I work in reality TV and have done so for the last 2 years, I've done a shitload of shoots with both paid actors and non-paid actors (most of which are still coached as to what to do and say). Watching "reality" actors do their thing is not something new to me.
I work in reality TV and have done so for the last 2 years
Maybe that's the problem. You're going into this expecting a typical one dimensional American style reality show.
Have you watched the original program? Well, in the movie they basically tied together a bunch of "Ali G Show" style Borat skits with fictional moments to give everything context.
So, for the viewer at home, Borat is hitchhiking when he gets in the fratboy mobile. But the fratboys were not given the same story as the viewer at home. Obviously, the cameras were in the camper already. So, as it was described elsewhere in this thread, the boys were prepped to be a part of a Kazakhi television show ... and part of that involved allowing cameras to be in their camper and picking up Borat.
You see, there is a whole level of fiction (what the interviewees were told) that the audience is not let in on and vice versa. It runs a whole lot deeper than typical "reality" tv.
The fraternity brothers. University of South Carolina student and Chi Psi brother David Corcoran seems to be the only member of the trio speaking on the record so far. Corcoran talks to FHM: "My first thought was, 'What if my mom finds out?'" And the other brothers? "Of the two others who joined Corcoran on the embarrassing romp, one still is a brother in Chi Psi, and the other has left the university," Chi Psi Alpha Beta chapter president Todd Bailey tells The State. Bailey says he has no desire to see the movie.
That has to be the first time USA Today ever used "according to FHM..."
If any of the people in this movie could "act" the look of sheer disgust (that was very convincing to me), they might just have a future in Hollywood, or at least some community theater. When Borat brings that sack of poo downstairs at that dinner party, that lady's look was so priceless. Same thing with some of those folks in the hotel. Maybe they knew what was going to happen but, deep down, they weren't prepared for... the wrath of the fat Khazak producer!
I work in reality TV and have done so for the last 2 years
Maybe that's the problem. You're going into this expecting a typical one dimensional American style reality show.
Have you watched the original program?
I love the show and the obvious shock in the genuine reactinos of his victims. I just didn't see the same type of shock in the people from the film. I'm not saying the entire film was staged, after all I think its far too difficult to find a stadium full of people and tell them theres a joke being played. I just think he chose to use plants instead of real people for many of the situations.
another example would be him walking around the streets of NY without a handheld microphone and picking up the sound of the passers by with incredible clarity.
It runs a whole lot deeper than typical "reality" tv.
do you work in the industry? because "typical reality TV" is one of those descriptive terms I've yet to hear in a pitch room. Please enlighten me.
Is it anything like "typical rap music" or "typical poor people"?
Guzz, the entire time during the movie he is still making his documentary about America. By the time he jumped in the RV he was alone because his "producer" abandoned him and he was going it "alone" = him and the film crew. Thus he still could've told them he was from a "TV Show" and set up the cameras and mike for his "shoot."
It runs a whole lot deeper than typical "reality" tv.
do you work in the industry? because "typical reality TV" is one of those descriptive terms I've yet to hear in a pitch room. Please enlighten me.
No, I don't .. thank God. Please enlighten me with an example of "reality tv" thats actually worth watching. So far, every example I've seen, aside from maybe a few seasons of "Real World" (gotta love Puck) have been utter and complete crap. The fact that its become an "industry" in and of itself is part of the problem ... about as entertaining as all of the America's Funniest Home Videos spinoffs. Maybe a lot of people are "buying", but its soulless crap, IMHO. If you have an example of something that I'm missing, please let me know.
Rap music? Poor people? Eh? Are you trying to put reality tv on some sort of cultural pedestal?
My interpretation is that, because you work in reality tv, you're approaching Borat the same way my highly educated film student friends approach all films. You can't help but try to deconstruct it, figure it out, and basically take the fun out of it. Only, it seems like most of your initial guesses were wrong so, in trying to better understand the film, you took away any possibility of ever actually enjoying it.
Guzz, the entire time during the movie he is still making his documentary about America. By the time he jumped in the RV he was alone because his "producer" abandoned him and he was going it "alone" = him and the film crew. Thus he still could've told them he was from a "TV Show" and set up the cameras and mike for his "shoot."
I suppose, but it just seemed so staged to me.
Like I said this is just one mans opinion of the film. I think the only way I'll actually be convinced is by seeing SBC sitting in a court fighting a case
It runs a whole lot deeper than typical "reality" tv.
do you work in the industry? because "typical reality TV" is one of those descriptive terms I've yet to hear in a pitch room. Please enlighten me.
No, I don't .. thank God. Please enlighten me with an example of "reality tv" thats actually worth watching. So far, every example I've seen, aside from maybe a few seasons of "Real World" (gotta love Puck) have been utter and complete crap. The fact that its become an "industry" in and of itself is part of the problem ... about as entertaining as all of the America's Funniest Home Videos spinoffs. Maybe a lot of people are "buying", but its soulless crap, IMHO. If you have an example of something that I'm missing, please let me know.
honestly I don't really watch reality TV, it's not my thing. Outside of what I need to know to do my job well I don't make a habit of watching any of them. It sounds like you are on some "I'm better than that" type steez though so having any discussion on this genre/ cultural phenomenon wouldn't be worth engaging.
Rap music? Poor people? Eh? Are you trying to put reality tv on some sort of cultural pedestal?
actually yes, reality TV is indeed a part of 21st century mainstream culture and theres no way around that. Television is a major medium and reality TV programs have dominated it for nearly 10 years now. There are devout fans of shows, there is a celebrity built around its participants and there are so many more facets of it in American life thats its hard to name them all in a single typed forum response
My interpretation is that, because you work in reality tv, you're approaching Borat the same way my highly educated film student friends approach all films. You can't help but try to deconstruct it, figure it out, and basically take the fun out of it. Only, it seems like most of your initial guesses were wrong so, in trying to better understand the film, you took away any possibility of ever actually enjoying it.
I am one of those "highly educated film students" and yes I can pick apart many a film but whats the point of doing it unless I am being tested or I need to learn a certain element for a project I'm working on?
I went into this film with some friends completely baked and ready to turn my mind off for an hour and half. I was hoping for a similar set up to the TV program in which Borat talks to unsuspecting people and grabs real reactions, something about the reactions and situations in this film hoswever made me feel that the characters were plants.
If the situations weren't scripted they were at least produced with a someone telling the characters what to do in this situatin and adlibs being used to get there.
It sounds like you are on some "I'm better than that" type steez
I didn't intend that tone and I apologize. I got a bit peeved at the "rap music", "poor people" comment as I wouldn't put reality tv (the "plight" of or the cultural significance of) in the same arena as discussions about hip hop or poverty ... so that put me on the defensive.
I do get discouraged at what has been done with the genre of reality tv ... enough to just dismiss it all to some degree. I guess, the fact that it has become a genre may be the problem in my eyes. When "The Real World" was released, reality tv itself was a novelty. It had been done ... what was the first example in the 70s, "The Family" or something? But the very idea of it was fresh and new. Now, to hear about it referred to as an "industry". People sit around tables and discuss the next big idea in "reality tv". The concept itself just isn't clever anymore.
When something clever comes along like Ali G/Borat, though, I appreciate it greatly. And perhaps adapting it to a film was too much for some people. I think what is difficult to see when watching the film is the levels of reality going on. We weren't told what the fratboys were told. However, that doesn't mean that the fratboys were "in on the joke" to the extent that they knew Borat was actually Sacha Baron Cohen. I don't think that he crossed that line at all in the movie. In fact, he never left character during the filming. So I think to see the mics and to immediately dismiss the scene as fraud is jumping the gun a bit.
When something clever comes along like Ali G/Borat, though, I appreciate it greatly. And perhaps adapting it to a film was too much for some people. I think what is difficult to see when watching the film is the levels of reality going on. We weren't told what the fratboys were told. However, that doesn't mean that the fratboys were "in on the joke" to the extent that they knew Borat was actually Sacha Baron Cohen. I don't think that he crossed that line at all in the movie. In fact, he never left character during the filming. So I think to see the mics and to immediately dismiss the scene as fraud is jumping the gun a bit.
I think the lesson learned for me is that I can take Borat in small doses. The fact that it was shot in a documentary/ mockumentary style yet the audience isn't let in on what the characters (the fratboys) know makes it seem less genuine than perhaps it was supposed to be.
Those fratboys were coached in someway if they were not actual actors, which takes away from the feel of it being real. They knew they were recieving Borat on the RV and they knew he was going to play a Pam anderson porn. The surprise that usually generates a laugh from me simply wasn't there.
as for reality TV it's really not designed in the most part to be smart (or dumb for that matter) it's pretty much designed to be cheap and easy to produce. It's massive popularity was a bit of a surprise and it initially started airing due to a potential writers strike in '99. The funny thing is there are very few reality shows I see now that don't have a writer or a writing team.
I see your point about the coaching, but the same can be said about the Borat skits on the series. He always has the premise that he's a journalist from Kazakhstan ... and, when interviewed by a journalist of any kind, you will always be coached in some way.
A good example of that would be in the bonus section on, I think, the second season of the DVDs. When Borat is hanging out with the Texas hunter in the game farm ... after the hunter shoots an animal, Borat asks him to pretend that he had just killed it with a knife which the guy actually does.
I guess the difference there would be that the audience is in on both levels of reality so it doesn't seem fake ... or at least we're told about the fake parts. In the movie, the audience is supposed to, perhaps, believe that Borat is actually hitchhiking.
Well ... I now actually just better understand your point.
Ali G got played out real quick here in the UK, so by the time Borat came along I really wasn???t interested in anything that might be on the ???Ali G Show??? or what ever it was called. Anyway a few months ago Funky Mimizu recommends that I watch a few Borat links off Youtube. Reluctantly I watch them and you know what I thought they where great, spent a good few hours watching that stuff. So today I want to see the movie and I was really disappointed with it. I agree with the previous poster who said its like Sacha Baron Cohen had forgotten how to do Barat.
I hardy found any off the movie funny, it felt staged and fake. I would recommend anyone to watch all the clips from You tube (from the TV shows) and not bother watching the movie.
salon.com published a 'what's real in borat' piece today if yr curious.
What's real in "Borat"? Everything you wanted to know about the Kazakh road trip -- what was staged, who was an actor, and who was just hapless comedy roadkill.[/b]
By David Marchese and Willa Paskin[/b]
Nov. 10, 2006 | The devilish pranks of "Borat" have made him the powder-blue polyester breakout hit of the season. But how many of Sacha Baron Cohen's gags are real, and which ones are staged? Which of Borat's victims were legitimately goofed, and which ones just played along for giggles? With few exceptions, the real folks featured in "Borat," the movie, have been happy to talk about their experience, and outing them has turned into a mini-media craze, with tons of news outlets trying to sniff out the stories behind the making of the film. To save you time and satisfy your curiosity, we tracked down some of Borat's victims on our own and also compiled a guide revealing which figures were in on the joke (Pamela -- say it ain't so!) and which weren't. But even after our sleuthing, some mysteries remain -- like where the heck did that naked wrestling match take place? No one seems to know. If you have a clue -- or any great additional information -- please send it to us. This is a work in progress, so be sure to check back in. We think you'll find it very niiice. The Scene:[/b] Borat goes to the rodeo Where:[/b] Salem Civic Center, Salem, Va. Borat arrives at the rodeo, with plans to sing the national anthem. The rodeo's producer, Bobby Rowe, helpfully advises Borat to shave his mustache, so as not to be mistaken for a Muslim. When Borat tries to kiss him on the cheek, Rowe tells him never to do that, that people might get the wrong impression that he's gay. After Borat declares, "We hang homosexuals in my country!" Rowe smirkingly responds: "That's what we're trying to do here." Before launching into the anthem, Borat shrieks, "We support your war of terror" -- to thunderous applause. The crowd's enthusiasm tapers off as Borat voices his wish that "George W. Bush will drink the blood of every man, woman and child in Iraq" and turns into all-out booing once Borat begins to sing the Kazakh national anthem -- during which point a horse, apparently spooked by the crowd, freaks out and falls to the ground with his flag-waving rider. What happened:[/b] The event caused quite a stir. John Saunders, the Salem Civic Center's assistant director, told the Roanoke Times that if Borat and crew hadn't high-tailed it out of the arena, "There would have been a riot. They would have been killed." Rowe told Salon that he'd agreed to let Borat sing, believing the story that Borat was a Kazakh journalist traveling across the country. Rowe says he requested a sample track, but was sent a blank CD. And what about those anti-gay comments? Rowe, who says he hasn't seen the film, didn't disavow them, but instead offered a curious rationale: "As long as [homosexuals] don't mess with me and get me involved, if that's their choice, just have at it. Just don't come in my household and try to demand, as they're doing now, all sorts of things. All this marriage and this mess. If you want to go live together, go live together, but don't drag everyone else into it. It's, like, before you could just pump your gas, but the thieves ruined it for everyone. Now everyone has to go pay for their gas first. Homosexuals, they want their rights for marriage and all this stuff, and they want respectability. If you want to live that life, live that life, but don't involve the whole rest of the country." Is Rowe concerned about how he comes off in the film? "I'm not really worried about it," he says. "It can't be so bad that I can't survive. No one's coming and trying to eat me." The Scene:[/b] Borat almost stays at a bed-and-breakfast Where:[/b] Though the film suggests the bed-and-breakfast is somewhere between Atlanta and Dallas, it's actually in Newton, Mass. Borat arrives at a bed-and-breakfast only to realize that, to his horror, the kindly owners are ... Jewish. Scared into playing nice, Borat hesitantly takes a bite out of a pastrami and rye sandwich they bring to his bedroom -- then spits it out the minute they turn away. Later that night, convinced that the shape-shifting couple has transformed into a menacing pair of insects, he throws money at them and runs screaming, with his producer Azamat, into the night. What happened:[/b] Mariam and Joseph Behar, the proprietors of the kosher bed-and-breakfast, tell Salon that they rented out three rooms to what they thought was a Kazakh documentarian and his film crew. The location had been scouted and photographed, with the Behars' knowledge, prior to the taping. Speaking on the telephone, Joseph, with Mariam chatting in the background, says they saw the film and thought it "was not anti-Semitic at all. It was outstanding. I think [Sacha Baron Cohen] is a genius." Though Borat never broke character, and no one in the production let the Behars in on the joke, Joseph found Borat to be "very lovely and very polite, very attractive." Joseph says that he first started to have doubts about Borat's authenticity when Borat told him he was going to be married in Malibu. "I know what kind of people live in Malibu," Joseph said, "and I didn't think someone in Malibu would marry this kind of man." Mariam also overheard Borat using Hebrew words (Borat's Kazakh is a mix of gibberish Hebrew and various Eastern European languages). The producers did ask the Behars to bring food to Borat's room -- something not usually done for guests -- though they did not say what kind of food to bring. The Scene:[/b] Borat has an etiquette lesson Where:[/b] Birmingham, Ala. Borat visits etiquette instructor Kathie Martin for advice on appropriate dinner party behavior. Most memorably, Borat regales Martin with Polaroids of his very, very naked, teenage son, which Martin, with preternatural poise, suggests he not show to his fellow dinner party attendees. What happened:[/b] Martin was told by producers that a Kazakh documentarian would like to have a lesson before beginning his travels, so as not to embarrass himself. Martin saw the film on Saturday and told us she found that "certain parts were funny, certain parts were not." She told Newsweek, "I would've liked my 15 minutes of fame in this life to have been for something more worthwhile than an R-rated movie." Her first meeting with Borat was canceled after the crew came to Martin's house and encountered technical difficulties -- but not before Martin had prepared a five-course meal for her guest. As for the naked pictures, Martin, polite as always, remarked, "It helped that I was not wearing my glasses." The Scene:[/b] Borat eats with a Southern dining society Where:[/b] The dinner took place at the Magnolia Springs Manor in Helena, Ala. The Southern plantation home was built in 1875 and currently functions as an event hall. Among many transgressions that night, Borat insults the wife of Mountain Brook Presbyterian Church pastor Cary Speaker; after remarking on how popular two of the women would be in Kazakhstan, Borat gestures at Speaker's wife and says, "not so much." Oh, he also brings a bag of his own excrement to the table after using the bathroom, mistakes a retired fellow diner for being retarded
, and invites a "prostitute" over for company. What happened:[/b] The Birmingham News reports that Borat's dining companions weren't that upset with how they appeared in the film. "All things considered, we got out of this pretty clean," said the retired Mike Jared. "I don't think he made a fool of us," said Cindy Streit, the Birmingham etiquette coach who arranged the dinner. Speaker, who abruptly left the party after the alleged prostitute arrived, says his attitude is "Hey, he fooled us; it's funny. Watching this, I'm sure it's funny [to some people]. It was just not funny that night." He adds that his two college-age sons found his appearance "hysterical." The Scene:[/b] Borat goes for humor lessons Where:[/b] Although the film makes it appear as if Borat's humor lessons took place in New York, he visited with humor coach Pat Haggerty, who lives and works in Washington, D.C. Haggerty instructs Borat to not make jokes about the "retard" brother Borat keeps in a cage, and that perhaps it's not the best idea to tell people about having sex with his mother-in-law. Borat also proves himself to be a quick study when it comes to the subtle timing of the "not" joke -- not! What he said:[/b] Haggerty told the BBC News that about halfway through their session he realized "this guy can't be real." Aware that he was being made to play the straight man, Haggerty continued with the lesson because "they paid me my money and they deserve an hour of my time." According to the same story, the public speaking coach is hoping his appearance in the film will give his career a boost. "The only downside is if I appear to be a fool." The Scene:[/b] Borat talks to the Veteran Feminists of America Where:[/b] New York Borat sits down with three members of the Veteran Feminists of America, informs them that women have smaller brains than men do, and inquires about "Baywatch." He also cajoles one to "listen, pussycat, smile a bit," without much luck. (To view some of the scene, go here.) What happened:[/b] Linda Stein, Grace Welch and Carole De Saram were told by producers that they would be appearing in a documentary to help women in Third World countries. Stein says she has mixed feelings about the incident. She finagled her way into an advance screening of the film and found some parts of the film funny, but thinks "the joke appeals more to men than women." Welch, a yoga instructor, found the whole incident funny. "What he does, he does very well, so I don't feel anger," she told the British Observer. "I was inclined very much to laugh at the event." As a result of the encounter she did go see "Talladega Nights: The Ballad of Ricky Bobby," thinking it was "Borat." "I had to soldier on to watch that," she said. "I don't usually go to those kinds of pictures." Cohen's Borat act was thoroughly convincing. Though Stein threw him out of the interview twice, she readily admits that "at no point during the whole event, as angry as I may have gotten, did it ever occur to me this was a comedian acting." The producer was able to sweet-talk the women into speaking with Borat again after the first heave-ho (the second time around, Borat asked the women to take off their tops). "Please," Stein says the producer begged, "he's from a third-world country, help him. He doesn't know any better." The producer then admonished Borat in a stage whisper, "You can't talk to American women this way." When Stein told Borat that women in America can do anything men can, be president, secretary of state ("Oh, like that chocolate lady?" Borat replied) or even a reporter, Borat argued, "No. I can lift a chair!" At which point he stood up and lifted a chair. Not to be outdone, Stein lifted a chair as well. "I can lift two chairs," Borat countered, lifting two chairs. Stein did the same. And she now takes exception to the omission of this scene from the film. "He didn't choose the segments that really make the point that women are equal and strong. He didn't make the point with sexism that perhaps he did with anti-Semitism and homophobia." The Scene:[/b] Borat learns to drive Where:[/b] Baltimore County, Md. After deciding that he must travel cross-country to meet Pamela Anderson, Borat decides to take driving lessons. Patiently teaching the easily distracted Kazakh is Michael Psenicksa, a driving instructor with 32 years of experience and the owner of his own driving school. During the harrowing car ride, Psenicksa tells Borat that in America, women must give consent for "sexy time." "That's good, huh?" says the instructor. "That's not good for me," Borat replies. What happened:[/b] In an interview with the Baltimore Sun, Psenicksa said his encounter with Borat began in May 2005, when he received a phone call from someone saying his production company was filming a documentary about foreigners learning how to drive. He realized he'd been the victim of a gag after he told his son-in-law about the experience, who said it sounded like a gag from "Da Ali G Show." When Psenicksa saw the show, he recognized his student. While he thought the movie was funny, Psenicksa says he was upset that other drivers were put at risk during the prank. "I'm not happy about that to this day." The Scene:[/b] Borat buys a car The Scene:[/b] Gaithersburg, Md. Borat arrives at a dealership looking to buy a vehicle for somewhere in the range of $600 to $650. Borat asks the salesman, the aptly named Jim Sell, for a "pussy magnet," at which point he's shown a Hummer. After Borat learns that no such actual magnet exists, and that the Hummer is out of his price range, we appear to see Sell arrange for Borat to buy a used ice cream truck. What happened:[/b] "I was approached by a man named Todd Lewis, who said he was a producer for a documentary," says Sell. "They wanted to film him negotiating with me over the price of a vehicle." When Borat arrived, "they kept him away from most people in the dealership. I had no idea who he was. I just thought he didn't know anything about this country." Sell knew something fishy was going on when Borat "gave me a pin and said it was a gift from his country. On one side was a flag, on the other side was a KKK sign." "Luckily, I handled myself OK," says Sell. "I just feel bad I wasted three hours of my time for 150 bucks. And I had nothing to do with selling him an ice cream truck." The Scene:[/b] Borat appears on a small Southern ABC affiliate Where:[/b] Jackson, Miss. Borat wreaks havoc at Jackson's WAPT, standing up every time he spoke, forcing the camera crew to scramble to avoid waist-level shots; offering up his sister to the silver-haired newscaster conducting the interview; interrupting the weatherman during a report by wandering on to the set. What happened:[/b] A story in the Jackson Clarion-Ledger quotes station general manager Stuart Kellogg as saying, "We were gotten. Our folks researched the production company, which has its own Web site and sounds legitimate. They did their homework, but not w
ell enough. It seemed plausible that he was who he said he was," Kellogg said. "Who knows what an accent from Kazakhstan sounds like?" The story also reports that Borat's visit led the station to upgrading its policy on researching guests and on building security. Another story reports that Dharma Arthur, the woman responsible for booking Borat on the show, says she lost her livelihood because of the incident. "I spiraled into depression, and before I could recover, I was released from my contract early. It took me three months to find another job, and now I'm thousands of dollars in debt and struggling to keep my house out of foreclosure. The upsetting thing is that a man who leaves so much harm in his path is lauded as a comic genius." The Scene:[/b] Borat meets a prostitute Where:[/b] Helena, Ala. Borat invites Luenell, a prostitute whose number he found in the back of a newspaper, to the Magnolia Mansion Dining Society, whose members promptly ask them to leave. Borat and Luenell go on to enjoy a night of mechanical bull riding at a local bar. Later, after Borat concludes that things aren't going to work out with Pamela Anderson, he realizes Luenell is the woman for him, marries her, and takes her back to Kazakhstan, where she feeds his whole town with her breast milk. What happened:[/b] Sadly, Luenell Campbell is not a Borat-style "Pretty Woman" but a 37-year-old comedian and actress who has appeared in "So I Married an Axe Murderer" and "The Rock," and is currently on a comedy tour. She's coy about her participation in the film, telling MTV, "I can't tell you about any of the inner workings. I'm sworn to secrecy ... Borat and I go back a long way. We knew each other in Kazakhstan." The Scene:[/b] Borat wrecks an antique store Where:[/b] Adolph Rose Antiques in Vicksburg, Miss. After being convinced that the shop owners are not trying to trick him by selling "old things," Borat destroys a good chunk of the store's merchandise via a series of pratfalls. Borat's offer to help pay for the broken antiques with a bag of pubic hair is, unsurprisingly, turned down. What happened:[/b] Store owner Larry Walker tells us that he was called out of the blue by a producer asking permission to come to his store, in order to film "a Belarussian documentary about life in the South." "I had a funny feeling at first," Walker continues. "But some woman called and seemed nice and convincing, and she sent me stuff on some official-looking letterhead. Then when Borat came, all hell broke loose." Walker, who found that he'd been duped only after a friend saw Borat on the "Today" show, estimates that $500 worth of merchandise was broken during the filming, which lasted about three hours. Still, he says he harbors no ill-will about being featured in the film (the damaged antiques were all paid for, even though the film implies otherwise). "It's a very funny movie. You have to laugh at it now. But at the time, we were just glad to get rid of him." The Scene:[/b] Borat takes a road trip with three frat boys Where:[/b] The film implies that it takes place on a stretch in the Southwest. In fact, it was in South Carolina. Borat gets picked up on the side of the road by three members of the Chi Psi fraternity. David, Justin and Anthony fulfill just about every frat-boy stereotype possible, saying they wished they had slaves, explaining that minorities have all the power, disabusing Borat of the notion that Pamela Anderson is a virgin, and devolving into general drunken boorishness. What happened:[/b] The University of South Carolina chapter of Chi Psi has been expectedly tight-lipped about the incident, which doesn't portray the boys in a particularly positive light. Chapter president Todd Bailey told a Web site that he's not eager to see the film: "Personally, I have no desire to see it, but I have to be aware of what's in the movie." David Corcoran, the most outspoken of the three, spoke with FHM about the experience. "This guy said they were filming a Kazakh reporter who wanted to hang out with frat guys," Corcoran said. "They met 10 of us and I guess chose the three who wouldn't recognize Borat." The producers paid for the three men to drink at a bar, and then had them get in the RV and "pick Borat up ... as if he was hitchhiking." Once in the RV, he says, Borat showed them naked pictures of his sister and confessed to beating women. The Scene:[/b] Borat tries to kidnap Pamela Anderson Where:[/b] Los Angeles A lovelorn Borat finally meets the object of his desire at a Virgin Megastore and attempts to kidnap her by throwing a bag over her head. After she escapes, he then chases the barefoot Anderson into the parking lot, where he is thrown to the ground by two security guards. What happened:[/b] Anderson tells MTV that she has been sworn to secrecy about her involvement with the project, but says, "I love Sacha. He's such a nice guy ... He's the new Monty Python." Despite her silence, it seems more than likely that Anderson was in on the joke. In August 2005, when the film was still shooting, there were suspicious reports of a Malibu beach commitment ceremony between Anderson's two dogs that was interrupted by Borat, who "emerged from the surf astride an inflatable turtle." Borat, the story claimed, "sprinted toward Anderson and felled her with a perfectly executed rugby tackle ... [she] struggled to her feet and brushed sand off of her long white gown as her loyal bodyguards seized the interloper, dragged him back to the shore, and dunked him in the hungry waves." That sounds like an alternative ending that might have just been too implausible to make the final cut. But we're sure it'll wind up in the DVD. -- By David Marchese and Will[/b]
Refresh our memory guzzo - do you work in the industry? It's so easy to forget these things.
I'm not sure if youre joking or not, but yes I work in the industry. Currently I am working as an associate producer on a cheesey red carpet clip show slated to air during awards season (February)
Ms Damn: Thanks for posting that. The article really didn't do much to convince me on the frat boy situation, the tight-lips on the frat boys leads me to think they were in on the shoot.
In the end though it doesn't matter so muc hto me cause my perception of what I watched was that it was staged and therefore I couldn't enjoy the same way I enjoyed the tv show. Whether its real or not is almost secondary to the enjoyment of viewing it.
The article really didn't do much to convince me on the frat boy situation, the tight-lips on the frat boys leads me to think they were in on the shoot.
"Two fraternity boys have filed a lawsuit over their drunken appearance in a hit movie.
The legal action, filed on Thursday on their behalf, claims they were duped into appearing in the spoof documentary Borat: Cultural Learnings Of America For Make Benefit Glorious Nation Of Kazakhstan, in which they made racist and sexist comments on camera.
The young men "engaged in behaviour that they otherwise would not have engaged in," the lawsuit says.
The film follows the adventures of comedian Sacha Baron Cohen's Kazakh journalist character in a blend of fiction and improvised comic encounters as he travels across the United States and mocks Americans.
The plaintiffs were not named in the lawsuit "to protect themselves from any additional and unnecessary embarrassment."
They were identified in the movie as fraternity members from a South Carolina university, and appeared drunk as they made insulting comments about women and minorities to Cohen's character.
The lawsuit claims that in October 2005, a production crew took the students to a bar to drink and "loosen up" before participating in what they were told would be a documentary to be shown outside of the United States.
The film "made plaintiffs the object of ridicule, humiliation, mental anguish and emotional and physical distress, loss of reputation, goodwill and standing in the community," the lawsuit said.
It names 20th Century Fox, a unit of News Corp, and three production companies as defendants.
The plaintiffs were seeking an injunction to stop the studio from displaying their image and likeness, along with unspecified monetary damages."
Just saw this lastnight. As a longtime fan of Borat/Bruno/Ali G, both the British (better) and American (still pretty hilarious) versions of the show, I can say I was thoroughly underwhelmed by this film.
I was hoping for a similar set up to the TV program in which Borat talks to unsuspecting people and grabs real reactions, something about the reactions and situations in this film hoswever made me feel that the characters were plants.
If the situations weren't scripted they were at least produced with a someone telling the characters what to do in this situatin and adlibs being used to get there.
regardless of how much was real and fake, this movie pretty much signals the end of borat. i don't see how he can keep going after this.
Basically...
I agree with the previous poster who said its like Sacha Baron Cohen had forgotten how to do Barat.
I hardy found any off the movie funny, it felt staged and fake. I would recommend anyone to watch all the clips from You tube (from the TV shows) and not bother watching the movie.
A good example of that would be in the bonus section on, I think, the second season of the DVDs. When Borat is hanging out with the Texas hunter in the game farm ... after the hunter shoots an animal, Borat asks him to pretend that he had just killed it with a knife which the guy actually does.
SBC clowns this guy so subtley, so perfectly by getting him to pose with the knife all hunter-style -- after he has just mowed the helpless animal down with a gun. No irony whatsoever from the redneck hunter. A superb Borat clip and better than the entire Borat movie combined.
Side note. Does it seems that Sacha sometimes has trouble keeping it character when confronted with really ignorant people? Watch his glare at the rodeo guy in the movie and his reaction when the hunters talk about Jews on his TV show (see: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZdS8oYbZOg )
Side note. Does it seems that Sacha sometimes has trouble keeping it character when confronted with really ignorant people? Watch his glare at the rodeo guy in the movie and his reaction when the hunters talk about Jews on his TV show (see: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZdS8oYbZOg )
He came over to the US prepared to poke fun at how ignorant Americans are, but I think even he was a little surprised to see how ignorant many Americans are. And yeah, I think it would be hard for any Jew -- experienced actor/comedian or not -- to keep it together when someone says he'd like to kill Jews for sport. I mean, there is almost nothing funny about that conversation if you think about it. The whole joke sorta disappears for a second, and you can see it on his face.
TSASI (6 days ago) I like that old guy. Legalize jew-hunting!
Leeb572 (5 days ago) You gotta admit. The old guy is right.
Wittmann73 (4 days ago) old guy rocks
homeydakine (4 days ago) The old guy is so cool! 9/11 stopped them from bilking money of me! Watch they might try to sue you. They are fucking cockroaches!
Refresh our memory guzzo - do you work in the industry? It's so easy to forget these things.
I'm not sure if youre joking or not, but yes I work in the industry. Currently I am working as an associate producer on a cheesey red carpet clip show slated to air during awards season (February)
Ms Damn: Thanks for posting that. The article really didn't do much to convince me on the frat boy situation, the tight-lips on the frat boys leads me to think they were in on the shoot.
In the end though it doesn't matter so muc hto me cause my perception of what I watched was that it was staged and therefore I couldn't enjoy the same way I enjoyed the tv show. Whether its real or not is almost secondary to the enjoyment of viewing it.
i heard about your cheesy red carpet clip show, and its all fake!
Im not totally sure working for E! really counts as being "in the industry" though. lol.
Borat was great. I assumed alot of it was staged and i still thought it was excellent. Finding out now that alot of it was real makes it a lot more shocking though.
All things considered, pretty fucking damned good for a feature length comedy!
The article really didn't do much to convince me on the frat boy situation, the tight-lips on the frat boys leads me to think they were in on the shoot.
"Two fraternity boys have filed a lawsuit over their drunken appearance in a hit movie.
The legal action, filed on Thursday on their behalf, claims they were duped into appearing in the spoof documentary Borat: Cultural Learnings Of America For Make Benefit Glorious Nation Of Kazakhstan, in which they made racist and sexist comments on camera.
The young men "engaged in behaviour that they otherwise would not have engaged in," the lawsuit says.
The film follows the adventures of comedian Sacha Baron Cohen's Kazakh journalist character in a blend of fiction and improvised comic encounters as he travels across the United States and mocks Americans.
The plaintiffs were not named in the lawsuit "to protect themselves from any additional and unnecessary embarrassment."
They were identified in the movie as fraternity members from a South Carolina university, and appeared drunk as they made insulting comments about women and minorities to Cohen's character.
The lawsuit claims that in October 2005, a production crew took the students to a bar to drink and "loosen up" before participating in what they were told would be a documentary to be shown outside of the United States.
The film "made plaintiffs the object of ridicule, humiliation, mental anguish and emotional and physical distress, loss of reputation, goodwill and standing in the community," the lawsuit said.
It names 20th Century Fox, a unit of News Corp, and three production companies as defendants.
The plaintiffs were seeking an injunction to stop the studio from displaying their image and likeness, along with unspecified monetary damages."
GUZZO, I FEEL YOU NEED TO RESPOND TO THIS POST. IT TAKES A MAN TO ADMIT WHEN HE IS VERY WRONG!
Comments
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/15175836/site/newsweek/
I think this is the point you're trying to make
Maybe that's the problem. You're going into this expecting a typical one dimensional American style reality show.
Have you watched the original program? Well, in the movie they basically tied together a bunch of "Ali G Show" style Borat skits with fictional moments to give everything context.
So, for the viewer at home, Borat is hitchhiking when he gets in the fratboy mobile. But the fratboys were not given the same story as the viewer at home. Obviously, the cameras were in the camper already. So, as it was described elsewhere in this thread, the boys were prepped to be a part of a Kazakhi television show ... and part of that involved allowing cameras to be in their camper and picking up Borat.
You see, there is a whole level of fiction (what the interviewees were told) that the audience is not let in on and vice versa. It runs a whole lot deeper than typical "reality" tv.
I meant "in the theater".
That has to be the first time USA Today ever used "according to FHM..."
If any of the people in this movie could "act" the look of sheer disgust (that was very convincing to me), they might just have a future in Hollywood, or at least some community theater. When Borat brings that sack of poo downstairs at that dinner party, that lady's look was so priceless. Same thing with some of those folks in the hotel. Maybe they knew what was going to happen but, deep down, they weren't prepared for... the wrath of the fat Khazak producer!
I love the show and the obvious shock in the genuine reactinos of his victims. I just didn't see the same type of shock in the people from the film. I'm not saying the entire film was staged, after all I think its far too difficult to find a stadium full of people and tell them theres a joke being played. I just think he chose to use plants instead of real people for many of the situations.
another example would be him walking around the streets of NY without a handheld microphone and picking up the sound of the passers by with incredible clarity.
do you work in the industry? because "typical reality TV" is one of those descriptive terms I've yet to hear in a pitch room. Please enlighten me.
Is it anything like "typical rap music" or "typical poor people"?
No, I don't .. thank God. Please enlighten me with an example of "reality tv" thats actually worth watching. So far, every example I've seen, aside from maybe a few seasons of "Real World" (gotta love Puck) have been utter and complete crap. The fact that its become an "industry" in and of itself is part of the problem ... about as entertaining as all of the America's Funniest Home Videos spinoffs. Maybe a lot of people are "buying", but its soulless crap, IMHO. If you have an example of something that I'm missing, please let me know.
Rap music? Poor people? Eh? Are you trying to put reality tv on some sort of cultural pedestal?
My interpretation is that, because you work in reality tv, you're approaching Borat the same way my highly educated film student friends approach all films. You can't help but try to deconstruct it, figure it out, and basically take the fun out of it. Only, it seems like most of your initial guesses were wrong so, in trying to better understand the film, you took away any possibility of ever actually enjoying it.
Too bad ... it was pretty damned funny.
I suppose, but it just seemed so staged to me.
Like I said this is just one mans opinion of the film. I think the only way I'll actually be convinced is by seeing SBC sitting in a court fighting a case
honestly I don't really watch reality TV, it's not my thing. Outside of what I need to know to do my job well I don't make a habit of watching any of them. It sounds like you are on some "I'm better than that" type steez though so having any discussion on this genre/ cultural phenomenon wouldn't be worth engaging.
actually yes, reality TV is indeed a part of 21st century mainstream culture and theres no way around that. Television is a major medium and reality TV programs have dominated it for nearly 10 years now. There are devout fans of shows, there is a celebrity built around its participants and there are so many more facets of it in American life thats its hard to name them all in a single typed forum response
I am one of those "highly educated film students" and yes I can pick apart many a film but whats the point of doing it unless I am being tested or I need to learn a certain element for a project I'm working on?
I went into this film with some friends completely baked and ready to turn my mind off for an hour and half. I was hoping for a similar set up to the TV program in which Borat talks to unsuspecting people and grabs real reactions, something about the reactions and situations in this film hoswever made me feel that the characters were plants.
If the situations weren't scripted they were at least produced with a someone telling the characters what to do in this situatin and adlibs being used to get there.
I didn't intend that tone and I apologize. I got a bit peeved at the "rap music", "poor people" comment as I wouldn't put reality tv (the "plight" of or the cultural significance of) in the same arena as discussions about hip hop or poverty ... so that put me on the defensive.
I do get discouraged at what has been done with the genre of reality tv ... enough to just dismiss it all to some degree. I guess, the fact that it has become a genre may be the problem in my eyes. When "The Real World" was released, reality tv itself was a novelty. It had been done ... what was the first example in the 70s, "The Family" or something? But the very idea of it was fresh and new. Now, to hear about it referred to as an "industry". People sit around tables and discuss the next big idea in "reality tv". The concept itself just isn't clever anymore.
When something clever comes along like Ali G/Borat, though, I appreciate it greatly. And perhaps adapting it to a film was too much for some people. I think what is difficult to see when watching the film is the levels of reality going on. We weren't told what the fratboys were told. However, that doesn't mean that the fratboys were "in on the joke" to the extent that they knew Borat was actually Sacha Baron Cohen. I don't think that he crossed that line at all in the movie. In fact, he never left character during the filming. So I think to see the mics and to immediately dismiss the scene as fraud is jumping the gun a bit.
you gonna be in LA?
god doesn't want me in San Diego
I think the lesson learned for me is that I can take Borat in small doses. The fact that it was shot in a documentary/ mockumentary style yet the audience isn't let in on what the characters (the fratboys) know makes it seem less genuine than perhaps it was supposed to be.
Those fratboys were coached in someway if they were not actual actors, which takes away from the feel of it being real. They knew they were recieving Borat on the RV and they knew he was going to play a Pam anderson porn. The surprise that usually generates a laugh from me simply wasn't there.
as for reality TV it's really not designed in the most part to be smart (or dumb for that matter) it's pretty much designed to be cheap and easy to produce. It's massive popularity was a bit of a surprise and it initially started airing due to a potential writers strike in '99. The funny thing is there are very few reality shows I see now that don't have a writer or a writing team.
A good example of that would be in the bonus section on, I think, the second season of the DVDs. When Borat is hanging out with the Texas hunter in the game farm ... after the hunter shoots an animal, Borat asks him to pretend that he had just killed it with a knife which the guy actually does.
I guess the difference there would be that the audience is in on both levels of reality so it doesn't seem fake ... or at least we're told about the fake parts. In the movie, the audience is supposed to, perhaps, believe that Borat is actually hitchhiking.
Well ... I now actually just better understand your point.
Anyway a few months ago Funky Mimizu recommends that I watch a few Borat links off Youtube. Reluctantly I watch them and you know what I thought they where great, spent a good few hours watching that stuff.
So today I want to see the movie and I was really disappointed with it. I agree with the previous poster who said its like Sacha Baron Cohen had forgotten how to do Barat.
I hardy found any off the movie funny, it felt staged and fake.
I would recommend anyone to watch all the clips from You tube (from the TV shows) and not bother watching the movie.
- spidey
Refresh our memory guzzo - do you work in the industry? It's so easy to forget these things.
I'm not sure if youre joking or not, but yes I work in the industry. Currently I am working as an associate producer on a cheesey red carpet clip show slated to air during awards season (February)
Ms Damn: Thanks for posting that. The article really didn't do much to convince me on the frat boy situation, the tight-lips on the frat boys leads me to think they were in on the shoot.
In the end though it doesn't matter so muc hto me cause my perception of what I watched was that it was staged and therefore I couldn't enjoy the same way I enjoyed the tv show. Whether its real or not is almost secondary to the enjoyment of viewing it.
"Two fraternity boys have filed a lawsuit over their drunken appearance in a hit movie.
The legal action, filed on Thursday on their behalf, claims they were duped into appearing in the spoof documentary Borat: Cultural Learnings Of America For Make Benefit Glorious Nation Of Kazakhstan, in which they made racist and sexist comments on camera.
The young men "engaged in behaviour that they otherwise would not have engaged in," the lawsuit says.
The film follows the adventures of comedian Sacha Baron Cohen's Kazakh journalist character in a blend of fiction and improvised comic encounters as he travels across the United States and mocks Americans.
The plaintiffs were not named in the lawsuit "to protect themselves from any additional and unnecessary embarrassment."
They were identified in the movie as fraternity members from a South Carolina university, and appeared drunk as they made insulting comments about women and minorities to Cohen's character.
The lawsuit claims that in October 2005, a production crew took the students to a bar to drink and "loosen up" before participating in what they were told would be a documentary to be shown outside of the United States.
The film "made plaintiffs the object of ridicule, humiliation, mental anguish and emotional and physical distress, loss of reputation, goodwill and standing in the community," the lawsuit said.
It names 20th Century Fox, a unit of News Corp, and three production companies as defendants.
The plaintiffs were seeking an injunction to stop the studio from displaying their image and likeness, along with unspecified monetary damages."
Basically...
SBC clowns this guy so subtley, so perfectly by getting him to pose with the knife all hunter-style -- after he has just mowed the helpless animal down with a gun. No irony whatsoever from the redneck hunter. A superb Borat clip and better than the entire Borat movie combined.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZdS8oYbZOg )
He came over to the US prepared to poke fun at how ignorant Americans are, but I think even he was a little surprised to see how ignorant many Americans are. And yeah, I think it would be hard for any Jew -- experienced actor/comedian or not -- to keep it together when someone says he'd like to kill Jews for sport. I mean, there is almost nothing funny about that conversation if you think about it. The whole joke sorta disappears for a second, and you can see it on his face.
TSASI (6 days ago)
I like that old guy. Legalize jew-hunting!
Leeb572 (5 days ago)
You gotta admit. The old guy is right.
Wittmann73 (4 days ago)
old guy rocks
homeydakine (4 days ago)
The old guy is so cool! 9/11 stopped them from bilking money of me! Watch they might try to sue you.
They are fucking cockroaches!
i heard about your cheesy red carpet clip show, and its all fake!
Im not totally sure working for E! really counts as being "in the industry" though. lol.
Borat was great. I assumed alot of it was staged and i still thought it was excellent. Finding out now that alot of it was real makes it a lot more shocking though.
All things considered, pretty fucking damned good for a feature length comedy!
GUZZO, I FEEL YOU NEED TO RESPOND TO THIS POST.
IT TAKES A MAN TO ADMIT WHEN HE IS VERY WRONG!