"repetition-defines-music"

kala

good read
fire up a spliff and a cup of your fave liquid

http://www.ethanhein.com/wp/2014/repetition-defines-music/

Jimster

kala said:

good read
fire up a spliff and a cup of your fave liquid

http://www.ethanhein.com/wp/2014/repetition-defines-music/

Margulis is the first white academic IÔÇÖve seen advance the idea that repetition could be musicÔÇÖs most basic defining quality. I think sheÔÇÖs absolutely right.

Fixed that for him.

batmon

"Hey guys lets use BRA for the millionth time!!"

"Didnt so-and so and them use that in the 80's?"

"Yeah - but we should be repetitive."

ethanhein

Thanks for linking, guys! I know Margulis isn't the first academic to make the argument she's making, but she's the first one I happened to come across. Really interested to hear what you guys think about all this.

james

Respect to dude's enthusiasm and earnestness and all, but the parts of this that are not grueling because of their deeply elementary nature--those parts that sound like either a) every freshman who's read a couple pages on Warhol multiples ("No, see, repetition is change"), b) my eight-year old when she realized that saying a word over and over will eventually make even something as familiar as your own name sound very strange to you, and/or c) every rock-band dude ever who, around the time of their fourth or fifth album, discovers Can (always dudes, always Can) and proclaims somewhere in the press that, hey, what do you know, repetition is neither as easy nor as empty as we've heard--are grueling because they fall into this kind of writing's Same Old Shit of wanting it both ways: insisting on the supremacy of ostensibly non-intellectual examples (Fuck Canonical Composer X, it's all about Funk Dude Y!), while speaking from atop a hill made entirely of rigidly intellectual logic, received academic thought, and theory-course claptrap. Dude's tone here is far less offensive and race-y than I've seen in other pieces of this type (and they are legion), so points for that, but still.

In his defense, though, I did read it without the spliff.

james

Uh oh.

ethanhein

You'll be amused to learn that I've never read anything by Warhol or listened to Can. Thanks for comparing me to your eight year old, though.

james

Not comparing you, just some of the ideas you present.

I'm sorry you had to hear all of the above from a stranger on the internet, but I stand by it.

Reynaldo

Heartbeat = rhythm. It's inescapable! OMG

DB_Cooper

ethanhein said:

You'll be amused to learn that I've never read anything by Warhol or listened to Can. Thanks for comparing me to your eight year old, though.

You should listen to Can.

Jimster

May I bless the thread with the obligatory subject-checks-in :hayek:

As a professional bore, I can cosign that not only are our ears tuned to favour repetition, but our eyes are as well - repetition in the wilderness is an indication of life and our brains are hard-wired to notice it. Berries, footprints, piles of sticks, the actioned-by-predator skeletal ribcages of people who hate repetition; it's all there.

I would be interested in the smell-repetition study - imperviousness to farts, stopping at the fourth KFC after driving past three others. The truth is out there.

HarveyCanal

batmon said:

"Hey guys lets use BRA for the millionth time!!"

"Didnt so-and so and them use that in the 80's?"

"Yeah - but we should be repetitive."

As if the only possible samples from that album come from Bra.

Jimster

Liking the other articles too Ethan, this has kept me awake this afternoon:

http://www.ethanhein.com/wp/2009/learning-music-theory-with-autotune/

HarveyCanal

Can't do it, meaning I can't get through reading so much blah-blah about music. Either you like or you don't, that's all the music criticism ever needed, and that comes from a former music journalist who for a time went pretty deep into jazz theory.

Jimster

HarveyCanal said:

Can't do it, meaning I can't get through reading so much blah-blah about music. Either you like or you don't, that's all the music criticism ever needed, and that comes from a former music journalist who for a time went pretty deep into jazz theory.

^^^ SPLIFF VERSION.









But I like this definition too.

DB_Cooper

HarveyCanal said:

pretty deep into jazz theory.

Just these words alone make me want to kill myself.

james

HarveyCanal said:

Either you like or you don't

Just these words alone make me want to kill myself.

LaserWolf

james said:

Respect to dude's enthusiasm and earnestness and all, but the parts of this that are not grueling because of their deeply elementary nature--those parts that sound like either a) every freshman who's read a couple pages on Warhol multiples ("No, see, repetition is change"), b) my eight-year old when she realized that saying a word over and over will eventually make even something as familiar as your own name sound very strange to you, and/or c) every rock-band dude ever who, around the time of their fourth or fifth album, discovers Can (always dudes, always Can) and proclaims somewhere in the press that, hey, what do you know, repetition is neither as easy nor as empty as we've heard--are grueling because they fall into this kind of writing's Same Old Shit of wanting it both ways: insisting on the supremacy of ostensibly non-intellectual examples (Fuck Canonical Composer X, it's all about Funk Dude Y!), while speaking from atop a hill made entirely of rigidly intellectual logic, received academic thought, and theory-course claptrap. Dude's tone here is far less offensive and race-y than I've seen in other pieces of this type (and they are legion), so points for that, but still.

In his defense, though, I did read it without the spliff.

Dude. The article is great because it is so much like all those observations, not despite them. It may sound easy to say the same thing as your 8yo, but like Can it is neither easy, nor empty.*


*Jks, I havn't read the article yet.

And let me repeat: :hayek:
Thanks for coming and listening to our opinions. We have many.

HarveyCanal

james said:

HarveyCanal said:

Either you like or you don't

Just these words alone make me want to kill myself.

Plaese to provide us a dissertation study on why you like certain things versus why you don't. Certainly, there is a science to it and it couldn't possibly be simply random, frivolous whims.

HarveyCanal

It's like the hard-headed deejay who swears that a certain song is hot, yet when he plays it his crowd unmistakably goes flat.

How long does his grand theory of goodness get pushed ahead of the reality of simple acceptance/denial/obliviousness?

Either they like it or they don't and no explaining/pontificating will ever change that.

vintageinfants

21st century schizoid man by king crimson and hunting bears by radiohead aren't music?

Horseleech

HarveyCanal said:

It's like the hard-headed deejay who swears that a certain song is hot, yet when he plays it his crowd unmistakably goes flat.

How long does his grand theory of goodness get pushed ahead of the reality of simple acceptance/denial/obliviousness?

Either they like it or they don't and no explaining/pontificating will ever change that.

One may or may not like certain music.

One may or may not like discussing music.

There's no right or wrong in either one.

parallax

james said:

Uh oh.

HAHAHAHAHA!!!

I only know you through this site, but I love you, james.

james

HarveyCanal said:

james said:

HarveyCanal said:

Either you like or you don't

Just these words alone make me want to kill myself.

Plaese to provide us a dissertation study on why you like certain things versus why you don't.

I'm not gonna do all that, but I will say that with regards to something as important as motherfucking music, only two kinds of people say "Either you like it or you don't": 1) Dummies who don't care to think about music, or 2) smart people who clearly do think about music but who have reached either the end of their stamina or the limitations of their argument and thus retreat mollusk-like into the plainly false assertion that anyway it's all always been just about personal preference, man.

batmon

yall gettin repetitive

Mek_Jagger

Liking the other articles music too Ethan, this has kept me awake this afternoon

mandolin @ 3:00 is

parallax

batmon said:

yall gettin repetitive

LazarusOblong

Mark E. Smith said it already:

Right noise.
We're gonna get real speedy
You gotta wear black all the time
You're gonna make it on your own.

Cos we dig
Cos we dig
We dig
We dig repetition
We dig repetition
We've repetition in the music
And we're never going to lose it.

All you daughters and sons
who are sick of fancy music
We dig repetition
Repetition on the drums
and we're never going to lose it.

This is the three R's
The three R's:
Repetition, Repetition, Repetition

Oh mental hospitals
Oh mental hospitals
They put electrodes in your brain
And you're never the same
You don't dig repetition
You don't love repetition

Repetition in the music and we're never going to loose
it

President Carter loves repetition
Chairman Mao he dug repetition

Repetition in China
Repetition in America
Repetition in West Germany
Simultaneous suicides

We dig it, we dig it,
we dig it, we dig it

Repetition, repetition, repetition
Repetition, repetition, Regal Zonophone

There is no hesitation
This is your situation
Continue a blank generation
Blank generation
Same old blank generation
Groovy blank generation
Swinging blank generation

Repetition, repetition, repetition....

HarveyCanal

james said:

HarveyCanal said:

james said:

HarveyCanal said:

Either you like or you don't

Just these words alone make me want to kill myself.

Plaese to provide us a dissertation study on why you like certain things versus why you don't.

I'm not gonna do all that, but I will say that with regards to something as important as motherfucking music, only two kinds of people say "Either you like it or you don't": 1) Dummies who don't care to think about music, or 2) smart people who clearly do think about music but who have reached either the end of their stamina or the limitations of their argument and thus retreat mollusk-like into the plainly false assertion that anyway it's all always been just about personal preference, man.

Oh really, there's only 2 types of people, ha?

Well, how about?

3) regular people who are sick of hearing nerds turn something fun/rewarding into something excrutiating/heavy-handed.

There's certainly a place for music discussion. It's just that hardly anyone knows how to do it anymore. It should resemble a conversation between friends more than a school paper is all I'm saying.

james

HarveyCanal said:

It's like the hard-headed deejay who swears that a certain song is hot, yet when he plays it his crowd unmistakably goes flat.

How long does his grand theory of goodness get pushed ahead of the reality of simple acceptance/denial/obliviousness?

Either they like it or they don't and no explaining/pontificating will ever change that.

I think this is ludicrous (not least for your puzzling exclusion of the deejay from this mythical "they"), but I'm tabling that to focus on my main greivance:

Dude, I know you and I are both on the old side here, but come on now--neither one of us is old enough to be spelling out "deejay." That's some "hamburger sandwich"/"jean pants" type shit, and should really stop.

vintageinfants

i spent part of this morning looking for james' near scripture-like "can i live?" post. never has this site needed it more.