Love this show like most of you guys, but I'm a bit troubled by one aspect. We are presented with two versions of Rust Cohle - young Rust and future, older Rust. To me, these two Rusts seem like totally different characters, not younger/older versions of each other. Sure, they may share the same pessimistic world view, but I find hard it to believe that Rust, at some point in his life, would regress into some grizzled, redneck dude who basically lives in a shed in the wood and spends his days in a bar (ie, the type of southern dude, younger Rust routinely clowns). Older Rust is basically Wooderson from Dazed and Confused if he got burned out from all the drugs and alcohol. But I guess the point of the show is that something very traumatic happens to Rust in the course of the investigation to turn him that way, so I'll reserve full judgment and see what goes down.
Also came across some interesting theories in the course of reading up on the show -
- The references to the "Yellow King" may be taken from supernatural/horror stories involving aliens and other dimensions that influenced HP Lovecraft. This could signal the show will take a supernatural turn, leading to the trauma that Rust experiences. Also may explain the shift between reality and fantasy in Rust's perspective. See http://insidetv.ew.com/2014/01/12/true-detective-premiere/
- Recall Rust's monologue about the type of torture inflicted by drug cartels. Rust himself may have been tortured during his stint in the undercover drug unit. Even worse, he may have been castrated, hence his seeming lack of interest in women.
I'm not that bothered by these early and superficial differences between the young man and old. It seems plausible to me that Young Rust's philosophical soliloquies and hallucinations can easily devolve into the ramblings of an even more disillusioned drunk and mostly idle older man.
He's on the job in 1995, too; focused and wound up tight from being institutionalized. His skin-pulled-tight-over-a-skull facial structure definitely adds to it, but he exudes tension every time he's on screen.
I like how the physical differences between the two men feeds into their characters, and highlights how they differ from each other.
phongone said:
- Recall Rust's monologue about the type of torture inflicted by drug cartels. Rust himself may have been tortured during his stint in the undercover drug unit. Even worse, he may have been castrated, hence his seeming lack of interest in women.
Interesting. I find his lack of interest in women totally in line with his damaged persona, castration not necessary! It would not feel right for him to get with a woman (just yet anyway), in my opinion...especially as he told Maggie it's really only to make kids anyway.
And there's the question of who. I think he's too principled to make it with his partner's old lady and too smart to make it with a two-bit motel room hustler or a dancer.
Really enjoy the show. After watching the 4th episode again, I was a bit irritated by the quickness with which the jail dude and Tyrone Weems offered info. They both rattled off the appropriate info in diarrhea fashion. Weems didn't even know who Marty was, but immediately went into the bit about him only cooking for one crew. I get it, gotta wrap it up for tv time, but those scenes just felt very convenient.
Oh and...
Rust calling and saying "90 seconds." It was exciting tv, but that's like some I'm right around the corner shit. Marty didn't even know he was in the projects.
It's some elbows complaints, but you know. It's a really great show, so some of those things just feel kind of funny and convenient.
Probably says more about me than the show but I fell asleep twice before making it all the way through the first episode. The pacing can be straight glacial then we get into, like, the bust in Episode 5 and it was all over in a flash. Without any spoilerz, big man at the diner who was all like, "I can see your soul through the edges of your eyes" didn't do his op any favors the way he camouflaged his truck on the side of the road. But, uh, props to Det. Hart for staying with Pink Floyd through the bitter end, if that tour tee was from his own closet - I can only hopes he carries that passion the interim of the Yellow King case.
I think I missed/forgot something - what is the school Rust goes to at the end? How did he know to go there? Is it the missing girl from the billboard's old school?
I think I missed/forgot something - what is the school Rust goes to at the end? How did he know to go there? Is it the missing girl from the billboard's old school?
[del]i'm pretty sure it's the school that the gypsy baptist minister's castrated friend went to.[/del]
the grizzled old crawdad trapper (victim's grandfather) told them that she (rhianne?) went to that school, with reggie ledoux. it is also a paid for by tuttle's "ministry". they got the APB back in the middle of talking to the groundskeeper (when hart went ham on the horn, and cohle just sauntered back)
They went there and some dude was riding a lawn mower, talking about the different places he works. I forget, but it may have tied into the church dudes in some way, not the baptist dudes, but the higher up big wigs.
is cohle telling hart to "take the cuffs off before the blood settles" normal cop knowledge or the knowledge of someone who has been around people as they die with cuffs on?
If Rust is the killer then I will be mad. I hate when shows have long scenes leading you to think one thing when you are only to find out the opposite later.
If he is the killer, why make a stink of the jail dude? Why review the tape of his suicide. Why dust the phone if he was the one who made the call. I get it, he's shaking dust and covering up, but still, nobody else gave a fuck. He was the one making the effort.
Also, that long scene at the end of episode 5. Why would he go in that old school and walk around like he's discovering shit if he's the real killer. Nobody was there to watch him act like that. Maybe it's bigger than him, but I don't know. I hate when they have scenes that are totally contradictory to what would happen in reality. People don't always act like someone is watching them. Those scenes are there to show you the contradiction in the stories told and the actual realities. If it turns out he is the killer, there's quite a few scenes that are just hammed up to fool us.
I just hope it's not a lame reveal at the end that undermines all the things that built up to it.
Controller7, yes that would SUCK.. but I don't think he'll end up the killer. I think it's more likely he's been investigating the case solo ever since the interrogation where the man mentioned the Yellow King. It's lead him to discover things about some politicians or councilors involved in a cover up and now they're out to get him. He came in for the interview in 2012 hoping to learn things he didn't already know but now he's realised the cops don't know anything more and are trying to pin it on him.
An interesting thing mentioned in one of the 'inside the episode' vids was that by getting the cops to buy him beer and getting drunk in the interview he's made his evidence inadmissible in court.
What Cal said. I think they're implying that the governor's brother who is a minister might be behind all the killings. He funded the closed down school that was shown at the end of the last episode, and the prisoner who killed himself said that bigwigs were behind all the murders. Seems to point in the minister's direction.
Episode 5 was eerie as fuck and top-notch. Couple things to note. When Charlie Lang (the victim's husband in jail) tells the detectives what he knows about Reggie Ledoux, he says Ledoux has a spiral tattoo on his back. When we finally get to see Ledoux, he has plenty of tats, but not the spiral.
In the last scene when Rust is examine the tree sculpture, the camera pans out and you see black stars in the jagged glass. Ledoux was babbling about black stars to Rust.
In one of the earlier episodes, Marty's father-in-law was talking about kids dressing up in black and having sex. Lo and behold, Marty's daughter is a promiscuous goth in 2002. Is this just a call-back to Rust's "m-brane" theory and as Ledoux says "Time is a flat circle? Or maybe even something more sinister?
is cohle telling hart to "take the cuffs off before the blood settles" normal cop knowledge or the knowledge of someone who has been around people as they die with cuffs on?
I haven't been around people dying with hand-cuffs on but know that once blood circulation stops, gravity takes over. Blood settles closest to the ground so anything on the skin (side facing down) will leave a 'blood' imprint.
I noticed no swirl on Ledoux's back as well...so was Lange lying to get Hart and Cohle off his back, maybe get some consideration in the process or because he is also part of the bigger machine? Or that wasn't Ledoux? Lange mentioned how big Ledoux was a couple of times and that guy who got his head shot off wasn't all that big.
for a dude that doesn't really care for many scripted TV shows -- I must admit that this series really has me mesmerized. There are so many different directions the writer(s) still have to take this series, and it's just mind blowing to me that we are 5 shows into an 8 episode (I think?) series, I have absolutely know idea how this story will end up.
I thought it was lame how Woody aced the guy so impulsively, esp. given that the murders have been revealed to be part of a giant conspiracy web (I dunno, maybe keep one of the main dudes at the center of said web alive to get some intel??).
I get it, Woody has daughters (major theme of the episode), and seeing the imprisoned kids incensed him.
But REALLY really? Like that? Just come out and off the guy? Woody: what did you expect to find in there? He's a satanic killer sicko; there was obviously gonna be some foul shit in there. And in the grand scheme of things, two half-dead kids locked up in a truck isn't all *that* shocking.
I just wasn't buying how shook he suddenly got. Come out and pistol whip him, OK. Blow his head off? Not seeing that.
But REALLY really? Like that? Just come out and off the guy? Woody: what did you expect to find in there? He's a satanic killer sicko; there was obviously gonna be some foul shit in there. And in the grand scheme of things, two half-dead kids locked up in a truck isn't all *that* shocking.
I just wasn't buying how shook he suddenly got. Come out and pistol whip him, OK. Blow his head off? Not seeing that.
I initially thought that, too, but I think that is our 2014 exposure to lowest-depths-of-human-cruelty selves reacting. It wasn't that long ago that I saw pictures of where those three women were chained and imprisoned and tortured for 10 years on a number of news sites.
That happened in 1995 small town Louisiana, not sure Hart is that hardened and his lack of impulse control has already been demonstrated.
Still: veteran cop, on the trail of a sicko ritual killer, searching his freaky redneck compound....I'm just saying maybe he shoulda been a little more mentally prepared for what he encountered...which wasn't *that* shocking IMO.
That happened in 1995 small town Louisiana, not sure Hart is that hardened and his lack of impulse control has already been demonstrated.
Or Hart is in the mix and had to get rid of Ledoux for self-protection.
I am open to any/all internet speculation, but Hart being a part of does not hold water to me. Unless the twist at the end is that he is a totally different person than he has been revealed to be, he seems way too meat and potatoes to go in for ritual killing.
That happened in 1995 small town Louisiana, not sure Hart is that hardened and his lack of impulse control has already been demonstrated.
Or Hart is in the mix and had to get rid of Ledoux for self-protection.
I am open to any/all internet speculation, but Hart being a part of does not hold water to me. Unless the twist at the end is that he is a totally different person than he has been revealed to be, he seems way too meat and potatoes to go in for ritual killing.
I don't think either one is doing the killings but following the crumbs about the Governor, the task force and the 'big people' involved, I could believe that Hart could be convinced to give up pursuing the case or any new leads by the powers that be. Especially if his family, namely the eldest daughter, is somehow at risk. To speculate even more, that divergence could be what led to the fall out between him and Cohle and maybe even Hart's retrirement.
not to get all dr. phil, but i took the daughter's promiscuity as being a direct response to her father's earlier infidelity. when the girlfriend came to his home to tell his wife about the affair, the child was present.
Comments
yeah, my wife muttered something about Russian Ark when this last ep finished...
Also came across some interesting theories in the course of reading up on the show -
- The references to the "Yellow King" may be taken from supernatural/horror stories involving aliens and other dimensions that influenced HP Lovecraft. This could signal the show will take a supernatural turn, leading to the trauma that Rust experiences. Also may explain the shift between reality and fantasy in Rust's perspective. See http://insidetv.ew.com/2014/01/12/true-detective-premiere/
- Recall Rust's monologue about the type of torture inflicted by drug cartels. Rust himself may have been tortured during his stint in the undercover drug unit. Even worse, he may have been castrated, hence his seeming lack of interest in women.
He's on the job in 1995, too; focused and wound up tight from being institutionalized. His skin-pulled-tight-over-a-skull facial structure definitely adds to it, but he exudes tension every time he's on screen.
I like how the physical differences between the two men feeds into their characters, and highlights how they differ from each other.
Interesting. I find his lack of interest in women totally in line with his damaged persona, castration not necessary! It would not feel right for him to get with a woman (just yet anyway), in my opinion...especially as he told Maggie it's really only to make kids anyway.
And there's the question of who. I think he's too principled to make it with his partner's old lady and too smart to make it with a two-bit motel room hustler or a dancer.
Oh and...
Rust calling and saying "90 seconds." It was exciting tv, but that's like some I'm right around the corner shit. Marty didn't even know he was in the projects.
It's some elbows complaints, but you know. It's a really great show, so some of those things just feel kind of funny and convenient.
1) Want a f*cking beer.
2) Feel guilty every time I popped a beer at the weekend.
I think I missed/forgot something - what is the school Rust goes to at the end? How did he know to go there? Is it the missing girl from the billboard's old school?
[del]i'm pretty sure it's the school that the gypsy baptist minister's castrated friend went to.[/del]
the grizzled old crawdad trapper (victim's grandfather) told them that she (rhianne?) went to that school, with reggie ledoux. it is also a paid for by tuttle's "ministry". they got the APB back in the middle of talking to the groundskeeper (when hart went ham on the horn, and cohle just sauntered back)
I forget.
If he is the killer, why make a stink of the jail dude? Why review the tape of his suicide. Why dust the phone if he was the one who made the call. I get it, he's shaking dust and covering up, but still, nobody else gave a fuck. He was the one making the effort.
Also, that long scene at the end of episode 5. Why would he go in that old school and walk around like he's discovering shit if he's the real killer. Nobody was there to watch him act like that. Maybe it's bigger than him, but I don't know. I hate when they have scenes that are totally contradictory to what would happen in reality. People don't always act like someone is watching them. Those scenes are there to show you the contradiction in the stories told and the actual realities. If it turns out he is the killer, there's quite a few scenes that are just hammed up to fool us.
I just hope it's not a lame reveal at the end that undermines all the things that built up to it.
An interesting thing mentioned in one of the 'inside the episode' vids was that by getting the cops to buy him beer and getting drunk in the interview he's made his evidence inadmissible in court.
In the last scene when Rust is examine the tree sculpture, the camera pans out and you see black stars in the jagged glass. Ledoux was babbling about black stars to Rust.
In one of the earlier episodes, Marty's father-in-law was talking about kids dressing up in black and having sex. Lo and behold, Marty's daughter is a promiscuous goth in 2002. Is this just a call-back to Rust's "m-brane" theory and as Ledoux says "Time is a flat circle? Or maybe even something more sinister?
Closing song was dope.
I haven't been around people dying with hand-cuffs on but know that once blood circulation stops, gravity takes over. Blood settles closest to the ground so anything on the skin (side facing down) will leave a 'blood' imprint.
I noticed no swirl on Ledoux's back as well...so was Lange lying to get Hart and Cohle off his back, maybe get some consideration in the process or because he is also part of the bigger machine? Or that wasn't Ledoux? Lange mentioned how big Ledoux was a couple of times and that guy who got his head shot off wasn't all that big.
http://io9.com/the-one-literary-reference-you-must-know-to-appreciate-1523076497
bravo HBO
I get it, Woody has daughters (major theme of the episode), and seeing the imprisoned kids incensed him.
But REALLY really? Like that? Just come out and off the guy? Woody: what did you expect to find in there? He's a satanic killer sicko; there was obviously gonna be some foul shit in there. And in the grand scheme of things, two half-dead kids locked up in a truck isn't all *that* shocking.
I just wasn't buying how shook he suddenly got. Come out and pistol whip him, OK. Blow his head off? Not seeing that.
I initially thought that, too, but I think that is our 2014 exposure to lowest-depths-of-human-cruelty selves reacting. It wasn't that long ago that I saw pictures of where those three women were chained and imprisoned and tortured for 10 years on a number of news sites.
That happened in 1995 small town Louisiana, not sure Hart is that hardened and his lack of impulse control has already been demonstrated.
Still: veteran cop, on the trail of a sicko ritual killer, searching his freaky redneck compound....I'm just saying maybe he shoulda been a little more mentally prepared for what he encountered...which wasn't *that* shocking IMO.
Or Hart is in the mix and had to get rid of Ledoux for self-protection.
me too. I kinda covered my eyes at first.
I am open to any/all internet speculation, but Hart being a part of does not hold water to me. Unless the twist at the end is that he is a totally different person than he has been revealed to be, he seems way too meat and potatoes to go in for ritual killing.
I don't think either one is doing the killings but following the crumbs about the Governor, the task force and the 'big people' involved, I could believe that Hart could be convinced to give up pursuing the case or any new leads by the powers that be. Especially if his family, namely the eldest daughter, is somehow at risk. To speculate even more, that divergence could be what led to the fall out between him and Cohle and maybe even Hart's retrirement.
everything about this show is superlative.