Thanks for that bit. I have been out of the computer support game for over 7 years (switched to bookkeeping and just got my degree in accounting). Good to know the max you can jam in a stock laptop. Is there any laptops that are built using a different RAM chip set to get past the 16 GB hard cap set by SO-DIMMs? Also, is Apple useing SO-DIMMs? I know there are other reasons to get Win7 Pro/Enterprise/Ultimate but I figure RAM would be the main driver for non-laptop users.
Thanks for the knowledge drop...
The limitation is not on the laptops themselves, other then the fact that the size of a laptop does not offer enough space to add more memory sockets. It is possible that 16GB SO-DIMMs will one day appear but at the moment the DDR3 DRAM chips needed to build such modules are not manufactured (remember that the form factor of modules is standardised, so you simply can not squeeze more on the PCB).
As for Apple, they interestingly use the small SO-DIMMs, which were originally designed for laptops in their bigger systems like iMacs. Theoretically there would be plenty of space in an iMac case to have a motherboard with DIMM (as opposed to SO-DIMM) sockets and to have more than two sockets, but Apple decided not to. One possible explanation is that neither a MacBook Pro nor an iMac user needs more than 16GB. Another explanation is that if you think you really need more memory, well... "allow me to show you our range of MacPro machines which allow you to go to 64GB" - Apple is smart after all when it comes to milking customers.
The latest move from Apple on the new MacBook Air and the Retina display MacBook Pro is that the memory is soldered onto the motherboard. The user has no chance to upgrade after purchase. Again, partly this is due to the extremely sleek design not allowing for sockets, but it is a massive margin maker opportunity for Apple. When you select your Mac Book Air and configure it the price difference between the 4GB and 8GB is $100. The price difference on the Retina display MacBook Pro between 8GB and 16GB is $200. I can tell you that in both cases there is approximately a 400% markup in the sales price compared to Apple's cost of these different memory configurations.
They do the same with iPhones and iPads. Look at the limited storage (not memory) configurations: 16GB, 32Gb and 64GB NAND (Flash) storage which you have to select at the time of purchase. No chance to change it later, no memory slot to put a MicroSD card or any other upgrade into it. Now look at the price differences: iPad 16GB, 32Gb and 64GB NAND (Flash) storage: $499, $599, $699. Now go to Newegg and check how much a 16GB or 32GB MicroSD card would set you back. Ouch! It's the same memory chips inside as those soldered into the iPad but costs a fraction. Apple is charging $100 premium for an additional 16GB, whereas you culd buy a memory card for other smart phones or tables for as little as ten bucks. These memory configuration options are the biggest margin maker for Apple and an absolutely masterful strategy at milking customers.
BTW: If you have a small capacity iPhone or iPad (or KindleFire) and would love to add storage capacity look for Kingston's clever Wi-Drive which gives you additional storage via WiFi for those Apple devices.
My previous Lenovo is good, but I want to upgrade a little and wondered if anyone has any opinion on the Lenovo Z70?
In 2015 what's the best $1000-1500 laptop? I'd like a big screen (16"+), plenty of memory and an optical DVD/RW drive.
Touch screen tech not wanted!
I can't comment on the Z-70, but I recently bought the B-50.
It had DVD drive etc but I had it ripped out and replaced with SSD and more ram.
pros: nice looking, runs very well / quick. boots in about 5 seconds.
cons: build quality feels a little plasticcy. no backlight on keys. terrible speakers (my last laptop had a JBL set-up with a SUB! I could happily produce on it if required). full of lenovo bloatware on purchase. battery life is not great, will JUST make it through a movie unplugged.
I researched the hell out of laptops and ended up at Lenovo (I had 3 dells previously over the years)
the Z70 looks really nice.
Having done hardware support for a large organisation before, I do rate the Lenovos in terms of build quality. They are nowt to look at but if you are moving them around frequently they do stand up to a beating. There were a couple of Toshibas in the inventory but the screen hinges tended to get worn and become floppy and the external casings got a bit cracked (although not enough to stop them working).
Lenovo builds a good machine. I don't have an opinion on the durability of the ideapad line, but their thinkpad lines are built like tanks. They are awesome road warrior machines. If travel damage is a concern there are laptops built to take some shocks.
I hope this helps,
Saracenus
Duderonomy said:
I'm having one of these:
Lenovo Z575
I even like the colour!
I'm running 2 laptops, and the older one is the Lenovo Z575 which I do most of my music on, and not only is it still running perfectly, yesterday it survived a bookshelf falling on it (think glacial calving). After I pulled it out of the debris with my heart in my mouth, it had frozen and the screen was loose, but it satisfyingly snapped back together, and after a forced re-start it's fine. A tank indeed.
What he means is, if you are running the laptop on mains then take the battery out of the laptop completely - they just slot in with no tools - and run it completely on the mains. The act of discharging/recharging/discharging... is what ages a battery to the point where it won't hold charge for more than 10-15 minutes. Depending on how cheap the battery is and how often you run it down, they'll last anywhere from 1-5 years.
I leave my battery in because sometimes the kids will unplug something from my chokka 4-way extension leads to charge their shit with, with no thought to what is running off them. The f*cking cheek of them.
I just learnt something new today, my assumptions were the same as *eo´s.
Just finally got round to ordering a new battery for my trusty, cheap as fuck second hand Lenovo 410 so will use this new knowledge for maximum battery lifeage.
I 4th the resilience of these machines - this has moved countries a number of times, lugged about in rucksacks, and it doesn't even have a scratch. The only problem is they're so ubiquitous these days that I sometimes miss seeing a machine with a bit less brick about its design.
Comments
The limitation is not on the laptops themselves, other then the fact that the size of a laptop does not offer enough space to add more memory sockets. It is possible that 16GB SO-DIMMs will one day appear but at the moment the DDR3 DRAM chips needed to build such modules are not manufactured (remember that the form factor of modules is standardised, so you simply can not squeeze more on the PCB).
As for Apple, they interestingly use the small SO-DIMMs, which were originally designed for laptops in their bigger systems like iMacs. Theoretically there would be plenty of space in an iMac case to have a motherboard with DIMM (as opposed to SO-DIMM) sockets and to have more than two sockets, but Apple decided not to. One possible explanation is that neither a MacBook Pro nor an iMac user needs more than 16GB. Another explanation is that if you think you really need more memory, well... "allow me to show you our range of MacPro machines which allow you to go to 64GB" - Apple is smart after all when it comes to milking customers.
The latest move from Apple on the new MacBook Air and the Retina display MacBook Pro is that the memory is soldered onto the motherboard. The user has no chance to upgrade after purchase. Again, partly this is due to the extremely sleek design not allowing for sockets, but it is a massive margin maker opportunity for Apple. When you select your Mac Book Air and configure it the price difference between the 4GB and 8GB is $100. The price difference on the Retina display MacBook Pro between 8GB and 16GB is $200. I can tell you that in both cases there is approximately a 400% markup in the sales price compared to Apple's cost of these different memory configurations.
They do the same with iPhones and iPads. Look at the limited storage (not memory) configurations: 16GB, 32Gb and 64GB NAND (Flash) storage which you have to select at the time of purchase. No chance to change it later, no memory slot to put a MicroSD card or any other upgrade into it. Now look at the price differences: iPad 16GB, 32Gb and 64GB NAND (Flash) storage: $499, $599, $699. Now go to Newegg and check how much a 16GB or 32GB MicroSD card would set you back. Ouch! It's the same memory chips inside as those soldered into the iPad but costs a fraction. Apple is charging $100 premium for an additional 16GB, whereas you culd buy a memory card for other smart phones or tables for as little as ten bucks. These memory configuration options are the biggest margin maker for Apple and an absolutely masterful strategy at milking customers.
BTW: If you have a small capacity iPhone or iPad (or KindleFire) and would love to add storage capacity look for Kingston's clever Wi-Drive which gives you additional storage via WiFi for those Apple devices.
New laptop time again...
My previous Lenovo is good, but I want to upgrade a little and wondered if anyone has any opinion on the Lenovo Z70?
In 2015 what's the best $1000-1500 laptop? I'd like a big screen (16"+), plenty of memory and an optical DVD/RW drive.
Touch screen tech not wanted!
It had DVD drive etc but I had it ripped out and replaced with SSD and more ram.
pros: nice looking, runs very well / quick. boots in about 5 seconds.
cons: build quality feels a little plasticcy. no backlight on keys. terrible speakers (my last laptop had a JBL set-up with a SUB! I could happily produce on it if required). full of lenovo bloatware on purchase. battery life is not great, will JUST make it through a movie unplugged.
I researched the hell out of laptops and ended up at Lenovo (I had 3 dells previously over the years)
the Z70 looks really nice.
Just finally got round to ordering a new battery for my trusty, cheap as fuck second hand Lenovo 410 so will use this new knowledge for maximum battery lifeage.
I 4th the resilience of these machines - this has moved countries a number of times, lugged about in rucksacks, and it doesn't even have a scratch. The only problem is they're so ubiquitous these days that I sometimes miss seeing a machine with a bit less brick about its design.