Obay

DORDOR Two Ron Toe 9,871 Posts
edited February 2008 in Strut Central
Seeing these all over the city and in the subway.

  Comments


  • catalistcatalist 1,373 Posts
    that top one is so classic....

    Apparently it is a mystery as to who is behind these fake ads , but there will be some sort of unveiling behind them within the month.. that's what I read in the paper at least.

    if it was real that would be some scary shit!

  • The_NonThe_Non 5,690 Posts
    Seems to be some anti-Ritalin ad.
    If people disciplined their kids better, there would be no "ADD."

  • RaystarRaystar 1,106 Posts

  • Birdman9Birdman9 5,417 Posts
    Seems to be some anti-Ritalin ad.
    If people disciplined their kids better, there would be no "ADD."

    If parents and teachers would let children develop normally (and in many cases, more at their own pace) instead of automatically feeding them pills because a teacher 'can't control them', I can't help but think that ADD cases would plummett. But hey, pills is good for the economy, right?

  • batmonbatmon 27,574 Posts

  • Seems to be some anti-Ritalin ad.
    If people disciplined their kids better, there would be no "ADD."

    and if public schools had gym class so folls can run off some of that energy....

  • verb606verb606 2,518 Posts
    Seems to be some anti-Ritalin ad.
    If people disciplined their kids better, there would be no "ADD."

    If parents and teachers would let children develop normally (and in many cases, more at their own pace) instead of automatically feeding them pills because a teacher 'can't control them', I can't help but think that ADD cases would plummett. But hey, pills is good for the economy, right?

    Sayin. Don't get my wife started on this. She's a kindergarten teacher (age 3-6 montessori actually) and she hates the over-diagnosing of ADD. She echoes the things said above; that most cases of ADD can be headed off at the pass by establishing boundaries and other proper raising methods that rein in some of their wack behavior.


    About those ads, though. Someone actually paid for those? I figured they were some guerrilla shit, but then I was wondering how they got them behind the glass. That's pretty ill though. They should put a phone number on there and see if anyone calls to find out how they can get the product.

  • jaysusjaysus 787 Posts
    but then I was wondering how they got them behind the glass.

    Drill out the center of a Torx driver. It's not too hard.

    I am just hoping this is not those OBEY dudes. Guerrilla street art turned Macy's clothing brand? WTF?

  • DORDOR Two Ron Toe 9,871 Posts
    There is talk they are for a advocacy organization of colleges across the province.

    Still really strange...

  • dayday 9,612 Posts
    There is talk they are for a advocacy organization of colleges across the province.

    Still really strange...

    http://torontoist.com/2008/02/obay.php

  • twoplytwoply 2,903 Posts
    Does anyone have hard evidence that ADD is over-diagnosed, or are people just basing this on personal observation?

    I think part of the problem people have with the diagnosis is its ambiguity. What exactly does ADD mean? Why do different sufferers experience different symptoms?

    Personally, I like to think ADD stands for Aggregate Disorder Disorder. By definition a disorder must substantially impact a person's quality of life in a negative manner. But what if someone falls on the lighter end of the spectrum (disqualifying them from being diagnosed with a disorder) for a few different conditions, such as autism, tourette syndrom, obsessive compulsive behavior, dyslexia, etc.? This person could be beyond the realm of positive diagnosis for one disorder, but combined, all the conditions cause a substantial negative impact on their quality of life. I wouldn't be surprised if ADD has become a catch-all diagnoses for such people.

  • Birdman9Birdman9 5,417 Posts
    Does anyone have hard evidence that ADD is over-diagnosed, or are people just basing this on personal observation?

    I think part of the problem people have with the diagnosis is its ambiguity. What exactly does ADD mean? Why do different sufferers experience different symptoms?

    Personally, I like to think ADD stands for Aggregate Disorder Disorder. By definition a disorder must substantially impact a person's quality of life in a negative manner. But what if someone falls on the lighter end of the spectrum (disqualifying them from being diagnosed with a disorder) for a few different conditions, such as autism, tourette syndrom, obsessive compulsive behavior, dyslexia, etc.? This person could be beyond the realm of positive diagnosis for one disorder, but combined, all the conditions cause a substantial negative impact on their quality of life. I wouldn't be surprised if ADD has become a catch-all diagnoses for such people.

    I admit completely that I am basing it strictly on observation, conversations with friends who are teachers and psychiatrists, as well as what I have read/heard/seen on TV, mags and radio. Your assessment of what the term 'ADD' has become I think sounds pretty spot on. Kid acting up? Must be the ADD. Kid depressed? Can't be the recent divorce, must be a side effect of the ADD. Kid has trouble with reading? Can't be as 'simple' as dyslexia, must be ADD. Better have the doc give him something for that.

    I recently heard someone on the radio talking about how Ritalin supposedly affects a part of the brain that controls motivation, and he was charging that Ritalin creates, in effect, lazy children who are well behaved, but have little drive.

  • nzshadownzshadow 5,516 Posts


    Hi.

  • DB_CooperDB_Cooper Manhatin' 7,823 Posts
    Does anyone have hard evidence that ADD is over-diagnosed, or are people just basing this on personal observation?

    I can only say that in my personal observation during my three years working in a children's outpatient mental health facility, ADD is over-diagnosed. Shit is epidemic. You could truly see the difference between children with caring parents who were running wild and children whose parents didn't know the first thing about raising a child and didn't care to know. All of them received prescriptions.

  • twoplytwoply 2,903 Posts
    You could truly see the difference between children with caring parents who were running wild and children whose parents didn't know the first thing about raising a child and didn't care to know.


    Are caring and competence mutually exclusive when parenting? I mean, you bring up an interesting dilemma. There exist children whose parents lover them very much, but have no clue how to raise them. While educational programs and other resources designed to assist parents without proper child-rearing skills would be ideal, the reality is that most of these people are on their own. If a clinic or mental health program simply doesn't have the resources to help educate, and the only choice comes down to medicate or don't medicate a child with severe behavioral problems, which is more fair to the child? Telling the parents it's their responsibility to do a better job (knowing full well they probably won't change a thing), or helping the child to obtain at least some amount of self-control?

    I too flinch when I hear of children with behavior problems being medicated. I've worked with children for almost ten years and I've seen the effects firsthand. However, I've also seen children benefit from medication at a very low dosage. My nephew is one of those. He was diagnosed with ADHD, and more recently Asperger Syndrome, and had very severe behavior issues. He was expelled from three daycares by the time he was five and had angry, violent episodes on a daily basis. I have no doubt that if his parents had a better understanding of how to raise a child, much of his behavior would have been minimized. But that wasn't going to happen. Now he's been on medication for over a year and continues to improve all the time. He still occasionally shows oppositional-defiant tendencies, but he's a far more dynamic and happy person now that he's better able to express himself.


  • yeah these are scary too.

    it's like the style of totalitarian-style propoganda posters of national leaders became cool >>> Obama is cool >>> so let's make a totalitarian-style propoganda poster of him.

    at the end of the day though it's still a totalitarian-style propoganda poster of of a national leader. sorta creepy.

  • DB_CooperDB_Cooper Manhatin' 7,823 Posts
    I wish I knew the answer to any of your questions. As it is, I found the whole ordeal inordinately depressing and chose another career path.

    I will say that the psychopharmocologists who wrote the prescriptions were very aware of the dilemmas posed and thought the lesser evil was to medicate.

  • twoplytwoply 2,903 Posts
    I wish I knew the answer to any of your questions. As it is, I found the whole ordeal inordinately depressing and chose another career path.


    I know what you mean. It's amazing when you realize what a difference a positive, reasoned, authoritative approach can do for a child, and completely depressing when you realize that it's a drop in the bucket compared to the negativity and indifference the same child faces on a daily basis.

  • those ads are funny. wish there was more stuff like that (adbusters has done a few similar type projects here in NY).

    as for the ADD, I think it's definitely a problem with the whole concept of standardization in education. Some kids can have encouraging parents and a healthy home, but their personality type is just going to be more suited for high physical activity. plus, having worked in my fair share of public schools, it's become a major trend to focus more time and effort, from an early age, on standardized testing. SHIT IS BOGUS.


  • twoplytwoply 2,903 Posts
    standardized testing. SHIT IS BOGUS.

  • ElectrodeElectrode Los Angeles 2,872 Posts
    Does anyone have hard evidence that ADD is over-diagnosed, or are people just basing this on personal observation?

    I think part of the problem people have with the diagnosis is its ambiguity. What exactly does ADD mean? Why do different sufferers experience different symptoms?

    Personally, I like to think ADD stands for Aggregate Disorder Disorder. By definition a disorder must substantially impact a person's quality of life in a negative manner. But what if someone falls on the lighter end of the spectrum (disqualifying them from being diagnosed with a disorder) for a few different conditions, such as autism, tourette syndrom, obsessive compulsive behavior, dyslexia, etc.? This person could be beyond the realm of positive diagnosis for one disorder, but combined, all the conditions cause a substantial negative impact on their quality of life. I wouldn't be surprised if ADD has become a catch-all diagnoses for such people.

    I admit completely that I am basing it strictly on observation, conversations with friends who are teachers and psychiatrists, as well as what I have read/heard/seen on TV, mags and radio. Your assessment of what the term 'ADD' has become I think sounds pretty spot on. Kid acting up? Must be the ADD. Kid depressed? Can't be the recent divorce, must be a side effect of the ADD. Kid has trouble with reading? Can't be as 'simple' as dyslexia, must be ADD. Better have the doc give him something for that.

    I recently heard someone on the radio talking about how Ritalin supposedly affects a part of the brain that controls motivation, and he was charging that Ritalin creates, in effect, lazy children who are well behaved, but have little drive.

    You are so on point. I was raised very well with two loving parents, but I was fed a battery of pills as a kid, namely by my mom who is a big cheerleader for medication since depression and suicide runs in her side of the family, for everything from "ADD" to "depression". I'm a short guy (it wasn't until recently I found out that all that Prozac and bullshit stunted my growth considerably) who used to have a very quirky and eccentric personality. I was raised to have a lot of book smarts, but street/social smarts were non existant. Because of that, was I was picked on a lot from primary to high school. I've come a long way since then but maturity helped that, not pills. Parents should just let their kids be kids - unless they like to play with fire, have an interest in torturing small animals, making bombs or whatever, of course. I'm glad we live in an age of modern medicine, but a lot of the shit that Big Pharm whores pull is disgusting

  • The_NonThe_Non 5,690 Posts
    standardized testing. SHIT IS BOGUS.

    It's not the tests that are faulty. It is the teachers having kids play Monopoly in 10th grade Social Studies classes and only teaching to gear their kids towards the standardized test that is bogus. The U.S. educational system is in fuckin shambles, and nobody cares. So keep blaming the test and see where that gets you.
    Students need benchmarks set at certain grade levels to show aptitude. If there is a better way to do it than testing, I am all ears.

  • Does anyone have hard evidence that ADD is over-diagnosed, or are people just basing this on personal observation?

    to me until someone has to take a medical exam in order to be diagnosed with ADD I think it's all bullshit.

  • twoplytwoply 2,903 Posts

    It's not the tests that are faulty. It is the teachers having kids play Monopoly in 10th grade Social Studies classes and only teaching to gear their kids towards the standardized test that is bogus. The U.S. educational system is in fuckin shambles, and nobody cares.

    Yes, the tests are faulty. They assume that every student's knowledge base can be accessed in the same manner, which is not true. Playing Monopoly is not bogus, as it helps teach a hands-on, experience-based understanding of economics. Many people care about the fact that the educational system is "in shambles."


    Students need benchmarks set at certain grade levels to show aptitude.

    Aptitude for what? Taking tests?

  • mannybolonemannybolone 15,030 Posts
    only teaching to gear their kids towards the standardized test that is bogus.

    No child left behind!

  • only teaching to gear their kids towards the standardized test that is bogus.

    No child test question[/b] left behind!



  • yeah these are scary too.

    it's like the style of totalitarian-style propoganda posters of national leaders became cool >>> Obama is cool >>> so let's make a totalitarian-style propoganda poster of him.

    at the end of the day though it's still a totalitarian-style propoganda poster of of a national leader. sorta creepy.

    DONT BE SOUR CAUSE U AINT GOT 1.

  • LaserWolfLaserWolf Portland Oregon 11,518 Posts
    Great thread.

    1) Looks like AdBusters to me.

    2) There are rare cases of children who are moving at high speed every waking minute and never focusing. Then there are cases of schools where 1/2 of the boys are diagnosed ADHD through school referrals.

    3) My sister talks about studies that show that an hour a day spent playing in fields and woods is as or more effective than ritalin. She says the disorder is actually Green Deficit or Nature Deficit Disorder .

    4) The effect NCLB has had on focusing nearly 100% of school time on testing or preparing for testing is tragic.

    5) I see so many kids who have "problems" in elementary schools. When I step back and look at these problems I realize the only problem is they do not function well in the soulcrushing public school environment. Between k-3 almost every kid loves art, books and science. By middle school we have managed to destroy all their interest in every subject. Not just ADHD, but kids who just want to read, or do art, or play or talk to friends or run off and hide or ask "why" are considered problem children in schools.

  • djannadjanna 1,543 Posts
    Has anyone tried to work with kids with a severe chemical imbalance whose parents will not try medication and whose brains are totally haywire therefore making it impossible to function socially or academically? No? OK. I do everyday. Shit is wack.

    Two sides to every story.

  • LaserWolfLaserWolf Portland Oregon 11,518 Posts
    Has anyone tried to work with kids with a severe chemical imbalance whose parents will not try medication and whose brains are totally haywire therefore making it impossible to function socially or academically? No? OK. I do everyday. Shit is wack.

    Two sides to every story.

    I hear you, and I feel you. There are children with serious problems, and there are dedicated people like yourself who are working with them. The lifeskills class at the school I spend the most time in is an amazing place with really great dedicated teachers and staff.

    For some kids (I'm not talking about severe chemical imbalance) who are constantly in trouble or failing the problem is not the kid, but the system. I see kids who I think would be better served in a Montessori or Waldorf or an apprenticeship program or any thing besides the structure of public school.

    Apprenticeship program? We have created a system where it is difficult for teens to find work or for employers to hire them. Where finishing school and going to college is the only viable option for advancement. This is a new phenom. I had 2 friends, just as sharp as can be, but failures in school. This is back in the 70s. They both dropped out of high school. Yeah they hung out and did drugs, but by their mid twenties they both owned large successful business, one landscaping the other finish carpentry. But they were super smart and were able to see how they could do better work and have a better business plan than the guys they were working for. Most of their employees are high school drop outs who are not as sharp. It would have been great for those drop outs if instead of being "failures" they could have studied and developed their skills in horticulture and carpentry.
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