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Cypress Hill "Real Estate"/"Sexy Coffee Pot" question

IndianaCornikovaIndianaCornikova 13 Posts
edited October 2012 in Strut Central
Hey all...So it's understood that Muggs' incredible "Real Estate" production features the bassline from "Sexy Coffee Pot." However, I've never heard a version of the Tony Alvon song in which the bass is present without the drums. At the beginning of the Cypress cut, the bass appears to be totally soloed from the other instruments.

Any ideas as to how this was achieved? It doesn't sound EQ'd (no drums bleeding through). Is there a different mix that exists somewhere? Or did Muggs ever credit a live bassist?

I thought I'd ask the professionals. Thanks!

  Comments

  • DocMcCoyDocMcCoy "Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,913 Posts
    I can see how someone might think it's Sexy Coffee Pot, because the lick sounds similar. But the bass on Real Estate sounds like an upright, whereas it's obviously an electric bass on the Tony Alvon record. Furthermore, there's no audible suggestion that the loop has been filtered on the Cypress record, at least not to me - the drums hit way too hard on Sexy Coffee Pot for them to be rolled off so cleanly. I will, of course, defer to the more tech-savvy amongst us, but it doesn't sound like a filtered sample to me.
  • mannybolonemannybolone Los Angeles, CA 15,025 Posts
    Damn, I had never thought about this but yeah: how would you have taken the drums out?

    New sample mystery?!
  • DJ_EnkiDJ_Enki 6,471 Posts
    DocMcCoy said:
    I can see how someone might think it's Sexy Coffee Pot, because the lick sounds similar. But the bass on Real Estate sounds like an upright, whereas it's obviously an electric bass on the Tony Alvon record. Furthermore, there's no audible suggestion that the loop has been filtered on the Cypress record, at least not to me - the drums hit way too hard on Sexy Coffee Pot for them to be rolled off so cleanly. I will, of course, defer to the more tech-savvy amongst us, but it doesn't sound like a filtered sample to me.

    Yeah, I just assumed it was a replay of the bass line because of the different tone and lack of soloed bass in "Sexy Coffee Pot." I'll be pretty fucking startled if it can be re-created just by filtering the OG.
  • DJBombjackDJBombjack Miami 1,665 Posts
    I'm sure Biz has a 12" of Sexy Coffee Pot without the drums

    :holygrail:
  • mannybolonemannybolone Los Angeles, CA 15,025 Posts
    DJBombjack said:
    I'm sure Biz has a 12" of Sexy Coffee Pot without the drums

    :holygrail:

    :comedy_gold:
  • The_NonThe_Non 5,691 Posts
    DJ_Enki said:
    DocMcCoy said:
    I can see how someone might think it's Sexy Coffee Pot, because the lick sounds similar. But the bass on Real Estate sounds like an upright, whereas it's obviously an electric bass on the Tony Alvon record. Furthermore, there's no audible suggestion that the loop has been filtered on the Cypress record, at least not to me - the drums hit way too hard on Sexy Coffee Pot for them to be rolled off so cleanly. I will, of course, defer to the more tech-savvy amongst us, but it doesn't sound like a filtered sample to me.

    Yeah, I just assumed it was a replay of the bass line because of the different tone and lack of soloed bass in "Sexy Coffee Pot." I'll be pretty fucking startled if it can be re-created just by filtering the OG.
    If Muggs could play anything he sure didn't display it on the s/t LP. That album has a million fafillion samples.
  • tripledoubletripledouble 7,636 Posts
    from the vocal version?
  • DownstrokeDownstroke 81 Posts
    It's a lowpass job, the baseline is chopped off at the snare and filtered. I did a quick bodge job on this to test my theory and it seems to stand up, (I quickly did this in Garageband at work, so it's by no means an exact duplicate of what Muggs did, but you'll get the idea???)

  • Hotsauce84Hotsauce84 8,450 Posts
    Downstroke said:
    It's a lowpass job, the baseline is chopped off at the snare and filtered. I did a quick bodge job on this to test my theory and it seems to stand up, (I quickly did this in Garageband at work, so it's by no means an exact duplicate of what Muggs did, but you'll get the idea???)


    I love you producer nerd types. I say that sincerely and with all due respect. I wish I had the technical know-how to de/reconstruct something like this.
  • jammyjammy remixing bongo rock... 813 Posts
    Herm said:
    Downstroke said:
    It's a lowpass job, the baseline is chopped off at the snare and filtered. I did a quick bodge job on this to test my theory and it seems to stand up, (I quickly did this in Garageband at work, so it's by no means an exact duplicate of what Muggs did, but you'll get the idea???)


    I love you producer nerd types. I say that sincerely and with all due respect. I wish I had the technical know-how to de/reconstruct something like this.

    With all due respect i think it is a played live bass and not the Tony Avalon record. You can hear it in the upper harmonics of the Cypress part kinda. You can almost hear fingers sliding over the strings. The same way the bass sounds on things like Main Source's "Snake Eyes" on the outro or Eric B & Rakim's "Keep The Beat" intro. That's just my opinion though....
  • DownstrokeDownstroke 81 Posts
    jammy said:
    Herm said:
    Downstroke said:
    It's a lowpass job, the baseline is chopped off at the snare and filtered. I did a quick bodge job on this to test my theory and it seems to stand up, (I quickly did this in Garageband at work, so it's by no means an exact duplicate of what Muggs did, but you'll get the idea???)


    I love you producer nerd types. I say that sincerely and with all due respect. I wish I had the technical know-how to de/reconstruct something like this.

    With all due respect i think it is a played live bass and not the Tony Avalon record. You can hear it in the upper harmonics of the Cypress part kinda. You can almost hear fingers sliding over the strings. The same way the bass sounds on things like Main Source's "Snake Eyes" on the outro or Eric B & Rakim's "Keep The Beat" intro. That's just my opinion though....

    Hmm, I've got my doubts. Apart from the pitch which is slightly up on Mugg's production and the filter settings (which I've only roughly tried to emulate), it's pretty darn close. Also, back when Muggs was making the beat for "Real Estate" (pre-Roughouse deal iirc) he was just making beats on his SP in his crib. Why would he feel the need to get a bass player in to replay it when the lowpass filter trick was common knowledge amongst producer types. Just like The_Non mentioned, Muggs didn't hold back on samples on the album, so why would he worry about it just for this track?
  • JectWonJectWon (@_@) 1,654 Posts
    jammy said:
    ...upper harmonics ....

    Don't sleep on the muh' fukkin upper harmonics yall....the u.h.'s.

    I feel like I hear the fingers scratching the strings of an upright, as well.

    EDIT: actually. I cannot hear the fingers on the strings. Jesus, I don't know. Good question, OP.

    Re-EDIT: [del]Not a sound engineer at all...but to me, it seems like this is the s.c.p sample and the beat/pattern/ambiance from the drum break he puts on top pretty much drowns out the other shit going on in the s.c.p. sample other than the bass and horns.[/del]

    FINAL EDIT: Beginning bass is definitely redone by his bassist homie or, something.
  • DJ_EnkiDJ_Enki 6,471 Posts
    jammy said:
    The same way the bass sounds on things like Main Source's "Snake Eyes"

    "Snake Eyes" is the exact comparison I was thinking of--it has live bass playing underneath the Johnny Taylor sample.
  • oldnewsouloldnewsoul 238 Posts
    DJ_Enki said:
    jammy said:
    The same way the bass sounds on things like Main Source's "Snake Eyes"

    "Snake Eyes" is the exact comparison I was thinking of--it has live bass playing underneath the Johnny Taylor sample.
    Anton Pukshansky
  • mannybolonemannybolone Los Angeles, CA 15,025 Posts
    I hit up Joe "The Butcher" and he said, "I remember it as a replay."
  • The_NonThe_Non 5,691 Posts
    mannybolone said:
    I hit up Joe "The Butcher" and he said, "I remember it as a replay."

    Well I'll be damned
  • DocMcCoyDocMcCoy "Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,913 Posts
    We got to the bottom of that one pretty quick.
  • mannybolonemannybolone Los Angeles, CA 15,025 Posts
    Sorry! Didn't mean to kill the drama there. I just figured "asking the engineer" was more expedient. Good thing Joe's on Facebook!
  • DownstrokeDownstroke 81 Posts
    mannybolone said:
    I hit up Joe "The Butcher" and he said, "I remember it as a replay."

    Wow, this leads me to wonder how much else on that album is re-played, and also why they felt they needed to on Real Estate as there was still quite a Wild West attitude to sampling around 90-91.

    Bonus beat, Cypress Hill's demos where posted up a while back which sounded not that different from what was eventually released. I wonder if that's a sample or not.

  • Hotsauce84Hotsauce84 8,450 Posts
    I guess this is the best place to ask this, so... does anyone know why Muggs 'raps' Sen Dog's short verse in the "How I Can Just Kill A Man" video??

  • Ricky ForcefieldRicky Forcefield 88 Posts
    and on the radio version of How I Could Just.. why was there a 'BO!' after "yeah you know I'm gonna gat ya" ?
  • mannybolonemannybolone Los Angeles, CA 15,025 Posts
    Downstroke said:
    mannybolone said:
    I hit up Joe "The Butcher" and he said, "I remember it as a replay."

    Wow, this leads me to wonder how much else on that album is re-played, and also why they felt they needed to on Real Estate as there was still quite a Wild West attitude to sampling around 90-91.

    Bonus beat, Cypress Hill's demos where posted up a while back which sounded not that different from what was eventually released. I wonder if that's a sample or not.


    On the Main Source album - arguably one of the great sample-based albums of all time - they had Anton playing bass on many tracks. It wasn't that unusual regardless of sampling laws/practices of the time.
  • IndianaCornikovaIndianaCornikova 13 Posts
    mannybolone said:
    I hit up Joe "The Butcher" and he said, "I remember it as a replay."

    Okay, cool. Thanks for the insight!
  • jammyjammy remixing bongo rock... 813 Posts
    IndianaCornikova said:
    mannybolone said:
    I hit up Joe "The Butcher" and he said, "I remember it as a replay."

    Okay, cool. Thanks for the insight!

    yep, i always knew these were bass replays and i suspected the same guy for the large pro produced stuff. Anton Pukshansky. It'd be great to hear from this guy about these sessions or his recollection of what went down.
  • dreskieboogiedreskieboogie 951 Posts
    At your service, Anton Pukshansky interview:

    http://othersounds.com/interview-anton-pukshansky/

    Enjoy!
  • covecove 1,566 Posts
    good read, thanks!
  • ketanketan Warmly booming riffs 3,097 Posts
    cove said:
    good read, thanks!
  • mannybolonemannybolone Los Angeles, CA 15,025 Posts
    Excellent read. I love stories like this!

    Do you mind talking about Grand Puba whom you worked with on his hit ???360?? (What Goes Around Comes Around)????

    He was famous for not showing up. I did a lot of Sample This! on Grand Puba???s time. He would call me, ???Yo, do whatever you want. I???m not going to be there today.??? OK, Sample This! session.
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