Herbie takes over Thelonius

ketanketan Warmly booming riffs 2,296 Posts

I've seen building/organizations renamed as corporate sponsors change, but this just seems wrong to me.  It's probably not a big deal but...


  Comments


  • Yeah I agree. Suspect. Dude could instead lend his name to something new.

  • RhythmGJRhythmGJ Buffalo, NY 183 Posts
    Highly uncool!

    More to the story???

    At the _least_, why not the "Thelonious Monk and Herbie Hancock Institute of Jazz?"

    Not liking this at all.

    GJ

  • JimsterJimster Unshazamable saudade chord vehicle 6,184 Posts
    HH is one of my favourite players but I've heard some stories of him being a self-righteous douche from people who have first-hand experience.  I mean, yes, he probably has more talent than most but where I'm from, there is never any excuse for using that to be a dick.  It could have been his own idea.  That is what would sadden me the most.

    Never meet your idols, etc.

  • Fred_GarvinFred_Garvin The land of wind and ghosts 336 Posts
    Their board apparently made the decision, based on this:

    "A press statement noted that the decision had been unanimous, and was made "following a request by representatives of the Monk Estate regarding the continued use of Thelonious Monk's name.""

    Sounds like the Monk estate didn't want his name used any more, for reasons they seem to want to keep to themselves.

    A little research before assuming the worst of people is always a good thing.

    https://www.npr.org/2018/11/07/665403861/the-thelonious-monk-institute-of-jazz-is-now-the-herbie-hancock-institute-of-jaz
    ketan

  • ketanketan Warmly booming riffs 2,296 Posts
    That's cool - glad it was at the request of the Monk estate.  (The Pitchfork article didn't include that detail.)

  • RhythmGJRhythmGJ Buffalo, NY 183 Posts
    Yes! I hadn't seen that either, but that was the "more to the story?" that I was alluding to above^^^^.

    BTW FG, are you the same over at AK?

    GJ

  • JimsterJimster Unshazamable saudade chord vehicle 6,184 Posts
    It was a poorly-written article to not include that fact from the outset.



  • Damn yeah I'd say so. Anyway I shook hands with Herbie at a Wayne Shorter Quartet show once but didn't have the guts to say I didn't dig anything he's done since headhunters

  • JimsterJimster Unshazamable saudade chord vehicle 6,184 Posts
    didn't dig anything he's done since headhunters

    Gershwin's World

    Jaco's debut album

    River: The Joni Letters

    Round Midnight soundtrack

    Joe Henderson's "Double Rainbow" he also melts on.

    I've not heard all of his post 2000 stuff doe.

    Fred G, feel free to chime in.


  • DuderonomyDuderonomy Haut de la Garenne 7,123 Posts
    Off-topic, but I was wondering about The Headhunters; was the name an allusion to the pursuit of good blowjobs, or that they were sending out their music to the (real) headz, or simply a reclamation of a term indicative of something tribal or savage with undertones of general bad-ass-ery?

  • ElectrodeElectrode Los Angeles 2,608 Posts
    This reminded me about Ken Burns' jazz documentary from '01 and the online 'but-what-about...' criticism it produced, especially the post-Coltrane/"Bitches' Brew" tenth episode where Herbie was interviewed among others.

  • RhythmGJRhythmGJ Buffalo, NY 183 Posts
    Jimster said:
    It was a poorly-written article to not include that fact from the outset.


    I think that's why I missed it the first time. I scanned two articles (Pitchfork and Downbeat). One of them was basically a press release verbatim, and the other was mostly the press release (so I must have glossed over the important part).


    GJ


  • JimsterJimster Unshazamable saudade chord vehicle 6,184 Posts
    Off-topic, but I was wondering about The Headhunters; was the name an allusion to the pursuit of good blowjobs, or that they were sending out their music to the (real) headz, or simply a reclamation of a term indicative of something tribal or savage with undertones of general bad-ass-ery?

    "I remember one time when Milton Berle, the comedian, came down to see me when I was playing at the Three Deuces. I was in Bird's band at the time. I think this was in 1948. Anyway, Berle was sitting at a table listening to us and somebody asked him what he thought of the band and the music. He laughed and turned to this group of white people he was with and said that we were "headhunters," meaning we were fucking savages. He thought it was funny, and I remember all those white people laughing at us. Well, I never forgot that. Then I saw him on an airplane about twenty-five years after that and we were both riding in first class. I went up and introduced myself to him. I said, "Milton, my name is Miles Davis and I'm a musician."

    He started smiling and said, "Oh, yeah, I know who you are. I really love your music." He seemed happy that I had come up to him.

    Then I said, "Milton, you did something to me and some people in the band I was playing with some years ago that I've always remem­bered, and I always told myself that if I ever got close enough to breathe on you that I was gonna tell you the way I felt when you said what you said that night." He was looking at me kind of funny now because he didn't know what he had said. And I could feel some of the anger of that night coming back so it must have been showing in my face.

    I told him what he said and I told him how they had all laughed at us. Now his face was turning red because he was embar­rassed, and he had probably forgotten all about it. So then I told him, "I don't like what you called us that night, Milton, and none of the band liked it either after I told them what you said. Some of them also heard what you said."

    He looked all pitiful and everything and then he said, "I'm very, very sorry."

    And I said, "I know you are. But you're only sorry now, sorry after I told you, because you weren't sorry then." And then I turned around and went back to my seat and sat down and didn't say an­other word to him."


  • DuderonomyDuderonomy Haut de la Garenne 7,123 Posts
    Sigh... I figured it was probably something racist, but now, for me at least, it’s more about them being bad-asses.

  • Jimster said:
    didn't dig anything he's done since headhunters

    Gershwin's World

    Jaco's debut album

    River: The Joni Letters

    Round Midnight soundtrack

    Joe Henderson's "Double Rainbow" he also melts on.

    I've not heard all of his post 2000 stuff doe.

    Fred G, feel free to chime in.

    Thanks for this. I should say I was 17 or 18 when this happened!


  • JimsterJimster Unshazamable saudade chord vehicle 6,184 Posts
    Depends what kinda stuff you dig, for me it's usually lush chords and tension and relief.  And you know he had that shit down since "Maiden Voyage".

    But I also dig the "Sunlight" and "Man-Child" sets when he was doing the vocorder thing and going a bit disco.  It grooves and I see nowt wrong with that.  He's always had a thing for technology despite batting out piano dates his whole career.  And of course there was RockIt which sounded hip as shit in 1983. Trust me.

    It has, however, been patchy since.  He was doing a lot of coke for a long time and for my 2p, his choice of collaborators when he decides to do "Contemporary" sounds is often ill-informed.  I mean, summademshits is straight finger-crucifix. 

    But then getting Norah Jones  (I know, right?) to do the vocal on "Court and Spark" goes down like a fine malt. 

  • JimsterJimster Unshazamable saudade chord vehicle 6,184 Posts
    Graemlins apropos of nothing.  I think we all need more Graemlins.


  • Fred_GarvinFred_Garvin The land of wind and ghosts 336 Posts
    RhythmGJ said:
    BTW FG, are you the same over at AK?

    I'm the same person regardless of where I am... and maybe it's the frequent lack of sleep fueling my ignorance, but I'm drawing a blank on what "AK" is.


  • RhythmGJRhythmGJ Buffalo, NY 183 Posts
    Then you're not.

    But just so's you knows; you're not the only Fred Garvin on the Web (audio/music-related). Also hopefully not a male prostitute or wearing a truss, but those details are probably besides the point.

    GJ

  • Fred_GarvinFred_Garvin The land of wind and ghosts 336 Posts
    RhythmGJ said:
    Then you're not.

    But just so's you knows; you're not the only Fred Garvin on the Web (audio/music-related). Also hopefully not a male prostitute or wearing a truss, but those details are probably besides the point.

    GJ

    Probably.

    I actually only use that alias here, and I don't even remember why that is. I've never seen any others, though, so that's interesting.

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