Allman or Hendrix?
batmon
27,574 Posts
I know this might sound counterintuitive.We all know Hendrix was a sonic innovator,but Duane Allman was a beatiful guitarist as well.If Irnie Isley is one of Hendrix's true disciples and Allman'slist being much longer,who's influence on music do we see most today.This is my Co-worker's question.
Comments
Tell your coworker that Hendrix's list is plenty long, starting of course with Robin Trower, Stevie Ray Vaughan, and Frank Marino (who claimed to be posessed by Jimi's departed spirit) among others.
Of course you can blame Bo Bice on the Allman Brothers and their ilk...
Wow, good one.
I think because of the exposure Jimi Hendrix had, it would be easy to say that he had the biggest influence. However, his techniques were arguably his own, so whether it was Stevie Ray Vaughan or some of those Udo German guys with bandanas, his influence may be more seen than heard. Hendrix was a huge influence on Eddie Hazel, and we wouldn't have his output without that.
You also have Duane Allman. Music heads know him as a great session guitarist and of course being one of the Allman Brothers, but he did not get a chance to put himself out like a Hendrix or Eric Clapton (although according to the liner notes in The Duane Allman Anthology[/b], the people at Atlantic wanted him to try his own tracks, so I am sure some grooming was in the works). His guitar work in "Layla" is what a lot of people know, but listen to him in the live version of "Whipping Post" on The Allman Brothers At Fillmore East[/b] and the song they played right after, "Mountain Jam" (which is on Eat A Peach[/b]. Allman and Dickey Betts could not be fucked with. You have a lot of rock guitarists who loved what Allman was able to do, not just with the slide guitar, but just ripping into the electric blues the way he did. Then add to that all of the country guitarists who wanted to break out of sitting down and playing slide. Listen to a lot of Southern rock, hell, just listen to anything Lynyrd Skynyrd did before the accident. Allman's influence is all over that album.
Move a few years later to people like Steve Vai. Learned from Joe Satriani, and became Frank Zappa's "stunt guitarist". He has the technicality of a Hendrix, but with the theatrics of Keith Moon. He can play weird, he can play beautiful.
I can see this becoming a bit of the whole Page vs. Clapton vs. Beck debate, or James Brown vs. Eddie Bo, or anything else. It is too easy to fall into that trap, and really, how can you estimate influence? I'm not a guitarist, I can play maybe one song on a guitar and that's it. But Hendrix is one of my favorite guitarists, to be able to see and hear him develop his sound into what he would do with the Experience, it's an amazing story. But you also have these two blonde kids from Florida who loved soul music and the blues, who then decided to move to Macon, Georgia and play more music. Mix that with those two albino brothers from Texas (Johnny and Edgar Winter), and you have some of the best music out there, period.
Hendrix and Allman both died young at times when they were at their peak, musically and commercially. Hendrix was mellowing out and who knows what kind of music he would have ended up doing between 1971-1974. Allman died at the point when the rest of the country (and the world) were finding out about him and his band. Allman still has the kind of praise that Jimmy Page still gets, and the Allman Brothers Band were ruthless with what and how they played, not unlike the appoach Page and LZ did with the blues. Without Allman, the Allman Brothers Band would have their biggest hit with "Ramblin' Man". After Hendrix, a thousand other guitar heroes came to be, some alright, some eh. Both guitarists provided the essence of what was "cool", because they made it sound easy. The fact that both are discussed today, 34 (Allman) and 35 (Hendrix) years after their deaths, shows their influence.
We are not discussing fashion,race,record sales,or bandmates.
I dont care what were discussing. Hendrix wins.
WHatever. Who the hell is that other dude anyway?
CO-SIGN B! Jimi is from Seattle, ya'll folls better recognize!
Add this to Hendrix' vast legacy in guitar, blues, rock, pop, and i'd have to go with Jimi. Still, why choose one? Duane is also highly influential- in southern rock, blues-rock, 'jam-rock', and was a truly great one as well.
Hendrix is my man, but alot of cats try to mimic him to no avail.
Whereas there are other cats in the southern rock tradition who dont reference
Jimi,but are still nice with the axe.
hendrix still wins.
'eat a peach' and 'fillmore east' are exercises in musical truth that can exist on par with Hendrix's best LPs. 'Layla' is almost on that level altho i guess that ones a bit more open to argument. Then look at Allman's session work. Wilson Pickett, Aretha, King Curtis
i mean, i did pick Hendrix, but there's NO WAY Duane Allman could just be 'that other dude'
haha Im just kidding, I know who he is. But next to hendrix, hes most definitely 'that other dude'.
Exactly, and I am sure at times it's still all about race, at least with older musicians. I do know of some of the younger, jamband-styled bands who are more than willing to say they love Hendrix as much as Allman, or Zappa.
As for those who have said that Allman will always be "the other guy", as shitty as that sounds, it's correct. Allman will always be the guy who played on Wilson Pickett's "Hey Jude", or the other guy who played on "Layla", or that guy who played on Aretha Franklin's "The Weight". But the truth of the matter is, before his death, he was known for being on those records. Granted, maybe it was the need to shape him as a "guitar hero", but he was very humble. It got to a point where he wanted to stop doing session work (he did it simply to raise funds for the Allman Brothers to record their first album, which was with Tom Dowd).
Yet ask anyone who knows about blues-influenced guitarists, and Allman is up there.
Go hunt down the quadraphonic mix of The Allman Brothers At Fillmore East[/b] (there is also a DTS Music disc which was mastered from the quad masters, I can direct people to a torrent if anyone is interested), and that's some chicken skin shit right there.
I only mention this because I've been getting into his music in the last few months, trying to find anything and everything he's played on. I don't want to pick sides, but I have been a Hendrix fan for much longer.
it would be like "Coltrane or Shorter?" "Tony Williams or Joe Chambers?" yes the person the master is compared to is very very good, but miles and miles apart in the big picture.
as far as influence Jimi, Jimi, Jimi....every dude that stomps on a pedal, or lets the feedback ring has Jimi to thank.
I disagree here though.
you really dont think Trane is better and more influential than Wayne?
Tony might be the most innovative and amazing drummer of all time, I cant think of anyone with a combination of sick ass technique and mind blowing imagination like Tony...
ahh I see now, I got my names backwards in the comparisons, my bad
the Tony vs. Joe Chambers comparison is your most tenuous. Tony was a badass no doubt and a prodigy to boot. But he pretty much had one dynamic level: LOUD. and this isn't my own original opinion- i've read it and heard it from the mouths of the great wise elder musicians. Tony's brush skills?
Chambers is really complete. An excellent pianist and phenomenal composer as well as a great drummer.
Jimi is so nice but cats cant clone him. He is a genre to his own; "sui generis".
Allman's style is much more easily intergrated with other players.
No, I was saying the comparisons weren't quite fair when comparing Hendrix to Allman. In other words, I don't want to compare. Both were great guitarists, and I feel that both were great for what they've done. It is very easy to pick sides, but that goes back to intermediate school for me, like Ozzy vs. Dio or something.
As I said in another reply, I have been a Hendrix fan for much longer than I have with Allman. If forced, then I would pick Hendrix. But Hendrix was in his own world. Jimmy Page vs. Gregg Allman, that's a bit more fair.
Eh, I'm merely posting for the sake of posting. What's going on with you?
all I know is that the Miles live LPs "four and more" and "my funny valentine" has some of the most mindblowing jazz drumming I have ever heard...it is like his left and right hands and left and right feet were four seperate people, as much as I love Joe(especially on the Hutcherson jernts), I have never heard Joe come close to that drumming-wise.
and on the influence tip...While Ornette was taking the harmonic and melodic elements of Jazz out and making them free, Tony was doing the same thing with time and rhythm, I feel he is way overlooked when it comes to the pioneers of "free" jazz, although he wasnt waving the the "free" flag when he was developing his innovations, he was certainly the most skilled "free" drummer of the early 60s IMO. I hear a lot of Tony in the more out there drummers of the mid to late 60s.
I know ,that is why I edited my post..like I stated above, every guitarist that stomps on a pedal, uses feedback(damn near every rock guitarists in the last 30 years, I know... Small Faces, Velvets, Kinks, etc. did it first, but Jimi made it music)and tries to shape sound with the insturment has Jimi to thank.
Cool thanks..
For all intents and purposes, Hendrix had the biggest influence, and not just on music. Anytime a black musician does something other than the norm, or even if he plays a guitar, the Hendrix comparison is automatic. Prince was "the new Hendrix", but read interviews and he'll say his biggest influence was Carlos Santana.
When people think of the late 1960's, Hendrix and his "wild ways" often comes to mind.
Obviously, Hendrix is a household name. Allman is not.
But, I hope people don't hesitate to listen to Allman's work just because his so-called legacy is more low-key, or that he's just another white guy, one out of millions. His guitar work was very powerful, whether he did session work, whether it was with the Allman Joys or with the Allman Brothers Band. He didn't just rub a bottle on the strings and say "ooh, trippy". It had a lot of character, and it fit in with whatever the song was.
The Allman Brothers Band now has Derek Trucks and Warren Haynes, and Haynes is well known for being in Gov't Mule (which I have since learned was a name which came from after someone looked at one of James Brown's wife's ass).
Who is doing Allman now?
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Who is doing Jackson Pollock now?
Who is doing Willem de Kooning now?
Who is doing Jean-Michael Basquiat?
Who is doing Andy Warhol?
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Get My Drift? The more apllicable forms of art get utilized more often.
How much Burn does Ernie Isley really get with The Brothers.
Hendrix's guitar style is extraterrestrial making cats borrow bits and pieces,
but never fully getting it.
Fortunately no one.
dudes mastery of the studio / production techniques IS the cornerstone on which most modern rock records are based.
His session legacy is RETARDED
mastery of idioms from Folk, middle eastern, pop and basically DEFINING hard rock, metal.
his ability to switch it up between accoustic finger picking alternate tunings to full throtle destortion
and doing all within the context of an actual band not just as a solo dude or some jam band puts him MILES ahead.