Honesty is such a strange thing to hear from someone in politics. At first I wasn't totally sure that this was a real interview. I've researched it and determined that Nagin is obviously the shit.
We live in a highly reactive society and seldom give proactive/preventative measures much thought. This guy is right on target by GOING OFF like this. The only thing that these wanksters that we call leaders can do is now REACT to Nagin's comments for fear of looking bad during the middle of a national catastrophe (too late).
Nagin will have the ear of the nation for the next few weeks. I will be interested to hear what other things he has to say. I will vote for him...
Uh, I hate to say it but while I don't agree with all of Sabadaba's comments, he's not a raving lunie on this one.
1) Nagin gets mega props from me for REAL TALK but politically speaking, I don't think he's pulled an Obama. He's probably commiting political suicide outside mayorhood and I respect that he doesn't seem to give a fuck. People forget that what Americans want is not real talk. They want the "it's all fine" bullshit that most Presidents since forever have shoveled, especially Bush, who is the king of "I understand there is pain out there (but I just don't care)".
2) To me, there are still some questions I haven't heard addressed yet. Like - could Nagin have done more to get people out of the city? It's not ALL on him. Of course, the state and federal agencies had a role to play. But as mayor, what was within his power and what wasn't?
I also think it's a bit problematic to note the rampant drug problem in your own city without taking responsiblity for it at the same time. I do not doubt he's been hamstrung to fight it but if he's the mayor of New Orleans and NOLA has a huge drug problem, doesn't the buck kind of stop at his doorstep? That's a VERY fair question to ask.
3) Just to reiterate - I thought his comments were refreshing and necessary and I hope to hear more candor. But straight up - NOBODY is innocent in any of this. I don't care if you're DNC or GOP or what the fuck ever: a lot of MFers blew this and blew it bad.
just kidding...o, i agree with all your points. i think people would have fine with a dissenting voice, even if argumentative...but sabdadba wasnt argumentative, he was obnoxious, trying to get a rise out of people. shit, i still dont mind letting him talk into the wind and being as obnoxious as he wants. but if he really wanted to have the board here what he had to say, he needs to work on his social skills.
Blaming a mayor for a cities drug problem seems a little ridiculous, especially a huge city like New Orleans. Find me one major city in the US without drug addicts, and I'll find you a mayor that can control a major cities drug problems.
Blaming a mayor for a cities drug problem seems a little ridiculous, especially a huge city like New Orleans. Find me one major city in the US without drug addicts, and I'll find you a mayor that can control a major cities drug problems.
I don't disagree with the sentiment but I'm saying - if you're the mayor, this is the kind of thing you have to, on some level, take responsibility for *even if it's a losing proposition and everyone knows it*. More to the point, he was suggestnig that NOLA has a severe drug problem above and beyond other cities.
The point here is that while I thought the mayor had some powerful things to say, it doesn't obviate him from responsiblity that he may share in this. I can't say that for certain because I don't know the scope of what he could have done but I think it's a *fair question to ask* before we start slapping dude on the back and trying to get him to run for the Presidency in 2008 with Barak.
As far as I'm concerned, NO public officials look good in this right now and while I'm down to give Nagin a big up for frank talk, I don't think he deserves a free pass for it either.
Blaming a mayor for a cities drug problem seems a little ridiculous, especially a huge city like New Orleans. Find me one major city in the US without drug addicts, and I'll find you a mayor that can control a major cities drug problems.
I don't disagree with the sentiment but I'm saying - if you're the mayor, this is the kind of thing you have to, on some level, take responsibility for *even if it's a losing proposition and everyone knows it*. More to the point, he was suggestnig that NOLA has a severe drug problem above and beyond other cities.
The point here is that while I thought the mayor had some powerful things to say, it doesn't obviate him from responsiblity that he may share in this. I can't say that for certain because I don't know the scope of what he could have done but I think it's a *fair question to ask* before we start slapping dude on the back and trying to get him to run for the Presidency in 2008 with Barak.
As far as I'm concerned, NO public officials look good in this right now and while I'm down to give Nagin a big up for frank talk, I don't think he deserves a free pass for it either.
I agree with you Odub, but did you notice when I nicely made the point that you can't put all the blame on the mayor, he chose not to respond with anything, he just got snarky with everyone in the thread.
I have zero problem with a dissenting perspective, I do have a problem with complete dickery. I hope he maintains a permanent vacation from here.
I find this ethical question or joke/story that you presented to be a waste of my time. Even G.W. Bush deserves pure and non-judgemental compasion. Untill all life forms recieve forgiving compasion humanity will suffer and de-evolve. If you want to experiance the full potential of life then you must never hate someone some much that you wish them death and suffering. I know you might be joking with this thing you wrote but its time to get real and stop playing the tough guy atitude. You will relize this someday. peace and respect
this is a responce to that ethical question/statement from earlier
I find this ethical question or joke/story that you presented to be a waste of my time. Even G.W. Bush deserves pure and non-judgemental compasion. Untill all life forms recieve forgiving compasion humanity will suffer and de-evolve. If you want to experiance the full potential of life then you must never hate someone some much that you wish them death and suffering. I know you might be joking with this thing you wrote but its time to get real and stop playing the tough guy atitude. You will relize this someday. peace and respect
this is a responce to that ethical question/statement from earlier
I find this ethical question or joke/story that you presented to be a waste of my time. Even G.W. Bush deserves pure and non-judgemental compasion. Untill all life forms recieve forgiving compasion humanity will suffer and de-evolve. If you want to experiance the full potential of life then you must never hate someone some much that you wish them death and suffering. I know you might be joking with this thing you wrote but its time to get real and stop playing the tough guy atitude. You will relize this someday. peace and respect
this is a responce to that ethical question/statement from earlier
very true... its just that dudes like Bush make it SOOOOOOO hard. And shit, what if he aint even human? Then we'd have a right to hate him and want him dead wouldn't we!!!
I find this ethical question or joke/story that you presented to be a waste of my time. Even G.W. Bush deserves pure and non-judgemental compasion. Untill all life forms recieve forgiving compasion humanity will suffer and de-evolve. If you want to experiance the full potential of life then you must never hate someone some much that you wish them death and suffering. I know you might be joking with this thing you wrote but its time to get real and stop playing the tough guy atitude. You will relize this someday. peace and respect
this is a responce to that ethical question/statement from earlier
I'd agree with this in principle - barely. Because I do believe in compassion and love.
I also believe in justice and accountability. So the way I see it, someone like Bush has taken direct action that has caused death and suffering and I know he will likely never will be called to account for these things and as such, it will not discourage others like him from pursuing policies that further engender death and suffering.
So the way I see it...Bush's compassion goes a lot further than mine does and when he fails to show it, a lot more people suffer than when mine falters.
"In the days prior to Hurricane Katrina's landfall, the 49-year-old mayor ordered New Orleans' first-ever mandatory evacuation. He told those in the most flood-prone areas to leave early, and he set up shuttles to get the 100,000 or so residents without cars to shelters."
I was wondering about this myself and haven't seen a thing mentioned about it yet.
I find this ethical question or joke/story that you presented to be a waste of my time. Even G.W. Bush deserves pure and non-judgemental compasion. Untill all life forms recieve forgiving compasion humanity will suffer and de-evolve. If you want to experiance the full potential of life then you must never hate someone some much that you wish them death and suffering. I know you might be joking with this thing you wrote but its time to get real and stop playing the tough guy atitude. You will relize this someday. peace and respect
this is a responce to that ethical question/statement from earlier
I'd agree with this in principle - barely. Because I do believe in compassion and love.
I also believe in justice and accountability. So the way I see it, someone like Bush has taken direct action that has caused death and suffering and I know he will likely never will be called to account for these things and as such, it will not discourage others like him from pursuing policies that further engender death and suffering.
So the way I see it...Bush's compassion goes a lot further than mine does and when he fails to show it, a lot more people suffer than when mine falters.
I do think Bush is human(and if he was alien he still requires the lesson/force of compashion) and I also do believe in justice and accountability.Bush does need to be held acountable for makeing deadly decisions that hurts us all in this world. He has been simply missled in his education/upbringing,and spiritual teachings. We humans have the infinate ability to evolve into peacefull beings that we dont even understand yet. I think compashion and the atempt to bring peace into all beings has somthing to do with our hopes and dreams of a better world. what do ya think?
I do think Bush is human(and if he was alien he still requires the lesson/force of compashion) and I also do believe in justice and accountability.Bush does need to be held acountable for makeing deadly decisions that hurts us all in this world. He has been simply missled in his education/upbringing,and spiritual teachings. We humans have the infinate ability to evolve into peacefull beings that we dont even understand yet. I think compashion and the atempt to bring peace into all beings has somthing to do with our hopes and dreams of a better world. what do ya think?
Compassion without will to action is meaningless. It's not what's spoken but what's accomplished.
Great, I'm talking in aphorisms now.
Look - I'm not Christian so this whole "turn the other cheek," "Christ died for your sins," happy-Nag-Champa talk doesn't do it for me. I wouldn't wish for Bush to be killed by a road side bomb. But if it were to happen, I would look heavenward and speak the word, "justice."
I find this ethical question or joke/story that you presented to be a waste of my time. Even G.W. Bush deserves pure and non-judgemental compasion. Untill all life forms recieve forgiving compasion humanity will suffer and de-evolve. If you want to experiance the full potential of life then you must never hate someone some much that you wish them death and suffering. I know you might be joking with this thing you wrote but its time to get real and stop playing the tough guy atitude. You will relize this someday. peace and respect
this is a responce to that ethical question/statement from earlier
I'd agree with this in principle - barely. Because I do believe in compassion and love.
I also believe in justice and accountability. So the way I see it, someone like Bush has taken direct action that has caused death and suffering and I know he will likely never will be called to account for these things and as such, it will not discourage others like him from pursuing policies that further engender death and suffering.
So the way I see it...Bush's compassion goes a lot further than mine does and when he fails to show it, a lot more people suffer than when mine falters.
I do think Bush is human(and if he was alien he still requires the lesson/force of compashion) and I also do believe in justice and accountability.Bush does need to be held acountable for makeing deadly decisions that hurts us all in this world. He has been simply missled in his education/upbringing,and spiritual teachings. We humans have the infinate ability to evolve into peacefull beings that we dont even understand yet. I think compashion and the atempt to bring peace into all beings has somthing to do with our hopes and dreams of a better world. what do ya think?
I think you are naive and child-like. Not bad, just not accepting of the realities of human kind when they are pushed past the coping point and stressed beyond their capabilities. I think people can rise to the occasion, but not with catchy phrases about love and evolution. Certain crises demand action, and talking about Bush's upbringing just skirts the issue of his culpability.
I find this ethical question or joke/story that you presented to be a waste of my time. Even G.W. Bush deserves pure and non-judgemental compasion. Untill all life forms recieve forgiving compasion humanity will suffer and de-evolve. If you want to experiance the full potential of life then you must never hate someone some much that you wish them death and suffering. I know you might be joking with this thing you wrote but its time to get real and stop playing the tough guy atitude. You will relize this someday. peace and respect
this is a responce to that ethical question/statement from earlier
I also believe in justice and accountability.
I used to think that America was the greatest place on earth because of those 2 principals listed above. I always saw America as a place were people would give their lives for Justice. I fell for all that shit - let freedom reign & all of that. I don't know if I really feel like that anymore. What are people doing to hold their government accountable? Threatening the life of the president on an internet message board about age old records? Is "revolution in our lifetime" just a catchphrase for album cover? The people here are able, smart & articlate - I'm not jocking people, but I see Bam & others mobilise their folks to raise good money for folks in need. O-Dub has a knack for writing & expressing shit well. There are lots of good, talented people around. Someone has to be able to do something for the sake of justice. I say don't let that heatrock idea die - keep it going & the proceeds can raise money for folks fucked by this lame war, for people held down across the states. There's a community here of people who are really decent folks who, if their words mean anything, are tired of all the injustice & crap - if all this energy can be harnessed in some meaningful way, the possibilities are endless. I hope this doesn't come across as a diss to anyone. I'm not the best writer.
I know what you mean but im just trying to stay possitive and constructive. I feel like that attitude your talking about is like giving up and surrendering to frustration. I dont believe in looking at the past of human kind in deciding what to do in the future. Our creativity and imagination can bring new evolutions in human consciencness that might be able to bring us all together as one. I know this all sounds like soft/hippie/stoner stuff but its just thoughts Im having. Im not into violence at all.I guess my veiws are influenced by bhuddist philosaphies also.
I know this all sounds like soft/hippie/stoner stuff
Yup. If you can't bear to learn from and accept our history it seems to me you are doomed to repeat it.
I am not defeatist about this situation at all, though I admit it's hard to be anything but pragmatic at this point. Positive thinking has it's place, and I appreciate a positive point of view. But it needs to be girded in reality otherwise responses to this type of catastrophe will always be lacking.
I know this all sounds like soft/hippie/stoner stuff
Yup. If you can't bear to learn from and accept our history it seems to me you are doomed to repeat it.
I am not defeatist about this situation at all, though I admit it's hard to be anything but pragmatic at this point. Positive thinking has it's place, and I appreciate a positive point of view. But it needs to be girded in reality otherwise responses to this type of catastrophe will always be lacking.
Yo,
I think this hippy/stoner man is trying to tell us to learn from history - don't look to the past for answers because ain't none worked yet. If they had, we wouldn't be at this crossroads today. New ideas are goning to take us places. Kings & tyrants have been killed throughout human history. That hasn't stopped new maniacs from stepping up their game.
I know this all sounds like soft/hippie/stoner stuff
Yup. If you can't bear to learn from and accept our history it seems to me you are doomed to repeat it.
I am not defeatist about this situation at all, though I admit it's hard to be anything but pragmatic at this point. Positive thinking has it's place, and I appreciate a positive point of view. But it needs to be girded in reality otherwise responses to this type of catastrophe will always be lacking.
Yo,
I think this hippy/stoner man is trying to tell us to learn from history - don't look to the past for answers because ain't none worked yet. If they had, we wouldn't be at this crossroads today. New ideas are goning to take us places. Kings & tyrants have been killed throughout human history. That hasn't stopped new maniacs from stepping up their game.
peace
h
I disagree. Everything I have read has the depth of "don't worry, be evolved." I think it's bullshit.
I know this all sounds like soft/hippie/stoner stuff
Yup. If you can't bear to learn from and accept our history it seems to me you are doomed to repeat it.
I am not defeatist about this situation at all, though I admit it's hard to be anything but pragmatic at this point. Positive thinking has it's place, and I appreciate a positive point of view. But it needs to be girded in reality otherwise responses to this type of catastrophe will always be lacking.
Yo,
I think this hippy/stoner man is trying to tell us to learn from history - don't look to the past for answers because ain't none worked yet. If they had, we wouldn't be at this crossroads today. New ideas are goning to take us places. Kings & tyrants have been killed throughout human history. That hasn't stopped new maniacs from stepping up their game.
peace
h
I disagree. Everything I have read has the depth of "don't worry, be evolved." I think it's bullshit.
I think it would be bad if that idea of "don't worry, be evolved" would get around - there's probably enough apathy in the world. We need some new ideas, new politiacl parties, new shit. I'd rather say "be involved, be evolved".
Comments
We live in a highly reactive society and seldom give proactive/preventative measures much thought. This guy is right on target by GOING OFF like this. The only thing that these wanksters that we call leaders can do is now REACT to Nagin's comments for fear of looking bad during the middle of a national catastrophe (too late).
Nagin will have the ear of the nation for the next few weeks. I will be interested to hear what other things he has to say. I will vote for him...
he got me stuck...rarely people speaks like that. The last minutes are tears-droppin'...
Wow, this really sucks. I really loved this website. Oh well,
See you never.
- spidey
Uh, I hate to say it but while I don't agree with all of Sabadaba's comments, he's not a raving lunie on this one.
1) Nagin gets mega props from me for REAL TALK but politically speaking, I don't think he's pulled an Obama. He's probably commiting political suicide outside mayorhood and I respect that he doesn't seem to give a fuck. People forget that what Americans want is not real talk. They want the "it's all fine" bullshit that most Presidents since forever have shoveled, especially Bush, who is the king of "I understand there is pain out there (but I just don't care)".
2) To me, there are still some questions I haven't heard addressed yet. Like - could Nagin have done more to get people out of the city? It's not ALL on him. Of course, the state and federal agencies had a role to play. But as mayor, what was within his power and what wasn't?
I also think it's a bit problematic to note the rampant drug problem in your own city without taking responsiblity for it at the same time. I do not doubt he's been hamstrung to fight it but if he's the mayor of New Orleans and NOLA has a huge drug problem, doesn't the buck kind of stop at his doorstep? That's a VERY fair question to ask.
3) Just to reiterate - I thought his comments were refreshing and necessary and I hope to hear more candor. But straight up - NOBODY is innocent in any of this. I don't care if you're DNC or GOP or what the fuck ever: a lot of MFers blew this and blew it bad.
just kidding...o, i agree with all your points. i think people would have fine with a dissenting voice, even if argumentative...but sabdadba wasnt argumentative, he was obnoxious, trying to get a rise out of people. shit, i still dont mind letting him talk into the wind and being as obnoxious as he wants. but if he really wanted to have the board here what he had to say, he needs to work on his social skills.
I don't disagree with the sentiment but I'm saying - if you're the mayor, this is the kind of thing you have to, on some level, take responsibility for *even if it's a losing proposition and everyone knows it*. More to the point, he was suggestnig that NOLA has a severe drug problem above and beyond other cities.
The point here is that while I thought the mayor had some powerful things to say, it doesn't obviate him from responsiblity that he may share in this. I can't say that for certain because I don't know the scope of what he could have done but I think it's a *fair question to ask* before we start slapping dude on the back and trying to get him to run for the Presidency in 2008 with Barak.
As far as I'm concerned, NO public officials look good in this right now and while I'm down to give Nagin a big up for frank talk, I don't think he deserves a free pass for it either.
I agree with you Odub, but did you notice when I nicely made the point that you can't put all the blame on the mayor, he chose not to respond with anything, he just got snarky with everyone in the thread.
I have zero problem with a dissenting perspective, I do have a problem with complete dickery. I hope he maintains a permanent vacation from here.
this is a responce to that ethical question/statement from earlier
cool
very true... its just that dudes like Bush make it SOOOOOOO hard. And shit, what if he aint even human? Then we'd have a right to hate him and want him dead wouldn't we!!!
I'd agree with this in principle - barely. Because I do believe in compassion and love.
I also believe in justice and accountability. So the way I see it, someone like Bush has taken direct action that has caused death and suffering and I know he will likely never will be called to account for these things and as such, it will not discourage others like him from pursuing policies that further engender death and suffering.
So the way I see it...Bush's compassion goes a lot further than mine does and when he fails to show it, a lot more people suffer than when mine falters.
"In the days prior to Hurricane Katrina's landfall, the 49-year-old mayor ordered New Orleans' first-ever mandatory evacuation. He told those in the most flood-prone areas to leave early, and he set up shuttles to get the 100,000 or so residents without cars to shelters."
I was wondering about this myself and haven't seen a thing mentioned about it yet.
I do think Bush is human(and if he was alien he still requires the lesson/force of compashion) and I also do believe in justice and accountability.Bush does need to be held acountable for makeing deadly decisions that hurts us all in this world. He has been simply missled in his education/upbringing,and spiritual teachings. We humans have the infinate ability to evolve into peacefull beings that we dont even understand yet. I think compashion and the atempt to bring peace into all beings has somthing to do with our hopes and dreams of a better world. what do ya think?
Compassion without will to action is meaningless. It's not what's spoken but what's accomplished.
Great, I'm talking in aphorisms now.
Look - I'm not Christian so this whole "turn the other cheek," "Christ died for your sins," happy-Nag-Champa talk doesn't do it for me. I wouldn't wish for Bush to be killed by a road side bomb. But if it were to happen, I would look heavenward and speak the word, "justice."
I think you are naive and child-like. Not bad, just not accepting of the realities of human kind when they are pushed past the coping point and stressed beyond their capabilities. I think people can rise to the occasion, but not with catchy phrases about love and evolution. Certain crises demand action, and talking about Bush's upbringing just skirts the issue of his culpability.
You need to grow up and look around, my friend.
Yup. If you can't bear to learn from and accept our history it seems to me you are doomed to repeat it.
I am not defeatist about this situation at all, though I admit it's hard to be anything but pragmatic at this point. Positive thinking has it's place, and I appreciate a positive point of view. But it needs to be girded in reality otherwise responses to this type of catastrophe will always be lacking.
Yo,
I think this hippy/stoner man is trying to tell us to learn from history - don't look to the past for answers because ain't none worked yet. If they had, we wouldn't be at this crossroads today. New ideas are goning to take us places. Kings & tyrants have been killed throughout human history. That hasn't stopped new maniacs from stepping up their game.
peace
h
I disagree. Everything I have read has the depth of "don't worry, be evolved."
I think it's bullshit.
I think it would be bad if that idea of "don't worry, be evolved" would get around - there's probably enough apathy in the world. We need some new ideas, new politiacl parties, new shit. I'd rather say "be involved, be evolved".
h