DJs Who Keep Their Tracklists A Secret

Mr_Lee_PHDMr_Lee_PHD 2,042 Posts
edited June 2012 in Strut Central
Why?

Is there a logical / 'for the greater good' reason to doing this, or is it just some kind of personal 'I know something you dont know' kinda ego trip thing?

I've noticed a lot of people doing it on youtube.. posting 'rare hungarian funk'' or whatever, without any kind of details.. and then someone will recognize it, post in the comments what the record is, so the poster will disable comments in the hopes that it will be something everybody will keep asking about.. at least thats how it appears.

I've spent hours and hours digging and finding stuff.. if someone asks what it is, I'm only too happy to share the knowledge. I'm happy that people dig the same kind of music, so I'm glad to share it. The artist deserves all the exposure they can get in my opinion. After all, I didn't record the record.. who am I to take the credit for the awesomeness of something I didn't record? I'm just a messenger with a turntable.

I understand there was a reason for it regarding rare breaks in, say, 70's New York when it was every DJ for himself and there was a lot of rivalry, but that was mainly over breaks.. these days there appear to be DJs who will play an entire song that doesn't contain a break or anything, just a damn good song. It seems to come off as 'Look everybody, look, look what I've got... I want everybody to hear it, but I'm not telling anyone what it is'.

That said, most people are cool... Andy Votel, Cut Chemist, David Holmes.. they're only too glad to educate and share the knowledge.

So what are peoples thoughts on this ?
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  Comments


  • mannybolonemannybolone Los Angeles, CA 15,025 Posts
    "I've spent hours and hours digging and finding stuff.. if someone asks what it is, I'm only too happy to share the knowledge."

    And others feel like that labor has earned them the right to keep shit secret. I don't see how this is different than what '70s DJs were doing. Knowledge is capital. Some people want to share it, others want to hoard it but these are old philosophies.

  • The_Hook_UpThe_Hook_Up 8,182 Posts
    I know I keep my tracklists/playlists of my radio shows secret/unlisted because I'm lazy.

  • Mr_Lee_PHDMr_Lee_PHD 2,042 Posts
    I remember one time at a club when I was about to go on and this kid comes up to the booth and asked the DJ what the track was and DJ was like 'You'll find it one day son...' in one of those holier than thou kinda ways. Think he was playing it on CD too.

    Although it just so happened that I had one in my box, so I plucked it out.. 'Magician In The Mountain by Sunforest, think they repressed it recently..'

    DJ got all asshurt like I'd just told everyone his PIN number or something. Made me chuckle though.

  • One possible motive with regards to obscure/rare records that are off the radar so to speak is keep that record cheap by not blowing it up, therefore allowing you to hopefully cop a few then blow it up and have spare copies when dudes are like "i'll pay anything for a one of those"

    Most of the time it does seem to be some ego trip bullshit though.

  • DORDOR Two Ron Toe 9,896 Posts
    This is no different than most people tho in their real worlds. Doesn't have to be a DJ... I know dudes at work who won't tell anyone how to fix things. Bosses are always trying to get him to add fixes into a database. He tends to put that shit off worried that at one point they will have enough to fire him and bring in students who will refer to said database.

    Also, he figures he put the work into training/schooling/research, why should he just give the info out freely to someone who's not putting any work into it.

    I personally don't care and like to discuss and give info. But I kinda understand the point.

    The youtube dude is probably just trying to keep people coming back to his video and getting views.

    In the world we live in, information is power. His is just on a much smaller level.

  • discos_almadiscos_alma discos_alma 2,164 Posts
    mannybolone said:
    "I've spent hours and hours digging and finding stuff.. if someone asks what it is, I'm only too happy to share the knowledge."

    And others feel like that labor has earned them the right to keep shit secret. I don't see how this is different than what '70s DJs were doing. Knowledge is capital. Some people want to share it, others want to hoard it but these are old philosophies.

    Exactly. I think that the OP is missing a key point about being a successful DJ (working or part time). Maintaining your competitive edge as a DJ requires playing killer stuff that other DJs aren't playing. Why would a dj freely give away that valuable knowledge? To me, certain songs are cool to reveal to people, but others are off limits.

  • mannybolonemannybolone Los Angeles, CA 15,025 Posts
    "Maintaining your competitive edge as a DJ requires playing killer stuff that other DJs aren't playing"

    I'm not a working DJ but my guess is that those who are would disagree that this plays a big role in how DJs get business these days.

    My point is simply that the desire to hoard or share any form of capital - information or otherwise - is pretty common in practically ANY field.

  • Mr_Lee_PHDMr_Lee_PHD 2,042 Posts
    Indi_Lbl_HE@T said:
    mannybolone said:
    "I've spent hours and hours digging and finding stuff.. if someone asks what it is, I'm only too happy to share the knowledge."

    And others feel like that labor has earned them the right to keep shit secret. I don't see how this is different than what '70s DJs were doing. Knowledge is capital. Some people want to share it, others want to hoard it but these are old philosophies.

    Exactly. I think that the OP is missing a key point about being a successful DJ (working or part time). Maintaining your competitive edge as a DJ requires playing killer stuff that other DJs aren't playing. Why would a dj freely give away that valuable knowledge? To me, certain songs are cool to reveal to people, but others are off limits.

    But then again, if it's a raer, not many dudes would be able to find it anyway.

    Plus, someone else will always have something else new and different.

    To me, you're hired not just for the one or two raers you have in your box, but your overall tastes, the way you put it all together and your abilities in being able to entertain a crowd for a couple hours.

    I've never heard anyone say 'Hire him because he's got such-and-such a record'.

  • phatmoneysackphatmoneysack Melbourne 1,124 Posts
    It can be good and bad.

    A mix can be more interesting and exciting if you don't know what to expect. So listening to it blind can be a great thing.

    I have found that the the DJs who make these mixes are either being secretive or just lazy. Most of the time you can contact them and request and ID and they will respond. Other times they just don't respond at all, which I'm not mad at, because it makes it all the more rewarding when you do find the track in the future.

    Although it can be annoying when a track is not in English making it very hard to describe in order to search for it by other means.

  • discos_almadiscos_alma discos_alma 2,164 Posts
    mannybolone said:
    "Maintaining your competitive edge as a DJ requires playing killer stuff that other DJs aren't playing"

    I'm not a working DJ but my guess is that those who are would disagree that this plays a big role in how DJs get business these days.

    I really don't care about what the status quo is these days. There are still plenty of DJs to whom this matters.

  • discos_almadiscos_alma discos_alma 2,164 Posts
    Mr_Lee_PHD said:
    Indi_Lbl_HE@T said:
    mannybolone said:
    "I've spent hours and hours digging and finding stuff.. if someone asks what it is, I'm only too happy to share the knowledge."

    And others feel like that labor has earned them the right to keep shit secret. I don't see how this is different than what '70s DJs were doing. Knowledge is capital. Some people want to share it, others want to hoard it but these are old philosophies.

    Exactly. I think that the OP is missing a key point about being a successful DJ (working or part time). Maintaining your competitive edge as a DJ requires playing killer stuff that other DJs aren't playing. Why would a dj freely give away that valuable knowledge? To me, certain songs are cool to reveal to people, but others are off limits.

    But then again, if it's a raer, not many dudes would be able to find it anyway.

    Plus, someone else will always have something else new and different.

    To me, you're hired not just for the one or two raers you have in your box, but your overall tastes, the way you put it all together and your abilities in being able to entertain a crowd for a couple hours.

    I've never heard anyone say 'Hire him because he's got such-and-such a record'.

    Why does it have to be a raer? People ask about common shit all the time. Still plenty of $5-$10 heat out there that's off the radar.

    I'm not really trying to split hairs here, just making the point that there are plausible situations where a DJ would not want to reveal a title. Myself, I've never refused to answer a question like this, and I DJ exclusively with vinyl. It makes it near impossible to hide what you are playing from other DJs vs DJing with Serato.

  • bassiebassie 11,710 Posts
    Mr_Lee_PHD said:


    I've never heard anyone say 'Hire him because he's got such-and-such a record'.

    Yea, the "my paycheck depends on it" argument has very limited mileage. It's weird power games.

    I find it obnoxious. I rarely play a night where I don???t get asked about a record or two. I would feel like a cheeseball if I responded with some weird for-me-to-know-and-you-to-find-out BS. The person likes it enough to come and ask, I'll show them what it looks like and where they can get it.

    If I like the song you're playing, I may be asking just out of interest, or maybe I want it in my life, but it is certainly not a building block to taking down someone???s DJ career.
    The days of limited***/exclusive releases and whole crews??? livelihoods depending on winning a crowd over (a la Jamaican clashes) are well gone. Folks have way more to work with and straight up, the DJs who are making their living at it are not really stressing about passing on the names of a few records.

    Edit - ***As in number of releases/songs out in the world and access to the records.

  • GaryGary 3,982 Posts
    If I'm in a bar and a dj plays something great I will go up and say " great song, what is it?". Because I like songs. I like listening to them. If I hear something great i will want to hear it again. I don't go out often but two examples that I can think of is "come back darling" and t.i. "bring em out".

    Both times the dj was happy sharing music.

  • z_illaz_illa 867 Posts
    I thought about setting up a hacking service for djs. For a fee, I will put playlist loggers on your favorite djs laptops.

    Bring me your money sucker djs.

  • GaryGary 3,982 Posts
    Context is everything though. If cut chemist, who is known for obscure records is doing a show then yeah, that's poor taste. If its DJ DudeDownTheStreet then don't be an ass.

  • bassiebassie 11,710 Posts
    z_illa said:
    I thought about setting up a hacking service for djs. For a fee, I will put playlist loggers on your favorite djs laptops.

    Bring me your money sucker djs.

    My favourite DJs don't use laptops.

  • z_illaz_illa 867 Posts
    bassie said:
    z_illa said:
    I thought about setting up a hacking service for djs. For a fee, I will put playlist loggers on your favorite djs laptops.

    Bring me your money sucker djs.

    My favourite DJs don't use laptops.

    I know but we're old and know better. I'm trying to target the money here.

  • dammsdamms 704 Posts
    Does someone who doesn't even know who Lee Morgan is deserve to know about Woody Shaw or Marvin Peterson ?
    I don't have a problem with that. If you really want to find out you'll explore and learn a lot in the process. Especially in this era. I got into Jazz after listening to some tune in a Madlib mix around 2007 and only identified it in 2010. In the time between I became some sort of walking encyclopedia compared to what I knew 3 years before.

  • GaryGary 3,982 Posts
    If I had the time I'd digitize every record I own and get rid of the fuckers. I need the space. And then at least I would be able to listen to them on iPod , vs not listening to them at all.

  • bassiebassie 11,710 Posts
    damms said:

    you'll explore and learn a lot in the process.

    What says that the person asking isn't doing that as well?


    damms said:
    Does someone who doesn't even know who Lee Morgan is deserve to know about Woody Shaw or Marvin Peterson ?

    Deserve?
    Please.

  • GaryGary 3,982 Posts
    You don't deserve to start your own thread until you've read every other thread on soulstrut.

  • Read his damn serato screen. Problem solved.

  • z_illaz_illa 867 Posts
    speakmumbles said:
    Read his damn serato screen. Problem solved.

    Any djs out there rocking screen blockers?

  • dammsdamms 704 Posts
    bassie said:
    damms said:

    you'll explore and learn a lot in the process.

    What says that the person asking isn't doing that as well?
    well if the person's not getting the answer they want they should understand the DJ thinks they haven't looked hard enough. it could go like this:
    *DJ plays jazz tune*
    *homie slice digs it and approaches DJ*
    DJ: Booker Little's on the trumpet.
    homie slice : who ?
    *DJ stares a second then proceeds to resume his duty*
    bassie said:

    damms said:
    Does someone who doesn't even know who Lee Morgan is deserve to know about Woody Shaw or Marvin Peterson ?

    Deserve?
    Please.
    I could have formulated this way: it's absurd to me to know Hampton Hawes without having a clue on Monk. Hope you get the point better.

  • bassiebassie 11,710 Posts
    You're not making a point.
    It's music, not a badge.

  • skelskel You can't cheat karma 5,033 Posts
    Someone please explain the difference between dj non-reveal and the Trap Door mix non-reveal

    Kthxbai

  • damms said:
    I could have formulated this way: it's absurd to me to know Hampton Hawes without having a clue on Monk. Hope you get the point better.

    Personally, I don't find this absurd at all. If you're new to a particular genre everything starts off equally rare and equally new. The distinctions only become apparent when you start learning a bit more about the music.

    What's absurd is the implication here that people have to follow some kind from prescribed path, starting from the well-known to the obscure. Or that you're not allowed to know about artist D until you've got everything by artists A, B and C. Who cares if someone learns about Carl Holmes or Mike James Kirkland before hearing Marvin Gaye or Curtis Mayfield?

  • mrmatthewmrmatthew 1,575 Posts
    Has anyone ever seen been djing and sees someone in the audience holding up thier phone using this

    ?

    Happened to me a couple of times and makes me feel kind of violated :grrr:

  • dammsdamms 704 Posts
    neil_something said:
    damms said:
    I could have formulated this way: it's absurd to me to know Hampton Hawes without having a clue on Monk. Hope you get the point better.

    Personally, I don't find this absurd at all. If you're new to a particular genre everything starts off equally rare and equally new.
    not true. even if you don't know jackshit about Jazz chances still are that you at least heard of Miles, Coltrane, Ellington or Armstrong and if you haven't they are most likely to be the very first people you learn about when beginning your journey. unless you are a very special other type of person

    bassie said:
    You're not making a point.
    you're in denial

  • bassiebassie 11,710 Posts
    damms said:

    bassie said:
    You're not making a point.
    you're in denial

    about?
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