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Grading experts help, please

crazycratecrazycrate 32 Posts
edited August 2014 in Strut Central
Hi,
maybe someone can help me out. An 80.- Euro record that was advertised as near Mint turned out to have 3 very tiny marks that click/pop very very loud for 2 to 5 rotations. One of them you can easily see, the other ones are very tiny and hard to spot. The bigger mark is clearly not a pressing issue, the other 2 i don??t know but the sound they make is most likely not. The rest of the record is really clean but these 3 marks, that make it unenjoyable for me, because the clicks are so loud, obviously keep it from being NM. I want to leave feedback stating the grade it was sent to me. How would that be expertly graded? Thanks for any help.

j

  Comments

  • arvidarvid 50 Posts
    Hi J,

    I advise you to contact the seller and discuss with him.
    Most likely he graded the record visually and didn't notice the flaws, maybe he even listened through the record quickly and missed those spots.
    Obviously you're not satisfied with this record, so maybe you can return it to him and get a full refund or work it out in another way.
    As a seller I find it quite frustrating to receive negative feedback, without being informed about the buyer's dissatisfaction.
    It's all about communication.

    Regards,

    Arvid
  • crazycratecrazycrate 32 Posts
    Thanks for you reply, Arvid!

    I had contact with the seller and he admitted he played it and on his system it sounded "fine". It┬┤s impossible to overhear the damage when you listen through the album. He said it was his personal copy so I assume he not just needle dropped. Even if visually graded, the one larger mark is hard to miss. It┬┤s a quite deep impact point. Even if I return the record and he agrees to even cover the return postage I┬┤m tempted to give negative feedback and warn other buyers about the sloppy grading. I┬┤m really annoyed by receiving overgraded stuff and then have to repack and bring it to the post office. Or am I overacting here and that┬┤s what you┬┤re expected to deal with in buying online vinyl?

    Still, how is a shiny clean vinyl with 3 very loud popping marks graded?
  • LaserWolfLaserWolf Portland Oregon 11,517 Posts
    arvid said:
    Hi J,

    I advise you to contact the seller and discuss with him.
    Most likely he graded the record visually and didn't notice the flaws, maybe he even listened through the record quickly and missed those spots.
    Obviously you're not satisfied with this record, so maybe you can return it to him and get a full refund or work it out in another way.
    As a seller I find it quite frustrating to receive negative feedback, without being informed about the buyer's dissatisfaction.
    It's all about communication.

    Regards,

    Arvid

    ^This is the right route.
    Once you told the seller your problem his response should have been, 'how can I make you happy'.

    If he said you were wrong and he was right, it is negative feedback time.
    This is not a grading issue, it is a customer service issue.

    Just my opinion.
  • The_NonThe_Non 5,691 Posts
    crazycrate said:
    Thanks for you reply, Arvid!

    I had contact with the seller and he admitted he played it and on his system it sounded "fine". It┬┤s impossible to overhear the damage when you listen through the album. He said it was his personal copy so I assume he not just needle dropped. Even if visually graded, the one larger mark is hard to miss. It┬┤s a quite deep impact point. Even if I return the record and he agrees to even cover the return postage I┬┤m tempted to give negative feedback and warn other buyers about the sloppy grading. I┬┤m really annoyed by receiving overgraded stuff and then have to repack and bring it to the post office. Or am I overacting here and that┬┤s what you┬┤re expected to deal with in buying online vinyl?

    Still, how is a shiny clean vinyl with 3 very loud popping marks graded?

    I wouldn't grade it NM
    Having said that though, I've found out the "hard way" records play differently on different turntables/systems...
  • arvidarvid 50 Posts
    I never grade records with audible marks NM. But whether you grade it NM, EX or VG+, you should always try to describe the record as accurate as possible to avoid problems like this. That said, I totally agree with LaserWolf that a seller should step out of his way to make his customer "happy".
    If he's defensive and not willing to co-operate that would definitely be a reason to leave a negative feedback.

    Check his feedback history, if he isn't a fraud, he doesn't deserve a negative feedback for making a mistake.
  • youngEINSTEINyoungEINSTEIN 2,443 Posts
    I'm not an expert but I sell A LOT of records. First of all it sounds like he made a mistake in grading. 3 marks = VG+. Ultimately in a transaction your happiness is the primary objective. Once in a while I make a mistake in grading. If a buyer contacts me and is unhappy I generally issue a refund and let them keep the record.

    Also negative feedback to me is a last resort kind of thing. I've never left negative feedback and I've probably done 20,000 transactions on ebay.

    Peace, stein...
  • volumenvolumen 2,532 Posts
    Yea, that's not NM and if the mark was visible he should have double checked by playing it himself. It's hard to believe a pop is heard on one system and not another. I actually had a record that was NM but one track visually appeared scratched. Even though it didn't affect the play at all I still took it down to VG+ and noted it in the listing. Having said all that if they guy is willing to take it back and refund everything I wouldn't leave negative feedback. Sellers make mistakes. I've sent someone the wrong record and once I sent them the right one (and let them keep the wrong one) they still gave positive feedback and didn't even mention the mix up. Lazer knows what he's talking about, as long as the customer service comes thorough you should give positive feedback.
  • gazgaz 232 Posts
    sounds like a simple mistake and he's bending over backwards to help you, even offering to pay for your return post which is more than most would do, I'd leave him a positive
  • crazycratecrazycrate 32 Posts
    Thanks for the help ya┬┤ll!
  • akaaka 67 Posts
    If it does end up resolved to your satisfaction, I'd encourage you to leave positive feedback briefly explaining that ("issue with the record was quickly and amicably resolved with friendly seller, thanks") because in my view as a customer that's the best kind of feedback a seller can get (i.e. satisfying an unhappy customer).
  • Jonny_PaycheckJonny_Paycheck 17,825 Posts
    yeah, just to chime in - mistakes happen, it's a part of the business. Some people's ears and eyes aren't as careful, and sometimes a record in your "personal collection" hasn't been played in 5 years. I rarely offer (or receive) return shipping so he's going above and beyond my regular experience. I would return the record - paying a premium for a record with issues really sucks, I've done it many a time and all you think about is the issues, not the music. (it's different if you find it for $1 or whatever) - but then leave pos feedback. As a buyer, I want to know the seller is reasonable more than anything. I bought a record recently from a guy with decent feedback, it arrived and (IMO) was overgraded. when I attempted to address the issue the guy got super condescending and indignant, like I had never bought or sold a record in my life. Left him a big fat neg.
  • akaaka 67 Posts
    Jonny_Paycheck said:
    yeah, just to chime in - mistakes happen, it's a part of the business. Some people's ears and eyes aren't as careful, and sometimes a record in your "personal collection" hasn't been played in 5 years. I rarely offer (or receive) return shipping so he's going above and beyond my regular experience. I would return the record - paying a premium for a record with issues really sucks, I've done it many a time and all you think about is the issues, not the music. (it's different if you find it for $1 or whatever) - but then leave pos feedback. As a buyer, I want to know the seller is reasonable more than anything. I bought a record recently from a guy with decent feedback, it arrived and (IMO) was overgraded. when I attempted to address the issue the guy got super condescending and indignant, like I had never bought or sold a record in my life. Left him a big fat neg.
    If I'm checking out a seller on discogs with negs / neutrals, usually the most telling thing is the reply the seller gives on feedback. So many dudes trying to be right, when they need to think about how that comes across to customers.
  • LaserWolfLaserWolf Portland Oregon 11,517 Posts
    I have a friend who is extremely sarcastic and witty. He leaves sarcastic and witty replies to negs. Looks bad.

    I feel sorry for another friend who has negs like this "The record was sealed but when I played it there was a tick.".
  • skelskel You can't cheat karma 5,033 Posts
    Flame that bastard!

    Name and shame

    ::wink::
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