happen, which one would you pick???? Of course, Sen. McCain chose Button One. He hasn???t had a loved one killed in this enormous tragedy of a war, nor does he have a loved one in harm???s way. It has not affected him personally one bit. What skin is it off McCain???s teeth if our troops remain for a highly unlikely rosy outcome at the cost of thousands of more lives? I would push the button that would bring back my son, Casey, and the tens of thousands of the other victims who have been killed for nothing but outright lies and bald-faced betrayals. I would push the button that would give Iraq back its power, water, and their infrastructure.
My absolute favorite guest of the evening was Sen. John Warner, powerful Chair of the Senate Armed Disservices Committee. Of course, he fell in lockstep behind his fuehrer and praised the speech and how, although we have ???all??? paid a terrible price for this invasion and occupation, bringing freedom and democracy to the Iraqi people is worth all the sacrifices that the world is making. I sat in the Green Room with Sen. Warner???s entourage. I wondered (even out loud) what price they have paid for our administration???s misdeeds in Iraq. They all looked like happy, well-fed, well-dressed, well-educated, and well-hydrated Americans. They looked to me like they had plenty of electricity to blow dry their hair and charge their cell phones and lap tops. They looked like they had quite a nice supply of clean drinking water and fresh food. I sincerely doubt if any of them had a loved one ripped from their lives by a car bomb, IED, or bullet in an ambush. I wondered who the ???we??? was that John Warner spoke of. I spoke with John Warner after his interview and told him unless he was prepared to sacrifice even a good night???s sleep over this senseless and criminal war, then he should work on ending it, not prolonging the carnage. He told me that I was ???entitled to my opinion,??? but he would respectfully have to disagree with me. That was awfully Constitutional of him!
I finally got on to speak for my 82 seconds (all the time Larry King Live could spare for the peace message) about how this war is a catastrophe and how we should bring the troops home and quit forcing the Iraqi people to pay for our government???s hubris and quit forcing innocent children to suffer so we can fight terrorism somewhere besides America. How absolutely racist and immoral is it to take America???s battles to another land and make an entire country pay for the crimes of others? To me, this is blatant genocide. How dare we export our patriotic brand of flag waving death and devastation to a people who have been through so much already? It wasn???t bad enough that our sanctions killed tens of thousands of Iraqis before we even started an active aggression on them, now we have to create confusion, chaos, and disorder there. How dare our president, Congress, and we Americans allow this to continue?
After my brief advocacy for peace, my position was refuted by another Mom whose son was killed in Iraq in 2003 who said she ???totally disagrees??? with me and ???feels sorry??? for me. Well, you know what? I feel ache for her blindness and for the millions of sheeple who have had the wool pulled over their eyes by the bunch of hypocritical, bad shepherds who are running disastrous herd over the world. I have distressing news for the Soccer Safety Moms and the NASCAR Dads who are such ardent supporters of this administration and war: Your grandchildren and children who will be entering Kindergarten this fall will be fighting George???s endless war if he gets his way and is allowed to continue spreading the cancer of imperialism in the Middle-East. Donny Rumsfeld said we could be in Iraq for another dozen years. Does anybody think with all the billions of dollars that are being poured into constructing super-sized bases in Iraq that the war machine plans on relinquishing the cash-cow that is that poor, unfortunate land anytime soon? Think about it when you tuck your child into bed tonight.
I heard George and the Senators say that evening the sacrifices we as Americans have had to make for Iraq are ???worth it.??? I really would like to know who has benefited and profited from Iraq and who has really had to sacrifice anything. I know it was ???worth it??? to Dick Cheney who was the CEO of Halliburton, (of no-bid contract fame) which has raped billions of dollars from our government, from the people of Iraq, and from our soldiers who are not getting what they need to survive in a combat zone. It is ???worth it??? to Black Water Security Co. who sends one thousand dollar a day mercenaries to Iraq, funded by the War Department. It is ???worth it??? to L. Paul Bremer who slunk out of Iraq with 8.8 BILLION dollars missing from the Provisional authority. It is also ???worth it??? to the other companies and individuals who have been enriched by feeding our children to the military industrial complex. By George, I think we have found the people who think this war is ???worth it.??? But, is it worth it to George Bush who was counting on this unlawful and unprincipled aggression in Iraq to give him ???political??? capital? Instead, if poll numbers are any good indication, Americans are withdrawing their assent for George and they are withdrawing their consent for him to wage eternal war on humanity.
As I s at in the Green Room of CNN, I was saddened and troubled by George???s call for us Americans to fly the flag proudly on the 4th to honor our troops. For one thing, the American flag is not a magical token that can bring armor to the troops who are still dying without the protection. The flag is not a faith healer that can restore limbs and eyesight to the ones who have been maimed forever. The flag is not a genie in a bottle that can blink her eyes and bring our children home from this horrible blunder that they are suffering for and being slaughtered for. But, as for me, I will never be able to celebrate another patriotic holiday without mourning what this nation has stolen from my family. I will never be able to look at an American flag without thinking of the uniform my son wore proudly that displayed that same symbol and the evil ones who desecrated and defiled the stars and stripes by lying us into the invasion of Iraq. No, Casey???s sacrifice was not ???worth it??? and George needs to do more than wave his flag and manipulate our sense of patriotism. He needs to march his girls to a recruitment center and send them to Iraq to fight the terrorists that his moronic and callous foreign policies have recruited or he needs to wake up and smell the apple pie and bring our other sons and daughters home, now!
Cindy Sheehan
one fo the reasons I keep coming back to soulstrut is cause the political discussions are always so well articulated on both sides, and although this board is leans extremely to the left even the right wingers seem to be able to express themselves well. Those that want to participate in a political argument ehre should give the same respect that they want to recieve.
Now for my two cents:
Cindy Sheehan is asking for something that is impossible, she wants a face-to-face meeting so that Bush will essentially apologize for sending her son off to be killed. If bush or his handlers allwoed such a meeting to take place the apology she wants would never come. The president has been pressured by much bigger fish than the mother of a dead solider to say that he made a mistake and he ain't going to fold on his stance now.
Its sad to watch a mother in pain over the death of her child, and it's horrific to see news outlets take her crusade and dirty it up by mentioning she is getting a divorce. People need to simplify the cause instead of convoluding it with all this outside mess.
Larry: I agree with you in most of what you say, but even Cindy Sheehan has muddled her own cause by accepting the aid of people like Michael Moore, a man with an unbelieve bias that will not garner much sympathy with those who may have cared more when it was just a mother of a dead soldier who wanted to have private audience with the president to ask some questions
Question everything. Deepstank is right, they are scum and will smear you next.
Who else have they fucked over?
Max Cleland (self-inflicted multiple amputations)
John Kerry (rice shrapnel)
Paul Hackett (wuss)
Scott Ritter (kiddie porn)
John McCain ("black" (shudder) baby)
There's plenty more.... meanwhile criminals convicted of treasonous activity against their own govt, and accused of war crimes in international court, are in the cabinet. But they get a pass from all the Yale-cheerleader cheerleaders.
The world is just so
nice try,
international court - who cares.
I'm listening to Cindy Sheehan. Now I have listened to Hitchen's.
We were told that we were attacked on 9/11 because the terrorists hate our freedoms and democracy ??? not for the real reason, because the Arab Muslims who attacked us hate our middle-eastern foreign policy.
Note that Hitchens never once address what Cindy Sheehan is saying. He attacks her in every way he can. But he never address what she is saying. Sadly that is what the attackers on this board are doing too.
Dan
There's a big problem right there...
like, I hate ska AND techno.
It could happen.
this is like the same court that wants to hang Henry Kissinger right?
good luck with selling that argument.
Adam,
Suppose what Mrs. Sheehan wants is impossible. That, in and of itself, and the reasons why it is so, is the big problem. How many more people will die because Bush can't admit he made a mistake? How pathological is that???
Say what you want about Michael Moore (and this isn't really about him), but keep in mind that his public image is as much the product of his demonization by the right wing in this country as it is of his own words and actions.
I agree that this discussion has had it's ugly moments, but I think that's because there's so much at stake here. I simply cannot understand why anyone with access to information would step up to defend the status quo in this situation. It boggles the mind, and the degree to which the President and his proxys will resort to character assassination to muddy the waters of discourse ought to disgust everyone, not just those on the left.
Larry
cause she made the effort to be heard