I'm really interested in knowing what world perception is of the events, both the storm and the tragedy of how it was handled.
As an American in London, most people seemed thrown off that that sort of poverty/ extreme negligence exists. The general perception abroad seems to be that most Americans live cushy lives while their govt wages wars. They don't realize that many Americans struggle to survive. When I explain to folks that Bmore, Detroit, etc are arguably as destitute as New Orleans was, and that they'd likely be ignored just the same (i.e. that this isn't an isolated incident) people seem genuinely surprised.
You've got to remember that Hollywood forms 90 something % of perception of what the American lifestyle is about- image wise. Shit, I was still in the states when Katrina hit and I remember thinking that sort of poverty is rarely acknowledged on CNN etc even inside the states.
DocMcCoy"Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,913 Posts
I'm really interested in knowing what world perception is of the events, both the storm and the tragedy of how it was handled.
As an American in London, most people seemed thrown off that that sort of poverty/ extreme negligence exists. The general perception abroad seems to be that most Americans live cushy lives while their govt wages wars. They don't realize that many Americans struggle to survive. When I explain to folks that Bmore, Detroit, etc are arguably as destitute as New Orleans was, and that they'd likely be ignored just the same (i.e. that this isn't an isolated incident) people seem genuinely surprised.
You've got to remember that Hollywood forms 90 something % of perception of what the American lifestyle is about- image wise. Shit, I was still in the states when Katrina hit and I remember thinking that sort of poverty is rarely acknowledged on CNN etc even inside the states.
Speaking as an adopted Londoner myself, the issue of poverty and negligence wasn't a major revelation - that kind of shit exists everywhere. What was new, and horrifying, to me was seeing one of the most famous cities in the richest, most powerful country in the world looking no different from any of those areas in so-called third world countries that we've seen time and again on the news after they've been blitzed by a hurricane or something. That, and the lack of a swift response at the highest level, where they seemed more concerned with covering their arses and passing the buck. I remember saying at the time how I kept hearing from right-wingers that the structure of government in the US somehow prevented Bush from acting quickly - how true is this, really? For example, if something like Katrina had happened in Sheffield, an English city about the same size as NOLA, I wouldn't expect Tony Blair to say, "well, I can't really send in the emergency services just yet, because the local council haven't formally asked me to. And I don't want to accept any offers of outside aid until I've figured out what I'm going to do" (which was effectively what Dubya was doing). If he had, the call for him to resign would have been deafening. I mean, you either run the country, or you don't. If the former, then you surely have the power to override federal/state/local government protocols in a time of national emergency. If you don't have the political will to do that, then what the fuck use are you, and oughtn't you just pack your bags and fuck off back to Crawford?
I'm really interested in knowing what world perception is of the events, both the storm and the tragedy of how it was handled.
As an American in London, most people seemed thrown off that that sort of poverty/ extreme negligence exists. The general perception abroad seems to be that most Americans live cushy lives while their govt wages wars. They don't realize that many Americans struggle to survive. When I explain to folks that Bmore, Detroit, etc are arguably as destitute as New Orleans was, and that they'd likely be ignored just the same (i.e. that this isn't an isolated incident) people seem genuinely surprised.
You've got to remember that Hollywood forms 90 something % of perception of what the American lifestyle is about- image wise. Shit, I was still in the states when Katrina hit and I remember thinking that sort of poverty is rarely acknowledged on CNN etc even inside the states.
Speaking as an adopted Londoner myself, the issue of poverty and negligence wasn't a major revelation - that kind of shit exists everywhere. What was new to me was seeing one of the most famous cities in the richest, most powerful country in the world looking no different from any of those areas in so-called third world countries that we've seen time and again on the news after they've been blitzed by a hurricane or something. That, and the lack of a swift response at the highest level, where they seemed more concerned with covering their arses and passing the buck. I remember saying at the time how I kept hearing from right-wingers that the structure of government in the US somehow prevented Bush from acting quickly - how true is this, really? For example, if something like Katrina had happened in Sheffield, an English city about the same size as NOLA, I wouldn't expect Tony Blair to say, "well, I can't really send in the emergency services just yet, because the local council haven't formally asked me to. And I don't want to accept any offers of outside aid until I've figured out what I'm going to do" (which was effectively what Dubya was doing). If he had, the call for him to resign would have been deafening. I mean, you either run the country, or you don't. If the former, then you surely have the power to override federal/state/local government protocols in a time of national emergency. If you don't have the political will to do that, then what the fuck use are you, and oughtn't you just pack your bags and fuck off back to Crawford?
CHURCH.
Every American should be angered, saddened, and embarassed by this.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
Film surprisingly accurate Lauren Oddo of Frederick, MD, 21701, writes:
My son and I watched the first two acts last night. We own a home in the heart of Chalmette but were forced to move after the storm. I was all set to disagree with every biased, racially motivated statement made in the documentary, but was impressed by the accuracy of the film. I was glad to see all the different views portrayed, and angry and upset about the slow response of FEMA and the out-of-touch comments made by Michael Brown. This documentary should be studied by FEMA and the Department of Homeland Security as an example of what should never happen again. The most surprising statement of last night? When Junior Rodriguez said that the Canadian Mounties got to his office in St. Bernard Parish to help out before our federal government did. Was it a racist film? No. Both blacks and whites were stranded and are both still in the situation of begging for help to rebuild. Did it show how out of touch our federal government was with the situation? You bet. Thank you, Mr. Lee, for telling our story.
Storm did not discriminate Matthew Johnson of New Orleans, LA, 70124, writes:
I wasn't sure what to think going into the TV show. It, of course, made me mad and showed the haunting images, but it was incomplete and thus earns the status of a TV show. Lee might have interviewed people from Uptown, but like every single other person not from New Orleans, he portrays the real loss only in the poor black areas. Certainly anyone with access to Google.com can pull the statistics from the storm regarding loss of life/property and see that this storm did not discriminate. I think it's irresponsible to tell a one-sided story about a storm that took no sides. New Orleanians were devastated, let down and humiliated. We don't need another carpetbagger[/b] down here telling us what we already know and trying to create even more tension.
Lee doing his job Angela Howard of Kenner, LA, 70065, writes:
I don't understand why people say that this documentary is racist. Spike Lee did exactly what he was suppose to do, and that is let others tell their story. It wasn't him, it was the people speaking their mind. I personally didn't see any racism. I felt that what I was hearing was what different people experienced and went through. I am one of those people who stayed during the storm at the Orleans Parish Prison. Watching this made me realize how lucky I was compared to others, even though I was not in the best situation. I really was one of the lucky ones. This documentary needed to be filmed so that people across the nation could finally see and hear what people of New Orleans went through.
So far, so good Lennix Rogers of New Orleans, LA, 70131, writes:
So far the documentary was an unbiased portrayal of a preventable situation gone wrong and massed by bureaucratic neglect.
Truth tough to swallow for some Deidra Bias of Tuscaloosa, AL, 35405, writes:
I am a native of New Orleans now living in Alabama. What Spike Lee did was tell the truth. A lot of people can't handle the truth or don't want to admit the truth, even if it is staring them in the face. We all know what happen during and after Katrina, and we know that all involved could have handle it better. Lee just unveiled the truth of the most dreadful days that a lot of people had to endure. Those who did not like what Lee did: Do your own documentary and lets see if it will be any different.
I remember saying at the time how I kept hearing from right-wingers that the structure of government in the US somehow prevented Bush from acting quickly - how true is this, really?
If there was a structural problem it was that this administration has eviscerated the domestic agencies that should have been responding, appointed political hacks to head them, and further shipped people/resources overseas.
There's nothing inherent in U.S. government that prevented it from taking more decisive action.
Speaking as an adopted Londoner myself, the issue of poverty and negligence wasn't a major revelation - that kind of shit exists everywhere. What was new, and horrifying, to me was seeing one of the most famous cities in the richest, most powerful country in the world looking no different from any of those areas in so-called third world countries that we've seen time and again on the news after they've been blitzed by a hurricane or something. That, and the lack of a swift response at the highest level, where they seemed more concerned with covering their arses and passing the buck. I remember saying at the time how I kept hearing from right-wingers that the structure of government in the US somehow prevented Bush from acting quickly - how true is this, really? For example, if something like Katrina had happened in Sheffield, an English city about the same size as NOLA, I wouldn't expect Tony Blair to say, "well, I can't really send in the emergency services just yet, because the local council haven't formally asked me to. And I don't want to accept any offers of outside aid until I've figured out what I'm going to do" (which was effectively what Dubya was doing). If he had, the call for him to resign would have been deafening. I mean, you either run the country, or you don't. If the former, then you surely have the power to override federal/state/local government protocols in a time of national emergency. If you don't have the political will to do that, then what the fuck use are you, and oughtn't you just pack your bags and fuck off back to Crawford?
What's ridiculous about the argument that "bureaucracy" got in the way of Bush's helping people in the wake of Katrina is that most legal analysts would agree that the Bush administration has 'interpreted' the powers of the executive branch more widely than any administration before it. Meaning when they want something, they feel less of a need to run it by congress or to consult the courts. "bureaucracy" wasn't an issue when they wanted free reign wiretapping phones, for example.
Of course Americans have voted for right wingers that cut state and social programs for decades, politicians found an attractive language for it, and folks bought it. Meanwhile infrastructure rots.Then, when Katrina hit and they saw the reality of the situation they were horrified..
If there was a structural problem it was that this administration has eviscerated the domestic agencies that should have been responding, appointed political hacks to head them, and further shipped people/resources overseas.
There's nothing inherent in U.S. government that prevented it from taking more decisive action. and yes[/b]
Meanwhile infrastructure rots
also,
while i was much more affected (emotionally) by parts 1&2 of the documentary, i was truly dumbfounded to see the levels of inefficiency within our own infrastructure/system that were depicted in the 2nd half of the film.
-the comparison to the netherlands and the dutch levy system was disheartining. -the insurance company segmant only anchored the feeling for what apparently is a total loss of humanity for those citizens of NOLA/Mississippi.
but the issue i find most disheartening is whether or not any elected official/sub-contractor/agency will ever recieve more than condemnation for their actions (or lack there of). Corp of Engineering my take blame, but in the end, they are the same ones rebuilding the levies. Nagin was re-elected, and dispite what some say (as far as the loathing of the Bush administration), i would not be surprised if a republican presidential nominee carried the state in '08.
The question i kept finding myself asking as i watched the documentary is if we as citizens really have no power over our own government anymore? are we that feeble minded to continue to allow those in positions of power put us in such dangerous situations? whether it be the military complex (shout to IKE) or an endless mile of red tape, it seems like we just continue to take the shit we are given. and i am not absolving myself of blame in that comment.
i don't know man...Katrina and the like really suggest that our democratic government (for the people and by the people) is a misnomer.
Ditto on the Dutch system... it's like... fuck. We could have that, but we don't. We have wars and tax cuts and Enron.
You know what fucking made me fucking sick? I watched the shit last night (please excuse the anger, I missed the first two segments so this is very ) and this morning (NOT 12 HOURS LATER) there's a State Farm commercial about how much they're helping Katrina victims. DISGUSTING.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
I was glad to hear Harry "Swamp Thang" Cook of the Hot 8 Brass Band confirming that for many of us who grew up in New Orleans that the immanent destruction of the city by hurricane has long been an accepted given.
Also, Garland Robinette provided some serious "right on" moments.
Comments
I believe they said it would be up on Wednesday, 8/30
As an American in London, most people seemed thrown off that that sort of poverty/ extreme negligence exists. The general perception abroad seems to be that most Americans live cushy lives while their govt wages wars. They don't realize that many Americans struggle to survive. When I explain to folks that Bmore, Detroit, etc are arguably as destitute as New Orleans was, and that they'd likely be ignored just the same (i.e. that this isn't an isolated incident) people seem genuinely surprised.
You've got to remember that Hollywood forms 90 something % of perception of what the American lifestyle is about- image wise. Shit, I was still in the states when Katrina hit and I remember thinking that sort of poverty is rarely acknowledged on CNN etc even inside the states.
Speaking as an adopted Londoner myself, the issue of poverty and negligence wasn't a major revelation - that kind of shit exists everywhere. What was new, and horrifying, to me was seeing one of the most famous cities in the richest, most powerful country in the world looking no different from any of those areas in so-called third world countries that we've seen time and again on the news after they've been blitzed by a hurricane or something. That, and the lack of a swift response at the highest level, where they seemed more concerned with covering their arses and passing the buck. I remember saying at the time how I kept hearing from right-wingers that the structure of government in the US somehow prevented Bush from acting quickly - how true is this, really? For example, if something like Katrina had happened in Sheffield, an English city about the same size as NOLA, I wouldn't expect Tony Blair to say, "well, I can't really send in the emergency services just yet, because the local council haven't formally asked me to. And I don't want to accept any offers of outside aid until I've figured out what I'm going to do" (which was effectively what Dubya was doing). If he had, the call for him to resign would have been deafening. I mean, you either run the country, or you don't. If the former, then you surely have the power to override federal/state/local government protocols in a time of national emergency. If you don't have the political will to do that, then what the fuck use are you, and oughtn't you just pack your bags and fuck off back to Crawford?
CHURCH.
Every American should be angered, saddened, and embarassed by this.
If there was a structural problem it was that this administration has eviscerated the domestic agencies that should have been responding, appointed political hacks to head them, and further shipped people/resources overseas.
There's nothing inherent in U.S. government that prevented it from taking more decisive action.
What's ridiculous about the argument that "bureaucracy" got in the way of Bush's helping people in the wake of Katrina is that most legal analysts would agree that the Bush administration has 'interpreted' the powers of the executive branch more widely than any administration before it. Meaning when they want something, they feel less of a need to run it by congress or to consult the courts. "bureaucracy" wasn't an issue when they wanted free reign wiretapping phones, for example.
Of course Americans have voted for right wingers that cut state and social programs for decades, politicians found an attractive language for it, and folks bought it. Meanwhile infrastructure rots.Then, when Katrina hit and they saw the reality of the situation they were horrified..
If there was a structural problem it was that this administration has eviscerated the domestic agencies that should have been responding, appointed political hacks to head them, and further shipped people/resources overseas.
There's nothing inherent in U.S. government that prevented it from taking more decisive action.
and yes[/b]
Meanwhile infrastructure rots
also,
while i was much more affected (emotionally) by parts 1&2 of the documentary, i was truly dumbfounded to see the levels of inefficiency within our own infrastructure/system that were depicted in the 2nd half of the film.
-the comparison to the netherlands and the dutch levy system was disheartining.
-the insurance company segmant only anchored the feeling for what apparently is a total loss of humanity for those citizens of NOLA/Mississippi.
but the issue i find most disheartening is whether or not any elected official/sub-contractor/agency will ever recieve more than condemnation for their actions (or lack there of). Corp of Engineering my take blame, but in the end, they are the same ones rebuilding the levies. Nagin was re-elected, and dispite what some say (as far as the loathing of the Bush administration), i would not be surprised if a republican presidential nominee carried the state in '08.
The question i kept finding myself asking as i watched the documentary is if we as citizens really have no power over our own government anymore? are we that feeble minded to continue to allow those in positions of power put us in such dangerous situations? whether it be the military complex (shout to IKE) or an endless mile of red tape, it seems like we just continue to take the shit we are given. and i am not absolving myself of blame in that comment.
i don't know man...Katrina and the like really suggest that our democratic government (for the people and by the people) is a misnomer.
You know what fucking made me fucking sick? I watched the shit last night (please excuse the anger, I missed the first two segments so this is very
Also, Garland Robinette provided some serious "right on" moments.